Will you download the contact tracing app?

plodder

robinph wrote: »

Seems that Gibraltar have already got a skinned version of the Irish App, NI will be releasing their skinned version of it shortly and Wales is considering using it as well:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-53322751

Biggest problem then will be for the app stores showing multiple versions of the same thing and confusing the issue as to which one each person should download.

You can use the same source code to build different versions of an app just tweaked with different content/graphics and different URLs to connect back to. So to the app stores they are to all intents and purposes completely different apps.

What's quite nice about the Irish one, compared to the German one for example is that it uses the same scripting framework (and source code) for iOS and Android, whereas I think the apps are completely separate/independent in the German version.

robinph

KyussB wrote: »

No extra information needs to be sent, but if your own phone stores a timestamp with each detected contact, and it knows the list of UID's (and their sequence) identifying one specific covid case, then it can reconstruct that information from locally stored data.

Ya though, not important.

So that just tells you that it was someone in Paddy's Bar on Monday last week who has since tested positive for covid19. You have no way of figuring out who they are, or even if you got access to the main database which other codes there were generated by that person or where else they might have gone.

RebelButtMunch

robinph wrote: »

So that just tells you that it was someone in Paddy's Bar on Monday last week who has since tested positive for covid19. You have no way of figuring out who they are, or even if you got access to the main database which other codes there were generated by that person or where else they might have gone.

Yeah, for example;
I'm still not sure how it defines 'close contact'.. If I briefly walk 4 meters behind 'Joe' in the supermarket, then Joe is covid positive, it seems I get an alert... That'd be pretty alarming seeing as I didnt get near Joe's breathing space and Id be highly unlikely to have caught covid

Stark

RebelButtMunch wrote: »

Yeah, for example;
I'm still not sure how it defines 'close contact'.. If I briefly walk 4 meters behind 'Joe' in the supermarket, then Joe is covid positive, it seems I get an alert... That'd be pretty alarming seeing as I didnt get near Joe's breathing space and Id be highly unlikely to have caught covid

You would have to be in close contact for at least 15 minutes before it would register you as a close contact.

KyussB

robinph wrote: »

So that just tells you that it was someone in Paddy's Bar on Monday last week who has since tested positive for covid19. You have no way of figuring out who they are, or even if you got access to the main database which other codes there were generated by that person or where else they might have gone.

Different discussion - that was explaining part of resolving the potential privacy issue I was concerned about.

hmmm

ixoy wrote: »

Hah, the Waterford Whispers have it covered again:
Man Who Uses WhatsApp, TikTok, Google Maps, Snapchat, Instagram, Facebook & Twitter Apps Has Privacy Concerns About Covid-19 App

heh "and whoever makes TikTok". It's funny because it really isn't. :rolleyes:

touts

ixoy wrote: »

Hah, the Waterford Whispers have it covered again:
Man Who Uses WhatsApp, TikTok, Google Maps, Snapchat, Instagram, Facebook & Twitter Apps Has Privacy Concerns About Covid-19 App

That's excellent. Conspiracy theory peddlers like Gemma O'Doherty and Liam Herrick are doing their nut online and on the airwaves today but fortunately it appears the majority of people are ignoring them.

sydthebeat

can anyone clarify please if you need location on in order for this to work? i know it doesn't record location data, but is it correct to say the googles exposure notification service needs location on to work properly?

wadacrack

https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1280544655340380161

MadYaker

I don't need to. My phone is 5G compatible so I'm safe from the virus anyway.

GarIT

sydthebeat wrote: »

can anyone clarify please if you need location on in order for this to work? i know it doesn't record location data, but is it correct to say the googles exposure notification service needs location on to work properly?

On some newer devices, I think Android 10 onwards. Google took into account that you could potentially guess location using Bluetooth proximity so require location on to check which Bluetooth devices are nearby.

You can go through permissions and disable location for every other app.

I think RTÉ need to explain in a little more detail how the app actually works.

And who’s your man that said there’s no evidence it will work? How could there be? It was released less than 24 hours ago b

owlbethere

It's on the news now. They need 60% of the population to download and use the app to be successful.

There's an issue there surely because older people are not very tech savvy and many older people maybe not have a mobile phone or it might be an older phone and not a smartphone.

myfreespirit

GarIT wrote: »

On some newer devices, I think Android 10 onwards. Google took into account that you could potentially guess location using Bluetooth proximity so require location on to check which Bluetooth devices are nearby.

You can go through permissions and disable location for every other app.

The app is confusing about the need for location to be turned on.
I experimented with turning both Bluetooth (Android 7.0 device) and location off and got these notifications from the app:

DevilsHaircut

plodder wrote: »

Yes, that's what I said. I think it's important to know that contact tracing works without registering your phone number, but if you register your number you get a call, and the HSE find out that you are a contact.

