GUI Statement - Mod warning #1

prawnsambo

Thanks for all the replies lads. So basically electronic scorecards can be used. I note Golfgraffix's offer above: Thanks for that. I know HandicapMaster have online scoring implemented in their software and I think HowDidIdo have something similar in the pipeline. So with all those options, it looks like it should be possible to resume qualifying competitions on 8th June one way or another. Good stuff.

That model local rule for bunkers is useful too. I know our club has said that players can smooth over bunkers with their feet or club head (and obviously personal rakes), so that should eliminate issues if placing is allowed and bunkers are raked by staff after competitions are over.

paulos53

Our timesheet opened this morning.
I just had a look and the majority of names are outside the 5km restriction. In fact there are quite a few that live more than 20km away

Kiith

I booked in every day next week, and just got an email saying that as per our protocols, we are only allowed play 3 times. I don't really mind that, but kind of annoying they'll enforce the 3 days protocol but not the 5km protocol? Anyway, 3 days will do i guess.

GreeBo

Golfgraffix wrote: »

The R&A are now allowing score cards to be done electronically. We (ClubNet) have opened our app with the digital card to all Irish clubs with no subscription fees for the rest of the year. There is a one off set up cost of €250 that we can’t avoid. Scoring can be done by one person in each group or by a web browser so 99.9% of golfers should be covered.

I think we have about 120 clubs up and running, close to 57,000 golfers.

Does the app allow you to see your own score all the time? (the one that your marker is entering)
Or does it allow you to see all "current" scores...which would be good and bad!

pinkdoubleeagle

You did very well to get 3 days. Some lads in our place playing 6 days in a row whilst others are struggling to get more that one game in.

Kiith

I got all 5 originally, but took my names off two of them Shouldn't be too selfish i suppose, even if i'd really like to be.

prawnsambo

Golfgraffix wrote: »

Scoring in Stroke Play (Rule 3.3b)
In view of concerns around handling and exchanging scorecards (which may be in paper or electronic form as already provided in the Rules), on a temporary basis, Committees may choose to allow methods of scoring in stroke play that do not strictly comply with Rule 3.3b, or do not comply with the normal methods used under Rule 3.3b.

It is not necessary to physically return a scorecard to the Committee provided the Committee can accept the scores in another way.

Just reading this and the advice on the R&A website and I see no reference to qualifying competitions. I think most clubs were using variations of those guidelines before the lockdown, but (certainly in my club) these were non-qualifying competitions. As an aside, CONGU make no mention of scorecards in their advice on bunkers in qualifying competitions that was quoted above.

slingerz

GreeBo wrote: »

Does the app allow you to see your own score all the time? (the one that your marker is entering)
Or does it allow you to see all "current" scores...which would be good and bad!

i think electronic scorecards are progressive and should be welcomed really. I hope my club is among those who have signed up to the electronic scorecards for the rest of the year.

slingerz

Kiith wrote: »

I booked in every day next week, and just got an email saying that as per our protocols, we are only allowed play 3 times. I don't really mind that, but kind of annoying they'll enforce the 3 days protocol but not the 5km protocol? Anyway, 3 days will do i guess.

i assume it is becuase they can enforce how often people are on the course but have no control over how far people will travel

First Up

thecomedian wrote:

What else do you think we will need to have as proof we’re going shopping? What you’re describing sounds serious

I think government and the Gardai are extremely serious about enforcing the restrictions, especially when they are being eased.

"Going shopping" with your golf clubs in the boot is going to prompt some questions. Such as where exactly are you going and what do you need to shop for that is taking you more than 5k from home.

The onus will be on you to prove why you are doing it; not on them to prove you are not.

CalamariFritti

Just to mention - as I was informed by a member of AGS at a checkpoint - shopping is not a blanket excuse for travelling farther than 5km. I was told they are expected to curb unnecessary travel so if you have a food shop/supermarket within 5km it may not suffice as a reason to go beyond 5km.

In my case I wanted to get some items the supermarkets in my town don't stock so I was going to go to the next town (10 km). I was asked are those necessary items and when they weren't in the strictest sense I was told to turn around.

Did I think that this wasn't really supported by the text of the restrictions as I read them? Yes I did. Was I going to win that argument? No I wasn't.

So if you are going to flout the 5km rule - and I'm not advocating that just to be clear - be prepared to have a good reason and be prepared to be turned around.

Russell D. Woodcock

There's not a bloody chance in hell I'll be sticking to the 5km.


Haven't swung a club on a course since early March. I'm a member of three clubs, all of which are well outside the 5km and I hope to have a round on each one before the end of the month. The furthest away is 60km each way and wild horses couldn't stop me going for a round.



Looking forward to it. It's been far too ruddy long.

