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Farage highlighting illegal migration chaos

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    #152
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,101 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    So things that happened 100's of years ago mean the current British population should be indebted?


    britain's crimes have been going on up until very recently.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #153
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    OneEightSeven wrote: »
    What products and services would those be?

    Also, what are your thoughts on MENA & African migrants being overrepresented on sexual violence statistics in countries like Finland and Sweden? Most of those arrived as refugees.


    How would MENA and Africans providing services and creating products here make me feel more comfortable that their presence has made my country a more dangerous place for women?

    You misunderstood the point about diversity being advantageous in terms of the global market place and so your equivocating in relation to that is an invalid argument.

    In terms of sexual crimes. I make no excuses for that. I would agree with the argument within Finland (and elsewhere) that those found guilty of such crimes should have their asylum applications denied immediately as well as

    I am not in any way making excuses for anyone who commits such crimes or arguments that they are not penalised, what I am doing is saying that the argument that Farage (and others) makes that countries are being overrun with solely economic opportunistic migrants is false and at the very least, hypocritical.


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    #154
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    TL;DR

    Nigel Farage is a xenophobic ****.

    Is that you Michael McDowell?


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    #155
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    So things that happened 100's of years ago mean the current British population should be indebted?

    I'll give you some time to look in to the history of Britain's influence on the world in order to realise that it was far from 100's of years ago.

    And I never said indebted, I was making the point that you cannot ignore one fact when looking at the other.


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    #156
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    end of the road wrote: »
    britain's crimes have been going on up until very recently.

    How recenly? Are the current British population responsible for those "crimes"?


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    #157
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Tell me how wrote: »
    I'll give you some time to look in to the history of Britain's influence on the world in order to realise that it was far from 100's of years ago.

    And I never said indebted, I was making the point that you cannot ignore one fact when looking at the other.

    So because Britain has a history of being See you next Tuesdays, everyone has to accept large scale migration.

    Thatcherisms final victory

    Your world view is dead after the combination of 2008 and Covid19.


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    #158
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Danzy wrote: »
    So because Britain has a history of being See you next Tuesdays, everyone has to accept large scale migration.
    Never said that.
    Danzy wrote: »
    Thatcherisms final victory

    Don't know what your point is here.
    Danzy wrote: »
    Your world view is dead after the combination of 2008 and Covid19.

    Why don't you tell me what my world view is, and why it's dead because of 2008 and Covid-19.


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    #159
    DelaneyIn
    Registered Users Posts: 524 ✭✭✭DelaneyIn


    Tell me how wrote: »
    Or, another way to put it.

    The UK, which invaded all but 22 countries in its history, currently has less than 2% of its population living there illegally.

    How long does the reverse colonialism happen for? And if you see it as some kind of blowback for colonialism, then what is the end point of this anti-colonialism?


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    #160
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Tell me how wrote: »
    And I never said indebted, I was making the point that you cannot ignore one fact when looking at the other.

    yes you can ignore it because it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. The majority of the British people alive today have noting to do with colonialism and as such, have no need to pay for it with taxes and safety.

    Reperation is a very very leftist belief and it makes no logical sense if you think about it for more than two seconds


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    #161
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Tell me how wrote: »
    Never said that.



    Don't know what your point is here.



    Why don't you tell me what my world view is, and why it's dead because of 2008 and Covid-19.

    Aren't you all for neoliberal levels of migration, very opposed to Farage on topics like this.

    Ironic that he a banker is taking a working class left view on migration, and you yours.

    Maybe I've you mixed up with someone else, I honestly can't be arsed to look back it's been a long day.

    Have a good evening either way safe from Zoom quizes, IPAs and high temperatures.


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    #162
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Tell me how wrote: »
    Never said that

    You said it about 5 minutes ago, dont you remember?


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    #163
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Danzy wrote: »
    Aren't you all for neoliberal levels of migration, very opposed to Farage on topics like this.

    Ironic that he a banker is taking a working class left view on migration, and you yours.

    Maybe I've you mixed up with someone else, I honestly can't be arsed to look back it's been a long day.

    Have a good evening either way safe from Zoom quizes, IPAs and high temperatures.

    You still haven't said what my view on migration is.

