Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

MrDavid1976

Paddygreen wrote: »

How many grannies is one job worth guys?

Perhaps what we need to do is to look at all the causes of disease and premature death in this country and then either ban it or tax it.

1. ban cigarettes
2. Ban diesel cars with immediate effect
3. introduce Congestion charges in our cities to Reduce traffic
4. Introduce Punitive taxes on alcohol to discourage consumption
5. Introduce alcohol consumption limits
6. Substantial increase in the sugar tax and extend beyond drinks
7. Accelerate the ban on the internal combustion engine from 2030 to 2025. in the meantime a sharp increases in
8. Introduce punitive air taxes to reduce emissions in that area by disincentivising air travel
9. Halve the space available in our cities for road transport to shift to public transport, paths and cycle paths.

Ginger n Lemon

Good news - reason is coming back

"Update: Hardware retailer Woodies has pulled back on a plan to ban under-16s from its stores when they open again on Monday.

Earlier this afternoon, it said staff were concerned about social distancing with children in the shop.

However, the store has reversed the decision."

Last thing we needed is to discriminate against age.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/business/covid-19-woodies-row-back-on-banning-under-16s-from-stores-999938.html

average_runner

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

Perhaps what we need to do is to look at all the causes of disease and premature death in this country and then either ban it or tax it.

1. ban cigarettes
2. Ban diesel cars with immediate effect
3. introduce Congestion charges in our cities to Reduce traffic
4. Introduce Punitive taxes on alcohol to discourage consumption
5. Introduce alcohol consumption limits
6. Substantial increase in the sugar tax and extend beyond drinks
7. Accelerate the ban on the internal combustion engine from 2030 to 2025. in the meantime a sharp increases in
8. Introduce punitive air taxes to reduce emissions in that area by disincentivising air travel
9. Halve the space available in our cities for road transport to shift to public transport, paths and cycle paths.

None of the above causes a pandemic the last time I checked or killed as much in the last 6 weeks

average_runner

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

And yet advice from Simon Harris and the government is "stay at home", as of 15th of May anyways.

"There is growing evidence that vitamin D is protective against coronavirus and that people with chronically low levels may be at greater risk.

A study by Trinity College Dublin published this week also shows vitamin D appears to help reduce serious complications with coronavirus.

Prof Neal said fresh air quickly dispersed any virus droplets in the atmosphere."

Soon our govt will be sued by more than just cancer patients missing out on screening or treatment.

If vitamin d is so good, why are UAE, Qatar etc flying high in the numbers?

Fresh air theory? We have spent more time in fresh air over the last two months compare to normal, parks are full, people are exercising and relaxing . Numbers still went up.

Just two questions

MrDavid1976

average_runner wrote: »

None of the above causes a pandemic the last time I checked or killed as much in the last 6 weeks

Really? Air quality is a consistent killer. Diabetes causes multiple diseases. Alcohol is the big health timebomb and smoking kills. Over 31500 people died in 2019.

Paddygreen

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I know this is a "comedy" account but seriously, no place for this nonsense here. Keep it to AH.

The impending recession and employment crisis that will affect hundreds of thousands of people (and many who never really felt the benefits of the "recovery" of the last few years anyway) is far more important than your continued attention-seeking.

All we can really do is listen to the experts I’m afraid. No amount of jobs is worth a single death. The government has to stall the ball and keep people focused on the most pressing issue- the war on coronavirus, or people might panic about the implosion of the economy, which is small potatoes compared to coronavirus . The esteemed experts say we have to stay the course, that’s good enough for me.

lord quackinton

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It’s the social contract that exits in most countries. Work and pay taxes or raise the next generation of tax payers all your life in the knowledge that you will reap very few of the benefits while doing so, but also in the knowledge that when you can no longer work, that next generation will now be supporting you.

A social contract that was drawn up when retirement was 65 and most people were dead by 70
Since 2000 5 years has been added to life expectancy in Ireland which now sits at 82
And how have Europe inc Ireland decided to deal with the ticking time bomb, take in millions of immigrants to substantially increase their population of low skilled cheap labour which will drive growth And keep inflation down

MrDavid1976

average_runner wrote: »

If vitamin d is so good, why are UAE, Qatar etc flying high in the numbers?

Fresh air theory? We have spent more time in fresh air over the last two months compare to normal, parks are full, people are exercising and relaxing . Numbers still went up.

Just two questions

No the numbers did not go up. They have reduced substantially. Saying otherwise is fake news.

This virus was circulating 3 months ago and that is when most of the damage was done.

average_runner

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I know this is a "comedy" account but seriously, no place for this nonsense here. Keep it to AH.

The impending recession and employment crisis that will affect hundreds of thousands of people (and many who never really felt the benefits of the "recovery" of the last few years anyway) is far more important than your continued attention-seeking.

Recession will be short lived. Alot of medical companies are booming right now. IT is still going strong.

Things will change but that be for the better. Less pubs for example. Hopefully we continue with new pace of life, seeing families in the park, neighbour's building a community instead of all rushing around

iamwhoiam

average_runner wrote: »

If vitamin d is so good, why are UAE, Qatar etc flying high in the numbers?

