Why are Irish conservatives not represented in the media/politics?

8kczg9v0swrydm

This interests me on a number of levels.

I know the politics of a number of countries quite well and I noticed that in each one of them, both the liberal and conservative (mostly in the social sense) parts of the population have their own media outlets - nationwide TV, newspapers, major websites, even colleges. They also each have political parties which represent their views.

However, this does not seem to exist in Ireland, where a massive sway towards the liberal side exists. I cannot think of a single major newspaper or TV station that would cater to the conservative section of the population. Moreover, I cannot think of a single major political party that would be socially conservative.

I think it would be fair to say that the three biggest social issues of the day which divide liberals and conservatives are abortion, homosexual unions and mass Muslim migration (maybe EU membership, at a push). The referendums on the first two were by no means a landslide, and migration still does not have consensus. Yet if one was to look at the media/politics of this country, it would seem that pro-lifers, advocates of traditional marriage and immigration skeptics do not exist.

Why is that? Is it a) conservatives just fail to organize, b) they do not care about propagating their views or maybe c) they are somehow outmaneuvered/suppressed in society by the liberal media giants (yes, "giants" in the Irish sense).

With public discourse controlled by liberal-leaning media and politicians, is it time to declare that conservatism is the new counter-culture?

One eyed Jack

Emmaline Tender Fowl wrote: »

With public discourse controlled by liberal-leaning media and politicians, is it time to declare that conservatism is the new counter-culture?

It wouldn’t be conservatism if it were to be known as the new anything.

L1011

In terms of votes received, the conservative media commentators there are are massively over-represented; with a permanent op-ed presence in the print media and basically a guaranteed seat on any discussion.

They account for about 2% of the vote.

There is no "silent majority" or anything like it - just an incredibly noisy tiny minority.

freshpopcorn

I think in Ireland we’ve seen parties such some of those United Ireland parties who may have been a tad conservative on some of those issues and they generally didn’t poll that well.
I find people might make the odd comment about issues such as homosexuality but once they’ve money they don’t care.

Silentcorner

L1011 wrote: »

In terms of votes received, the conservative media commentators there are are massively over-represented; with a permanent op-ed presence in the print media and basically a guaranteed seat on any discussion.

They account for about 2% of the vote.

There is no "silent majority" or anything like it - just an incredibly noisy tiny minority.

Is there a single party in this country who willingly discusses

Social Welfare Reform - ending lifelong social welfare dependency
Law and Order - The complete shambles of our courts.
Addressing the Cocaine Epidemic
Addressing the Mental Health Crisis (that doesn't involve spending more taxpayers money)
Addressing the dysfunction of certain Cultural Groups and certain demographics and the implications of their behaviour on our broader society,
Our deteriorating Education Standards.
The coming Pension Crisis.
The huge cost of Gender Quotas being enforced in our Private Sector.
Indeed, has anyone questioned the requirement for Political Parties to sign up to a Feminist manifesto as per our latest election.
Addressing the consistent abuse of public office and the complete lack of accountability and the complete lack of punishment for those who do....
The role the EU has on social issues, ie, the Gender Deconstruction Theory that our kids are now being exposed to in their classrooms.
Addressing the widening gap in job security and benefits between the Private Sector and the Public sector.

Because I'd image a lot more than 2% of us would like to see a much more prominent discussion on a myriad of issues....

I do recall one Presidential Candidate getting into a lot of hot water for touching on one of those issues, he polled a lot higher than 2%.

If there is a Conservative Political Party in this country...I haven't come across it!

Eric Cartman

Silentcorner wrote: »

Is there a single party in this country who willingly discusses

Social Welfare Reform - ending lifelong social welfare dependency
Law and Order - The complete shambles of our courts.
Addressing the Cocaine Epidemic
Addressing the Mental Health Crisis (that doesn't involve spending more taxpayers money)
Addressing the dysfunction of certain Cultural Groups and certain demographics and the implications of their behaviour on our broader society,
Our deteriorating Education Standards.
The coming Pension Crisis.
The huge cost of Gender Quotas being enforced in our Private Sector.
Indeed, has anyone questioned the requirement for Political Parties to sign up to a Feminist manifesto as per our latest election.
Addressing the consistent abuse of public office and the complete lack of accountability and the complete lack of punishment for those who do....
The role the EU has on social issues, ie, the Gender Deconstruction Theory that our kids are now being exposed to in their classrooms.
Addressing the widening gap in job security and benefits between the Private Sector and the Public sector.