    Farage isn't taking a working class view on migration either. He is using his imperialist and exceptionalist mindset to help create a narrative which is pushed by both his friends in the media, and by those currently in government to help mould the view of a particular sector of UK society but I am not sure I would even agree that it is exclusive to the working class.


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    #164
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    You said it about 5 minutes ago, dont you remember?

    No.

    Can you quote my post where I said that everyone has to accept large scale migration.


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    #165
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Tell me how wrote: »
    No.

    Can you quote my post where I said that everyone has to accept large scale migration.

    Sure no problem

    Tell me how wrote: »
    Or, another way to put it.

    The UK, which invaded all but 22 countries in its history, currently has less than 2% of its population living there illegally.


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    #166
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 29,101 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    How recenly? Are the current British population responsible for those "crimes"?


    iraq would be the biggest example.
    i tend to not hold a population responsible for their government's behaviour unless they are aware that such is going to happen and vote for them on the basis that it will happen.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #167
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    DelaneyIn wrote: »
    How long does the reverse colonialism happen for? And if you see it as some kind of blowback for colonialism, then what is the end point of this anti-colonialism?

    He couldn't give a shi7 about colonialism or the British crimes of the past, call it solidarity, internationalism, etc, it's still race to the bottom free market extremism whether it is Jeremy Corbyn or a city banker calling for it.


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    #168
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Sure no problem

    Ok, and where in that statement do I say that people should accept large scale migration?

    I'll go ahead and tell you that it doesn't. But you are assuming what others are saying and then fighting that argument. Ironic then that you post that people don't like facts and evidence when you misinterpret posts such as this.


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    #169
    rgossip30
    Registered Users Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭rgossip30


    An interesting article on immigration and asylum after brexit in the UK . This will likely send a lot of asylum seekers and irregular migrants escaping more stricter rules to Ireland . The future is looking even less bright !

    https://www.freemovement.org.uk/status-of-eu-immigration-law-after-brexit/


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    #170
    2u2me
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,693 ✭✭✭2u2me


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »

    He isn't a journalist.

    I see you are a beetlejuice fan. Keep saying it enough times and it might become true.

    I have listened to him a fair few times on LBC radio, he's a kind gent.
    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    He a xenophobic racist

    No, he's really not.


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    #171
    rgossip30
    Registered Users Posts: 2,471 ✭✭✭rgossip30


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    He a xenophobic racist who's just broken the rules and should be treated as such.

    Well this is your usual form , ranting racist .


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    #172
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Tell me how wrote: »
    The point being made above and largely on this thread was about the UK so in that sense, it very much has a bearing here, and equally if the conversation is broadened to other European countries including Germany, France, Spain, Portugal, Holland etc not to mention the US.

    How is diversity a positive? Do you really not have an idea on this?
    Here's one example, the world is a global marketplace, the designing of products and services for markets which are different to the typical Western European culture and the marketing and delivering of these products and services will be more successful if workers in the company have an inherent awareness of cultural norms in the market being targeted.

    Here's another one, it's Saturday afternoon, how many people across the country are looking forward to their Saturday night takeaway and how many of these will select Asian, Chinese, Indian food as their favourite choice?

    It is laughable that you claim diversity is a positive yet your only two examples of why that is are a impressively vague statement about products and services that aren't typically western (so what?) and the fact that people enjoy foods not native to their country.

    That's diversity to you?


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    #173
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Tell me how wrote: »
    Ok, and where in that statement do I say that people should accept large scale migration?

    I'll go ahead and tell you that it doesn't. But you are assuming what others are saying and then fighting that argument. Ironic then that you post that people don't like facts and evidence when you misinterpret posts such as this.


    OK well perhaps I have misinterpreted it. Why exactly did you bring it up?


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    #174
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    rgossip30 wrote: »
    Well this is your usual form , ranting racist .

    It really is beyond parody.

    A mission against those they deen as sinners.

    Arch Bishop John McQuaid would be proud of them.


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    #175
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Deleted User wrote: »
    It is laughable that you claim diversity is a positive yet your only two examples of why that is are a impressively vague statement about products and services that aren't typically western (so what?) and the fact that people enjoy foods not native to their country.

    That's diversity to you?

    I kept it simple, given the audience. I note you didn't discount either of the points either.

    Are you saying diversity isn't important? Why?


