Covid19 Part XVII-24,841 in ROI (1,639 deaths) 4,679 in NI (518 deaths)(28/05)Read OP

Away With The Fairies

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Anyone else think the 2 meters and 15 mins thing is complete bullsh*t. Would anyone here be confident to sit 2 meters away from a confirmed case for even 30 seconds. I know I wouldn't.

I wouldn't want to sit 2 meters away from anyone...

And you don't have to be sitting with anyone. Aerosols from an infected person can be left in the air hours after they're gone and can still infect people.

podgeandrodge

Boggles wrote: »

"Lethal" is relevant to the amount of people who get it and how fast they get it.

It's more transmissible and has a higher mortality rate.

80% of the population of the USA getting it will result in 2 million+ people dying based on .9%.

It's nothing like a flu, nor is it even remotely comparable.

What are you basing the potential of 80% getting it from?

podgeandrodge

Babooshka wrote: »

Don't know where you're all living but where I live joggers are very considerate, me included. I move onto grass verges to let people walk by and I certainly don't splutter or breathe on anyone. You could always begin coughing as they're passing, I'm sure they'd move sharpish if you did.

As I said, not the normal runners, the mad crazy loon joggers. Most runners are, as you say, considerate.

magic17 wrote: »

What an inconvenience for you. I'm sorry to hear about your trouble. Are you ok?

Yep, doing especially fine given that I know most people agree with me when it comes to these special type of ignorant fúckers that don't give a shít about anyone else!

eagle eye

The great thing about wearing a mask when shopping is that people stay well away from you. Everybody should be wearing them but it's about one in twenty max wearing masks where I am. Those not wearing them see you coming and avoid you like the plague which is great for me.
It's like they think you have the virus because you are wearing a mask.

Boggles

podgeandrodge wrote: »

What are you basing the potential of 80% getting it from?

The Imperial College London.

It's the model that was presented to Trump that convinced him it's not "just a flu".

Eod100

eagle eye wrote: »

The great thing about wearing a mask when shopping is that people stay well away from you. Everybody should be wearing them but it's about one in twenty max wearing masks where I am. Those not wearing them see you coming and avoid you like the plague which is great for me.
It's like they think you have the virus because you are wearing a mask.

Bus and rail union want all passengers to use them. Out of curiosity can people hear you if you need to talk through them? Not sure how you would ask for specific fare through it without lowering mask which surely defeats the purpose..

eagle eye

Eod100 wrote:

Bus and rail union want all passengers to use them. Out of curiosity can people hear you if you need to talk through them? Not sure how you would ask for specific fare through it without lowering mask which surely defeats the purpose..

Yes, just talk a little louder.

ChelseaRentBoy

People shouid be refused entry into shops and public transport without masks. We have to get serious now about beating this thing.

beggars_bush

I'm coming to the opinion that the government need to make masks mandatory once in a shop or on public transport

People won't bother otherwise

wadacrack

I like even the psychological impact of masks. If you see many people wearing masks. Its a reminder that normality cannot resume yet. More will keep distance and adhere to the new social distancing

Eod100

beggars_bush wrote: »

I'm coming to the opinion that the government need to make masks mandatory once in a shop or on public transport

People won't bother otherwise

I dunno is it a stock issue. Maybe afraid people will buy disposable masks that we would need for healthcare workers. Was thinking they would be different markets, consumer vs healthcare workers but maybe with supply issue they will sell them to whoever

Nonoperational

Nonoperational wrote: »

Haven’t been on this thread in a while, but thought I’d give my opinion on yesterdays events.

As regards complications shuch as stroke, Kawasaki disease etc, we really haven’t noted any signal here yet. What we are seeing is a signal for pericarditis and possibly myocarditis. The incidence of stroke etc would be so small in Ireland if compared to the US that it will still be incredibly rare.

Regarding people testing negative put in “covid” wards. This is being treated by some people as absolute when the reality is different.

The general procedure in my hospital is as follows:

Patient comes in and a clinical decision is made based on symptoms if the patient goes to the “covid ed” or the “normal ed”. We don’t have test results at this stage. They usually take 24 hours.

