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Entitlement to deposit back

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135

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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Teach30 wrote: »
    Quick update

    Deposit is non refundable I have been informed via email. As our new date does not suit them we are not entitled to any money back they say. Also they won’t be offering money as a gesture of goodwill as they can’t afford to.
    So basically it’s our fault. Won’t be recommending them to any one else. The tone of their email was not nice. Very much a go f yourselves.

    We expected it so aren’t massively upset just annoyed.

    Scum, make sure yeah name and shame em..they could atleast try to meet ye in the middle personally i think ye are well within yer rights for a refund as it was just a case of all bets were off. You didnt cancel and they werent allowed play.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Dav010 wrote: »
    And have to pay them the balance? I doubt that would inconvenience them at all, but it would cost you a lot more.

    Well this might be controversial.. but i wouldn't pay em. Id atleast make em lose a day anyway if they were gonna keep the deposit..


  • Registered Users Posts: 539 ✭✭✭Teach30


    Yakult wrote: »
    Zero gig income yes, but you can be sure they are getting their COVID 19 payments each week. Like a lot of people.



    Was this made clear to you when making the original booking? That deposits are non-refundable?

    They’re part of an association so it’s on their booking form. I ticked a box when I replied to email and it’s on that. My bad

    Still not impressed by tone of their email it was quite mocking telling us to ask our new band would i ask them to waive the booking fee as a gesture of goodwill.

    Won’t bother name them here I’d prob have no luck for it.

    I’m curious as to what would happen if we told we weren’t postponing. They can’t play the date so what would happen to deposit then. Would that be the “frustrated” contract?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Teach30 wrote: »
    They’re part of an association so it’s on their booking form. I ticked a box when I replied to email and it’s on that. My bad

    Still not impressed by tone of their email it was quite mocking telling us to ask our new band would i ask them to waive the booking fee as a gesture of goodwill.

    Won’t bother name them here I’d prob have no luck for it.

    I’m curious as to what would happen if we told we weren’t postponing. They can’t play the date so what would happen to deposit then. Would that be the “frustrated” contract?

    They would have failed to keep there end of the bargain and have to give you the money back, honestly..you should get your money back id be interested to know the reaction if you were will to press the issue further and demand your money back, how far would they be willing to go. I cant see how they can keep your deposit.


  • Registered Users Posts: 539 ✭✭✭Teach30


    Cupatae wrote: »
    They would have failed to keep there end of the bargain and have to give you the money back, honestly..you should get your money back id be interested to know the reaction if you were will to press the issue further and demand your money back, how far would they be willing to go. I cant see how they can keep your deposit.

    Yea if I hadn’t told them I was postponing I might have had some hope.
    I couldn’t be bothered with the hassle of trying to get it back tbh. €500 isn’t going to break me. More sickened at the attitude in the email I received back from him. Almost laughing at us and the new band.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,951 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    Teach30 wrote: »
    They’re part of an association so it’s on their booking form. I ticked a box when I replied to email and it’s on that. My bad

    Still not impressed by tone of their email it was quite mocking telling us to ask our new band would i ask them to waive the booking fee as a gesture of goodwill.

    Won’t bother name them here I’d prob have no luck for it.

    I’m curious as to what would happen if we told we weren’t postponing. They can’t play the date so what would happen to deposit then. Would that be the “frustrated” contract?

    Sorry you have been treated so badly. I book bands for corporate events and I would be interested if this is something I should consider for booking again. How well known are they?


  • Registered Users Posts: 69,013 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Cupatae wrote: »
    Well this might be controversial.. but i wouldn't pay em. Id atleast make em lose a day anyway if they were gonna keep the deposit..

    And if you don't pay them the rest; they aren't going to turn up. So your plan falls apart.
    anewme wrote: »
    Sorry you have been treated so badly. I book bands for corporate events and I would be interested if this is something I should consider for booking again. How well known are they?

    PM this user if you wish, DO NOT post the name on the main forum.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    They have done nothing wrong. Morally they could have done better.

    But if you name and shame them you leave yourself open to very expensive defamation actions.

    On such actions, the legal costs are in the region of €20,000+

    Not advisable in the slightest.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Darc19 wrote: »
    They have done nothing wrong. Morally they could have done better.

    But if you name and shame them you leave yourself open to very expensive defamation actions.

    On such actions, the legal costs are in the region of €20,000+

    Not advisable in the slightest.

    You are entitled to leave a review on a service, if i was her id tell anyone that listened about this lot. They basically scammed 500 euro call a spade a spade.


  • Registered Users Posts: 69,013 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Cupatae wrote: »
    You are entitled to leave a review on a service.

    But not here. No name.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,580 ✭✭✭dubrov


    OP, it is clear cut that they have to refund you. There is still an implied contact and they are unable to provide the service originally agreed. The date the service is provided is key to the contract so it is not sufficient for them to offer an alternative date that suits them.