Because I'd image a lot more than 2% of us would like to see a much more prominent discussion on a myriad of issues....

I do recall one Presidential Candidate getting into a lot of hot water for touching on one of those issues, he polled a lot higher than 2%.

If there is a Conservative Political Party in this country...I haven't come across it!

there isn't because usually they come with a religious affiliation (e.g renua) or a xenophobic link (e.g the national front) which precludes sensible conservatives from entertaining their vote. Were we to have a party which could navigate the ship avoiding those dangerous waters it would do well, but its a tough ask.

Silentcorner

Eric Cartman wrote: »

there isn't because usually they come with a religious affiliation (e.g renua) or a xenophobic link (e.g the national front) which precludes sensible conservatives from entertaining their vote. Were we to have a party which could navigate the ship avoiding those dangerous waters it would do well, but its a tough ask.

I'm not sure it is...

We are entering some very difficult years financially and very tough decisions will have to be made, a lot of the issues I listed above come at a huge cost, someone will address those issues at some point....

I mean, we have the highest rate of jobless households in the EU...that alone is not sustainable....

You'll get the twitterati and the bishops in the media's knickers in a twist but who really listens to those anymore....

2ndcoming

Silentcorner wrote: »

The huge cost of Gender Quotas being enforced in our Private Sector.

Who is enforcing this exactly?

Silentcorner

2ndcoming wrote: »

Who is enforcing this exactly?

The government...

https://www.thejournal.ie/gender-pay-gap-7-4093919-Jun2018/

Harry Palmr

When I read this sort of thing I'm reminded that however annoying the woke types can be they are much less of a danger than a party of modern day Alice Glenn's.

Silentcorner

Harry Palmr wrote: »

When I read this sort of thing I'm reminded that however annoying the woke types can be they are much less of a danger than a party of modern day Alice Glenn's.

You know it perfectly ok not to agree with others on vital economic and social issues...

Pretending different opinions don't exist however is much more dangerous.

L1011

Silentcorner wrote: »

Is there a single party in this country who willingly discusses

Social Welfare Reform - ending lifelong social welfare dependency
Law and Order - The complete shambles of our courts.
Addressing the Cocaine Epidemic
Addressing the Mental Health Crisis (that doesn't involve spending more taxpayers money)
Addressing the dysfunction of certain Cultural Groups and certain demographics and the implications of their behaviour on our broader society,
Our deteriorating Education Standards.
The coming Pension Crisis.
The huge cost of Gender Quotas being enforced in our Private Sector.
Indeed, has anyone questioned the requirement for Political Parties to sign up to a Feminist manifesto as per our latest election.
Addressing the consistent abuse of public office and the complete lack of accountability and the complete lack of punishment for those who do....
The role the EU has on social issues, ie, the Gender Deconstruction Theory that our kids are now being exposed to in their classrooms.
Addressing the widening gap in job security and benefits between the Private Sector and the Public sector.

Because I'd image a lot more than 2% of us would like to see a much more prominent discussion on a myriad of issues....

I do recall one Presidential Candidate getting into a lot of hot water for touching on one of those issues, he polled a lot higher than 2%.

If there is a Conservative Political Party in this country...I haven't come across it!

Once a party decides that's what they're in to, they're fighting for the same sub 2% of the vote as Renua/IFP/NP are.

That's it - there's sub 2% support for it.

You'll find more support for individual elements of it, but people are going to be repelled by something when you stack the lot together; and you're back to the sub 2%

Said presidential candidate has been returning to the expected polling figures at every election since, as more of what he's about is revealed. Guess what he managed to get at the election this year? Sub 2%.

rossie1977

Emmaline Tender Fowl wrote: »

This interests me on a number of levels.

I know the politics of a number of countries quite well and I noticed that in each one of them, both the liberal and conservative (mostly in the social sense) parts of the population have their own media outlets - nationwide TV, newspapers, major websites, even colleges. They also each have political parties which represent their views.

What major newspapers, TV channels and colleges in the UK, mainland Western Europe, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, South Korea or USA are outwardly and vocally anti abortion and anti homosexual unions?

I can't think of a single one. Not even Fox News are. Every single media outlet in those countries that are, are extremely niche.

Immigration is not a right/left, conservative/progressive issue. The most left wing countries on earth ie North Korea, Cuba, Venezuela have some of the strongest barriers to immigration. Even China is extremely difficult to move there full time.

