Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

bb1234567

showpony1 wrote: »

some posts here in this thread will have you believe literally nothing will happen to you if you're below 60 - then you've posts above as if teens shouldn't be within a mile of each other. most all over the place thread i've ever read.

I don't mind the teenagers mixing but 20 of them almost on top of each other (at least 6 couples sitting on laps) is taking the cake a bit considering the circumstances . I was just pretty surprised to see it, so early

Strumms

Del Griffith wrote: »

You come across as one of these people that lives in the fantasy that we will have zero cases before restrictions can be lifted but thats not the case. All the curtain twitching and loud tutting in the world won't change the fact that as per the plan, people are supposed to get this virus.

Selfish is expecting to continue an indefinite lockdown that the next several generations will pay for through debt slavery. As long as the vulnerable remain cucooned and the likes of nursing homes are protected then I'm glad to see people starting to get back to normal, the sooner and swifter the better imo.

I come across as “ one of these people that lives in the fantasy that we will have zero cases before restrictions can be lifted but thats not the case “

Would you like to kindly point out where I have said or implied this ?

“All the curtain twitching and loud tutting in the world won't change the fact that as per the plan, people are supposed to get this virus.”

People are supposed to get it ? Ok off you go and get it, let us know how you get on.

“An indefinite lockdown ?”

Sorry, I hate to break it to you but I’m not advocating an indefinite lockdown.

:rolleyes:

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Hmmm. Were they still claiming the 350 euro a week whilst serving beer? Seems a bit.... fraudulent.

All a business has to do is demonstrate that the impact on their business meets the criteria to qualify for the WSS and that the employee also qualifies. They can actually continue to work.

Interesting news from the EU.


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/eu-urges-vigilance-to-avoid-coronavirus-second-wave-1.4255632?mode=amp

stephenjmcd

Big issues on certain dublin bus routes this morning..services full after a few stops and queues at stops in the city.

prunudo

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Big issues on certain dublin bus routes this morning..services full after a few stops and queues at stops in the city.

As I've said for a while, the 2m social distancing rule can't work all of the time. Public transport for one can't function even remotely properly with it in place.

Roanmore

Goldengirl wrote: »

No, as far as I know it is both shops and exercise.

After all this time people still getting this wrong :rolleyes:

CalamariFritti

SusieBlue wrote: »

It was never for shops, all along you could go to any shop any distance from your home.
The 2km/5km rule was for exercise only. Sure some people don’t even live within 5km of a supermarket.

As I had to experience first hand that statement appears not to be true.

A member of AGS told me first hand that you can not go to any shop any distance from your home. Only if essential (whatever that means) and if you can't get your essential item closer to home.

Of course members of AGS are not infallible either but I must assume they have been briefed properly and not telling me stuff they make up on the spot.

jibber5000

Driving early this morning in the west. Roads very busy, noticeable how many builders were about.

Great to see.

MrDavid1976

One of the sensible aspects of the plan is to ask people who can remote work from home to do so. This will help with public transport capacity - and remote working needs to be a long term feature. We also need to create a national culture whereby if people are sick in any way whether having the common cold, the flu or any virus, then they should be staying at home and remote work if they are able.

However, we do not have the capacity in the public transport system for buses/trains to be running with only 17% capacity. The 2metre distance (which is more than WHO recommends) will hold things back and we will need to up capacity. Healthy people will just need to get back to a relative normal. Vulnerable people will need to be protected and protect themselves.

CalamariFritti

CalamariFritti wrote: »

As I had to experience first hand that statement appears not to be true.

A member of AGS told me first hand that you can not go to any shop any distance from your home. Only if essential (whatever that means) and if you can't get your essential item closer to home.

Of course members of AGS are not infallible either but I must assume they have been briefed properly and not telling me stuff they make up on the spot.

way back 10 weeks ago the message was clear, 2km for exercise only, but travel further to shops was permitted. This meant you wouldn't be stuck doing your weekly shopping in the local Spar ! This was actually made clear by Leo Varadkar himself after a few people at the beginning were confused. I cant believe at this stage people still don't undertand that.

Whether the Gardai decide to challenge you on what shops you go to and what you buy is up to them (I certainly hadn't heard this from anyone)
..........but if they did that I would challenge them back. Are they going to arrest you because you are driving to Lidl instead of Spar? I couldnt afford to do a weekly shop in Spar!
You need to be prepared and have answers ready in case you're stopped at checkpoints.

Having said that I drove from Louth to Kildare yesterday to visit my sister. Its 1.5 hours away and after 10 weeks of being on my own during this lockdown I had enough. Best thing ever! Get on with your lives

MrDavid1976

CBear1993 wrote: »

Will be interesting to see the amount of nosy neighbour *****hawks waiting for their local construction site to open tomorrow and post any little violation they can conjure up in their mind to social media.

(Largely) Men going back to work to feed their families, meanwhile the actual perpetrators of this are the fat cat developers sitting in the head offices. The boots on the ground men have no choice as they have contractual obligations to fulfil.

So think twice before we go on a rant on twitter about 2 lads 1.9m apart while lifting a load.

