Green Party wish list.

Huntergonzo

LawBoy2018 wrote: »

If the Greens reject the deal, will FF & FG throw in the towel and call for another election? Or will they begin recruiting Independent TDs? If it turns out to be the latter, I could see the Greens being punished down the line.

Despite their baggage, I would love to see SF take the reigns.

If it falls apart, I'd say possibly another election, that would suit both FG & SF, not so much Micheal Martin and his obsession with being the chief.

SF would be bottom of my list, every bit as dishonest as the rest but with a pernicious element in the background.

Tell me how

KyussB wrote: »

We have 9.5 years to reduce emissions by 50% (that is the Greens pledge...), with potentially 2-2.5 years of stimulus, following potentially by 7 years of austerity.

Explain exactly how we are to reduce emissions by 50%, when we have a high risk of spending most of this decade in austerity?

It's not the Greens pledge.

It's what FG (supported by FF) signed us up to.

Eric Cartman

KyussB wrote: »

We have 9.5 years to reduce emissions by 50% (that is the Greens pledge...), with potentially 2-2.5 years of stimulus, following potentially by 7 years of austerity.

Explain exactly how we are to reduce emissions by 50%, when we have a high risk of spending most of this decade in austerity?

if everyone is too poor from taxation to buy beef or run a car we can hit the target, this is the only way I can make sense of Eamon Ryans policies.

KyussB

Tell me how wrote: »

It's not the Greens pledge.

It's what FG (supported by FF) signed us up to.

If you mean the Paris Agreement, yes that's true. It's also what the Green's officially advocate doing, what they have platformed on to the electorate and their voters, and what they have signed up to in the agreement with FF and FG.

Yet the Green's have cynically agreed to budget balancing policies, with a high chance of leading to austerity in just 2-2.5 years, which would make it impossible to achieve the goal they promised their voters.

It is deeply cynical and a betrayal of their voters, and trashes their supposed 'green' credentials.

tayto lover

KyussB wrote: »

If you mean the Paris Agreement, yes that's true. It's also what the Green's officially advocate doing, what they have platformed on to the electorate and their voters, and what they have signed up to in the agreement with FF and FG.

Yet the Green's have cynically agreed to budget balancing policies, with a high chance of leading to austerity in just 2-2.5 years, which would make it impossible to achieve the goal they promised their voters.

It is deeply cynical and a betrayal of their voters, and trashes their supposed 'green' credentials.

The Greens never knew exactly what they wanted anyway.
Hopefully they’ll eat each other up from within. Shower of clowns.

Tell me how

KyussB wrote: »

If you mean the Paris Agreement, yes that's true. It's also what the Green's officially advocate doing, what they have platformed on to the electorate and their voters, and what they have signed up to in the agreement with FF and FG.

Yet the Green's have cynically agreed to budget balancing policies, with a high chance of leading to austerity in just 2-2.5 years, which would make it impossible to achieve the goal they promised their voters.

It is deeply cynical and a betrayal of their voters, and trashes their supposed 'green' credentials.

It sounds like you think the Greens would have been better off refusing to get in to government until a commitment was made to fund all projects upfront which would achieve the targets set out in the PA.

How do you think that would have worked? Look at the vitriol they are getting for these efforts to do something.

Shefwedfan

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

With Papas money. The party is awash with perpetual children bankrolled by their capitalist parents. It’s no wonder the vast majority of them don’t live in or understand the real world.

No I just got a job and worked for it....loads of people do that

efanton

Shefwedfan wrote: »

No I just got a job and worked for it....loads of people do that

I think would be the case for most people, no matter which party they support.
So was there any point at all in making that statement?

There's absolutely no denying that this country favours those with wealth.
Their children get better education, they have access to better health care, and they are not trapped in a rental market that bleeds any hope of them ever saving enough even to just qualify for a mortgage. If there ever is a surplus rather than use it to provide better education, health care or infrastructure that would benefit everyone, instead the first thing on the list is a tax cut for those that are already ahead.

Despite any protestations from FG or its supporters, or indeed many from the FF gene-pool, this country or the previous governments polices has never been a meritocracy.

The more money you start with in this country, the more money you will make, and the gap between those that have and those do not is forever growing.

ELM327

Shefwedfan wrote: »

No I just got a job and worked for it....loads of people do that

It's almost as if, due to our welfare culture, people have forgotten this idea of working their way up!

Eric Cartman

efanton wrote: »

I think would be the case for most people, no matter which party they support.
So was there any point at all in making that statement?