    Your next step should be to threaten them with small claims court. It's up to you if you want to follow through. It's not expensive but obviously there is time involved


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,951 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    Sorry, just to be clear.

    I was not asking for the OP to name them here at all. People can make their own decisions as to how OP has been treated.

    I would also recommend OP to leave a review on their FB page or if they have a site for reviews. Nothing over dramatic or emotional. But factual as you have here.

    I often find in cases like this, I end up siding with the suppliers, as the public can be difficult and demanding.

    OP has not come across that way at all.

    And for a supplier to send a customer a sneery email when customer is out of pocket by 500 for something completely outside his control.

    No, for me that's a step too far. Nasty.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    dubrov wrote: »
    OP, it is clear cut that they have to refund you. There is still an implied contact and they are unable to provide the service originally agreed. The date the service is provided is key to the contract so it is not sufficient for them to offer an alternative date that suits them.

    Your next step should be to threaten them with small claims court. It's up to you if you want to follow through. It's not expensive but obviously there is time involved

    Incorrect.

    The band has not cancelled. The hotel did. And then due to this, the wedding was cancelled and effectively the bride / groom cancelled the band.

    The band could probably perform as band members could be 2m apart.

    This is why wedding insurance is so important.

    BTW, Leaving an untruthful review can be defamation too. I've seen many defamation cases go through the courts in the past couple of years that have cost people dearly.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,523 ✭✭✭Ginger83


    SCC 25 quid


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Cupatae


    Darc19 wrote: »
    Incorrect.

    The band has not cancelled. The hotel did. And then due to this, the wedding was cancelled and effectively the bride / groom cancelled the band.

    The band could probably perform as band members could be 2m apart.

    This is why wedding insurance is so important.

    BTW, Leaving an untruthful review can be defamation too. I've seen many defamation cases go through the courts in the past couple of years that have cost people dearly.

    You can dress it up what ever way you like, use what ever legal terms you like but at the end of the day people can see it for what it really is, the band weren't out of pocket and the OP clearly had no intention of blaggarding them.They essentially scammed 500 euro.

    As for your attempt to persuade em not to leave a negative review...thats the beautiful thing about the internet, they dont have to leave there name, goodluck proving it was them who left the review but everyone that sees it and reads a level headed review will know to steer clear and rightly so.. bands/people like that deserve no protecting.. and imo the op has been too kind to em already.

    Post what ever review you like OP dont listen to this nonsense scaremongering.

    I honestly think you would be entitled to a refund, if you were to pursue it i dont see any reasonable person granting them the 500 euro, for absolutely nothing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,128 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    Teach30 wrote: »
    They’re part of an association so it’s on their booking form. I ticked a box when I replied to email and it’s on that. My bad

    Still not impressed by tone of their email it was quite mocking telling us to ask our new band would i ask them to waive the booking fee as a gesture of goodwill.

    Won’t bother name them here I’d prob have no luck for it.

    I’m curious as to what would happen if we told we weren’t postponing. They can’t play the date so what would happen to deposit then. Would that be the “frustrated” contract?

    A lot of people seem to have missed that you agreed to the T&C. There was no need for them to send a mocking email but if you consented to forfeiting the deposit then I don't see what more can be done.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,951 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    Darc19 wrote: »

    BTW, Leaving an untruthful review can be defamation too. I've seen many defamation cases go through the courts in the past couple of years that have cost people dearly.

    Nobody is advocating that OP leave an untruthful review. He can leave a review stating what happened as he did here.

    People can make their own decisions based on that.

    Im all for working with people and this is an unprecedented pandemic, but how people react in these situations says more about them. Even though they are legally correct if customer signed a contract, I'd prefer not to book a service from someone who treated a customer in that manner.

    There is being legally correct and there is acting with integrity. They are not the same thing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,580 ✭✭✭dubrov


    Darc19 wrote: »
    Incorrect.

    The band has not cancelled. The hotel did. And then due to this, the wedding was cancelled and effectively the bride / groom cancelled the band.

    The band could probably perform as band members could be 2m apart.

    This is why wedding insurance is so important.

    BTW, Leaving an untruthful review can be defamation too. I've seen many defamation cases go through the courts in the past couple of years that have cost people dearly.

    Where did I say the band had cancelled? They are unable to provide the agreed service. That agreed service is not the same as doing the same act in a different venue or on a different date. The service is linked to the wedding.

    Even if the band had a non-refundable clause in a signed contract, it doesn't necessarily override consumer law. They would have to show it is fair and they would not be profiting based on it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    dubrov wrote: »
    Where did I say the band had cancelled? They are unable to provide the agreed service. That agreed service is not the same as doing the same act in a different venue or on a different date. The service is linked to the wedding.