I agree with your general point on the curtain twitchers but those fat cat developers are building homes for people to live in and offices for people to work in. And believe me I am not a fan of some of these developers and their general behaviour.

Many of these sites will not reopen as they are pretty much gone bust. Others need to open as otherwise they will not meet contractual deadlines, not receive payments for such, and perhaps even see projects stall - those workers will not have jobs.

_Kaiser_

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Having said that I drove from Louth to Kildare yesterday to visit my sister. Its 1.5 hours away and after 10 weeks of being on my own during this lockdown I had enough. Best thing ever! Get on with your lives

Run into any checkpoints on the motorway?

I'll be making a 150km trip later on myself as after 8 weeks away to support family, I'm going home this afternoon.

Have a letter from work to cover me anyway if needed (my place is on the way) but just wondering if AGS are out much at this point. I haven't seen anything where I am now, but I haven't been out very far either

_Kaiser_

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Run into any checkpoints on the motorway?

I'll be making a 150km trip later on myself as after 8 weeks away to support family, I'm going home this afternoon.

Have a letter from work to cover me anyway if needed (my place is on the way) but just wondering if AGS are out much at this point. I haven't seen anything where I am now, but I haven't been out very far either

None!
I drove down using M1, M50 and N7 - no checkpoints at all.
Drove home via Kilcock, Trim, Navan and roads were clear.
The only Garda car was on the outskirts of Clane as I was getting near my sisters house, but not stopping cars, just driving.

My sister has just had to get a barring order against her husband so this was my genuine excuse if I needed one, she is vulnerable. Also I live alone and so does she. I didn't stop along the way either. People need to use common sense and get on with their lives. Fear is crippling people.

The worse thing that can happen is that you are stopped and told to go home. (and if that happened I would have just gone on to the back roads anyway and continued on my trip)

MrDavid1976

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

One of the sensible aspects of the plan is to ask people who can remote work from home to do so. This will help with public transport capacity - and remote working needs to be a long term feature. We also need to create a national culture whereby if people are sick in any way whether having the common cold, the flu or any virus, then they should be staying at home and remote work if they are able.

However, we do not have the capacity in the public transport system for buses/trains to be running with only 17% capacity. The 2metre distance (which is more than WHO recommends) will hold things back and we will need to up capacity. Healthy people will just need to get back to a relative normal. Vulnerable people will need to be protected and protect themselves.

Just adding to this. Those who must be obeyed spent weeks saying masks were not needed (seemingly on the basis that people are too stupid to use them) - other countries who have quicker reopening strategies are making them mandatory and indeed supplying them. Why did we sit on our hands on this one?

_Kaiser_

[Deleted User] wrote: »

None!
I drove down using M1, M50 and N7 - no checkpoints at all.
Drove home via Kilcock, Trim, Navan and roads were clear.
The only Garda car was on the outskirts of Clane as I was getting near my sisters house, but not stopping cars, just driving.

My sister has just had to get a barring order against her husband so this was my genuine excuse if I needed one, she is vulnerable. Also I live alone and so does she. I didn't stop along the way either. People need to use common sense and get on with their lives. Fear is crippling people.

The worse thing that can happen is that you are stopped and told to go home. (and if that happened I would have just gone on to the back roads anyway and continued on my trip)

Agree with you. I don't expect any issues. After all, if I was stopped the worst that can happen is I'm sent home - which is exactly where I am going.

stephenjmcd

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

Just adding to this. Those who must be obeyed spent weeks saying masks were not needed (seemingly on the basis that people are too stupid to use them) - other countries who have quicker reopening strategies are making them mandatory and indeed supplying them. Why did we sit on our hands on this one?

Walked past a few buses this morning that were full to their current capacity. 1 or 2 wearing masks and most drivers not. People making up their own minds as was expected

NegativeCreep

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

Just adding to this. Those who must be obeyed spent weeks saying masks were not needed (seemingly on the basis that people are too stupid to use them) - other countries who have quicker reopening strategies are making them mandatory and indeed supplying them. Why did we sit on our hands on this one?

Some autistic people can’t wear masks. Simon Harris brother owns a charity for autistic people. Someone told me that was part of the reason. Absolutely ridiculous

Widescreen

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

Just adding to this. Those who must be obeyed spent weeks saying masks were not needed (seemingly on the basis that people are too stupid to use them) - other countries who have quicker reopening strategies are making them mandatory and indeed supplying them. Why did we sit on our hands on this one?

Aren't they still sitting on their hands! If they want us to wear them tell us it is mandatory in certain situations, not just suggested.

We shouldn't have to mess around making masks either for god's sake, they should be handed out in major stores and bus/train stations.

What's so difficult about it! Things like that will keep the R rate below 1, they can't just keep putting us on lock down if the cases go up again, which unfortunately is what will happen.

