Deferred State Exams 2020 [SEE MOD NOTE POST #1]

km79

https://www.education.ie/en/Press-Events/Press-Releases/2020-press-releases/PR20-04-29.html

happywithlife

km79 wrote: »

https://www.education.ie/en/Press-Events/Press-Releases/2020-press-releases/PR20-04-29.html

Under the revised arrangements and in light of the exceptional circumstances presented by the COVID-19 pandemic, the work and achievement of third year Junior Cycle students will be recognised with a state certificate from the Department of Education and Skills.

As soon as possible after the end of the current school year, students will receive a written school report on their learning achievements in each subject, short course and/or priority learning unit

Schools are also being given autonomy to decide whether to run school-based assessments and what form they take. Options to consider include school-designed examinations, tasks, projects, assignments, essay style questions, presentations, or other tasks agreed at a local level. Guidance for schools on reporting to students and parents, developed with the advice of the advisory group of stakeholders, will be published by the Department.

The bones of the press release to save people having to.open it up

Rosita

Schools are also being given autonomy to decide whether to run school-based assessments and what form they take.


Have to laugh at this face-saving claptrap. As if the Dept of Ed still retained the power to bestow autonomy on schools on this matter. That horse had bolted and was in the next parish by the time that statement was thought up. Their challenge now is to not make a dog's dinner of the LC as well.

Inspector Coptoor

What I am taking from this is that a school and moreover, a department, have the freedom to decide how to proceed in terms of assessment.

I don't see it as my role to assess third years again.
We have brought them through 5 house exams, a mock in most cases, 2 CBAs and an AT.

There's enough data there and my suggestion would be to keep teaching them until the 2nd last week in May and then give them an average grade over the last 3 years that can be adjusted a little non a positive sense if near a grade boundary.

I, for one, am not marking open book exams as they have no value or validity.

Benicetomonty

Bottom line is assessment via remote learning is neither practical nor fair. Why?

1. Not practical. Not all students will be able to do it. What do they get at as their grade at the end of such an assessment?
2. Unfair. Cheating will be rife. Zero standardisation. A free-for-all. And biased towards the better students, because the better you are at studying, the better you'll be at cheating!


In my opinion teachers should go back to Sept, add up all the grades between then and March (maybe including a few more recent assignments if turnouts amongst entire class groups was high), get an avg, establish a descriptor based on that figure and job done.
I know people here balked when I suggested a similar solution for the LC (and with good cause tbf) but hopefully it might be more acceptable for the JC. It wont be state certified, the work will have been fairly (and non retrospectively) graded and it will absolutely be a once off since the dept are leaving it to schools to determine what"s best. Time to leave this sorry saga behind and do what is fairest and simplest for everybody's sake.

jimmytwotimes 2013

km79 wrote: »

And why are ye agreeing to that ?

As explained previously, only 1 or 2 willing to speak up on our staff and the rest like sheep, allowing management free rein generally. Not a unique situation I wud say going on what others are asked to do.

rainbowtrout

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

As explained previously, only 1 or 2 willing to speak up on our staff and the rest like sheep, allowing management free rein generally. Not a unique situation I wud say going on what others are asked to do.

That won't change until people start to speak up. People do have to take some responsibility for their situation.

jimmytwotimes 2013

rainbowtrout wrote: »

That won't change until people start to speak up. People do have to take some responsibility for their situation.

Of course but not looking likely, can't be the 1 of 2 speaking up all the time. Plenty moan in private, no good if you won't speak up

Mardy Bum

The only way attainment can be credited with any degree of validity will be through a descriptor. Achieved/Partially Achieved. Leave it at that. The world keeps turning.

Giving anything more specific is just making a mockery of the system.

Before anyone mentions the predictive grades at LC, this is nothing of the sort.

trihead

School report - May /June - Teachers & Schools

As soon as possible after the end of the current school year, students will receive a written school report on their learning achievements in each subject, short course and/or priority learning unit

Certificate of Completion - Sept/Oct - DES

This will issue from the Department early in the next school year. It will provide each student with a certificate confirming completion of the Junior Cycle programme of study, including the list of subjects, short courses and/or priority learning units studied and the level at which the subject was studied.

* pulled from education.ie doc

Purefrank128

trihead wrote: »

Certificate of Completion - Sept/Oct - SEC

No, from DES, not SEC!

rainbowtrout

I had noticed a bit more engagement from my third years this week, probably from the last round of 'you'll now have exams in May instead of September'. I'm wondering if this is the end of their engagement now or will they hang in there to get the good report?

TheValeyard

rainbowtrout wrote: »

I had noticed a bit more engagement from my third years this week, probably from the last round of 'you'll now have exams in May instead of September'. I'm wondering if this is the end of their engagement now or will they hang in there to get the good report?

Good kids will stay.

randylonghorn

TheValeyard wrote: »

Good kids will stay.

Good students will stay engaged.

Bad students can be good kids!

Sorry for being pedantic, I know that's what you really meant and feel free to kick my arse, but as written it just stuck right in my craw and I had to say something!

TheValeyard

randylonghorn wrote: »

Good students will stay engaged.

Bad students can be good kids!

Sorry for being pedantic, I know that's what you really meant and feel free to kick my arse, but as written it just stuck right in my craw and I had to say something!

Kick your ass?

