Renovating derelict House

Gael23

A house has come up for sale near me which is completely uninhabitable having been left to rot for years.
Would such a project be realistic for a private buyer? I wouldn’t even know where to start. It’s for sale for €100k and I think when rebuilt it would be worth around €200-250k

Calahonda52

how big is it?
100k seems high, is it in Dublin 4?
If its 100 sq meters then it will be a loss.
as it wuill cost about 1,500 per sq m for everything, services, fees, etc

mickdw

At that money to buy it and assuming your final valuation is reasonable, its not a runner as you will basically be rebuilding it apart from the walls. Evdn at that you are not saving the cpst of foundation and walls cause you will likely habe to completely renew ground floor with dpc and insulation and then there will be significant costs in bringing existing walls up to standard.

GerardKeating

Gael23 wrote: »

It’s for sale for €100k and I think when rebuilt it would be worth around €200-250k

Are you doing this for a house to live in, or for a quick resale?

Gael23

GerardKeating wrote: »

Are you doing this for a house to live in, or for a quick resale?

To live in for a few years but unlikely a home for life

Bonzo Delaney

Gael23 wrote: »

To live in for a few years but unlikely a home for life

Prob only an option if you've a couple of hundred k to invest in it and do most of the work yourself as a mid term investment them may be sell it after a few years.
You might get your wages back out of it and a small profit if your lucky.

To bring a derelict house back to modern standards is a money pit from every stage from the ground up.
Probably only a runner if your emotionally attached to the property or area and intend on leaving the house through the front door in a box

GreeBo

Is it salvagable or would you be better off knocking it?
Hows the roof for example? How old is the house? Is it likely to need electrics and plumbing?
Is the exterior sound?

Is the 200-250K the going price for similar finished houses in the area or jus what you are hoping?

Without having any more info, I would say stay away unless, as above, you can do the work yourself and can buy it for cash.

Steer55

Gael23 wrote: »

A house has come up for sale near me which is completely uninhabitable having been left to rot for years.
Would such a project be realistic for a private buyer? I wouldn’t even know where to start. It’s for sale for €100k and I think when rebuilt it would be worth around €200-250k

Its site value only, offer €50,000 for it esp in the current climate.

Gael23

GreeBo wrote: »

Is it salvagable or would you be better off knocking it?
Hows the roof for example? How old is the house? Is it likely to need electrics and plumbing?
Is the exterior sound?

Is the 200-250K the going price for similar finished houses in the area or jus what you are hoping?

Without having any more info, I would say stay away unless, as above, you can do the work yourself and can buy it for cash.

The house is abut 50 years old and has been vacant for around 30 years. Its a semi detached so I don't think demolition is an option but if it was then yes I think it would be better to start again.
Would want to get it structurally checked first because if the roof is not good. then thats a dealbreaker. Other than that its a total rebuild.

The boundary wall with neighbours on one side is cracked but. thats not a huge job and then your looking at all new windows and fascia/soffits on the exterior

Bonzo Delaney

Ahh I'd visions of a stone house in the middle of a field somewhere with a tree growing out one of the windows.

But only one to make a buck out of it still would be a builder to treat it as a door upper and have the cash ready to make a quick turn around with it
Esp if the going rate for surrounding houses are only a little over double the asking price

mickdw

Im currently involved in a refurb and extension project.
100 sqm refurb and 100 sqm new build portion.
Although the house was in good condition and perfectly habitable, when all is considered, it is now proving more expensive than a new build.

Calahonda52

Gael23 wrote: »

The house is abut 50 years old and has been vacant for around 30 years. Its a semi detached so I don't think demolition is an option but if it was then yes I think it would be better to start again.
Would want to get it structurally checked first because if the roof is not good. then thats a dealbreaker. Other than that its a total rebuild.

The boundary wall with neighbours on one side is cracked but. thats not a huge job and then your looking at all new windows and fascia/soffits on the exterior

Using the word derelict and then wondering about the
roof makes me think you really haven't thought this though.

IMO if the roof is fobar, its a bonus as you can then do a really good job on the insulation and airtightness.

Mellor

Gael23 wrote: »

A house has come up for sale near me which is completely uninhabitable having been left to rot for years.
Would such a project be realistic for a private buyer? I wouldn’t even know where to start. It’s for sale for €100k and I think when rebuilt it would be worth around €200-250k

There's not nearly enough information there for anybody to answer your question accurately. For a start the size of the plot and the size of the house aren't even mentioned. Nor is there any real information on how "derelict" it is. There's a huge cost difference in costs between ripping back to bare external walls, re-fitting out and only needing to replace superficial finishes. A layperson would probably describe both situations as derelict.

