Garda brutality in Clonmel April 2020

Yurt2

Some people will try to defend anything.

If 3 gardai can't restrain one undersized male when he's already face-down, limbs immobilised without beating the sh*t out of him they need to find another line of work.

Cops aren't above the law, that's assault and a potentially deadly one at that.

12gauge dave

Once you resist arrest you lose all sympathy from me I'm afraid.

Miike

12gauge dave wrote: »

Once you resist arrest you lose all sympathy from me I'm afraid.

So drunk people or people with profound mental health problems (who are transiently not of sound mind) should get a brutal beating? Sound logic.

Feisar

Two of them open up on him at the same time which tells me it was controlled, as in one lad didn't loose the head. More like, "right, lets give this lad a clipping" type of scenario.

Mantis Toboggan

There's a reason why the Guards are totally against body cams.

Pkiernan

Mess with the bull, get the horns.

That'll cool his jets and soften his cough.

littlevillage

Pkiernan wrote: »

Mess with the bull, get the horns.

That'll cool his jets and soften his cough.

Thats a pretty silly comment. If you were on the receiving end of that assault..... I wonder would you be soo flippant?

Gardai have been shown again and again to be self serving and highly corrupt in this country.

Two wrongs doesn't make a right.... Presumably our victim was upto some shenanigans in order to need restraining, but the Gardai have totally overstepped the mark.

Mister Vain

Kurwa!!!

Poor Uncle Tom

12gauge dave wrote: »

Once you resist arrest you lose all sympathy from me I'm afraid.

There has been deaths in garda custody before, in Clonmel too. I would love th see the full video of events and also hear the garda's version.

skooterblue2

Miike wrote: »

So drunk people or people with profound mental health problems (who are transiently not of sound mind) should get a brutal beating? Sound logic.

Mental health explains why these things happen but does not excuse the behaviour that goes with it. You are still responsible for your behaviour.

LuasSimon

Clonmel is a town that has suffered hugely at the hands of drug gangs in recent years , you should make a video of what the drug gangs do to people or their families who have a drug debt .

Yurt2

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Mental health explains why these things happen but does not excuse the behaviour that goes with it. You are still responsible for your behaviour.

And cops assaulting a prone person on the ground with closed fists? Are they responsible to the law or should we shrug our shoulders because we hate scallys more than we have respect for the rule of law?

The only difference between a thug causing hassle for people on the streets and these three bozos is that they are in uniform and John Paul the public nuisance is in his civvies.

If they don't have the temperament to not beat the sh*t out of someone when effecting an arrest, they should find employment doing data entry in a corner cubicle away from people.

This is not a commentary on the state of AGS generally, we can really do without gents like these in our police force.

skooterblue2

Yurt! wrote: »

And cops assaulting a prone person on the ground with closed fists? Are they responsible to the law or should we shrug our shoulders because we hate scallys more than we have respect for the rule of law?

The only difference between a thug causing hassle for people on the streets and these three bozos is that they are in uniform and John Paul the public nuisance is in his civvies.

If they don't have the temperament to not beat the sh*t out of someone when effecting an arrest, they should find employment doing data entry in a corner cubicle away from people.

This is not a commentary on the state of AGS generally, we can really do without gents like these in our police force.

You see we dont have a full story. We have a segment in time. You know its not that simple and there is probably a history of blackguarding going on there.
I am no fan of the guards but I hate druggie scumbags more.

Sierra Oscar

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

There's a reason why the Guards are totally against body cams.

They're not though. Every representative body is in favour of them.

the dark phantom

the dark phantom wrote: »

Its not my video, I don't live there but unfortunately I do know the kip well. Its outside the old Regal theatre on the Davis Road. Easy for three people to hit someone once they are handcuffed on the ground. There is another video of S B getting a few belts on the legs in Garrymore few weeks back floating around too

He wasn’t handcuffed. That’s what they were trying to do. Would love to see why he was being arrested!

JeffKenna

That doesn't look great for the Guards involved. Belting into a fella when he's pinned on the ground.

Yurt2

skooterblue2 wrote: »

You see we dont have a full story. We have a segment in time. You know its not that simple and there is probably a history of blackguarding going on there.
I am no fan of the guards but I hate druggie scumbags more.

So who do cops have license to beat the sh*t out of?

Pickpockets? Drug peddlers? People parking illegally? Anyone they see fit?

You hate druggie scumbags, fantastic. But you're shrugging your shoulders at a whole other category of scumbag. We don't need context, these guys could have easily killed the guy had a blow landed in the wrong place. Worse still, there was a fairly high profile case in Clonmel where a teenager died in custody in extremely controversial circumstances and the family never got answers(not making a judgement on this case, we still don't know what went down). These rocket scientists with short fuses should know better.

These chaps must have had a head-cold the day they were taught about restraint or their responsibilities under the law generally in Templemore.

Assaults like this don't have a grey area, in no reasonable way could it be said they were defending themselves. He was subdued before they started landing blows.


P45s and investigations all-round. The law doesn't care what colour collar their shirt is.

Feisar

Yurt! wrote: »

And cops assaulting a prone person on the ground with closed fists? Are they responsible to the law or should we shrug our shoulders because we hate scallys more than we have respect for the rule of law?

The only difference between a thug causing hassle for people on the streets and these three bozos is that they are in uniform and John Paul the public nuisance is in his civvies.

