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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,300 ✭✭✭MaybeMaybe


    How do you both murder and manslaughter someone? Is it not one or the other?

    saw the same question on reddit and this was posted as the answer

    https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/mv0i36/chauvin_guilty_on_all_charges_what_are_your/gva0afc/


  • Administrators Posts: 53,832 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    How do you both murder and manslaughter someone? Is it not one or the other?

    The jury were told to consider each charge separately.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,375 ✭✭✭✭prawnsambo


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    You most certainly can.

    Causing reputational damage through incompetence that affects investor confidence and the value of the entity. See you in Court.
    A red face is usually self-inflicted. Caused by embarrassment. For doing something stupid.


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,685 ✭✭✭✭Squidgy Black


    awec wrote: »
    Madrid is a little different, their president is elected and to stand for election you need to pump massive amounts of money in. You also have to have been a member for like 20 years.

    Yeah there's a lot of uproar over themselves and Barca due to the timing of things, Peréz was only re-elected like a week ago, and Barca's board election was last month


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,931 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    How do you both murder and manslaughter someone? Is it not one or the other?


    In USA they can use multiple charges for one event in order to permit nuanced judgements...or catch-all judgements as it could be interpreted. It allows for different verdicts that might more likely lead to an appropriate verdict. e.g. Chauvin clearly caused the death of the poor victim but the question asked here would have been one charge only. He clearly also didn't set out that day to murder Floyd. If he had just been charged with murder - as here - he may well have been declared not guilty according to law. In the UK and Ireland there is not really a notion of justice in our courts. There is only the law and what that leads too. The US system is also based on 'English' common law but - as in Ireland - it has developed and evolved.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,873 ✭✭✭hold my beer


    jacothelad wrote: »
    In the UK and Ireland there is not really a notion of justice in our courts

    What you mean by this jaco?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭The Inbetween is mine


    I believe carphone warehouse has closed with immediate effect


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,328 ✭✭✭the baby bull elephant


    jacothelad wrote: »
    e.g. Chauvin clearly caused the death of the poor victim but the question asked here would have been one charge only. He clearly also didn't set out that day to murder Floyd. If he had just been charged with murder - as here - he may well have been declared not guilty according to law. In the UK and Ireland there is not really a notion of justice in our courts. There is only the law and what that leads too. The US system is also based on 'English' common law but - as in Ireland - it has developed and evolved.

    I may have to re-examine my criminal law textbooks but I don't think you're correct there certainly in relation to the Irish jurisdiction.

    4.—(1) Where a person kills another unlawfully the killing shall not be murder unless the accused person intended to kill, or cause serious injury to, some person, whether the person actually killed or not.

    (2) The accused person shall be presumed to have intended the natural and probable consequences of his conduct; but this presumption may be rebutted.

    Is the governing statute on murder. There would probably be some argument around whether he intended to cause serious injury or kill George Floyd in fairness but a murder charge failing doesn't mean that manslaughter is impossible to bring. In fact several of the defences to murder merely bring it down to a manslaughter charge if proven.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,931 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    What you mean by this jaco?
    Justice has little to do with the outcomes produced by the law. People often think of 'justice' being done ..or not....according to their views of morality. The blindfold, a symbol of blind justice, represents equality. Justice sees no difference between the parties involved.The law often seems to make a mockery of the western concept of justice and how we bind it up with morality. The meaning of justice has been considered over the centuries by successive philosophers, academics and lawyers, and there are many different theories. Major breaches of a moral code are also likely to be against the law. Criminal law provides the obvious example of where morality and law often merge. The issue of whether law should be involved in enforcing a moral code in matters that concern the personal lives of people, such as their sexuality, has long been a controversial issue, as was demonstrated in the Wolfenden Report in the 1950s.
    The problem with using moral concepts to produce 'justice' may punish behaviour that may not have proved harmful to another person and the exercise of free choice by individuals is a moral value with which it is wrong to interfere. Consider some issues that face modern society and the law. Separating conjoined twins which will lead to the death of one. Where is the Sword of justice to fall in this matter.......? Nowhere. It is a matter of law.
    Consider turning off life support...again it is a matter of law. The right to end one's life....assisted suicide etc are all matters of law v. what one might see as the antithesis of justice.


    Sorry for being so long winded but it's a long time since I opened a law book....1987 I think :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,931 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    I may have to re-examine my criminal law textbooks but I don't think you're correct there certainly in relation to the Irish jurisdiction.

    4.—(1) Where a person kills another unlawfully the killing shall not be murder unless the accused person intended to kill, or cause serious injury to, some person, whether the person actually killed or not.

    (2) The accused person shall be presumed to have intended the natural and probable consequences of his conduct; but this presumption may be rebutted.

    Is the governing statute on murder. There would probably be some argument around whether he intended to cause serious injury or kill George Floyd in fairness but a murder charge failing doesn't mean that manslaughter is impossible to bring. In fact several of the defences to murder merely bring it down to a manslaughter charge if proven.
    I studied U.K. law in the 1980s, I'm not au fait with any of it these days.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,581 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Very good Jaco! Good read.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭The Inbetween is mine


    Dubinusa wrote: »
    Very good Jaco! Good read.

    We'll have to rename him Rumpole of the Bailey!