    Even if the band had a non-refundable clause in a signed contract, it doesn't necessarily override consumer law. They would have to show it is fair and they would not be profiting based on it.

    I didn't know you were the op.

    Obviously you know absolutely zilch about contracts. Zilch


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,580 ✭✭✭dubrov


    Darc19 wrote: »
    I didn't know you were the op.

    Obviously you know absolutely zilch about contracts. Zilch

    You suggested that my post was based on the band cancelling as opposed to the hotel. It does not matter.

    I also didn't add any details that the OP hadn't already stated.

    OP, check out this link on the CPCC.
    When can I ask for a refund of my deposit?
    You have a right to ask for your deposit back if:

    you cannot agree a new delivery date
    the new delivery date suggested is much later than you originally agreed
    the business fails to meet the new agreed delivery date
    the business cannot give you the item you agreed to buy

    If the business refuses to return your deposit, you may have to take legal action to try to get your deposit back. If your claim is less than €2,000, you can use the Small Claims procedure to try and resolve the issue. It costs €25 to lodge an application with the Small Claims Registrar and the procedure is a relatively cheap, fast and easy way for consumers to resolve some types of disputes, generally without having to use a solicitor.


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  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,720 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    Cold comfort now but it appears it's possible to insure a wedding.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,862 ✭✭✭un5byh7sqpd2x0


    ... And I'm Elvis Presley.

    You’re not, you’re BA Baracus - now, pity da fool.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,582 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    dubrov wrote: »
    You suggested that my post was based on the band cancelling as opposed to the hotel. It does not matter.

    I also didn't add any details that the OP hadn't already stated.

    OP, check out this link on the CPCC.

    You missed the paragraph before that on the ccpc site.

    If the business tells you that your delivery will be delayed, you should try to agree a new, reasonable date for delivery. If the product is delivered and is not what you ordered, you should contact the business immediately to arrange for it to be changed. In these situations, it is important for you to have written confirmation for proof of what you ordered.


    In this case the band didn’t cancel, the op still has them booked for that date, they just can’t play in the hotel due to Covid. Which really isn’t the bands fault.

    I do think the band should refund the money, I don’t think it is quite as simple as you make it out to be. The band are not at fault for the venue being closed, the person booking the performer is responsible for providing the venue for the performance, not the band.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,580 ✭✭✭dubrov


    Dav010 wrote:
    You missed the paragraph before that on the ccpc site.

    Dav010 wrote:
    If the business tells you that your delivery will be delayed, you should try to agree a new, reasonable date for delivery. If the product is delivered and is not what you ordered, you should contact the business immediately to arrange for it to be changed. In these situations, it is important for you to have written confirmation for proof of what you ordered.

    That paragraph is irrelevant. The OP has tried to agree a reasonable date for delivery. They are under no obligation to do so


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,580 ✭✭✭dubrov


    Dav010 wrote:
    In this case the band didn’t cancel, the op still has them booked for that date, they just can’t play in the hotel due to Covid. Which really isn’t the bands fault.

    I agree the band are not at fault for the situation and it is outside of their control.

    It doesn't change the fact that they are obligated to refund the OP in full.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,582 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    dubrov wrote: »
    I agree the band are not at fault for the situation and it is outside of their control.

    It doesn't change the fact that they are obligated to refund the OP in full.

    No they aren’t, the op was responsible for the venue, not the band. Why are you talking about absolutes like “obligated”? The band can still perform in June.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,582 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    dubrov wrote: »
    That paragraph is irrelevant. The OP has tried to agree a reasonable date for delivery. They are under no obligation to do so

    It’s very relevant, the band did not cancel and can perform on the June date, the op just needs to provide the venue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,991 ✭✭✭kirving


    Darc19 wrote: »
    But if you name and shame them you leave yourself open to very expensive defamation actions.

    On such actions, the legal costs are in the region of €20,000+

    Not advisable in the slightest.

    So it I leave a truthful review about a company online, I could be sued?

    Absolutely nothing wrong with leaving an entirely factual review. Evidence is all there in email.

    IMO, it's incredibly bad form for the band not to refund at least part of the deposit. 50/50 would be about right I think.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,582 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    So it I leave a truthful review about a company online, I could be sued?

    Absolutely nothing wrong with leaving an entirely factual review. Evidence is all there in email.

    IMO, it's incredibly bad form for the band not to refund at least part of the deposit. 50/50 would be about right I think.

    Would you include in your truthful review that you are responsible for venue and that the band can play on the date you booked them for?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    So it I leave a truthful review about a company online, I could be sued?

    Absolutely nothing wrong with leaving an entirely factual review. Evidence is all there in email.

    IMO, it's incredibly bad form for the band not to refund at least part of the deposit. 50/50 would be about right I think.

    Honesty is a defence to defamation. You can leave a review and suffer no adverse consequences once your review contains all the facts.


This discussion has been closed.
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