While the comments above are possibly correct, it's not worth it. But there lots of assumption involved.
But as a general rule, if it's for sale at 100k, it's not worth 100k, and you wouldn't have to pay 100k.

Gael23

Mellor wrote: »

There's not nearly enough information there for anybody to answer your question accurately. For a start the size of the plot and the size of the house aren't even mentioned. Nor is there any real information on how "derelict" it is. There's a huge cost difference in costs between ripping back to bare external walls, re-fitting out and only needing to replace superficial finishes. A layperson would probably describe both situations as derelict.

While the comments above are possibly correct, it's not worth it. But there lots of assumption involved.
But as a general rule, if it's for sale at 100k, it's not worth 100k, and you wouldn't have to pay 100k.

Its totally uninhabitable and has been left to rot for at least 30 years

Bonzo Delaney

Gael23 wrote: »

Its totally uninhabitable and has been left to rot for at least 30 years

The question must be asked how has a semi d been left idle for 30 years
Is the area an area worth investing in
How has it gone through the last boom and the last few years of relative prosperity with out been developed

Mellor

Gael23 wrote: »

Its totally uninhabitable and has been left to rot for at least 30 years

Whether something is habitable is largely superficial. Structurally it could be fine.

There’s a huge difference between a renovation and a rebuild.

GreeBo

Mellor wrote: »

Whether something is habitable is largely superficial. Structurally it could be fine.

There’s a huge difference between a renovation and a rebuild.

Agreed, but sometime a rebuild can work out easier and cheaper.
But either way, you need to know what you are getting into before you buy.

Mellor

GreeBo wrote: »

Agreed, but sometime a rebuild can work out easier and cheaper.
But either way, you need to know what you are getting into before you buy.

I think you are missing my point.

If it's be left ideal to 30 years it's not going to be habitable.
If the damage is superficial, you will only need to renovate finishes to every room.
If the damage is structural, you may need to rebuild the first floor, stairs, walls, wiring, etc. That's a major rebuild and will cost multiples more.

Nobody can tell which applies in this case from the info provided.

Gael23

Bonzo Delaney wrote: »

The question must be asked how has a semi d been left idle for 30 years
Is the area an area worth investing in
How has it gone through the last boom and the last few years of relative prosperity with out been developed

That is something for years that has always baffled me. Its a highly sought after residential area with a mix of older people there since 1968 when the houses were built and younger families.
I believe the council have CPO'd the property under the vacant sites act and. are now selling it on the open market. Picture of it below

https://www.daft.ie/waterford/houses-for-sale/waterford-city/18-viewmount-park-dunmore-road-waterford-city-waterford-2405500/

GreeBo

Mellor wrote: »

I think you are missing my point.

If it's be left ideal to 30 years it's not going to be habitable.
If the damage is superficial, you will only need to renovate finishes to every room.
If the damage is structural, you may need to rebuild the first floor, stairs, walls, wiring, etc. That's a major rebuild and will cost multiples more.

Nobody can tell which applies in this case from the info provided.

I dont believe I'm missing your point, just pointing out that, as in your structural example, it can be cheaper to demo and rebuild the house rather than try to address these issues in situ.

In either case, a layman isnt going to be able to tell just by looking at it (unless its a clear demo job!)

listermint

Was there a death in it or something, as idle for that long does seem odd.

The roof is missing the top tiles which means there is water pissing into that attic for god knows how long. I would imagine roof trusses are rotten certainly in that location and water has probably damaged all the plasterboard right down under neath.

It certainly looks very salvageable tbh. But would be a complete gutout.

Roof. 20k ~
Plasterboards. 15k~
Electrics. 12k~
Plumbing. 8K~
Heating. 6k ~
Insulation. 20K~
Windows Doors 12K~

And all ancillary stuff like engineers, labour etc. Id say circa 120-140K could turn it around.

listermint

Note recent sales in that area are 205K-260K.

