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Truth about traveller crime

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    #422
    Morgans
    Registered Users Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭Morgans


    Omackeral wrote: »
    Well done. You missed the entire point of the post. I said blatantly disregard anything else about the man. It’s what was said and the reaction to same, not who said it or how they themselves fared afterwards. Majority of people didn’t and don’t care about Casey. Most cast a protest vote.

    So, thankfully there wasnt this huge upswell of downtrodden never listened to voters waiting for a messiah to stand up for them. As many had pretended there was in the aftermath of that presidential election. In what was the most boring presidential election where many felt there wouldnt even be a contest, the media caught onto him and gave him a profile. Hilarous that there wasn't pitchforks out for his tax-dodging ways.


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    #423
    Morgans
    Registered Users Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭Morgans


    deaddonkey15 wrote: »
    He finished second. 1 in 3 voters gave him a first or second preference.

    https://www.donegaldaily.com/2020/02/10/general-election-2020-peter-casey-eliminated-on-fourth-count/


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    #424
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Morgans wrote: »
    So, thankfully there wasnt this huge upswell of downtrodden never listened to voters waiting for a messiah to stand up for them. As many had pretended there was in the aftermath of that presidential election. In what was the most boring presidential election where many felt there wouldnt even be a contest, the media caught onto him and gave him a profile. Hilarous that there wasn't pitchforks out for his tax-dodging ways.

    Forget about Peter Casey, the man. Focus on why so many latched on to what he said. Do you think it's because it resonated with folks? Or maybe you believe what the other candidates were saying about having no bother living next door to a Traveller camp?


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    #425
    batman75
    Registered Users Posts: 597 ✭✭✭batman75


    Peter Casey isn't official Ireland in that he isn't a civil servant or serving politician. He doesn't officially represent the people. He definitely hit a nerve with voters but Michael D is popular so once he declared he was running again he was a shoe in.


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    #426
    Morgans
    Registered Users Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭Morgans


    Omackeral wrote: »
    Forget about Peter Casey, the man. Focus on why so many latched on to what he said. Do you think it's because it resonated with folks? Or maybe you believe what the other candidates were saying about having no bother living next door to a Traveller camp?

    If people of Donegal (or North Dublin) wanted Peter Casey and his views to be represented in a leglislative assembly they could have voted for him. They didn't. Also, John Waters and Gemma O'Doherty did similarly well when asking people for their vote as being part of the downtrodden truth-tellers, despised by the media/establishment in the general election.

    Most people can see through the prejudiced and not at all racist rhetoric/goh****ery.

    Some people are fooled and easily riled up. Oldest sthtick in the book and understandable why people are victims. If lack of taxpaying was really the issue with travellers, there would be lads on here complaining about Apple employees rather than halting sites - what was it - the only traveller I'd trust is one in the cemetery.


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    #427
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,339 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    Morgans wrote: »
    https://www.donegaldaily.com/2020/02/10/general-election-2020-peter-casey-eliminated-on-fourth-count/

    That's the general election, and only for Donegal, not the presidential election.


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    #428
    Morgans
    Registered Users Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭Morgans


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    That's the general election, and only for Donegal, not the presidential election.

    After galvanisig this under the surface not-at-all-racist vote, remind us again how this podium finisher got on in the subsequent general election?

    Was the question...


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    #429
    batman75
    Registered Users Posts: 597 ✭✭✭batman75


    Morgans wrote: »

    If lack of taxpaying was really the issue with travellers, there would be lads on here complaining about Apple employees rather than halting sites - what was it - the only traveller I'd trust is one in the cemetery.

    I suppose the question following on from the piece I quote is do we know how they make their money. More importantly does the state? Even if we go along with the ethnic minority argument, they are still residents of the state. All residents of the state who earn pay tax so surely what's good for the goose is for the gander.


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    #430
    batman75
    Registered Users Posts: 597 ✭✭✭batman75


    Do we have any statistics regarding crime amongst the travelling community versus the settled community. That would surely give us an idea whether it is greater or less.


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    #431
    Morgans
    Registered Users Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭Morgans


    batman75 wrote: »
    Do we have any statistics regarding crime amongst the travelling community versus the settled community. That would surely give us an idea whether it is greater or less.

