Deferred State Exams 2020 [SEE MOD NOTE POST #1]

Mardy Bum

Chaya Fresh Shoehorn wrote: »

I'm very disappointed in the complete recklessness and populism of Simon Harris. He had come up in my estimation during this crisis but I'm afraid his weak reactive pandering to media pressure, while failing to proactively tackle any issues, comes to the fore once again. There is no health advice to reopen schools this term in any capacity - both Tony Holohan and Philip Nolan have made that pretty clear. They have even been worryingly non committal about even offering hope for the safety of the postponed LC. Jennifer O'Connell wrote an article yesterday saying we should prioritise opening schools, which was full of vague suggestions and unworkable notions. She got a lot of fair criticism on Twitter from teachers and parents alike, became petulant in her responses claiming abuse when none was apparent, and Simon tweeted his support to her and thanked her for opening this "important conversation." Now today he's suddenly exploring the idea. Either she was dishonestly used as a government mouthpiece to test the waters, or he is a weak populist easily swayed by media pressure.

The irony was that if a right wing populist said what she said they would be derided. They certainly wouldn't receive messages of support from politicians, journalists and academics. See Toby Young for comparison. Because she is more amenable, she got applause for starting the "conversation" and sympathy when rightfully criticised.

Disappointing to see academics in education applaud. Says a lot about the state of third level.

Coneygree

I am completely puzzled by Harris saying this. I actually thought it was a fabricated quote when it was posted in our school whatsapp this morning. We can barely go to the shops at the moment, and that looks like it'll be the case for another month, at least. Most shops and services are closed and look like they will stay closed in the near future. All gatherings are banned...yet they want small children to return to normality first? Before everything else resumes? I would have thought schools would be one of the last things to resume normal proceedings for obvious reasons. Maybe he's trying to keep morale up but this is a complete no-go in my opinion. The logistics of even having one class group in school for one day in a safer environment than their own home is impossible currently.

Bobtheman

I think we should all take it down a notch. I'm sure there is some discussion about it at Government level. I'm not sure it's fair to call it reckless as it's not a definite policy yet.
It's hard to follow the science of it all. None of us are total experts . This is a unique event. If there was a Bible for all of this it would be out by now but there isn't. Nation's have varied in their approaches . There is not one way out.
Let's not panic- it's not as if he said schools opening in a week ?!

km79

Bobtheman wrote: »

I think we should all take it down a notch. I'm sure there is some discussion about it at Government level. I'm not sure it's fair to call it reckless as it's not a definite policy yet.
It's hard to follow the science of it all. None of us are total experts . This is a unique event. If there was a Bible for all of this it would be out by now but there isn't. Nation's have varied in their approaches . There is not one way out.
Let's not panic- it's not as if he said schools opening in a week ?!

Given that they can’t decide whether Hardware shops are opened or closed I don’t think they should be throwing out comments about schools reopening tbh

TheValeyard

khalessi wrote: »

I think their plan is, mention it, get a reaction, then plan

Ahhhh from Plan A to Plan B

Bobtheman

km79 wrote: »

Given that they can’t decide whether Hardware shops are opened or closed I don’t think they should be throwing out comments about schools reopening tbh

Yeah you have a point. Im only emphasising that its all up in the air at the moment.

Bobtheman

Coneygree wrote: »

I am completely puzzled by Harris saying this. I actually thought it was a fabricated quote when it was posted in our school whatsapp this morning. We can barely go to the shops at the moment, and that looks like it'll be the case for another month, at least. Most shops and services are closed and look like they will stay closed in the near future. All gatherings are banned...yet they want small children to return to normality first? Before everything else resumes? I would have thought schools would be one of the last things to resume normal proceedings for obvious reasons. Maybe he's trying to keep morale up but this is a complete no-go in my opinion. The logistics of even having one class group in school for one day in a safer environment than their own home is impossible currently.

He never said theyd return first. I think on May 5th we will see some business allowed to open . The earliest for such a primary school opening would be June. And then very curtailed-it would be all primary school pupils in on one day. But who knows?

km79

Irish times putting an interesting spin on TUI faq
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/no-guarantee-leaving-cert-will-proceed-this-summer-teachers-union-tells-members-1.4232694?mode=amp

km79

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/back-to-school-partial-reopening-to-be-examined-by-health-authorities-simon-harris-1.4232636

Seems to have been primary schools he was talking about. And June is mentioned.
Also in article it suggests a start of secondary school next year will be a blend of classroom and remote learning for students. That will be tricky if different years are in different days cos the teachers will have to travel to teach whatever year groups are in so won't be able to remote teach from home. And classrooms will be at a premium if social distancing is in place.
Still interesting to see what is being considered

Rosita

Just read a piece on the RTÉ website and it quoted Harris and one of the medical experts about the schools. Neither mentioned primary schools. Seems to be Sixth Years they are interested in (according to that report) Back to question A then - if it is possible to even discuss the possibility of bring Sixth Years back to school in May then why defer the LC?

paddybarry

km79 wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/back-to-school-partial-reopening-to-be-examined-by-health-authorities-simon-harris-1.4232636

Seems to have been primary schools he was talking about. And June is mentioned.
Also in article it suggests a start of secondary school next year will be a blend of classroom and remote learning for students. That will be tricky if different years are in different days cos the teachers will have to travel to teach whatever year groups are in so won't be able to remote teach from home. And classrooms will be at a premium if social distancing is in place.
Still interesting to see what is being considered

Why would you not be able to teach other years remotely? Surely you just go to class and use that space?

Treppen

"The TUI also says it has been given a written guarantee that remote teaching and learning will cease when the public health emergency measures are over.