Fresh air theory? We have spent more time in fresh air over the last two months compare to normal, parks are full, people are exercising and relaxing . Numbers still went up.

Just two questions

What are the Vit D levels in the populations of UAE or Qater ?

Ginger n Lemon

average_runner wrote: »

If vitamin d is so good, why are UAE, Qatar etc flying high in the numbers?

Fresh air theory? We have spent more time in fresh air over the last two months compare to normal, parks are full, people are exercising and relaxing . Numbers still went up.

Just two questions

Listen I dont know why these published scientific studies tells us that Vitamin D helps greatly against Covid and fresh air evaporates covid very fast.

I am not a scientist. Read the article, read the scientific studies.

Jaysus, Brazil is a pretty hot country and they have 0.0007% of population dying off covid.

growleaves

https://orthodoxethos.com/post/the-coronavirus-crisis-letter-from-the-holy-mountain

Ever since the Lord performed the Mystical Supper and handed down the most holy mystery of the Divine Eucharist, the world-saving Divine Liturgy has not ceased to be celebrated to this day.

Neither Diocletian, nor the Turks, nor the Communists in Russia, nor the Germans during the years of the occupation managed to stop the Divine Liturgy and the faithful from approaching Holy Communion. And now, with the fear of the virus, the churches have closed down and the faithful are deprived of the saving grace of the mysteries, of which they have so great a need.

On the contrary, while everyone here [in Greece] remains fearfully silent, in the Orthodox Churches of Serbia, Bulgaria, and Georgia divine worship continues unhindered, the churches are open, Divine Liturgy is celebrated, and the faithful are not afraid of being affected by the virus.

The protective measures employed by the present government are unconstitutional, unbearable, extreme, and unfair to the Greek Orthodox, while they have also created an atmosphere of terrorism, which the media aggravate.

Yes, the virus exists and we must protect our health and the health of those around us. Fear, however, must vanish, because when man is in a state of fear he cannot think and act rationally and discreetly.

average_runner

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

No the numbers did not go up. They have reduced substantially. Saying otherwise is fake news.

This virus was circulating 3 months ago and that is when most of the damage was done.

Look at Saudi Arabia so and also Brazil. Still rising there and they are only including admittance to the hospital like uk

Ginger n Lemon

average_runner wrote: »

Recession will be short lived. Alot of medical companies are booming right now. IT is still going strong.

Things will change but that be for the better. Less pubs for example. Hopefully we continue with new pace of life, seeing families in the park, neighbour's building a community instead of all rushing around

Less pubs will cause a very socially awkward society. Our birth rates will go down significantly.

You dont expect to be having cans in your back garden in January now do you.

MrDavid1976

average_runner wrote: »

Recession will be short lived. Alot of medical companies are booming right now. IT is still going strong.

Things will change but that be for the better. Less pubs for example. Hopefully we continue with new pace of life, seeing families in the park, neighbour's building a community instead of all rushing around

Yes a slower pace of life is guaranteed as people will not have jobs. Then we will not have the team revenues to pay for the services. So what then will we see:

- reduction in the pension and dole
- increase in taxes
- reduction in allowances such as the fuel allowance
- reduced spending on public services including on health programmes and projects such as on capitals be social housing will be sharply cut back
- local authorities will not have the money to maintain the parks.
- if we are not seen to manage our economy with the slowest exit in the western world then borrowing costs will go up.

Ginger n Lemon

Moving horse racing re opening forward might cause a chain reaction if Greece is anything to go by.

"GREECE SPEEDS UP REOPENING OF RESTAURANTS, BARS

Greece's government has decided to bring forward the opening of restaurants, bars and cafés by a week to May 25.

The decision came after the government was criticized for bringing the reopening of shopping malls, department stores and discount outlets forward by two weeks."

Lets hope.

average_runner

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Listen I dont know why these published scientific studies tells us that Vitamin D helps greatly against Covid and fresh air evaporates covid very fast.

I am not a scientist. Read the article, read the scientific studies.

Jaysus, Brazil is a pretty hot country and they have 0.0007% of population dying off covid.

But have a massive amount of cases. They were saying it was related to the jab a few weeks ago.
Spain has a high death count and they have plenty of vitamin d.

The fact is we don't know yet, it's a 29 protein strain virus so very hard to find its weakness, that's the problem hence hard to get the vaccine.

We will win this, we will open sooner than we think, schools there is no rush, most kids have almost completed their years work anyhow

average_runner

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

Really? Air quality is a consistent killer. Diabetes causes multiple diseases. Alcohol is the big health timebomb and smoking kills. Over 31500 people died in 2019.

All individually killed how much in Ireland in the last six weeks or any six weeks?

MrDavid1976

average_runner wrote: »

Look at Saudi Arabia so and also Brazil. Still rising there and they are only including admittance to the hospital like uk

We are talking about this country. If you want to talk about U.K. there is a thread for it and please set up a thread for Saudi or Brazil if you wish.

average_runner

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Less pubs will cause a very socially awkward society. Our birth rates will go down significantly.

You dont expect to be having cans in your back garden in January now do you.