    And if it turns out that the settled community is responsible for more crime can we not just round them up and have one big bonfire to rid ourselves of the problem for good? These are the questions the media won't touch with a bargepole.


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    #432
    batman75
    Registered Users Posts: 597 ✭✭✭batman75


    Morgans wrote: »

    And if it turns out that the settled community is responsible for more crime can we not just round them up and have one big bonfire to rid ourselves of the problem for good? These are the questions the media won't touch with a bargepole.

    It might help with dispelling perceptions about travellers. All sectors of society commit crime. What do you think it would take for the travelling community to be more accepted by the settled community here in Ireland?


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    #433
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Morgans wrote: »
    If people of Donegal (or North Dublin) wanted Peter Casey and his views to be represented in a leglislative assembly they could have voted for him. They didn't.

    All you’re doing there is hammering home my point ffs! Exactly. It didn’t matter who said it, it’s that it was said. Is that point getting through to you yet? I can only say Casey himself is irrelevant so many more times!


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    #434
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    batman75 wrote: »
    Do we have any statistics regarding crime amongst the travelling community versus the settled community. That would surely give us an idea whether it is greater or less.

    Traveller prisoner population is 11%. Traveler population in Ireland is.....


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    #435
    batman75
    Registered Users Posts: 597 ✭✭✭batman75


    Omackeral wrote: »
    Traveller prisoner population is 11%. Traveler population in Ireland is.....

    Is that a newspaper figure or released in Govt documentation? Does the census form ask you to identify as traveller or otherwise I can't remember.


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    #436
    Morgans
    Registered Users Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭Morgans


    Omackeral wrote: »
    All you’re doing there is hammering home my point ffs! Exactly. It didn’t matter who said it, it’s that it was said. Is that point getting through to you yet? I can only say Casey himself is irrelevant so many more times!

    No its not. Its not Peter Casey, its the far right bigoted group who all play on their truth telling that the liberal media cant handle, (the you wont see this told on RTE, Irish Times etc) brigade. Not just Peter Casey, they didnt get anywhere in the general election. So, while you keep saying there is this groundswell of support for Casey and the likes - and people saying here that 99% of people believe it - thankfully most people can see through the bull****.


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    #437
    shaveAbullock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 965 ✭✭✭shaveAbullock


    batman75 wrote: »
    Is that a newspaper figure or released in Govt documentation? Does the census form ask you to identify as traveller or otherwise I can't remember.

    It does, the census asks what ethnicity you are. Since irish traveller is a recognised ethnicity it is a legitimate answer.

    Census info on Irish Travellers can be found here.

    https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-cp8iter/p8iter/p8itd/


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    #438
    batman75
    Registered Users Posts: 597 ✭✭✭batman75


    I see another poster asked why Travellers are considered an ethnic minority. Aside from Govt Policy do we know why they are considered an ethnic minority?


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    #439
    shaveAbullock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 965 ✭✭✭shaveAbullock


    batman75 wrote: »
    I see another poster asked why Travellers are considered an ethnic minority. Aside from Govt Policy do we know why they are considered an ethnic minority?

    Perhaps because they are a recognised ethnicity by the Irish state and there are only about 30k of them so a minority.


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    #440
    batman75
    Registered Users Posts: 597 ✭✭✭batman75


    shaveAbullock wrote: »
    Perhaps because they are a recognised ethnicity by the Irish state and there are only about 30k of them so a minority.

    I get the minority part. But the ethnicity nobody has been able to answer aside from Govt recognition. They are as Irish as the rest of us. They speak English. Not aware of any traveller literature or music that is distinct from the mainstream.


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    #441
    shaveAbullock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 965 ✭✭✭shaveAbullock


    batman75 wrote: »
    I get the minority part. But the ethnicity nobody has been able to answer aside from Govt recognition. They are as Irish as the rest of us. They speak English. Not aware of any traveller literature or music that is distinct from the mainstream.

    I agree with you but the leaders of the Irish state do not and claim theytravellers do indeed have their own unique culture that's worth preserving.


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    #442
    batman75
    Registered Users Posts: 597 ✭✭✭batman75


    You would wonder does the ethnic status hinder their ability to blend into general society. Maybe they don't want to blend into general society?


