Sweden avoiding lockdown

Not in Kansas

This thread had been the worst thread on Boards for months. Every time I dip into it it's the same people arguing obsessively. It makes the thread completely unreadable and pointless.

Real Donald Trump

Well worth a watch, wish we had this sort of leadership here.

Scoondal

Real Donald Trump wrote: »

Well worth a watch, wish we had this sort of leadership here.

Thank you for linking me to this interesting video.

Scoondal

Nobody that I know has had Covid19, let alone been hospitalised with this virus.

skimpydoo

Sweden is no longer ignoring lockdown.

MerlinSouthDub

skimpydoo wrote: »

Sweden is no longer ignoring lockdown.

Have you read the article? It's nothing like what we would know as a lockdown.

skimpydoo

MerlinSouthDub wrote: »

Have you read the article? It's nothing like what we would know as a lockdown.

It's local lockdowns and still a type of lockdown.

cnocbui

skimpydoo wrote: »

It's local lockdowns and still a type of lockdown.

So it's a Claytons lockdown - the lockdown you have when you aren't having a lock down.

charlie14

MerlinSouthDub wrote: »

Have you read the article? It's nothing like what we would know as a lockdown.

There is no definitive description of a lockdown. It has varied with different degrees of restrictions, guidances, penalties, no penalties, specific area lockdowns etc.

Your "It`s nothing like what we would know as a lockdown" is like the answer to the question "When is a lockdown not a lockdown" being "When it is in Sweden".

Vieira82

Scoondal wrote: »

Thank you for linking me to this interesting video.

Yes.. very factual... specially coming from someone that has made her career glorifying fascism in Argentina, that tried for years to "show Cuba like it is" and in general likes to periodically release documentaries against anything left or centrist leaning. For her anything that is not far right is automatically a commie... extremely factual of course

JimmyVik

Real Donald Trump wrote: »

Well worth a watch, wish we had this sort of leadership here.

That youtube video is so one sided.
Are you not embarrassed to post that

micar

Scoondal wrote: »

Nobody that I know has had Covid19, let alone been hospitalised with this virus.

Not that you are aware of.

I know of about 12 people and 1 of those were in hospital

Ireland has a population of €4.9m and there have been 50k confirmed cases

That's 1% of the population

Chances that you know someone who has had it are extremely high.....you just don't know it.

Ozark707

micar wrote: »

Not that you are aware of.

I know of about 12 people and 1 of those were in hospital

Ireland has a population of €4.9m and there have been 50k confirmed cases

That's 1% of the population

Chances that you know someone who has had it are extremely high.....you just don't know it.

Yes considering that the 50k is probably a fraction of who have actually got it

micar

Ozark707 wrote: »

Yes considering that the 50k is probably a fraction of who have actually got it

Exactly

And that's why I said "confirmed cases"

We will never know the actual number of cases.

tobefrank321

About 3200 new cases for the last 4 days or an average of 800 per day
8 new people admitted to ICU or an average of 2 per day
4 newly confirmed deaths

Uppsala has new restrictions:

Uppsala has become the first region in Sweden to introduce local coronavirus measures after that became possible yesterday. That means that until November 3rd, everyone in the area is urged to avoid public transport, avoid contact with people other than those you live with, and avoid organising or attending parties or social gatherings. The changes also mean stricter recommendations for workplaces (everyone should work from home who can do), shops, and sports facilities, which should all limit the number of people present at any one time.

https://www.thelocal.se/20200902/coronavirus-the-latest-news-about-the-outbreak-in-sweden-timeline-part-two

charlie14

tobefrank321 wrote: »

About 3200 new cases for the last 4 days or an average of 800 per day
8 new people admitted to ICU or an average of 2 per day
4 newly confirmed deaths

Uppsala has new restrictions:



https://www.thelocal.se/20200902/coronavirus-the-latest-news-about-the-outbreak-in-sweden-timeline-part-two

I saw over the weekend where Johan Nojo, the infection diseases doctor for the region of Uppsala described it as "It`s more a lockdown situation, but a local lockdown"
I doubt that statement was welcomed with enthusiasm by some in authority.
Confirmed cases look to be up close to 50% for the corresponding days the previous week.