If they don't have the temperament to not beat the sh*t out of someone when effecting an arrest, they should find employment doing data entry in a corner cubicle away from people.

This is not a commentary on the state of AGS generally, we can really do without gents like these in our police force.

Actually we need more of them, scum thinking (knowing) they can do what they like needs to stop. A mainland Europe military style policing style is what is needed. IMHO of course, I can lean towards authoritarianism in my views with dealing with blights on society.

JeffKenna

Feisar wrote: »

Actually we need more of them, scum thinking (knowing) they can do what they like needs to stop. A mainland Europe military style policing style is what is needed. IMHO of course, I can lean towards authoritarianism in my views with dealing with blights on society.

Era we saw first hand in the North how that works out.

Feisar

JeffKenna wrote: »

Era we saw first hand in the North how that works out.

Not the same when it's a biased sectarian foreign oppressor. NI always gets rolled out as an example of how it doesn't work. How come France/Spain/Germany etc don't have the same problem?

skooterblue2

JeffKenna wrote: »

Era we saw first hand in the North how that works out.

That was a sectarian conflict that was engineered. Not the same thing.

Yurt!

Yurt! wrote: »

So who do cops have license to beat the sh*t out of?

Seemed to me that the first part of the video showed the cops trying very hard to pin him down without hurting him. That changed as their patience wore thin. Not excusing their behavior, but at the same time, I'm not ready to call for their heads. The guy being arrested struggled and prevented them from cuffing him.

It's simple enough. If you're arrested, don't resist arrest. Go with the cops, and then present your defense. Like any normal person would.

Tell me honestly. If the police came along to arrest you, and you disagreed with the offense, would you resist that arrest? Or go with them, and argue to arrest with their superiors, or get legal aid in opposing the arrest?

Common sense really seems to be disappearing rapidly.

AnMuinteoirOg

Miike wrote: »

Restrain him using appropriate restraints and techniques. Not give him a savage beating.

Have you ever tried to Handcuff a Violent Prisoner or somebody who is coked off their head? If somebody doesn't want to be handcuffed, then its extremely hard to do so. There's only so many techniques you can try before its just a case of brute force to get them on.

Yurt2

Feisar wrote: »

Not the same when it's a biased sectarian foreign oppressor. NI always gets rolled out as an example of how it doesn't work. How come France/Spain/Germany etc don't have the same problem?

What do you want to see? Robocop patrolling O'Connell Street? Fever-dreams of Cossacks flogging misbehaving street urchins in puma tracksuits is what we're dealing with here.

France, Germany and Spain have every drug and social problem Ireland has. And in particular France has an acknowledged and well-publicized problem with levels of police violence that have escalated public disorder beyond where it needed to go in many instances.

Yurt2

Deleted User wrote: »

Seemed to me that the first part of the video showed the cops trying very hard to pin him down without hurting him. That changed as their patience wore thin. Not excusing their behavior, but at the same time, I'm not ready to call for their heads. The guy being arrested struggled and prevented them from cuffing him.

It's simple enough. If you're arrested, don't resist arrest. Go with the cops, and then present your defense. Like any normal person would.

Tell me honestly. If the police came along to arrest you, and you disagreed with the offense, would you resist that arrest? Or go with them, and argue to arrest with their superiors, or get legal aid in opposing the arrest?

Common sense really seems to be disappearing rapidly.

No-one has a license to beat up a prone person on the ground like that. Not you, not I, not Charlie Flanagan, not Drew Harris or Judge from Wanderly Wagon.

Patience or their Garda badge doesn't come into it. If they can't effect an arrest without committing a fairly brutal assault, they're in the wrong line of work - end of story.

Sometimes I think people would like to live in Argentina in the 1970s. Common sense as you say yourself.

Feisar

Yurt! wrote: »

What do you want to see? Robocop patrolling O'Connell Street? Fever-dreams of Cossacks flogging misbehaving street urchins in puma tracksuits is what we're dealing with here.

France, Germany and Spain have every drug and social problem Ireland has. And in particular France has an acknowledged and well-publicized problem with levels of police violence that have escalated public disorder beyond where it needed to go in many instances.

No need for the hyperbole in fairness.

Carfacemandog

circadian wrote: »

People complaining about brutality are probably the same folks that would be calling for some sort of vigilante justice in retaliation to some unsavoury act.

You'll need to give me a bit of time. With the bad lighting Im struggling to make out the guys skin colour so don't know if I should wholeheartedly approve or be shocked, horrified and appalled by this.

bucketybuck

littlevillage wrote: »

Thats a pretty silly comment. If you were on the receiving end of that assault..... I wonder would you be soo flippant?

You imply that potentially any of us could have been the guy on the ground, that we live in some dystopian world where the guards randomly pick people to beat down for no reason.

And it just isn't true.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes, I have no sympathy at all for some guy getting a few digs from the guards because I can be very confident that he wasn't just picked at random.

JohnnyFlash

Feisar wrote: »

No need for the hyperbole in fairness.

Dude displays the same sort of short fuse and angry personality as these cops do.

Yurt2

Feisar wrote: »

No need for the hyperbole in fairness.

You're last post was arguing in favour of authoritarianism. Robocop was quite literally a satire of people clamouring for a police state. There's no hyperbole here. You're arguing in favour of assault.

Can I ask you, who has license to beat the cr*p out of you and under what circumstance?