How will schools be able to go back in September?

combat14

Asti request minister review medical advice for return to school

https://www.asti.ie/news/asti-requests-minister-to-seek-review-of-medical-advice-for/

am_zarathustra

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Haven't seen that anywhere, in fact surprisingly the unions seem to be optimistic albeit there's some concerns about the tight time frame involved. Maybe even they realise it's the best that can be achieved in a bad situation.

Teachers unions can insist all they like and they might secure masks for their members however they don't get to dictate what hundreds of thousands of children do.

Children don't have a choice about going to school in the same way that they would in going to a shop or on public transport.

So what will ASTI insist on, come to school in a mask or be home schooled? Never going to happen, can you imagine the legal fallout for starters.

https://www.asti.ie/news/asti-requests-minister-to-seek-review-of-medical-advice-for/

ldy4mxonucwsq6

combat14 wrote: »

Asti request minister review medical advice for return to school

https://www.asti.ie/news/asti-requests-minister-to-seek-review-of-medical-advice-for/

I'd imagine they mean for their members, and they are asking for review not insisting on everyone wearing masks like you said.

combat14

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

I'd imagine they mean for their members, and they are asking for review not insisting on everyone wearing masks like you said.

looks like more than review for members..

querying fact phase 4 reopening hasn't even got green light yet and also that significant changes have occurred to public health policies in the interim including everyone wearing masks In retail space

Boggles

combat14 wrote: »

Asti request minister review medical advice for return to school

https://www.asti.ie/news/asti-requests-minister-to-seek-review-of-medical-advice-for/

Seems completely reasonable.

They should be also seeking independent medical advice.

s1ippy

I think that's a good point of enquiry because Foley repeatedly claimed that their decisions were based on medical guidance where that is just absolutely untrue.

lulublue22

Will Yam wrote: »

So are you saying that going out and about is risk free?

You do understand that taking reasonable precautions such as those advocated byNPHET ie face masks , SD etc etc are to mitigate risk. There is no one looking for a risk free environment. Your argument is pure populist nonsense. Either we need to implement measures such as SD face coverings or we don’t. Please stop with the hyperbole.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

combat14 wrote: »

looks like more than review for members..

querying fact phase 4 reopening hasn't even got green light yet and also that significant changes have occurred to public health policies in the interim including everyone wearing masks In retail space

So where did you get "ASTI are insisting in everyone wearing masks" from or is that just your take on it?

Based on medical guidance kids under 13 don't have to wear a mask regardless of the situation, it's not mandatory for them at the moment. So not everyone has to wear them in retail space.

Boggles

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

So where did you get "ASTI are insisting in everyone wearing masks" from or is that just your take on it?

He says they sound like it and in reading the press release it certainly does.

In addition, significant changes in public policy have been introduced regarding the wearing of masks on public transport and in other enclosed spaces since the interim recommendations for the reopening of schools and educational facilities were provided to the Department in Education.

Over 13s have to wear them in a business premise but not in a school.

Does the virus know they are in school and leave them alone?

All perfectly reasonable questions IMO.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

Boggles wrote: »

He says they sound like it and in reading the press release it certainly does.



Over 13s have to wear them in a business premise but not in a school.

Does the virus know they are in school and leave them alone?

All perfectly reasonable questions IMO.

So not everyone then?

wirelessdude01

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

So where did you get "ASTI are insisting in everyone wearing masks" from or is that just your take on it?

Based on medical guidance kids under 13 don't have to wear a mask regardless of the situation, it's not mandatory for them at the moment. So not everyone has to wear them in retail space.

What age do you think secondary going teenagers are?

Boggles

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

So not everyone then?

I imagine everyone who can possibly wear them in post primary.

But who knows maybe there is a perfectly logical medical explanation as to why you have to wear one nipping in for bread and not sitting in a packed class room with little ventilation.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

What age do you think secondary going teenagers are?

ASTI are not insisting that everyone wears masks, that's not true.

Current guidance omits the entire primary schoolgoing population and some first years too from any mandatory face coverings.

Ectoplasm

Lillyfae wrote: »

/

I want at risk children to be safe. I want immuno compromised children to stay healthy. I want special needs children to have their needs properly met. I want teachers to have a safe work environment. Of course I do! Unsafe opening of schools will result in nothing except a higher mortality rate eventually. I think that the resources needed to include a centralised facilitation of online platforms, with devices being provided to teachers who are immunocompromised and immunocompromised children who don't have the means to provide their own, so that they can all work from home. If broadband is a problem, it doesn't need to be live teaching, or the teacher could be provided with a location to use adequate broadband from. I think that everyone on the register of teachers who is not immunocompromised, already in employment, or abroad needs to be utilised on the sub panels, or risk losing their registration. I think whole schools need to be reconfigured or extended or rebuilt with the input of occupational hazard/ public health expert risk assessments BEFORE they can be opened.