Vieira82

tobefrank321 wrote: »

About 3200 new cases for the last 4 days or an average of 800 per day
8 new people admitted to ICU or an average of 2 per day
4 newly confirmed deaths

Uppsala has new restrictions:



https://www.thelocal.se/20200902/coronavirus-the-latest-news-about-the-outbreak-in-sweden-timeline-part-two

So if they are now doing this are they admitting they should have taken a stronger action during the first wave?

dubrov

Vieira82 wrote:

So if they are now doing this are they admitting they should have taken a stronger action during the first wave?

It seems a change of approach alright. It isn't consistent with previous measures they have taken which were aimed at living with the virus long term.

Ginger n Lemon

tobefrank321 wrote: »

About 3200 new cases for the last 4 days or an average of 800 per day
8 new people admitted to ICU or an average of 2 per day
4 newly confirmed deaths

Uppsala has new restrictions:



https://www.thelocal.se/20200902/coronavirus-the-latest-news-about-the-outbreak-in-sweden-timeline-part-two

Still at 1 a day? Damn.

321123

Just had a chat with my partner who is Swedish and listened to the press conference regarding the new recommendations for Uppsala.

Uppsala is a university town and the virus has gone from mostly just spreading among students to more the general public. So in order to stop the spread they have taken these steps.

It is a two week specific ask that people limit the social interaction to people they live with or relatives and that public transportation is avoided if it is not absolutely necessary to get to work that can't be done from home or to go to education.

Shops are asked to limit the customers if necessary but no specific limit is mentioned.

Anders Tegnell was asked about restaurants and bars and said that people should avoid meeting up there in larger groups but that family and close friends is fine as long as it is in smaller groups. And they have no plans to work towards closing or regulating them.

So nothing is being closed in Uppsala (not even nursing homes from visitors).

Judge for yourself if that sounds like a lockdown to you. Sounds more like Irish Level 1 or so to me (minus requirement for facemasks).

Hopefully it will have enough effect and Uppsala can go back to more normality in a few weeks. The aim is still to live with the virus on an overall level and in order to do that short targeted recommendations like these are going to be used.

Ginger n Lemon

321123 wrote: »

Just had a chat with my partner who is Swedish and listened to the press conference regarding the new recommendations for Uppsala.

Uppsala is a university town and the virus has gone from mostly just spreading among students to more the general public. So in order to stop the spread they have taken these steps.

It is a two week specific ask that people limit the social interaction to people they live with or relatives and that public transportation is avoided if it is not absolutely necessary to get to work that can't be done from home or to go to education.

Shops are asked to limit the customers if necessary but no specific limit is mentioned.

Anders Tegnell was asked about restaurants and bars and said that people should avoid meeting up there in larger groups but that family and close friends is fine as long as it is in smaller groups. And they have no plans to work towards closing or regulating them.

So nothing is being closed in Uppsala (not even nursing homes from visitors).

Judge for yourself if that sounds like a lockdown to you. Sounds more like Irish Level 1 or so to me (minus requirement for facemasks).

Hopefully it will have enough effect and Uppsala can go back to more normality in a few weeks. The aim is still to live with the virus on an overall level and in order to do that short targeted recommendations like these are going to be used.

Doesnt sound like any form of a lockdown actually.

They have 1 death with covid a day. Country of 10,230,000. probably did this conference just to get some attention and inform Uppsala citizens to avoid students lol.

trixi001

Vieira82 wrote: »

So if they are now doing this are they admitting they should have taken a stronger action during the first wave?

The advice is still simply that in Sweden - advice, its almost all voluntary!

The only thing legally binding is public events over 50 people and overcrowded bars and restaurants

greyday

We will see in a month how they are doing, the people warning the second wave would sweep across populations seem to be correct but at least we know more about treatment and behaviours now then in March, personally I fear the Swedes may have become so complacent about the virus now that they may be in for more suffering than necessary.

charlie14

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Still at 1 a day? Damn.

Stop acting like a ghoul.
Nobody wants to see any more deaths than humanly possible due to this virus.
This thread,or indeed any other I know off, is not about counting deaths. They are about the best ways to prevent them.

Ginger n Lemon

charlie14 wrote: »

Stop acting like a ghoul.
Nobody wants to see any more deaths than humanly possible due to this virus.
This thread,or indeed any other I know off, is not about counting deaths. They are about the best ways to prevent them.