So it maybe a break even scenario if costs can be kept tight. If the walls need work etc, then it probably wont be a break even unless the sale price was lowered significantly

GreeBo

Gael23 wrote: »

That is something for years that has always baffled me. Its a highly sought after residential area with a mix of older people there since 1968 when the houses were built and younger families.
I believe the council have CPO'd the property under the vacant sites act and. are now selling it on the open market. Picture of it below

https://www.daft.ie/waterford/houses-for-sale/waterford-city/18-viewmount-park-dunmore-road-waterford-city-waterford-2405500/

It doesnt look shocking, but unless you are inside and poking around the attic you wont really have a clue.

Would you plan to live there or is it an investment?
I think you could spend the same again on fixing it so as an investment it wouldnt seem to make sense. (IMO)

Mellor

GreeBo wrote: »

I dont believe I'm missing your point, just pointing out that, as in your structural example, it can be cheaper to demo and rebuild the house rather than try to address these issues in situ.

Yup, the above confirms it. What you are saying is correct, but it isn't relevant to what I was saying.

I was talking about the huge cost difference between a minor job where only a superficial renovation is needed, verses a major one where a some level of rebuild is required.
Comparing two different situations , the scale of which wasn't clear from OP.


Full demolish & rebuild verses rebuilding insitu is a completely different disussion.
It's two methods to approach the major rebuild situation. Would never be cost effective for the superficial reno.

Bonzo Delaney

Interesting one in fairness
Defo complete gut job including roof.
It's a straight forward roof so not a major headache.
If you pay100k for as it stands
Then spend 150k on complete refurb
You'd prob have an A3 rated house with most standard mod cons. For the going rate of other houses in the area.

It'd be a nice one for a local builder with a bit of collateral behind them to buy, refurb, and stick a 40m² kitchen /living extension on the back then sell on in 4-6 months time for a decent wage and a small profit.

Dont forget most people who would by a clean unmodernised 40yr old house would prob gut and upgrade everything even after paying the going local rate for similar house.
If it could be got for anything less than 100k it'd be one to seriously consider for a value for money finished product.

Now where did I leave that couple of 100k I had lying around....

GreeBo

Bonzo Delaney wrote: »

Interesting one in fairness
Defo complete gut job including roof.
It's a straight forward roof so not a major headache.
If you pay100k for as it stands
Then spend 150k on complete refurb
You'd prob have an A3 rated house with most standard mod cons. For the going rate of other houses in the area.

It'd be a nice one for a local builder with a bit of collateral behind them to buy, refurb, and stick a 40m² kitchen /living extension on the back then sell on in 4-6 months time for a decent wage and a small profit.

Dont forget most people who would by a clean unmodernised 40yr old house would prob gut and upgrade everything even after paying the going local rate for similar house.
If it could be got for anything less than 100k it'd be one to seriously consider for a value for money finished product.

Now where did I leave that couple of 100k I had lying around....

I think you are in danger of going over the ceiling price for houses in that area.
You could spend 300K on it and it still wont be worth more than 250K.

Unless I had really, really strong reasons to want to live in the area and other properties were rare, I wouldnt risk the investment to *hopefully* break even.

mickdw

Assuming all is well with the history of that and not vacant for some horrific reason, its probably not bad.

chooseusername

Gael23 wrote: »

A house has come up for sale near me which is completely uninhabitable having been left to rot for years.
Would such a project be realistic for a private buyer? I wouldn’t even know where to start. It’s for sale for €100k and I think when rebuilt it would be worth around €200-250k

Would it be worth looking at this Repair and leasing scheme?
and;This
Quote;
The maximum funding available is €40,000, inclusive of VAT.

What kind of repairs will be paid for under the scheme?

The ideal properties targeted under the RLS will require a low level of investment to bring them to the required standard for renting.
The majority of works will include items such as, for example:
new flooring, kitchen, furniture;
low grade plumbing or heating works, energy efficiency upgrades;
window and door upgrades or replacements;
insulation;
painting and decorating.
It is not envisaged that any level of significant structural works will be needed and in the majority of cases no planning permissions will be required.

Tefral

How handy are you OP?

I bought a house with half the roof missing and absolutely nothing done on the inside for 45k with an acre of overgrown land.

I finished the house for a high enough spec for €115k. A2 rated, heat pump etc etc. today my mortgage is now €152k. I did a **** load of the work myself in the evenings with my wife so its do-able if your handy and have the float.

If its not something you are able to take on labour wise yourself, id say you need to get that house for 50-60k. Remember not all money you put in will be worth it to the overall price. Try to get it into the A rating if you can and look for things people want, like ensuites etc that add money to the overall house.

If you are taking the roof off id try get a room in there while your at it, extra rooms could add 15k to the asking price.