So we need to drink to have kids?
Pubs arent big outside Ireland UK.
Plenty of ways to have a better social outlet.

A social society shouldn't depend on drink. We are changing as a nation, the young 20's seem more fitness base now which is great

MrDavid1976

average_runner wrote: »

All individually killed how much in Ireland in the last six weeks or any six weeks?

Firstly the 1500 is over three months. Where are you getting six weeks from?

Secondly. these factors were significant in the 1500 people who died. Those with underlying health conditions represented the majority of cases. Respiratory illness, high blood pressure, cardiac issues, obesity.

In fact looking back, the failure of the country to lock down sooner cost a large number of lives. How many lives were lost due to the failures in nursing homes?

Now this strategy will cost an inordinate amount of lost jobs.

Ginger n Lemon

average_runner wrote: »

But have a massive amount of cases. They were saying it was related to the jab a few weeks ago.
Spain has a high death count and they have plenty of vitamin d.

The fact is we don't know yet, it's a 29 protein strain virus so very hard to find its weakness, that's the problem hence hard to get the vaccine.

We will win this, we will open sooner than we think, schools there is no rush, most kids have almost completed their years work anyhow

You really need to read more and type less. Article clearly said

"Italy and Spain have both experienced high mortality rates, and scientists found both countries have lower than average vitamin D levels.

This is partly because people in southern Europe, particularly the elderly, avoid strong sun, while their darker skin pigmentation also reduces the body's ability to produce natural vitamin D."

The fact is btw, that we know. We know A LOT.

lord quackinton

Am I missing something here
Ireland well ahead of Brazil with deaths per million
Why are people being trumpian with the factual stats

SNNUS

Paddygreen wrote: »

All we can really do is listen to the experts I’m afraid. No amount of jobs is worth a single death. The government has to stall the ball and keep people focused on the most pressing issue- the war on coronavirus, or people might panic about the implosion of the economy, which is small potatoes compared to coronavirus . The esteemed experts say we have to stay the course, that’s good enough for me.

Herd mentality!

Paddygreen

Eamon Ryan and co will be pivotal in setting up the post lockdown economy. A Green New Deal will be what is needed.!

average_runner

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

You really need to read more and type less. Article clearly said

"Italy and Spain have both experienced high mortality rates, and scientists found both countries have lower than average vitamin D levels.

This is partly because people in southern Europe, particularly the elderly, avoid strong sun, while their darker skin pigmentation also reduces the body's ability to produce natural vitamin D."

The fact is btw, that we know. We know A LOT.

We know so much, how come different countries are saying different things?

We dont even know how it mutates yet, but we will

average_runner

Paddygreen wrote: »

Eamon Ryan and co will be pivotal in setting up the post lockdown economy. A Green New Deal will be what is needed.!

A green deal will increase taxes by another 10% via direct and indirect

Paddygreen

SNNUS wrote: »

Herd mentality!

We are all in this together as we move to pastures new.

_Kaiser_

Paddygreen wrote: »

All we can really do is listen to the experts I’m afraid. No amount of jobs is worth a single death. The government has to stall the ball and keep people focused on the most pressing issue- the war on coronavirus, or people might panic about the implosion of the economy, which is small potatoes compared to coronavirus . The esteemed experts say we have to stay the course, that’s good enough for me.

I'm sorry but this just is not true at all and filled with hyperbole like the "war on coronavirus" and "no amount of jobs is worth a single death".

This will probably sound harsh but here's the reality as I see it.

I feel genuinely sorry for anyone who has died or lost loved ones as a result of the virus. Let's get that out there first and foremost...

But...

1. The vast majority of these people are those who had serious medical problems that were going only one way anyway. The virus accelerated the process but death was probably not far away in many cases regardless.
Also, as someone whose mother wasted away strapped to oxygen machines and nebulisers for the last 2 years of her life, I can tell you that it was no way to go and she herself wanted it to end. Quality of life is far more important than quantity.

For the overwhelming majority of people, coronavirus means taking some sensible precautions and improving their hygiene. If they do get it, it's unlikely they'll need hospitalisation and may not even realise they had it at all.


2. We aren't just talking about jobs and the economy but the very real pressures these will lead to on people. Hundreds of thousands out there are reading that independent article this morning and worrying about how they feed their family, themselves and pay for the roof over their heads if they cannot get back to work.
The social and personal cost will be enormous - predicted to be far worse than 2008 - 2013ish - and it will affect EVERYONE.

No money means services and supports are cut. Other vital medical treatments are delayed or cancelled, infrastructure suffers, mental stress, substance abuse and suicide increases.


3. Coronavirus is going nowhere for the foreseeable future no matter how long we try to hide from it in Ireland. All we are doing here at this point is unnecessarily exacerbating the problems and the length of time it'll take to recover and the pain that will be inflicted in the meantime.

We need to learn to live alongside it while still doing those things that are essential not just to an economy, but to LIVING.

average_runner

lord quackinton wrote: »

Am I missing something here
Ireland well ahead of Brazil with deaths per million
Why are people being trumpian with the factual stats

But you got to compare like with like. Cant compare us to Sweden, but can compare Sweden to finland