If the patient goes to “covid ed” they are still kept away from other patients. PPE is used both for them and for all staff. If they go to a ward with Covid patients then they are kept alone, they wear masks, staff wear full PPE. It’s not like they are put into close proximity with positive patients. They then go to a query ward where there are a mix of patients. There will be many many patients who test negative and are then moved to a non covid ward.

The issue is that the covid test only picks up what the swab contacts with. If you have a high clinical index of suspicion then a patient can and most likely will have covid even after swabbing negative. We then more to tests like CT to see if we can get a further insight.

The issue in the case mentioned appears to be where they went. If they went to a single room then being in a covid area or not should not make a significant difference. It is entirely possible and indeed in my opinion likely that, at the moment, a person could have covid after 2 negative tests if the symptoms fit. We had a number of cases where this was the case. One we confirmed by CT, one by bronchial washing. Multiple negative swabs but clinically consistent with covid.

I would say that at risk patients should always be isolated if at all possible ideally in single rooms with appropriate air systems. I’m not sure of the situation in Mayo.

What I have heard is that in Mayo UH has located their Covid ward in the centre of the hospital, between non-covid wards and this is causing a lot of concern locally. I dont know if this is true or not, but I do personally know an individual who was admitted to the Hospital with respiratory symptoms in early April, confirmed negative on but kept in for a couple of weeks, discharged and was well for a number of days before getting ill again, testing positive and is now back in hospital. Am hearing that there are a number of cases like that locally, and this is what is causing concern

gipi

beggars_bush wrote: »

I'm coming to the opinion that the government need to make masks mandatory once in a shop or on public transport

People won't bother otherwise

If masks are made mandatory, then the government will be asked to supply them to the "I can't afford a mask" brigade.
That's why I reckon they'll be advised not mandated.

ZX7R

gipi wrote: »

If masks are made mandatory, then the government will be asked to supply them to the "I can't afford a mask" brigade.
That's why I reckon they'll be advised not mandated.

Any sort of mouth covering would suffice

is_that_so

ChelseaRentBoy wrote: »

People should be refused entry into shops and public transport without masks. We have to get serious now about beating this thing.

Cue fisticuffs, widespread personal abuse and legal challenges. We are not going to beat it, we will have to learn to live with it.

is_that_so

gipi wrote: »

If masks are made mandatory, then the government will be asked to supply them to the "I can't afford a mask" brigade.
That's why I reckon they'll be advised not mandated.

Harris has more than once said they will not be mandatory, if such advice is given.

Away With The Fairies

gipi wrote: »

If masks are made mandatory, then the government will be asked to supply them to the "I can't afford a mask" brigade.
That's why I reckon they'll be advised not mandated.

If they made it mandatory, I'm sure people would find something to cover their mouth.

seamus

gipi wrote: »

If masks are made mandatory, then the government will be asked to supply them to the "I can't afford a mask" brigade.
That's why I reckon they'll be advised not mandated.

No, the main problem is the actual supply. Making sure that people can get access to appropriate masks and aren't buying some papery yoke that's been whipped up in the flats down the road, or wandering around with a wooly scarf over their mouths.

Recent polls suggest about 15% of the population are wearing masks. Rough figures suggest that if mask-wearing is to be made mandatory, then we're going to need access to at least 2.2 million masks in the space of a week. You can't make it mandatory in shops if people can't get them.

Away With The Fairies

is_that_so wrote: »

Cue fisticuffs, widespread personal abuse and legal challenges. We are not going to beat it, we will have to learn to live with it.

Legal challenges? Are people that stupid? If it's made mandatory, there's no confusion.

Away With The Fairies

seamus wrote: »

No, the main problem is the actual supply. Making sure that people can get access to appropriate masks and aren't buying some papery yoke that's been whipped up in the flats down the road, or wandering around with a wooly scarf over their mouths.

Recent polls suggest about 15% of the population are wearing masks. Rough figures suggest that if mask-wearing is to be made mandatory, then we're going to need access to at least 2.2 million masks in the space of a week. You can't make it mandatory in shops if people can't get them.

People can make their own so.

What Username Guidelines

seamus wrote: »

No, the main problem is the actual supply. Making sure that people can get access to appropriate masks and aren't buying some papery yoke that's been whipped up in the flats down the road, or wandering around with a wooly scarf over their mouths.