Absolutely. With Ireland reporting 13 deaths today alone, while Sweden keeps reporting 1 death a day with covid, best way to prevent deaths is to follow Swedish approach.

We are in agreement for once, my ghoulish friend.

charlie14

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Absolutely. With Ireland reporting 13 deaths today alone, while Sweden keeps reporting 1 death a day with covid, best way to prevent deaths is to follow Swedish approach.

We are in agreement for once, my ghoulish friend.

Do you realise just how much of an insensitive fool you are making of yourself.
Your like some old hag cackling beside a guillotine.
Cop yourself on.

Ginger n Lemon

charlie14 wrote: »

That curve is not looking too flat today.

Today is their 4th highest for deaths, and that includes at least two dates just three weeks ago where they added historical cases to bring them up to date.
The conventional wisdom here was that the percentage of deaths to confirmed cases would drop from where it was two weeks ago. If anything at 12.4% it has risen.

charlie14 wrote: »

Some of those behind the Swedish strategy seem to be getting a bit miffed over their rise up that table of deaths per 100,000 of population.They recently passed both ourselves and the Netherlands, and I seem to recall them having a dig at the Netherlands recently as well.

charlie14 wrote: »

If you cannot accept that two weeks ago Sweden had the highest deaths per head of population from Covid-19, or that for the month of April the number of deaths was the highest since December 1993 and attempt to brush those facts under the carpet as not being Covid-19 related, then that is up to you.

charlie14 wrote: »

Stop acting like a ghoul.
Nobody wants to see any more deaths than humanly possible due to this virus.
This thread,or indeed any other I know off, is not about counting deaths. They are about the best ways to prevent them.

Charlie. You are 1 hell of a poster, thats for sure.

This thread has focused on Swedish covid deaths significantly all the way up to end of June, when co incidentally their deaths have floored (and remained on the floor since).

Now that their deaths are non existent you get ultra hostile and, I am not even sure the point you are trying to make - deaths are not relevant? or daily deaths should not be mentioned from neither Ireland or Sweden? If I post Sweden has 1 daily death with covid per day I am an insensitive fool?

I know you wont answer - but do you have any idea why Swedish deaths with covid are so low since June?

Spiderman0081

No matter what approach Sweden takes in the future, I will be glad that I am here in Sweden. I have been since day one of the virus. I personally, have still not met one single person who does not think as I do. People can link all they want to people on twitter who are anti the Swedish approach. I can’t find a single person who is not grateful that they are here. Old, young or with underlying conditions. Not one.
I know several people who currently have covid. I spoke to two of them today. They and their families are isolating at home. As with everyone else I know who has had covid, they blame no one.
This thread is meaningless. It has become a bickering theater for the few.

cnocbui

charlie14 wrote: »

Stop acting like a ghoul.
Nobody wants to see any more deaths than humanly possible due to this virus.
This thread,or indeed any other I know off, is not about counting deaths. They are about the best ways to prevent them.

Oh really. Sanctimonious drivel.

Continued lockdown may cause 29 times more deaths than it aims to prevent

https://www.msn.com/en-za/news/other/continued-lockdown-may-cause-29-times-more-deaths-than-it-aims-to-prevent/ar-BB13GT5B

Lockdown deaths could end up higher than Covid fatalities – we all should want to prevent that

There was a stark example of that yesterday when the Office for National Statistics released their at home excess death figures, showing that from the start of lockdown in March to September 26,000 poor souls lost their lives because they were unable or unwilling to go to hospital.

That’s just the beginning.

As a health audit conducted by the Daily Mail published today shows lockdown has seen surgery postponed for 50,000 children in England between March and May, stroke treatments down 45 per cent, cancers detected down 58 per cent, chemo admissions down 66 per cent, and cases of depression doubling.

I am not for a single second questioning the severity of Covid-19. I’ve had the damn disease myself back in March and I’m personally aware of its brutality. That’s why I’m convinced the most vulnerable deserve enhanced protection.

But if we follow Keir Starmer’s policy of perpetual national lockdowns, which are not backed up by science, the health consequences are only going to get worse.

There could easily end up being more deaths from lockdown than coronavirus. We all should want to prevent that.