The rise in use of online teaching due to closure of schools has resulted in speculation that it could become a permanent feature of how students are taught in future."

Says who?

Not me anyway. People still don't get it, the education takes place with the interaction between teacher and students. Remote teaching is a poor sticking plaster substitute at best.

km79

paddybarry wrote: »

Why would you not be able to teach other years remotely? Surely you just go to class and use that space?

That was my first thought too
But I’m assuming social distancing will still be in place so classes will be so spread out over all rooms
Anyway that’s a long long way away yet

km79

Rosita wrote: »

Just read a piece on the RTÉ website and it quoted Harris and one of the medical experts about the schools. Neither mentioned primary schools. Seems to be Sixth Years they are interested in (according to that report) Back to question A then - if it is possible to even discuss the possibility of bring Sixth Years back to school in May then why defer the LC?

Indeed
https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0419/1132468-children-return-school/

So his comment this morning is fuelling more speculation and confusion ....

r93kaey5p2izun

paddybarry wrote: »

Why would you not be able to teach other years remotely? Surely you just go to class and use that space?

But if classes are split into several groups teachers will be used to cover the extra groups from the year that is in, and won't be then available to teach groups at home. Only 1st and 5th might be in, for example, but they'll be spread out across the whole school and using up far more teachers.

Treppen

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

I’d suggest to people who think that’s it’s as simple as saying “ schools should open one day a week” be given 10 6 year olds to keep 2 ms apart all day , ensure the children wash their hands properly at hourly intervals , disinfect every surface the children touch and ensure all 10 don’t touch their faces , use proper cough hygiene and ensure parents collecting the children stay 2m apart as well.

We are going to need to go back to school before there is an effective vaccine , but will need the proper resources to do so. Primary schools , in the main , don’t have spare rooms . If it’s proposed to split children over different rooms each day , these rooms would have to be cleaned top to toe every single day . In primary , it’s impossible to get subs , so what happens when teachers fall ill? If a child becomes ill , are schools wide open to legal action ?

This teacher has it all figured out byhookorbycrook :pac::pac::pac:

https://twitter.com/Mr_Minchin/status/1251089002100330496?s=20

Treppen

looking for a solution at lunchtime? ... look no further..

https://twitter.com/bell_allie/status/1251123891910651905?s=20

km79

political analyst

I think it would be viable to postpone this year's Leaving Cert (LC) until next year, when this year's students can sit the LC exams with next year's LC students. If it means that it would have the knock-on effect of a delay of a year in infants' entry into primary school, so be it - more money should be put into Early Childcare and Education (ECCE) to create more places for those infants.

Inspector Coptoor

political analyst wrote: »

I think it would be viable to postpone this year's Leaving Cert (LC) until next year, when this year's students can sit the LC exams with next year's LC students. If it means that it would have the knock-on effect of a delay of a year in infants' entry into primary school, so be it - more money should be put into Early Childcare and Education (ECCE) to create more places for those infants.

So, 121,000 students to do the LC next year?
At the same time?

And no graduates in 4 years time?

Completely and utterly unworkable.

C__MC

The actual thoughts of trying to remotely teach third years tomorrow

km79

C__MC wrote: »

The actual thoughts of trying to remotely teach third years tomorrow

I’m just going to plough on with my revision plan

shesty

You could do 2 classes a day in per day...so have say JI and 6th in on Mondays, SI and 5th on tuesday and so on...it doesn't have to be the whole school in on the one day....
There are ways and means.Anyway, Harris said that is one option they are looking at, not THE option.
Still lots to be decided.

Rosita

km79 wrote: »

Indeed
https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0419/1132468-children-return-school/

So his comment this morning is fuelling more speculation and confusion ....

I think Harris is getting carried away in his 'suddenly they've all forgotten how disastrous I was over the last few years - now all I have to do is sound plausible in front of a microphone and I have no trollies to explain (and even the doctor guy announces about the dead people)' persona. He also appears to have taken over as a GAA spokesman referring to their competitions.

Rosita

shesty wrote: »

You could do 2 classes a day in per day...so have say JI and 6th in on Mondays, SI and 5th on tuesday and so on...it doesn't have to be the whole school in on the one day....
There are ways and means.Anyway, Harris said that is one option they are looking at, not THE option.
Still lots to be decided.

Simon Harris has said that exam classes will be the priority so not sure that senior infants will be top of the list in the short term.

Rosita

political analyst wrote: »

I think it would be viable to postpone this year's Leaving Cert (LC) until next year, when this year's students can sit the LC exams with next year's LC students. If it means that it would have the knock-on effect of a delay of a year in infants' entry into primary school, so be it - more money should be put into Early Childcare and Education (ECCE) to create more places for those infants.

The points race would be fun!

jimmytwotimes 2013

C__MC wrote: »

The actual thoughts of trying to remotely teach third years tomorrow

What third year is gonna engage? No exam til Sept. Schools out for summer for third yrs!

Rosita

km79 wrote: »

I’m just going to plough on with my revision plan

Likewise. Would be good to know what we are revising for though. The LC doesn't bother me - at least it's clear what exam they're doing. That's a start.

mirrorwall14

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

What third year is gonna engage? No exam til Sept. Schools out for summer for third yrs!

Standing in the queue at aldi listening to two parents chatting about how wonderful it is that the junior cert is cancelled and they can just move on. I butted in to point out that they have to do the exam in September. Cue some very confused parents who never read past the headlines..

km79

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

What third year is gonna engage? No exam til Sept. Schools out for summer for third yrs!

I’ll do my bit
I am expecting nothing back !