Recent polls suggest about 15% of the population are wearing masks. Rough figures suggest that if mask-wearing is to be made mandatory, then we're going to need access to at least 2.2 million masks in the space of a week. You can't make it mandatory in shops if people can't get them.

Do what New York is doing and advise homemade cotton masks, call them mouth coverings, get retailers on board. It's certainly helping Germany keep R0 below 1

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Anyone else think the 2 meters and 15 mins thing is complete bullsh*t. Would anyone here be confident to sit 2 meters away from a confirmed case for even 30 seconds. I know I wouldn't.

Its a probability based guideline. Analysis at some point would have shown that 95% of transmissions of respiratory viruses, transmitted through airborne particles, would have occurred following greater than 15 minutes exposure and less than 2 meters distance. But conversely, if someone who has the virus has 20 interactions a day of less the 15 minutes or greater than 2 meters, there is likely to be at least 1 transmission. And that is why we social distance. Not to eliminate all possibility of transmission, but to reduce the opportunities for transmission such that every positive individual passes to an average of 1 or less individuals.

stephenjmcd

is_that_so wrote: »

Cue fisticuffs, widespread personal abuse and legal challenges. We are not going to beat it, we will have to learn to live with it.

Exactly this, the government know the firstly supply isn't there which is why they reference face coverings and not face masks, secondly they can't pass legislation on it therefore can't make it mandatory, I'd suspect although it would be an overreaction and waste of tax payers money that yes there would be multiple legal challenges and something the attorney general wouldn't be able to defend unless theres a loophole in the covid legislation brought in late march.

is_that_so

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

Legal challenges? Are people that stupid? If it's made mandatory, there's no confusion.

It won't be made mandatory so that leaves the discretionary approach which would need to be balanced up against a loss of business and bad PR.

Snow Garden

Snow Garden wrote: »

232 days until Christmas

6 year old has already asked will Santa be allowed to visit with social distancing.

stephenjmcd

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

Legal challenges? Are people that stupid? If it's made mandatory, there's no confusion.

Yes legal challenges potentially by Gemma and her bunch of idiots but in this case they'd probably win it. To make something mandatory and in law there needs to be legislation passed.

Likewise if a supermarket for example went out and said we now insist on mandatory face covers while government only advise then said supermarket wouldn't stand a chance in court if they were sued by some idiot claiming it infringed on their rights under the constitution etc, i.e the crew you see outside the four courts this week.

New Home

Snow Garden wrote: »

232 days until Christmas

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=1295 :cool::P

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

Legal challenges? Are people that stupid? If it's made mandatory, there's no confusion.

Yes.

Away With The Fairies

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Yes legal challenges potentially by Gemma and her bunch of idiots but in this case they'd probably win it. To make something mandatory and in law there needs to be legislation passed.

Likewise if a supermarket for example went out and said we now insist on mandatory face covers while government only advise then said supermarket wouldn't stand a chance in court if they were sued by some idiot claiming it infringed on their rights under the constitution etc, i.e the crew you see outside the four courts this week.

Can they not use emergency legislation to make it mandatory?

Gynoid

eagle eye wrote: »

The great thing about wearing a mask when shopping is that people stay well away from you. Everybody should be wearing them but it's about one in twenty max wearing masks where I am. Those not wearing them see you coming and avoid you like the plague which is great for me.
It's like they think you have the virus because you are wearing a mask.

I just went out to my first big supermarket since March 27th, in a big town. Have been topping up locally for past 6 weeks. There were quite a few in the shop wearing masks. Maybe 20%. I wore one. People were very careful with distance in the aisles. The guy at the checkout said there could often be up to half the customers in masks recently. He also said friends in Dublin had got it and recovered but said it was like the flu times a hundred, and took many weeks to feel remotely normal. It is just a cultural change we have to make, people are a bit embarrassed still. I also saw my first person in full on respirator mask with the cartridges to side and with big safety googles. It is a bit dystopian looking but fair fecks to them if that is what they need to keep them self and their loved ones safe. Maybe it would go hard on the people in their circle if they got it. Masks will become normal.

is_that_so

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

Can they not use emergency legislation to make it mandatory?

That wouldn't get through the Dail anyway, especially as those advising are not in favour of such a scenario.