But ya, I'm just here to have a go at teachers, sure.

You say this, and yet whenever teachers with experience of working in schools point out that
these guidelines are inadequate and impractical (the diagrams for classroom layout alone are hilariously bad) you look to argue with them.

I'm seriously disappointed with these guidelines precisely BECAUSE I want to get back in the classroom full-time. When I point out the flaws it is BECAUSE I want schools to reopen and STAY open. I hated, hated, hated wfh. Zoom classes are just not the same thing and it took a lot more preparation to modify classes to be effective online and even then it was difficult to engage every student in a way that is very hard to address when not in person.

The issue is that I don't believe following the guidelines, as laid out, will actually allow us to open and stay that way. That is based on my experience working in a large post primary school. That is my problem and I believe most teachers have the same issue. However, anytime we point out the issues, it is painted as 'lazy teachers' who want to 'keep schools closed'. No matter what, we can't seem to win.

Boggles

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

ASTI are not insisting that everyone wears masks, that's not true.

Current guidance omits the entire primary schoolgoing population and some first years too from any mandatory face coverings.

How many ASTI members work in primary schools?

ldy4mxonucwsq6

Boggles wrote: »

I imagine everyone who can possibly wear them in post primary.

But who knows maybe there is a perfectly logical medical explanation as to why you have to wear one nipping in for bread and not sitting in a packed class room with little ventilation.

It's for practical reasons, changing masks at least once during the day, taking it off for breaks and lunch, wearing it properly.

It's easier to put one on for 5 mins going to a shop (or a short trip on school bus) than it is to wear one all day every day.

It has been approached in a risk v benefit manner and hence quite rightly the advice that they aren't mandatory in school.

caveat emptor

Wow, looks like Fauci saw the quiz question yesterday about the transmissibility from the koreanan study.
That was the point of looking at how many household contacts subsequently got infected off there little darlings over 9.

Great to see they are pushing for an actual review by public health experts instead of saying it'll be grand.

https://twitter.com/R_H_Ebright/status/1288832785344593922?s=20

wirelessdude01

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

ASTI are not insisting that everyone wears masks, that's not true.

Current guidance omits the entire primary schoolgoing population and some first years too from any mandatory face coverings.

But your argument was that u13 don't have to.....

The ASTI are rightly pointing out how it says one thing but something else states differently. You couldn't make the stuff up really. Only in Ireland would the govt be talking through their ar€es.

Loafing Oaf

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

ASTI are not insisting that everyone wears masks, that's not true.

Current guidance omits the entire primary schoolgoing population and some first years too from any mandatory face coverings.

You're quibbling. I can't see the ASTI asking for masks to be mandatory for everyone in secondary schools bar a handful of 12-year-old first years...

Boggles

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

It's for practical reasons, changing masks at least once during the day, taking it off for breaks and lunch, wearing it properly.

It's easier to put one on for 5 mins going to a shop (or a short trip on school bus) than it is to wear one all day every day.

It has been approached in a risk v benefit manner and hence quite rightly the advice that they aren't mandatory in school.

That's all lovely. Fair play to you

But none of those are medical reasons.

And that's why the ASTI are seeking clarity based on science and policy why Health Protection measures apply in one scenario but another, with specific reference to the once in generation global pandemic.

I'd struggle to find anyone valid reason why it is not perfectly acceptable for any representatives of an organisation to seek that information.

I imagine you agree?

Boggles

caveat emptor wrote: »

Wow, looks like Fauci saw the quiz question yesterday about the transmissibility from the koreanan study.
That was the point of looking at how many household contacts subsequently got infected off there little darlings over 9.

Great to see they are pushing for an actual review by public health experts instead of saying it'll be grand.

https://twitter.com/R_H_Ebright/status/1288832785344593922?s=20

CDC are recommending mask usage for all schools, even for the younger kids.

They had a look at the "shure twil will be grand" method of infection control and decided against it.

Benimar

Will Yam wrote: »

The poster said s/he wanted his/her kids to be in a safe environment.

If you want safety, take no risks, stay at home as I said.

This concept of absolute safety is utter nonsense. It doesn’t exist.

That poster is me.