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    #443
    deaddonkey15
    Registered Users Posts: 3,576 ✭✭✭deaddonkey15


    Morgans wrote: »
    https://www.donegaldaily.com/2020/02/10/general-election-2020-peter-casey-eliminated-on-fourth-count/
    Morgans wrote: »
    After getting this huge profile of a truth-teller, exposing the nonsense of liberal ireland and giving voice to the 99% of people who feel the same, he did finish third in the lowest turnout in National history for a presidential election. A post in which he would never have been able to do anything to change the situation

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/presidential-election/results


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    #444
    na1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 921 ✭✭✭na1


    Adam9213 wrote: »
    Now if I was a young traveler I would hate society and would rob and steal from you no problems whatsoever, I would have the same attitude as young black people in the US in the 80s who had the same stereotypes put onto them.

    So if you rob or kill somebody, it will be their fault?


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    #445
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    batman75 wrote: »
    I see another poster asked why Travellers are considered an ethnic minority. Aside from Govt Policy do we know why they are considered an ethnic minority?

    inbreeding?


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    #446
    na1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 921 ✭✭✭na1


    pablo128 wrote: »
    When you freely admit travellers have ready access to firearms and are willing to use them against members of the public, you've lost the argument.

    He meant to say: Travellers are very nice, polite and easy going people. If you disagree with this statement, they'll smash you face or shoot you.


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    #447
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Morgans wrote: »
    So, while you keep saying there is this groundswell of support for Casey

    I have more or less said the opposite around 3 times now. Jesus. I said they don't care about him as a man, they liked the fact that he called a spade a spade when it came to a notorious group. A protest vote if ever there was one. There's no talking to you because you don't read what's written.

    The fact you're now dragging the bloody alt-right into a conversation about Travellers means you're not worth any more time IMO.


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    #448
    Granadino
    Registered Users Posts: 729 ✭✭✭Granadino


    batman75 wrote: »
    You would wonder does the ethnic status hinder their ability to blend into general society. Maybe they don't want to blend into general society?

    That would mean joining the rat race. Maybe they have a point.


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    #449
    Morgans
    Registered Users Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭Morgans


    Omackeral wrote: »
    I have more or less said the opposite around 3 times now. Jesus. I said they don't care about him as a man, they liked the fact that he called a spade a spade when it came to a notorious group. A protest vote if ever there was one. There's no talking to you because you don't read what's written.

    The fact you're now dragging the bloody alt-right into a conversation about Travellers means you're not worth any more time IMO.

    Your clear position is that his message resonated so much with the Irish people that he finished on the podium in the Presidential election. And this anti-traveller message was even more clearly reinforced when he failed to get any traction in the general election.


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    #450
    Omackeral
    Registered Users Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭Omackeral


    Morgans wrote: »
    Your clear position is that his message resonated so much with the Irish people that he finished on the podium in the Presidential election.

    1) Every other candidate said they'd happily live next to Travellers. People didn't believe that story evidently.

    2) It was a forgone conclusion that Michael D Higgins had it won anyway so it mattered not. A protest vote.

    Morgans wrote: »
    And this anti-traveller message was even more clearly reinforced when he failed to get any traction in the general election.

    1) People weren't prepared to piss away their vote in a GE that's never certain. Not the case in the above scenario.

    2) Why do I continue to engage you?


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    #451
    tastyt
    Registered Users Posts: 2,022 ✭✭✭tastyt


    People don’t wake up one morning and say “ I think I’m going to hate travellers from now on “

    They are hated because of their actions. Full stop.
    They want no part in our society and we don’t want them, it’s up to the state to make sure that at least they can act within the laws.

    And another thing, people don’t need to be lectured to or told how they should feel about travellers. There are a hundred reasons why they are hated.

    Would I say it to one of their faces , no. Not because I don’t have balls but because I’m not ****ing stupid. They are criminals who go round in gangs wielding machetes, there’s no such thing as a fair fight with them regardless of all their bull**** bravado talk about bare knuckle boxing.

    Add to that their disgraceful treatment of animals and it’s plain to see they are a scourge on the country


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