Sorry I dont believe in corporal punishment

Shn99

Emma o Kelly on RTE news saying "if they can do PGs for the JC then one would wonder can they do it for the LC"

Icsics

Shn99 wrote: »

Emma o Kelly on RTE news saying "if they can do PGs for the JC then one would wonder can they do it for the LC"

Hears that & JMc didn’t rule it out....there ur headline for 2mws papers

r93kaey5p2izun

I think it's a scandal that all this fuss is being made about the JC while the LCA remains ignored. There is no total certainty for the LC, but all outstanding elements have currently been addressed in some form ie either cancelled with 100% awarded, or postponed to take place in July/August. There is disagreement over how fair and workable it is, but a statement on what they intend has been made. Whereas for LCA, some exams were omitted from the statement, and Year 1 assessments were totally ignored. That is just not acceptable.

ethical

Credit where credit is due regarding the JC. Ms.McDonald of the ASTI requested very early on that the Dept acknowledge the participation of the JC students 3 yr programme and she was turned down ,refused flatly and today the Dept come back and say yes we will do that!
I know some people on here think I can be critical of our Union representatives and true I can be,we pay their wages!, but I can praise them too and welcome the work of the ASTI and Ms McDonald in securing something for the hard working JC students.

spurious

The LCA has always been the poor relation.

It's almost as if some of the main players in the Department don't know it exists...now that couldn't be right, could it? (cough)

Random sample

spurious wrote: »

The LCA has always been the poor relation.

It's almost as if some of the main players in the Department don't know it exists...now that couldn't be right, could it? (cough)

You’d imagine though, that whoever is in charge of LCA in the SEC would be shouting about it at every given opportunity though, no? This is their time to shine!

I’ve seen so many teachers in recent weeks ask about the LCAs and the difficulty they will have with the current plan etc. I’ve put it in my submission to the union, because i felt it wasn’t getting enough coverage, and I know some of my colleagues did too, so I don’t understand how they aren’t aware now! And rectifying the situation.

km79

Update from asti Sc rep
Our concerns in relation to junior certs 2020 have all been taken into consideration.
1 There will be no exams in September, the junior cert is cancelled.
2 All pupils will receive a certificate of completion from the DES at the end of their 3 year cycle.
3 The profile of achievement for Junior Cycle(JCPA) is gone for this year.
4 Schools will issue reports for third years, like they do for all other years in the school. In the interest of equity the result should be based predominantly on work done prior to lockdown. The report can take format of marks grades comments or descriptors this to be agreed by staffs in schools . This is a school summer report nothing else.
5 The union website www.asti.ie will be updated tomorrow to give answers to questions you may have. If you still have questions don’t hesitate to get in touch.

Point 4 is very very interesting for schools going ahead with exams

Treppen

Shn99 wrote: »

Emma o Kelly on RTE news saying "if they can do PGs for the JC then one would wonder can they do it for the LC"

I know one teacher who's notorious for giving high grades in exams to keep parents happy. If predicted grades go through she'll become the best teacher in the country :pac::pac::pac:

rainbowtrout

km79 wrote: »

Point 3 is very very interesting for schools going ahead with exams

Schools like Claregalway will have to adjust their plans. Maybe the Dept don’t like being told how to run things by rogue principals

km79

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Schools like Claregalway will have to adjust their plans. Maybe the Dept don’t like being told how to run things by rogue principals

I actually meant point 4 sorry

They won’t . Cos they were not intending on giving exams I think

ethical

I feel really sorry for all the JC students (and teachers!) that have worked flat out since March 12th only to be told now that the work after March 12th should not be considered!!!!! So for the student (or teacher !) that didnt bother their backside,no harm done!
(Of course the ETB "confidence and supply" form or was it "protection & accountability",so many box ticking feckin forms now, will catch the teacher out!!!)

ngunners

ethical wrote: »

I feel really sorry for all the JC students (and teachers!) that have worked flat out since March 12th only to be told now that the work after March 12th should not be considered!!!!! So for the student (or teacher !) that didnt bother their backside,no harm done!
(Of course the ETB "confidence and supply" form or was it "protection & accountability",so many box ticking feckin forms now, will catch the teacher out!!!)

Work after March the 12th shouldn’t be considered for what?

mirrorwall14

ethical wrote: »

I feel really sorry for all the JC students (and teachers!) that have worked flat out since March 12th only to be told now that the work after March 12th should not be considered!!!!! So for the student (or teacher !) that didnt bother their backside,no harm done!
(Of course the ETB "confidence and supply" form or was it "protection & accountability",so many box ticking feckin forms now, will catch the teacher out!!!)

Since when is work during the lock down not being considered? Source?

km79

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

Since when is work during the lock down not being considered? Source?

Asti SC rep
4 Schools will issue reports for third years, like they do for all other years in the school. In the interest of equity the result should be based predominantly on work done prior to lockdown. The report can take format of marks grades comments or descriptors this to be agreed by staffs in schools . This is a school summer report nothing else.

It’s not saying it shouldn’t be considered
But it is certainly giving schools that option !

Purefrank128

ethical wrote: »

I feel really sorry for all the JC students (and teachers!) that have worked flat out since March 12th only to be told now that the work after March 12th should not be considered!!!!! So for the student (or teacher !) that didnt bother their backside,no harm done!
(Of course the ETB "confidence and supply" form or was it "protection & accountability",so many box ticking feckin forms now, will catch the teacher out!!!)

Nowhere does it say that work after March 12 should not be considered. The ASTI quote it that "in the interest of equity the result should be based predominantly on work done prior to lockdown".

Predominantly, not exclusively.

So clearly work done after March 12 can and probably should be assessed. That's what the ASTI quote says.