There's absolutely no denying that this country favours those with wealth.
Their children get better education, they have access to better health care, and they are not trapped in a rental market that bleeds any hope of them ever saving enough even to just qualify for a mortgage. If there ever is a surplus rather than use it to provide better education, health care or infrastructure that would benefit everyone, instead the first thing on the list is a tax cut for those that are already ahead.

Despite any protestations from FG or its supporters, or indeed many from the FF gene-pool, this country or the previous governments polices has never been a meritocracy.

The more money you start with in this country, the more money you will make, and the gap between those that have and those do not is forever growing.

whatever about the others, I think we can all agree that no PbP voter understands anything about earning, jobs or hard work.

frw5

Shefwedfan wrote: »

No I just got a job and worked for it....loads of people do that

:eek:

Shefwedfan

efanton wrote: »

I think would be the case for most people, no matter which party they support.
So was there any point at all in making that statement?

There's absolutely no denying that this country favours those with wealth.
Their children get better education, they have access to better health care, and they are not trapped in a rental market that bleeds any hope of them ever saving enough even to just qualify for a mortgage. If there ever is a surplus rather than use it to provide better education, health care or infrastructure that would benefit everyone, instead the first thing on the list is a tax cut for those that are already ahead.

Despite any protestations from FG or its supporters, or indeed many from the FF gene-pool, this country or the previous governments polices has never been a meritocracy.

The more money you start with in this country, the more money you will make, and the gap between those that have and those do not is forever growing.

You can get up and get a job

Or sit on boards crying about it, I prefer to get a job

ELM327

Eric Cartman wrote: »

whatever about the others, I think we can all agree that no PbP voter understands anything about earning, jobs or hard work.

It is hard work to get up and go to the post office at 12 midday.
Very difficult to carry home the crate of Dutch on mickey money day.
Very easy to protest and ask for increased carbon taxes when it doesnt affect you.



All the while, I and other fools like me having entered the rat race don't have this bone idle option and instead have to fund those that do.

ELM327

Shefwedfan wrote: »

You can get up and get a job

Or sit on boards crying about it, I prefer to get a job

People say you can't get a job at the moment. We're hiring. I've interviewed tens of people and the same for other senior analysts in my company.


People said you couldnt get a job in the recession. I got a job in Banking & Finance in 2009.


It's a lot of me fein nonsense, because it's easier to sit on the couch and produce some children than it is to retrain and work on your career.

Rows Grower

Shefwedfan wrote: »

It doesn't matter what Martin trys it wont happen. FF bring everything to a vote and the party wont accept it,


MM knows if this doesn't go through now it will go to election and I very much doubt he will be leader for another election.

Leader?

He barely made it in by the skin of his teeth as a TD in the last election and that was with the full support of the party machine, which he will never have again.

It's a pity really as he actually had great potential as a patriot.

frw5

ELM327 wrote: »

It's a lot of me fein nonsense, because it's easier to sit on the couch and produce some children than it is to retrain and work on your career.

100% agree, BUT retraining, working on your career isn't even remotely enough atm, capiche?

Shefwedfan

efanton wrote: »

I think would be the case for most people, no matter which party they support.
So was there any point at all in making that statement?

There's absolutely no denying that this country favours those with wealth.
Their children get better education, they have access to better health care, and they are not trapped in a rental market that bleeds any hope of them ever saving enough even to just qualify for a mortgage. If there ever is a surplus rather than use it to provide better education, health care or infrastructure that would benefit everyone, instead the first thing on the list is a tax cut for those that are already ahead.

Despite any protestations from FG or its supporters, or indeed many from the FF gene-pool, this country or the previous governments polices has never been a meritocracy.

The more money you start with in this country, the more money you will make, and the gap between those that have and those do not is forever growing.

I responded to a post....did you miss that bit? It was on the post you quoted

Shefwedfan

ELM327 wrote: »

It's almost as if, due to our welfare culture, people have forgotten this idea of working their way up!

100% and people are amazed when someone actually goes and works hard and gets promoted

Shefwedfan

Rows Grower wrote: »

Leader?

He barely made it in by the skin of his teeth as a TD in the last election and that was with the full support of the party machine, which he will never have again.

It's a pity really as he actually had great potential as a patriot.