The HSE will (and should) usually 'find out' that you're a contact anyway through the main ('manual') contact tracing system.

'Finding out' who is a carrier/potential carrier is the main way to slow the spread of the disease.

In fact, by consenting to register your number, you're more likely to be declassified as a close contact (and avoid self-isolation) as the Bluetooth technology is somewhat inaccurate in terms of distance (i.e. you might have been 3m away from a person rather than 2m as estimated by the app).

GarIT

owlbethere wrote: »

It's on the news now. They need 60% of the population to download and use the app to be successful.

There's an issue there surely because older people are not very tech savvy and many older people maybe not have a mobile phone or it might be an older phone and not a smartphone.

25% is needed to make the app successful. If we had an early warning on 60% of coronavirus transmissions it would completely eliminate the virus.

GarIT

DevilsHaircut wrote: »

The HSE will (and should) usually 'find out' that you're a contact anyway through the main ('manual') contact tracing system.

'Finding out' who is a carrier/potential carrier is the main way to slow the spread of the disease.

In fact, by consenting to register your number, you're more likely to be declassified as a close contact (and avoid self-isolation) as the Bluetooth technology is somewhat inaccurate in terms of distance (i.e. you might have been 3m away from a person rather than 2m as estimated by the app).

That is incorrect unless you mean classified and not declassified.

And standard contact tracing doesn't work for people you don't know when things start to reopen.

hmmm

owlbethere wrote: »

It's on the news now. They need 60% of the population to download and use the app to be successful.

60% would be great, but that's a very high (unrealistic?) bar. 500,000 have already downloaded it, and that alone will potentially make an impact. An app isn't going to stop this, but it's relatively cheap to make, it allows everyone make a small contribution and every little bit helps.

Limpy

If you download it anonymously and cycle around Dublin, or to busy locations in general, would clicking I have covid alert 100s of people?

Can the App give off false alerts basically.

GarIT

myfreespirit wrote: »

The app is confusing about the need for location to be turned on.
I experimented with turning both Bluetooth (Android 7.0 device) and location off and got these notifications from the app:

Yeah it's not ideal. As far as I know it's to do with checking where another Bluetooth device is could be considered location.

GarIT

Limpy wrote: »

If you download it anonymously and cycle around Dublin, or to busy locations in general, would clicking I have covid alert 100s of people?

Can the App give off false alerts basically.

No

DevilsHaircut

seamus wrote: »

I imagine the purpose of putting your phone number in is so that when the HSE call you they can count you as a "notified contact" for that particular case. The app itself popping up on your phone can't be counted as a proper notification because you could have suppressed them, you might dismiss it by accident, your child/dog/cat might get to the phone before you do, etc.

It's to see that you are in fact self-isolating, to convince you to do so if you're not and to arrange for any supports you might need to do so.

GarIT

DevilsHaircut wrote: »

It's to see that you are in fact self-isolating, to convince you to do so if you're not and to arrange for any supports you might need to do so.

No. It is to notify you that you may have been in contact with a positive case and to request you make an appointment for a test

Gooey Looey

Limpy wrote: »

If you download it anonymously and cycle around Dublin, or to busy locations in general, would clicking I have covid alert 100s of people?

Can the App give off false alerts basically.

That's not possible. You need a code from the HSE to set yourself as infected in the app to notify others

is_that_so

OK, someone mentioned Hauwei and the Play store earlier. Can they download at all or does it need a "workaround"?

Mav11

Is there a delay in the download from the play store? On one hand it is telling me that it is installed and further on telling me that it will be installed shortly!!!

Santy2015

Over 600,000 downloads!! Will be 1m by tomorrow surely

GarIT

is_that_so wrote: »

OK, someone mentioned Hauwei and the Play store earlier. Can they download at all or does it need a "workaround"?

The app requires the latest version of Google play services to be installed. There are some workarounds for Google play services but I haven't heard of them being used for this app yet.

GarIT

Santy2015 wrote: »

Over 600,000 downloads!! Will be 1m by tomorrow surely

It's gone from 100,000 per hour for 3 hours this morning to 100,000 in 5 hours, looks like it's slowing down.

DevilsHaircut

plodder wrote: »

You can use the same source code to build different versions of an app just tweaked with different content/graphics and different URLs to connect back to. So to the app stores they are to all intents and purposes completely different apps.

What's quite nice about the Irish one, compared to the German one for example is that it uses the same scripting framework (and source code) for iOS and Android, whereas I think the apps are completely separate/independent in the German version.

I believe that the Irish app is largely based on the Singapore one, which they open-sourced in April.