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭Neil3030


    jacothelad wrote: »
    Justice has little to do with the outcomes produced by the law. People often think of 'justice' being done ..or not....according to their views of morality. The blindfold, a symbol of blind justice, represents equality. Justice sees no difference between the parties involved.The law often seems to make a mockery of the western concept of justice and how we bind it up with morality. The meaning of justice has been considered over the centuries by successive philosophers, academics and lawyers, and there are many different theories. Major breaches of a moral code are also likely to be against the law. Criminal law provides the obvious example of where morality and law often merge. The issue of whether law should be involved in enforcing a moral code in matters that concern the personal lives of people, such as their sexuality, has long been a controversial issue, as was demonstrated in the Wolfenden Report in the 1950s.
    The problem with using moral concepts to produce 'justice' may punish behaviour that may not have proved harmful to another person and the exercise of free choice by individuals is a moral value with which it is wrong to interfere. Consider some issues that face modern society and the law. Separating conjoined twins which will lead to the death of one. Where is the Sword of justice to fall in this matter.......? Nowhere. It is a matter of law.
    Consider turning off life support...again it is a matter of law. The right to end one's life....assisted suicide etc are all matters of law v. what one might see as the antithesis of justice.


    Sorry for being so long winded but it's a long time since I opened a law book....1987 I think :D

    Way too philosophical for us socially inept quants.

    Can you express this in some kind of formula please?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,931 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    Neil3030 wrote: »
    Way too philosophical for us socially inept quants.

    Can you express this in some kind of formula please?


    Two chemists go into a restaurant. The first chemist says, "I'll have H2O." The second chemist says, "I'll have an H2O too."... and he died.


    Q: What did the scientist say when he found 2 isotopes of helium?
    A: HeHe


    Helium walks into a bar,
    The bar tender says "We don't serve noble gasses in here."
    Helium doesn't react.

    After years of hard work, Angie took her first vacation on a luxury cruise ship. While sitting in a deck chair, she recognised a former school classmate, a long-lost friend from her old town. She crossed the deck and shook hands with her friend and said: “Hello, Angela. I haven’t seen you in years. What are you doing these days?”
    “I’m a lawyer,” whispered Angela. “But don’t tell my mother. She still thinks I’m a prostitute.”

    Apologies...


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,157 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    Neil3030 wrote: »

    Can you express this in some kind of formula please?

    The law is an ass, the only justice is Chuck Norris


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭Neil3030


    So law is a state transition function with a high degree of both systematic bias and stochastic variance. An alternative model that reduces both classes of error is Chuck Norris kicking humans in the face?

    And the the whore state has higher normalized value than the lawyer state, at least in the first-degree familial context?

    Jesus lads, why do you have to complicate this?


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,597 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    This doesn't seem especially surprising, considering all that went on:

    https://twitter.com/DeutschJill/status/1385108239877017602


  • Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    The amount of scam ads on YouTube is ridiculous.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,443 ✭✭✭kuang1


    The amount of scam ads on YouTube is ridiculous.

    Bought a new chrome book 3 months ago, and was pleasantly surprised when I started it up to find it included 3 months free membership to YouTube premium.

    Haven't seen an ad on YouTube for 12 weeks now, and have decided that I'll subscribe (€11.99 monthly) once the free trial is up.

    Have made it my music platform too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,808 ✭✭✭b.gud


    kuang1 wrote: »
    Bought a new chrome book 3 months ago, and was pleasantly surprised when I started it up to find it included 3 months free membership to YouTube premium.

    Haven't seen an ad on YouTube for 12 weeks now, and have decided that I'll subscribe (€11.99 monthly) once the free trial is up.

    Have made it my music platform too.

    If you happen to sign up while in India you could get a family membership for around €2.15 a month. I haven't seen a Youtube ad in about 6 months, it's great


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,383 ✭✭✭Dave_The_Sheep


    Between Adblock plus, Disconnect and uBlock Origin browser addons, I haven't seen a Youtube ad in years (on my PC).

    No need to pay a thing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,808 ✭✭✭b.gud


    The main problem for me was the Android TV we have which gets a lot of use, particularly with the young ones. Plus it lets you download videos for offline use which was handy when we needed something to buys us a few minutes out an about with sketchy internet


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    Adblock means I cannot remember the last time I’ve seen an ad on YouTube on my laptop. I always get momentarily confused when an ad plays on my wife’s laptop if she has YouTube up.


  • Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,383 ✭✭✭Dave_The_Sheep


    That's the one.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭The Inbetween is mine


    Back to the Superleague.... surprised to see today that Woodward left United because he wouldn't support the Glazers move to the new league.... didn't expect that..


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,685 ✭✭✭✭Squidgy Black


    Back to the Superleague.... surprised to see today that Woodward left United because he wouldn't support the Glazers move to the new league.... didn't expect that..

    Sounds like a load of BS from Woodward to be honest.

    He would've known about the club joining the ESL way before this week, and only stood down after all of the backlash.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭The Inbetween is mine


    Sounds like a load of BS from Woodward to be honest.

    He would've known about the club joining the ESL way before this week, and only stood down after all of the backlash.

    This is something that can be easily confirmed or rubbished though, so I'm not so sure it is tbh


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭Neil3030


    Who signed the letter of intent? Owners or chairmen?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 21,685 ✭✭✭✭Squidgy Black


    This is something that can be easily confirmed or rubbished though, so I'm not so sure it is tbh

    Easily confirmed by who though, United's original statement was that he had planned to stand down at the end of the year anyways before all this.


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