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    #176
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Danzy wrote: »
    It really is beyond parody.

    A mission against those they deen as sinners.

    Arch Bishop John McQuaid would be proud of them.

    While the fanboys are ok with people being treated abysmally, as long as it isn't them.

    The same ones who use phrases like 'we should look after our own' before then going in to threads about social welfare and arguing there should be none of it.

    Most people are prejudiced, in one direction, but, if the socially conscious were to get their way, everyone would be open to helping others in need. But, if the neo-cons get their way, there is no support and its everyone for themselves. Which world would you rather live in, if it had to be one or the other?


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    #177
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    OK well perhaps I have misinterpreted it. Why exactly did you bring it up?

    I didn't.

    Danzy did.


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    #178
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Tell me how wrote: »
    I kept it simple, given the audience. I note you didn't discount either of the points either.

    Are you saying diversity isn't important? Why?

    It's impossible to discount your first point as it means nothing. And no, I don't think people eating a curry is diversity.

    I am not opposed to diversity but once it happens naturally and not to the detriment of native culture and is done legally.

    I'm a firm believer that if you move to a place, you respect the culture, obey the laws and try to integrate as best you can by adapting to your surroundings and not expecting your new surroundings to adapt to you.

    Illegal immigrants and illegal immigration is not acceptable and certainly not an example of any positive diversity


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    #179
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Tell me how wrote: »
    While the fanboys are ok with people being treated abysmally, as long as it isn't them.

    The same ones who use phrases like 'we should look after our own' before then going in to threads about social welfare and arguing there should be none of it.

    Most people are prejudiced, in one direction, but, if the socially conscious were to get their way, everyone would be open to helping others in need. But, if the neo-cons get their way, there is no support and its everyone for themselves. Which world would you rather live in, if it had to be one or the other?

    I think your problem is that you see it in absolutes and extremes. And tarring the opposite side as bad while yours is good. Why can't we have a bit of both?

    You mention people looking after our own and complaining about social welfare fraud and career dole merchants as if the two are related?

    It is possible to want the residents of a country to be looked after and also complain that social welfare is too generous.


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    #180
    Tell me how
    Registered Users Posts: 21,692 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I think your problem is that you see it in absolutes and extremes. And tarring the opposite side as bad while yours is good. Why can't we have a bit of both?

    You mention people looking after our own and complaining about social welfare fraud and career dole merchants as if the two are related?

    It is possible to want the residents of a country to be looked after and also complain that social welfare is too generous.

    I don't have a problem, I pay attention to what is being said, by whom, over extended time and topics and form an opinion on that.
    I've been called everything on this site from a SJW to a business focused only capitalist, to a hippy to a FG blueshirt. Surely I can't be all.
    I'm not tarring any side, I'm calling it as I see it. Maybe I'm wrong, but at least it's an informed and considered opinion.


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    #181
    CtevenSrowder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,909 ✭✭✭CtevenSrowder


    Tell me how wrote: »
    You could argue that everything is a burden on taxpayers if you view it simply as money out without considering what they can bring.

    There are benefits from supporting migrants, particularly refugees.
    • Diversity

    Why is diversity automatically seen as a good thing to you?
    Tell me how wrote: »
    [*]Skills which many of them possess and could use to contribute to the country they go to.
    What about those that do not have any valuable skills? If their skills were so valuable why would they come illegally?
    Tell me how wrote: »
    [*]Cultural experiences
    What does this even mean, and why is it a benefit? Bearing in mind most of the illegals, and refugees, come from areas of the world were the idea of gay and women's rights are within the realms of science fiction, I fail to see why their cultural experiences (whatever it is exactly that you mean by that) are automatically seen as a benefit.
    Tell me how wrote: »
    [*]In many instances, as a recognition for the damage that was done to their country by the government and military of the country they are travelling to.
    [*]Empathy for a shared cultural experience of not being safe in your home country.

    How are either of these benefits to the host country?
    Tell me how wrote: »
    I hope you recognize how lucky you are to live in a country in which you feel safe and have adequate opportunities to live life as you wish.

    Thankfully most people do, and have an understanding of the hardships which others are continually enduring.

    Most of us are fully aware of this. However saying this as an argument as to why we have to accept illegal immigration, or large numbers of refugees, is nothing more than an appeal to emotion.


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