By all accounts he could be Taoiseach and nobody will give a flying f**k if he got in on the 1 millionth vote

frw5

Shefwedfan wrote: »

100% and people are amazed when someone actually goes and works hard and gets promoted

That's some promotion that buys a helicopter to fly to work because there is no public transport, personal hospital in case you have a medical condition, 3 butlers to take care of your family errands... please give us the formula, apart from moving to Australia, Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Netherlands, could list a few more where all that is STANDARD + environmental standards are somehow met too.
You think with this government Ireland is moving into their direction, catching up maybe? Can expect something of the same with this government in 10 years? I don't think so.

Shefwedfan

ELM327 wrote: »

People say you can't get a job at the moment. We're hiring. I've interviewed tens of people and the same for other senior analysts in my company.


People said you couldnt get a job in the recession. I got a job in Banking & Finance in 2009.


It's a lot of me fein nonsense, because it's easier to sit on the couch and produce some children than it is to retrain and work on your career.

We are hiring from every country in the World, we can’t get staff. I know loads of companies before COVID couldn’t find people, with covid this has reduced but still companies out looking

My mate took redundancy in Jan, precovid and was concerned when he left in March it might be difficult. He just started his new job last week. So he went out in the middle of the COVID and got employed....

Shefwedfan

frw5 wrote: »

That's some promotion that buys a helicopter to fly to work because there is no public transport, personal hospital in case you have a medical condition, 3 butlers to take care of your family errands... please give us the formula, apart from moving to Australia, Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Netherlands, could list a few more where all that is STANDARD + environmental standards are somehow met too.
You think with this government Ireland is moving into their direction, catching up maybe? Can expect something of the same with this government in 10 years? I don't think so.

1. Quit crying in internet
2. World is your oyster

That’s 100 quid for consultancy

efanton

Shefwedfan wrote: »

You can get up and get a job

Or sit on boards crying about it, I prefer to get a job

I have been fortunate enough to have had reasonably good jobs throughout my life.

have worked in many companies and a good few multinationals and the thing I have often noticed is people waltzing in with 3rd level degrees leapfrogging those that have been there for years and know the job far better, worked far harder, and earned a lower wage.

Even as a team leader, when reviewing those I had interviewed for jobs, the guy I thought would be best quite often was not selected. the person that had a 3rd level degree, or spoke with the right accent was more likely to get the job despite not having the same experience or detailed knowledge.

Now we can argue all day about the merits of a 3rd level education, about background making or breaking a person etc, and to be honest it would be a pointless argument. The reality of the world we currently live in is those who get the best start, be it financial, education, or through social networks will do better in the world we live in today.

I remember a time when I left this country in the 80's as a school leaver and went to the UK for work. Took any job I could get and worked my way up. But even the sh!tty jobs paid enough to have a half decent lifestyle. That's definitely not the case now. I used to work part time in a bar in the evenings 3 days a week for a few extra bob and a way of getting out without spending a whole lot of money so that I could save toward the education I knew I needed to progress, there's not a chance I would do that now on the wages paid to part time worker now.

And this is what is going to destroy the green party.
Far too many of them have lived in a cocoon, isolated from harsh realities for many people. They have ideals, and naturally think that everyone else aspires to the same ideals.
And they are right, everyone wants a better world but other people have bigger priorities to deal with first, like paying their bills, raising their kids and trying to get them decent education to break out from that cycle.

The reality is those who are given a good start, usually because their parent were wealthy enough to do so, will always do better. Its a self fulfilling prophecy, and to suggest that those who did not have the benefit of a good education, or parents who doted on them are slackers, out to get freebies or want to live of the state is simply wrong.
Wealth begets opportunity, opportunity begets wealth.

Shefwedfan

^^^^

Sorry I don’t believe a word of it

Once your in most multi nationals they promote internal before they even bother to go external, external hire is always harder to get approval v internal.

Rows Grower

efanton wrote: »

I have been fortunate enough to have had reasonably good jobs throughout my life.

have worked in many companies and a good few multinationals and the thing I have often noticed is people waltzing in with 3rd level degrees leapfrogging those that have been there for years and know the job far better, worked far harder, and earned a lower wage.

Even as a team leader, when reviewing those I had interviewed for jobs, the guy I thought would be best quite often was not selected. the person that had a 3rd level degree, or spoke with the right accent was more likely to get the job despite not having the same experience or detailed knowledge.

Now we can argue all day about the merits of a 3rd level education, about background making or breaking a person etc, and to be honest it would be a pointless argument. The reality of the world we currently live in is those who get the best start, be it financial, education, or through social networks will do better in the world we live in today.