Can you show where I said I wanted absolute safety for them? I’ll even settle for any reference I made to ‘complete’, ‘total’ or anything similar.

I’ll wait.

caveat emptor

What does the new information mean in context of pandemic. We can control risk but assuming only droplet transmission is now 100% wrong. The measures taken in most parts of society haven’t addressed this yet. Will take time to mitigate but common sense regard windows and airflow should be applied.

Don’t take my word for it. Here’s a different random guy on Internet who has a credential or two and is willing to share them with you.

https://twitter.com/alinouriphd/status/1288838288065933313?s=21

chocoholic999

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

It's for practical reasons, changing masks at least once during the day, taking it off for breaks and lunch, wearing it properly.

It's easier to put one on for 5 mins going to a shop (or a short trip on school bus) than it is to wear one all day every day.

It has been approached in a risk v benefit manner and hence quite rightly the advice that they aren't mandatory in school.

Masks will be mandatory if the school cannot implement the 1m SD.

wirelessdude01

chocoholic999 wrote: »

Masks will be mandatory if the school cannot implement the 1m SD.

Stop talking sense 😂

am_zarathustra

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

It's for practical reasons, changing masks at least once during the day, taking it off for breaks and lunch, wearing it properly.

It's easier to put one on for 5 mins going to a shop (or a short trip on school bus) than it is to wear one all day every day.

It has been approached in a risk v benefit manner and hence quite rightly the advice that they aren't mandatory in school.

"Students, faculty and other employees should wear masks properly at all times. Face shields, while not as good as masks — droplets can enter or exit from the bottom or sides — are better than nothing and an option for those who for medical reasons are unable to wear a mask. Everyone should wash hands or sanitize them every hour or so. Adequate ventilation and rigorous nightly cleaning of facilities with disinfectants will also need to be aspects of these return-to-school strategies.

Schools need to reduce class size to allow students to be 6 feet apart. Recommendations from the National Academies of Sciences, Engineering and Medicine and data from other countries suggest some 10 to 15 students in a regular classroom is about right. Students should also be assigned to “pods” or “cohorts” — small groups to limit the number of people they interact with throughout the day. Students should not change classrooms — teachers should — and student arrivals and departures should be staggered."

This is the advice from the NASEM. We probably have two scientist in the whole country that could maybe hope to ever work for this organisation given the type of credentials required. I believe their advice in actually valid. I don't for a second believe any scientist/researcher (and I know a fair few and was one before I became a teacher) would stand over these guidelines. The ASTI are absolutely right to query them

caveat emptor wrote: »

What does the new information mean in context of pandemic. We can control risk but assuming only droplet transmission is now 100% wrong. The measures taken in most parts of society haven’t addressed this yet. Will take time to mitigate but common sense regard windows and airflow should be applied.

Don’t take my word for it. Here’s a different random guy on Internet who has a credential or two and is willing to share them with you.

https://twitter.com/alinouriphd/status/1288838288065933313?s=21

There is a great study done early on in China in a restaurant on spread, completely dependent on where the person was in relation to the person shedding viral particles and the air conditioning unit!! The kids will all be in hoodies and coats!!

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/20/health/airflow-coronavirus-restaurants.html

Will Yam

Benimar wrote: »

That poster is me.

Can you show where I said I wanted absolute safety for them? I’ll even settle for any reference I made to ‘complete’, ‘total’ or anything similar.

I’ll wait.

You said “safe environment”.

An environment is either “safe”, or its less than safe.

So tell me what you mean?

Do you mean a safe environment.

Or do you mean a less than safe environment?

sideswipe

Can anybody point me in the right direction for home tutors at primary level? Had our 10 year old assessed having noticed she was struggling with maths over the lockdown- turns out she has dyscalculia. I don’t believe supports will be available/possible in schools with staff shortages when they reopen as support teachers will need to cover for any teachers missing with symptoms etc.
In fact I think there’s a fair chance it could all go tits up again looking at what is happening around the rest of the world coupled with the reviews of the roadmap by teachers here!

Bobtheman

Jesus this thread just goes on and on. The opening of schools is now really in the hands of principals not anybody here.
I fully expect a delay back given the four week notice of this plan. I fully expect all sorts of cock ups because the state has a **** record on health and housing. It can't plan anything.
Many workplaces are ignoring SD for pragmatic purposes or they have no union to take up the issue .
Let's pray for a cure for this so we can all be healthy again and the blow hards and know it alls here can rant about something else!!

lulublue22

sideswipe wrote: »

Can anybody point me in the right direction for home tutors at primary level? Had our 10 year old assessed having noticed she was struggling with maths over the lockdown- turns out she has dyscalculia. I don’t believe supports will be available/possible in schools with staff shortages when they reopen as support teachers will need to cover for any teachers missing with symptoms etc.
In fact I think there’s a fair chance it could all go tits up again looking at what is happening around the rest of the world coupled with the reviews of the roadmap by teachers here!