SEORG

Russell D. Woodcock wrote: »

There's not a bloody chance in hell I'll be sticking to the 5km.


Haven't swung a club on a course since early March. I'm a member of three clubs, all of which are well outside the 5km and I hope to have a round on each one before the end of the month. The furthest away is 60km each way and wild horses couldn't stop me going for a round.



Looking forward to it. It's been far too ruddy long.

I'll submit your nomination for citizen of the year.

mike12

Golfgraffix wrote: »

The R&A are now allowing score cards to be done electronically. We (ClubNet) have opened our app with the digital card to all Irish clubs with no subscription fees for the rest of the year. There is a one off set up cost of €250 that we can’t avoid. Scoring can be done by one person in each group or by a web browser so 99.9% of golfers should be covered.

I think we have about 120 clubs up and running, close to 57,000 golfers.

R&A Wording (Summary)

Scoring in Stroke Play (Rule 3.3b)
In view of concerns around handling and exchanging scorecards (which may be in paper or electronic form as already provided in the Rules), on a temporary basis, Committees may choose to allow methods of scoring in stroke play that do not strictly comply with Rule 3.3b, or do not comply with the normal methods used under Rule 3.3b.

It is not necessary to physically return a scorecard to the Committee provided the Committee can accept the scores in another way.

J

Its clubnet we have it looked like you could only enter a score for 1 person at a time.
You select someone and input the score.
I would have thought you would fill it in for 1 person as u go along.

GreeBo

slingerz wrote: »

i think electronic scorecards are progressive and should be welcomed really. I hope my club is among those who have signed up to the electronic scorecards for the rest of the year.

I think they are good too (though a wet day might be a problem)
Just interested in around what it (could) mean.
You could basically have live leaderboards, but the fairness of that could be called into question, its already a potential issue when you can see returned scores before you head out.

Could also be useful for tracking where people are on the course and sending them "hurry the F up!" alerts

prawnsambo

First Up wrote: »

I think government and the Gardai are extremely serious about enforcing the restrictions, especially when they are being eased.

"Going shopping" with your golf clubs in the boot is going to prompt some questions. Such as where exactly are you going and what do you need to shop for that is taking you more than 5k from home.

The onus will be on you to prove why you are doing it; not on them to prove you are not.

I think I covered this before on another thread :

prawnsambo wrote:

Probably channelling my inner FixdePitchmark

Thinking about the 18th and somebody being inevitably stopped at a checkpoint on the way to the golf course...

"Good morning sir, could you tell me where you're going?"
"To do essential grocery shopping Garda"
"Very good sir, I presume you have your shopping bags in the boot?"
"I do indeed Garda"
"Would you mind opening the boot sir, so I can check"
[Driver pops the boot congratulating himself on his cleverness in burying his gear under a pile of shopping bags]
"There you go Garda"
[some moments elapse and then the boot is shut again]
"Very impressive collection sir, and I see you even brought your own shopping trolley"

BoldReason

GreeBo wrote: »

I think they are good too (though a wet day might be a problem)
Just interested in around what it (could) mean.
You could basically have live leaderboards, but the fairness of that could be called into question, its already a potential issue when you can see returned scores before you head out.

We actually had to get rid of the games secretary for that very reason a couple of years ago. He was checking returned scores before heading out for his round. Lol

First Up

Russell D. Woodcock wrote:

Haven't swung a club on a course since early March. I'm a member of three clubs, all of which are well outside the 5km and I hope to have a round on each one before the end of the month. The furthest away is 60km each way and wild horses couldn't stop me going for a round.

Even wild horses in uniform?

GreeBo

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Just to mention - as I was informed by a member of AGS at a checkpoint - shopping is not a blanket excuse for travelling farther than 5km. I was told they are expected to curb unnecessary travel so if you have a food shop/supermarket within 5km it may not suffice as a reason to go beyond 5km.

In my case I wanted to get some items the supermarkets in my town don't stock so I was going to go to the next town (10 km). I was asked are those necessary items and when they weren't in the strictest sense I was told to turn around.

Did I think that this wasn't really supported by the text of the restrictions as I read them? Yes I did. Was I going to win that argument? No I wasn't.

So if you are going to flout the 5km rule - and I'm not advocating that just to be clear - be prepared to have a good reason and be prepared to be turned around.

I have a foolproof way of travelling as far as you need to to get to the golf course, just say you are going for a lesson.
- "I dont think your travel is essential sir?"
o "Would you like to see my swing Garda?"

CalamariFritti

GreeBo wrote: »

I have a foolproof way of travelling as far as you need to to get to the golf course, just say you are going for a lesson.
- "I dont think your travel is essential sir?"
o "Would you like to see my swing Garda?"