However, this does not seem to exist in Ireland, where a massive sway towards the liberal side exists. I cannot think of a single major newspaper or TV station that would cater to the conservative section of the population. Moreover, I cannot think of a single major political party that would be socially conservative.

DUP are extremely socially conservative...

FF and FG are both socially conservative on many issues. That's why we continue to have a war on drugs and some of the strictest drug laws in the Western world. Why c Why we introduced a draconian prostitution law in recent years. Why we had a blasphemy law up to a few months ago and why it took the will of the people to bring FF/FG to cave over their stance on abortion.

I think it would be fair to say that the three biggest social issues of the day which divide liberals and conservatives are abortion, homosexual unions and mass Muslim migration (maybe EU membership, at a push). The referendums on the first two were by no means a landslide

66% to 33% for abortion and 62% to 38% for gay marriage are landslide victories in any language. Reagan only picked up 59% of vote in 84 US election for comparison sake.

and migration still does not have consensus. Yet if one was to look at the media/politics of this country, it would seem that pro-lifers, advocates of traditional marriage and immigration skeptics do not exist.

Maybe you are looking in wrong place. Every church in the country has pro life documentation as you enter. Go visit Knock and you will see it pretty much everywhere.

Why is that? Is it a) conservatives just fail to organize, b) they do not care about propagating their views or maybe c) they are somehow outmaneuvered/suppressed in society by the liberal media giants (yes, "giants" in the Irish sense).

With public discourse controlled by liberal-leaning media and politicians, is it time to declare that conservatism is the new counter-culture?

Here is the thing. Ireland lived under the most extreme conservative christian rule in the Western world for 8 decades. Most people remember it and don't ever want to return to those days. Even extremely religious people like my mother don't want a return to those days.

2ndcoming

Silentcorner wrote: »

The government...

https://www.thejournal.ie/gender-pay-gap-7-4093919-Jun2018/

This is about pay not quotas. Private companies can hire whoever they want. Is there a reason you think women should be paid less for the same work?

Silentcorner

L1011 wrote: »

Once a party decides that's what they're in to, they're fighting for the same sub 2% of the vote as Renua/IFP/NP are.

That's it - there's sub 2% support for it.

Thats one way of convincing yourself that only 2% of Irish people would love to see our criminal justice system reformed, social welfare dependency addressed and Public Sector Waste addressed....plus all the others I have listed.

I think you are very very wrong if you think people do not care about the issues I have listed above...

L1011

Silentcorner wrote: »

Thats one way of convincing yourself that only 2% of Irish people would love to see our criminal justice system reformed, social welfare dependency addressed and Public Sector Waste addressed....plus all the others I have listed.

I think you are very very wrong if you think people do not care about the issues I have listed above...

People care individually about some of them

Stack the lot together and you're going to find less than 2% who share your view on the lot of them.

Silentcorner

2ndcoming wrote: »

This is about pay not quotas. Private companies can hire whoever they want. Is there a reason you think women should be paid less for the same work?

Of course I don't...laws already exists to make sure they don't...this is governments forcing private companies to reveal the difference in pay between all the women and all the men combined....which will have an impact on who they hire and who they promote....

Some companies are being given targets to appoint Female Directors...this stuff is madness....A Government has no business interfering with the Private Sector in this manner.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/work/biggest-irish-listed-companies-given-33-female-director-target-by-2023-1.3907443

Silentcorner

L1011 wrote: »

People care individually about some of them

Stack the lot together and you're going to find less than 2% who share your view on the lot of them.

I am going to respectfully disagree...

2ndcoming

Silentcorner wrote: »

Thats one way of convincing yourself that only 2% of Irish people would love to see our criminal justice system reformed, social welfare dependency addressed and Public Sector Waste addressed....plus all the others I have listed.

I think you are very very wrong if you think people do not care about the issues I have listed above...

Many of the issues you raise are exacerbated by neo-liberal conservatism, not helped by it. You capitalise Public Sector Waste, how are the private health and insurance industries doing during the current crisis by your estimation?

You can't address social welfare dependency when every time there's a bit of a squeeze the centre-right CONSERVATIVE political parties that have been in power since the year dot cut nearly all of the services helping people raise themselves out of that life.

Your issues are many and contradictory. Mississippi may be closed but what's Afghanistan's immigration policy like? You may feel more at home there...

Silentcorner

2ndcoming wrote: »

Many of the issues you raise are exacerbated by neo-liberal conservatism, not helped by it. You capitalise Public Sector Waste, how are the private health and insurance industries doing during the current crisis by your estimation?