Home tutors in the traditional sense is the term applied to those who do home tuition. Home tuition is gov sanctioned and funded. It has a set criteria which tends to be quite strict. In your situation if you don’t wish to send your child back to school you would be looking at home schooling. Home schooling is normally undertaken by parents. If you google home schooling Ireland you will find links to resources etc. I’m not sure you will be in a position to source a teacher to work full time with your child. If that’s what you are looking for. I’m not 100% certain from your post. You will find it easier to source some one to give your child grinds in maths. This is often via noticeboards in local supermarket etc. You could post on Educationposts website . There is a section there that might be a place to start.

sideswipe

Thanks Lulublue. As part of the assessment we were advised to get some extra home support. Homeschooling would be an option because of the nature of our work but she loves school, her teachers and her friends too much for that. I suppose I’m wonders if there are Qualified primary teachers that don’t teach in school settings but rather work privately? It’s come up in conversation with some other parents that if school was to end up closed again or blended learning it might be an option to set up a smaller, more manageable group in a home setting with a teacher where the issues of hygiene, SD, ventilation etc etc could be managed far better with 3 or 4 families sharing the cost for a full or partial week.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

chocoholic999 wrote: »

Masks will be mandatory if the school cannot implement the 1m SD.

Where exactly does it say that because that's not what I've read in the guidelines?

Masks won't be mandatory in our schools.

The schools are an exception otherwise they wouldn't have been closed for 6 months.

If it was that easy then why didn't we just make it mandatory back in May and open back up the schools then?

The countries that have "recommended" masks for pupils were closed for a few weeks at most.

If it wasn't masks it'd be some other sticking point.

Bobtheman

sideswipe wrote: »

Thanks Lulublue. As part of the assessment we were advised to get some extra home support. Homeschooling would be an option because of the nature of our work but she loves school, her teachers and her friends too much for that. I suppose I’m wonders if there are Qualified primary teachers that don’t teach in school settings but rather work privately? It’s come up in conversation with some other parents that if school was to end up closed again or blended learning it might be an option to set up a smaller, more manageable group in a home setting with a teacher where the issues of hygiene, SD, ventilation etc etc could be managed far better with 3 or 4 families sharing the cost for a full or partial week.

Try schooldays.ie they have adverts there

lulublue22

sideswipe wrote: »

Thanks Lulublue. As part of the assessment we were advised to get some extra home support. Homeschooling would be an option because of the nature of our work but she loves school, her teachers and her friends too much for that. I suppose I’m wonders if there are Qualified primary teachers that don’t teach in school settings but rather work privately? It’s come up in conversation with some other parents that if school was to end up closed again or blended learning it might be an option to set up a smaller, more manageable group in a home setting with a teacher where the issues of hygiene, SD, ventilation etc etc could be managed far better with 3 or 4 families sharing the cost for a full or partial week.

Honest answer I don’t know but given the lack of subs at local levelI’d doubt it. You will also need to factor in that the gov will be setting up national sub panels and will be looking to boost sub numbers. I can’t think why any qualified teacher now would opt for a private arrangement due to prsi/ sick pay issues etc . It might suit a local retired person but they are retired for a reason and in the present circumstances it may not be appealing.

am_zarathustra

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Where exactly does it say that because that's not what I've read in the guidelines?

Masks won't be mandatory in our schools.

The schools are an exception otherwise they wouldn't have been closed for 6 months.

If it was that easy then why didn't we just make it mandatory back in May and open back up the schools then?

The countries that have "recommended" masks for pupils were closed for a few weeks at most.

If it wasn't masks it'd be some other sticking point.

Sigh, there are a number of documents to read, some specific to topics or school stage. This is from Framework for physical distancing in post primaries.

"In exceptional circumstances, where notwithstanding the application of the measures in the above framework, physical distancing by organisational means for a larger class proves not to be possible, then the school must consider the use of face covering/visors in that larger class. This exceptional measure should be kept continually under review by the school, who should continually make every effort to devise an alternative solution using the measures set out at 1 to 6 above.