I remember a time when I left this country in the 80's as a school leaver and went to the UK for work. Took any job I could get and worked my way up. But even the sh!tty jobs paid enough to have a half decent lifestyle. That's definitely not the case now. I used to work part time in a bar in the evenings 3 days a week for a few extra bob and a way of getting out without spending a whole lot of money so that I could save toward the education I knew I needed to progress, there's not a chance I would do that now on the wages paid to part time worker now.

And this is what is going to destroy the green party.
Far too many of them have lived in a cocoon, isolated from harsh realities for many people. They have ideals, and naturally think that everyone else aspires to the same ideals.
And they are right, everyone wants a better world but other people have bigger priorities to deal with first, like paying their bills, raising their kids and trying to get them decent education to break out from that cycle.

The reality is those who are given a good start, usually because their parent were wealthy enough to do so, will always do better. Its a self fulfilling prophecy, and to suggest that those who did not have the benefit of a good education, or parents who doted on them are slackers, out to get freebies or want to live of the state is simply wrong.
Wealth begets opportunity, opportunity begets wealth.

Complete bolloxology, if you want to make a success of yourself nothing will hold you back.

efanton

Rows Grower wrote: »

Complete bolloxology, if you want to make a success of yourself nothing will hold you back.

So what is a multi millionaire like yourself doing on a forum.

Eric Cartman

efanton wrote: »

So what is a multi millionaire like yourself doing on a forum.

most people have other priorities or are unwilling to do what it takes.

Rows Grower

efanton wrote: »

So what is a multi millionaire like yourself doing on a forum.

Still trying to learn the cheap way.

efanton

Shefwedfan wrote: »

^^^^

Sorry I don’t believe a word of it

Once your in most multi nationals they promote internal before they even bother to go external, external hire is always harder to get approval v internal.

Did I mention promotions?
I was talking about new hires.

Are you suggesting that there are people from wealthy families that work in their local super mac, super market, or other unskilled job?
Are you suggesting that everyone whose parents are reasonably well off inherited the 'intelligence gene'. Surely some of them did not do so well in the leaving cert or never went to 3rd level.

I would be willing to bet that even though they did not do well academically they are not in unskilled or low paid work. Yet for the 'working class' that is exactly what is expected of them.

Some people do well despite everything and more power to them. Some people coming from wealthy backgrounds are pure wasters, but you would have to accept that education and background have an enormous affect on future income potential.
Why are wealthy families prepared to pay enormous fees for private schools and grinds to ensure their children get the best education, an education they will not get in the public schools if not to ensure they get an advantage.

There will always be that divide, its part of the fabric of our society nd denying it doesnt make it untrue. If not who would do those jobs than no one wants to do, who would collect the rubbish, sweep the street, work in fast food outlets or supermarkets?

But this is not a thread on social issues its a thread on the Green and some of their unrealistic policies. Would you not agree that most of the Green have a very urban viewpoint and neglect to consider that what they deem as normal or necessary might not applicable to the rest of rural Ireland.

Who is going to pay for all these green policies and who exactly benefits most from them?

Shefwedfan

efanton wrote: »

Did I mention promotions?
I was talking about new hires.

Are you suggesting that there are people from wealthy families that work in their local super mac, super market, or other unskilled job?
Are you suggesting that everyone whose parents are reasonably well off inherited the 'intelligence gene'. Surely some of them did not do so well in the leaving cert or never went to 3rd level.

I would be willing to bet that even though they did not do well academically they are not in unskilled or low paid work. Yet for the 'working class' that is exactly what is expected of them.

Some people do well despite everything and more power to them. Some people coming from wealthy backgrounds are pure wasters, but you would have to accept that education and background have an enormous affect on future income potential.
Why are wealthy families prepared to pay enormous fees for private schools and grinds to ensure their children get the best education, an education they will not get in the public schools if not to ensure they get an advantage.

There will always be that divide, its part of the fabric of our society nd denying it doesnt make it untrue. If not who would do those jobs than no one wants to do, who would collect the rubbish, sweep the street, work in fast food outlets or supermarkets?

But this is not a thread on social issues its a thread on the Green and some of their unrealistic policies. Would you not agree that most of the Green have a very urban viewpoint and neglect to consider that what they deem as normal or necessary might not applicable to the rest of rural Ireland.

Who is going to pay for all these green policies and who exactly benefits most from them?

Behind Mary Lou was Nessa Hourigan in Dublin Central.....