The Mystery of the Missing STEMIs During the COVID-19 Pandemic

https://www.tctmd.com/news/mystery-missing-stemis-during-covid-19-pandemic

These 2 Things Are Killing More Young People Than COVID, CDC Director Says

Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) Director Robert Redfield, MD, candidly discussed how school closures have affected children and teenagers across the country—and how previously existing issues are becoming an even bigger problem for young people. "We're seeing, sadly, far greater suicides now than we are deaths from COVID. We're seeing far greater deaths from drug overdose that are above excess that we had as background than we are seeing the deaths from COVID," Redfield said.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/these-2-things-are-killing-more-young-people-than-covid-cdc-director-says/ar-BB17iype

A group of concerned doctors is calling for Victoria’s coronavirus lockdown to end immediately.

In an open letter to Premier Daniel Andrews, 500 medical experts argue that the state government’s response to COVID-19 is causing severe harm, a spike in mental health issues and a worrying decline in tests for medical conditions like cancer and chest pain.

“The current restrictions are unnecessary, disproportionate and must be lifted,” the letter says.

“The response to the virus will cause more deaths and result in far more negative health effects than the virus itself.”

https://7news.com.au/sunrise/on-the-show/hundreds-of-melbourne-doctors-call-for-immediate-end-to-harmful-lockdown-c-1379531

Cancer tests and operations dropped up to 50 per cent during April lockdown, data shows

Mr Voller is one of tens of thousands of Australians who had the diagnosis or treatment of their cancer delayed during the COVID-19 pandemic and experts warn the effects in the coming months could be significant.

Data provided to 7.30 exclusively by Cancer Australia — the Federal Government's peak cancer body — reveals substantial drops in tests that diagnose three of the most common cancers in Australia between March and April, at the height of national lockdowns, as well as a drop in treatments for them.

"There was a 30 to 50 per cent drop in tests and operations," Cancer Australia CEO Professor Dorothy Keefe told 7.30.

The decrease in cancer diagnoses had been predicted for months in media reports and by frontline experts around the country, but this is the very first time it has been confirmed by data.

The data in the report was compared to that of the previous year and showed the decrease was greater than seasonal variations over the same period in 2019.

Non-surgical treatments for skin cancers fell by 30 per cent from this March to April, but then started to recover in June, as the lockdown restrictions eased.

Imaging procedures for the detection of breast cancers fell by 37 per cent between March and April, but started to recover in June. Breast biopsies fell by a quarter nationally in the March-April period.

And there was a similar trend for colon cancer: colonoscopies fell by 55 per cent from March to April. Numbers have started to recover but they are still lower than last year.

Professor Keefe told 7.30 it was concerning that cancers that were not diagnosed during lockdown may be picked up later "and they may not be as treatable".

"We would expect the cancers that haven't been diagnosed in the early part of the year will be diagnosed either later this year or early next year, and they will probably be slightly more severe cancers than they would have been had they been diagnosed earlier," she said.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-14/cancer-tests-operations-drop-up-to-50-per-cent-april-coronavirus/12622396

You are a one trick pony, Charlie; there is only one dismal song in your hymn book - the rest of pages are blank. Your posts comprise about 20% of all the posts in this thread and they are all just incredibly boring variations on the same theme 'Sweden bad, lockdown good' You have incurable tunnel vision, and are a seemingly endless stuck record, stuck record, stuck record...

There are potentialy more deaths at stake from other causes than would occur from SARS-2. Lockdown is an inappropriate response at this point. We now know it's a failed model and it's clear to all but the blind that the way forward should be issolation of the vulnerable, not isolation of everyone.

charlie14

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Charlie. You are 1 hell of a poster, thats for sure.

This thread has focused on Swedish covid deaths significantly all the way up to end of June, when co incidentally their deaths have floored (and remained on the floor since).

Now that their deaths are non existent you get ultra hostile and, I am not even sure the point you are trying to make - deaths are not relevant? or daily deaths should not be mentioned from neither Ireland or Sweden? If I post Sweden has 1 daily death with covid per day I am an insensitive fool?

I know you wont answer - but do you have any idea why Swedish deaths with covid are so low since June?

Any points I made in relation to death were in relation to how I believed the Swedish strategy was costing lives unnecessarily.
I did not post as if it was a ghoulish competition as you have been doing here for some time.
If I appear hostile it is because I find your posts are gross and insensitive.
And yes I believe you are a fool. Not because deaths are irrelevant. Because you treat them as irrelevant by using them as gibes at other posters.