The use of face coverings/visors must be implemented where the 1 metre distance cannot be achieved. For example:

(a) more than 24 students in a 49sq classroom that has been fully cleared
(b) more than 20 students in a 42sqm classroom.

Staff or students who cannot wear face coverings or visors for health reasons should be based in other classrooms or areas wherever possible. Students should not be required to wear face coverings or visors for the duration of the whole school day."

Many schools will be in this position anyway, we have several, very small rooms.

I also noticed you completely ignored the information I provided from probably the most impressive collection of scientists in the world......but sure, I'd say the lads in the DOE know best

chocoholic999

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Where exactly does it say that because that's not what I've read in the guidelines?

Masks won't be mandatory in our schools.

The schools are an exception otherwise they wouldn't have been closed for 6 months.

If it was that easy then why didn't we just make it mandatory back in May and open back up the schools then?

The countries that have "recommended" masks for pupils were closed for a few weeks at most.

If it wasn't masks it'd be some other sticking point.

It’s in the framework for social distancing. Another poster has posted the relevant paragraph. The fact is that some schools just won’t be able to implement 1m SD, even after implementing everything in the roadmap. Students in those schools will have to wear masks for any class where SD is impossible.

Spanish Eyes

Don't kill me yet, but what about visors for everyone. They are ok from a breathing pov, you can see and hear people aswell. I've used them. They cost (I think) a tenner in Super Valu.

Just wondered if this could be something to be explored rather than other either dubious or futile suggestions.

Hand gel at every move too. One for everyone in the audience. Use the "optional" donation for Schools to invest in PPE maybe now?

I caveat my post by saying that I have no school going kids now, so be kind.

chocoholic999

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Don't kill me yet, but what about visors for everyone. They are ok from a breathing pov, you can see and hear people aswell. I've used them. They cost (I think) a tenner in Super Valu.

Just wondered if this could be something to be explored rather than other either dubious or futile suggestions.

Hand gel at every move too. One for everyone in the audience. Use the "optional" donation for Schools to invest in PPE maybe now?

I caveat my post by saying that I have no school going kids now, so be kind.

Visors would certainly be more comfortable than masks. Others have posted that they are not a effective as masks though but I’m not sure.

combat14

just heard of 3 teachers not coming back from dubai this year wonder what the numbers of available of staff will be like for next year

BonsaiKitten

sideswipe wrote: »

Thanks Lulublue. As part of the assessment we were advised to get some extra home support. Homeschooling would be an option because of the nature of our work but she loves school, her teachers and her friends too much for that. I suppose I’m wonders if there are Qualified primary teachers that don’t teach in school settings but rather work privately? It’s come up in conversation with some other parents that if school was to end up closed again or blended learning it might be an option to set up a smaller, more manageable group in a home setting with a teacher where the issues of hygiene, SD, ventilation etc etc could be managed far better with 3 or 4 families sharing the cost for a full or partial week.

I've seen a lot of talk about American parents doing that so I expect that some Irish will look into it. I'd say there are some immunocompromised or retired teachers who won't return to the classroom (some would have subbed previously) who might be happy to do it, particularly in November as people often retire then. If your child wasn't going back to school that could be a good strategy. Not sure where you'd find them though.

If your child is going back to school then you probably just want a primary teacher to do grinds with your child, an hour or two would make a world of difference. There are a lot of teachers out there who do them, edposts/noticeboards etc are good places to look.

wirelessdude01

combat14 wrote: »

just heard of 3 teachers not coming back from dubai this year wonder what the numbers of available of staff will be like for next year

And the way the health professionals were treated anyone giving up a contract abroad to come back and 'don the green jersey' needs their heads knocked together.

Spanish Eyes

chocoholic999 wrote: »

Visors would certainly be more comfortable than masks. Others have posted that they are not a effective as masks though but I’m not sure.

Better than blended learning or them all cramming in 30 to a class with an uncomfortable mask I would think. And the teacher can be seen and heard and vice versa. Might be worth a shot.

Alrigghtythen

am_zarathustra wrote: »

"Students, faculty and other employees should wear masks properly at all times. Face shields, while not as good as masks — droplets can enter or exit from the bottom or sides — are better than nothing and an option for those who for medical reasons are unable to wear a mask. Everyone should wash hands or sanitize them every hour or so. Adequate ventilation and rigorous nightly cleaning of facilities with disinfectants will also need to be aspects of these return-to-school strategies.