Any guard seeing my swing will probably call an ambulance straight away.

Roger_007

I know that travelling more than 5km to play golf is not allowed by the letter of the law. laws are not made just for the fun of it. There is, or should be, a purpose to having any law. The purpose of this particular law is to restrict the number of people you might come into contact with on the basis that the further you go the more people you are likely to meet.
In order to comply with the spirit, rather than the letter, of the law we should all try to limit the number of other we come into contact with. For instance, if I drive to the nearest town and go for a walk down the main street and then do a bit of shopping, I am likely to come into fairly close contact with hundreds of people. If, on the other hand, I drive on my own directly to and from a golf course and play a round of golf, I will only come into any kind of contact with two other people.
We should all be doing what is the reasonably safest thing to do irrespective of what the law is.

redzerdrog

Roger_007 wrote: »

I know that travelling more than 5km to play golf is not allowed by the letter of the law. laws are not made just for the fun of it. There is, or should be, a purpose to having any law. The purpose of this particular law is to restrict the number of people you might come into contact with on the basis that the further you go the more people you are likely to meet.
In order to comply with the spirit, rather than the letter, of the law we should all try to limit the number of other we come into contact with. For instance, if I drive to the nearest town and go for a walk down the main street and then do a bit of shopping, I am likely to come into fairly close contact with hundreds of people. If, on the other hand, I drive on my own directly to and from a golf course and play a round of golf, I will only come into any kind of contact with two other people.
We should all be doing what is the reasonably safest thing to do irrespective of what the law is.

Funny enough been talking to a few members of AGS about this and they seem to take the same view regarding the spirit of the law rather than the letter if the law

pakman

Russell D. Woodcock wrote: »

There's not a bloody chance in hell I'll be sticking to the 5km.


Haven't swung a club on a course since early March. I'm a member of three clubs, all of which are well outside the 5km and I hope to have a round on each one before the end of the month. The furthest away is 60km each way and wild horses couldn't stop me going for a round.



Looking forward to it. It's been far too ruddy long.

If anyone is in doubt as to whether there are people who will act badly, leading to us all getting no golf, then here is your example.

Not being satisfied with just one course and willing to break the rules because "its been too long" or "not swung a club since March" as though that's somehow a unique circumstance.

HighLine

I seen these in action this morning whilst being tested at my club. I know they have been posted previously but they work very well. A clever, simple solution.

https://twitter.com/WicklowGolfClub/status/1261256373607727104?s=20

Mushy

HighLine wrote: »

I seen these in action this morning whilst being tested at my club. I know they have been posted previously but they work very well.

I imagine e these will become common everywhere. And electronic scorecards

prawnsambo

Mushy wrote: »

I imagine e these will become common everywhere. And electronic scorecards

The problem with electronic scorecards is that there's still no way to sign them. I've yet to see an implementation that does this definitively.

In other news, it seems that there will be no last minute change to the relaxation on Monday.

Mushy

prawnsambo wrote: »

The problem with electronic scorecards is that there's still no way to sign them. I've yet to see an implementation that does this definitively.

In other news, it seems that there will be no last minute change to the relaxation on Monday.

Surely can be set up so marker fills in card, the player has to approve score? And submitting is a declaration of truthful score

prawnsambo

Mushy wrote: »

Surely can be set up so marker fills in card, the player has to approve score? And submitting is a declaration of truthful score

Yes, but (a) there isn't a rule of golf that allows you do that and (b) there isn't a system (that I know of) that does that currently. Take the HadicapMaster system for example. I can log in as my partner and enter his scores on my phone and vice versa. But there's no way of knowing if he's 'signed' for the score if I save it. Or even if he taps on my phone to save it (not currently a good idea wrt covid-19). So rule 3.3(b) has not been verified as having been observed.

GreeBo

HighLine wrote: »

I seen these in action this morning whilst being tested at my club. I know they have been posted previously but they work very well. A clever, simple solution.

No way he holed that putt!

GreeBo

prawnsambo wrote: »

Yes, but (a) there isn't a rule of golf that allows you do that and (b) there isn't a system (that I know of) that does that currently. Take the HadicapMaster system for example. I can log in as my partner and enter his scores on my phone and vice versa. But there's no way of knowing if he's 'signed' for the score if I save it. Or even if he taps on my phone to save it (not currently a good idea wrt covid-19). So rule 3.3(b) has not been verified as having been observed.

There is no way to prove that you are the one who signed your card today either, so I dont see the difference tbh.

If each player is linked to a unique device (such as via AIB banking app) then the only person who can sign for me is using my device. Someone else using my device is no different than someone else using my signature, other than its far more secure as there is only 1 device compared to anyone with a pen signing my signature.