You can't address social welfare dependency when every time there's a bit of a squeeze the centre-right CONSERVATIVE political parties that have been in power since the year dot cut nearly all of the services helping people raise themselves out of that life.

Your issues are many and contradictory. Mississippi may be closed but what's Afghanistan's immigration policy like? You may feel more at home there...

Right...you are getting a little too excited already....I've listed a few issues I believe don't get addressed by media or politicians...I have no intention of getting into a to and fro with someone who is already getting hot and bothered!!!

suicide_circus

L1011 wrote: »

In terms of votes received, the conservative media commentators there are are massively over-represented; with a permanent op-ed presence in the print media and basically a guaranteed seat on any discussion.

They account for about 2% of the vote.

There is no "silent majority" or anything like it - just an incredibly noisy tiny minority.

how are you defining "conservative" to come to this conclusion?

Annasopra

suicide_circus wrote: »

how are you defining "conservative" to come to this conclusion?

Probably to do with over prominience various Iona Institute people have on Irelands media.

Idbatterim

Silentcorner wrote: »

I'm not sure it is...

We are entering some very difficult years financially and very tough decisions will have to be made, a lot of the issues I listed above come at a huge cost, someone will address those issues at some point....

I mean, we have the highest rate of jobless households in the EU...that alone is not sustainable....

You'll get the twitterati and the bishops in the media's knickers in a twist but who really listens to those anymore....

Totally agree, many workers really struggling here, now imagine several million of the welfare budget was spent reducing income taxes, and abolishing stamp duty etc for first time buyers, instead of several billion being blown on alcohol, bookies , taks aways and rip off smart phone and tv / broadband packages...

I'd love to have a trump here, someone who doesn't care about offending anyone, because irish politicians are spineless populist weasels

AndrewJRenko

Silentcorner wrote: »

Of course I don't...laws already exists to make sure they don't...this is governments forcing private companies to reveal the difference in pay between all the women and all the men combined....which will have an impact on who they hire and who they promote....

Some companies are being given targets to appoint Female Directors...this stuff is madness....A Government has no business interfering with the Private Sector in this manner.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/work/biggest-irish-listed-companies-given-33-female-director-target-by-2023-1.3907443

Though it's still not a gender quota as you originally claimed. Is there any such gender quota for private businesses?

AndrewJRenko

Eric Cartman wrote: »

there isn't because usually they come with a religious affiliation (e.g renua) or a xenophobic link (e.g the national front) which precludes sensible conservatives from entertaining their vote. Were we to have a party which could navigate the ship avoiding those dangerous waters it would do well, but its a tough ask.

We had the PDs that played those economic cards for a few years. They crashed and burned.

AndrewJRenko

Emmaline Tender Fowl wrote: »

This interests me on a number of levels.

I know the politics of a number of countries quite well and I noticed that in each one of them, both the liberal and conservative (mostly in the social sense) parts of the population have their own media outlets - nationwide TV, newspapers, major websites, even colleges. They also each have political parties which represent their views.

However, this does not seem to exist in Ireland, where a massive sway towards the liberal side exists. I cannot think of a single major newspaper or TV station that would cater to the conservative section of the population. Moreover, I cannot think of a single major political party that would be socially conservative.
u

Have you tried listening to Newstalk? Or watching Ivan and Matt's gammon fest on VMTV? Or reading the Business Post or the Mail?

Idbatterim

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

We had the PDs that played those economic cards for a few years. They crashed and burned.

Those were very different times! A huge sort of the sf surge was people being robbed on housing...

A new worker first party, would do well here

irishguitarlad

The op started the exact same thread about a month or two ago, yawn.

donspeekinglesh

Silentcorner wrote: »

Our deteriorating Education Standards.

Addressing the consistent abuse of public office and the complete lack of accountability and the complete lack of punishment for those who do....

Conservative politicians in the US are in favour of declining education standards - it's their best way of gaining new votes.

And the GOP think abusing public office is a perk of the job.

Silentcorner

donspeekinglesh wrote: »

Conservative politicians in the US are in favour of declining education standards - it's their best way of gaining new votes.

And the GOP think abusing public office is a perk of the job.

I've no idea why that has got anything to do with Irish politics.

Silentcorner

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Though it's still not a gender quota as you originally claimed. Is there any such gender quota for private businesses?

What do you think the purpose of it is?
What do you think the purpose of setting targets for Female Directors is?

This is private enterprise, how they recruit, how much they pay their employees, who they appoint directors is entirely up to the owners, the government has no business interfering.