Schools need to reduce class size to allow students to be 6 feet apart. Recommendations from the National Academies of Sciences, Engineering and Medicine and data from other countries suggest some 10 to 15 students in a regular classroom is about right. Students should also be assigned to “pods” or “cohorts” — small groups to limit the number of people they interact with throughout the day. Students should not change classrooms — teachers should — and student arrivals and departures should be staggered."

This is the advice from the NASEM. We probably have two scientist in the whole country that could maybe hope to ever work for this organisation given the type of credentials required. I believe their advice in actually valid. I don't for a second believe any scientist/researcher (and I know a fair few and was one before I became a teacher) would stand over the current guidelines. The ASTI are absolutely right to query them



There is a great study done early on in China in a restaurant on spread, completely dependent on where the person was in relation to the person shedding viral particles and the air conditioning unit!! The kids will all be in hoodies and coats!!

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/20/health/airflow-coronavirus-restaurants.html

National Academies of Sciences, Engineering and Medicine also recommends using tents and canopy as extra classroom space. There should be plenty of ventilation in those.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

chocoholic999 wrote: »

It’s in the framework for social distancing. Another poster has posted the relevant paragraph. The fact is that some schools just won’t be able to implement 1m SD, even after implementing everything in the roadmap. Students in those schools will have to wear masks for any class where SD is impossible.

So they can wear a visor if the school does not have available space to meet the criteria and they don't have a medical reason not to wear one.

Students still won't have to wear masks though, they can wear a visor (in "exceptional circumstances") which is much more comfortable than a mask (or they can get a note and be excused from wearing any face covering and be moved to a room where social distancing is possible).

"The school must consider" does not equal they have to.

Specifically states that any face covering is not to be worn all day either.

And nothing of the sort for primary I take it.

wirelessdude01

am_zarathustra wrote: »

(a) more than 24 students in a 49sq classroom that has been fully cleared
(b) more than 20 students in a 42sqm classroom.

Quick question, does this also apply at upper primary level? I have 28 in a space that I think measures approx 52sqm at most.

am_zarathustra

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Better than blended learning or them all cramming in 30 to a class with an uncomfortable mask I would think. And the teacher can be seen and heard and vice versa. Might be worth a shot.

They are categorically not as safe. The only way it would be safe for the teacher would be if all the students wore masks and they wore a shield but it's worth noting that the teacher could be sheding virus then so would need to be very mindful of staying 2m away. I agree though, given the distance we will be at a mask would really muffle the voice.

Masks for kids, shields for teachers, that's what I would have assumed the recommendation would have been as that is very clearly what research is saying.

I'd be happy with that to be honest

Spanish Eyes

On a more studious note, does anyone know if DES has had any contact with their counterparts in countries where schools reopened months ago now?

How are they getting on? Has there been a spike or spikes? What do they recommend and so on.

Just wondered.

Rimmy

am_zarathustra wrote: »

They are categorically not as safe. The only way it would be safe for the teacher would be if all the students wore masks and they wore a shield but it's worth noting that the teacher could be sheding virus then so would need to be very mindful of staying 2m away. I agree though, given the distance we will be at a mask would really muffle the voice.

Masks for kids, shields for teachers, that's what I would have assumed the recommendation would have been as that is very clearly what research is saying.

I'd be happy with that to be honest

Would rather everyone had a face shield. Masks just lead to necessary face touching.

bmc58

am_zarathustra wrote: »

They are categorically not as safe. The only way it would be safe for the teacher would be if all the students wore masks and they wore a shield but it's worth noting that the teacher could be sheding virus then so would need to be very mindful of staying 2m away. I agree though, given the distance we will be at a mask would really muffle the voice.

Masks for kids, shields for teachers, that's what I would have assumed the recommendation would have been as that is very clearly what research is saying.

I'd be happy with that to be honest

A five year old in Senior Infants cannot be expected to wear a mask.

Spanish Eyes

am_zarathustra wrote: »

They are categorically not as safe. The only way it would be safe for the teacher would be if all the students wore masks and they wore a shield but it's worth noting that the teacher could be sheding virus then so would need to be very mindful of staying 2m away. I agree though, given the distance we will be at a mask would really muffle the voice.

Masks for kids, shields for teachers, that's what I would have assumed the recommendation would have been as that is very clearly what research is saying.

I'd be happy with that to be honest

The students will not be heard much though, you can imagine the sh!ts and giggles behind their masks in class! I understand the current research on masks but that seems to change by the minute too, in a school setting it is not ideal from what I am reading.

I hope that teachers get the protection they want and need. If I were a teacher I'd absolutely insist on a visor for myself anyway.