NegativeCreep

NegativeCreep wrote: »

Some autistic people can’t wear masks. Simon Harris brother owns a charity for autistic people. Someone told me that was part of the reason. Absolutely ridiculous

I believe it should be obligatory to wear masks on public transport or crowds. But seeing that our Health Minister, Tony Holohan (who has made rules on EVERYTHING else!) and HSE have given wishy washy guidelines on them its up to individuals themselves to make that call.
My daughter lives and works in London, they're no obligatory there either.

As another OP said, people will make up their own minds. No point in calling them out about stuff there is no hard and fast rule about. Just do your best and get on with life.

_Kaiser_

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Agree with you. I don't expect any issues. After all, if I was stopped the worst that can happen is I'm sent home - which is exactly where I am going.

In the past 2 month I have drove to my mothers house 100km away twice. Both times put work boots and clothes in the boot in case challenged, but only used them on one trip. And to me what I did was perfectly acceptable and within the guidelines. I was providing support to a vulnerable person. Being available to do jobs outside the house that she was no longer physically capable of, but would have tried to have done if I had not called, Potentially giving herself an injury and needing to go to hospital with all the attendant risks. You also cannot underestimate the importance of the emotional support that some people need. Living alone, with no outlet in your 70's can be a scary place. Calling to that person to show you are available if required while adhering to physical distancing and hygiene measure is definitely within the scope of providing support for a vulnerable person and should be encouraged not vilified

_Kaiser_

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Walked past a few buses this morning that were full to their current capacity. 1 or 2 wearing masks and most drivers not. People making up their own minds as was expected

I won't be wearing masks. I don't use public transport though, live alone, and tend not to get up close and personal with strangers in the shops.

Plus, I don't buy into the hysteria around this whole thing and increasingly less worried as more information and declining numbers has emerged.

I'll continue to wash my hands regularly, limit shopping trips (something I would do anyway as not a fan of it unless for cool stuff), limit distance as far as is practical, and will be at home most of the time anyway.

But the time has come to start moving on and that's what I'll do.

stephenjmcd

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Walked past a few buses this morning that were full to their current capacity. 1 or 2 wearing masks and most drivers not. People making up their own minds as was expected

Are drivers not behind screens anyway?

Stark

NegativeCreep wrote: »

Some autistic people can’t wear masks. Simon Harris brother owns a charity for autistic people. Someone told me that was part of the reason. Absolutely ridiculous

Make them mandatory unless you have an exemption for specific issues such as above. Not ideal for someone to have to carry around an exemption note I know but there's no way out of the current situation that's nice for everybody and lockdown is probably the most wide ranging harmful solution of all. The autistic kids will suffer just as much when SNA funding and services evaporate after an extended lockdown destroys the economy.

Not to mention Facebook University is awash now with FUD about masks which is going to put more people off. We'll all be stuck watching Netflix in August while our friends in Europe are enjoying their summer holidays.

stephenjmcd

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I won't be wearing masks. I don't use public transport though, live alone, and tend not to get up close and personal with strangers in the shops.

Plus, I don't buy into the hysteria around this whole thing and increasingly less worried as more information and declining numbers has emerged.

I'll continue to wash my hands regularly, limit shopping trips (something I would do anyway as not a fan of it unless for cool stuff), limit distance as far as is practical, and will be at home most of the time anyway.

But the time has come to start moving on and that's what I'll do.

I'd be of the same line of thinking as yourself. As long as the traffic is relatively light I'm driving in and out of work but when its starts to build again I'll be back onto the bus.

Ginger n Lemon

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Big issues on certain dublin bus routes this morning..services full after a few stops and queues at stops in the city.

That is a big issue absolutely if you have an underlying condition or you are elderly on the bus.

Anything else is normal business taking its course. People will flood public transport, all opened shops, starting today.

This process has kicked off and it can't be stopped, government cant go into lockdown again as that will mean essentially damaging our economy to the point of no return. (at which stage its not covid they should worry about but rather public unrest) Nor do we have enough Gardai to put on every bus, they are busy going undercover in Donegal to expose some pubs pouring pints.

I appreciate some people would prefer social distancing but you need realise thats not how we've been building our modern world over the last 100 years.

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

What's your point? That these people died from Covid 19 and I should have known that while posting my own anecdotal account?

Whether people choose to believe what I posted is one thing, but I presented a case where there was a real human and family. You are whatabouting now about deaths in February which were never tested and may or may not have been related to Covid 19.

It doesn't at all detract from my point that the reported death numbers are not crystal clear. If anything, it supports it.

Well I find it horrifying that there are people who are dying off cancer but covid19 is put down as cause of death on death cert. How can you expect to treat covid even remotely serious if such stories circulate and they are clearly valid?

Perhaps explains why RTE/NPHET not once said what underlying conditions any person dying from covid had in the state, in the 60 + news episodes now.

stephenjmcd

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

That is a big issue absolutely if you have an underlying condition or you are elderly on the bus.

Anything else is normal business taking its course. People will flood public transport, all opened shops, starting today.

This process has kicked off and it can't be stopped, government cant go into lockdown again as that will mean essentially damaging our economy to the point of no return. (at which stage its not covid they should worry about but rather public unrest) Nor do we have enough Gardai to put on every bus, they are busy going undercover in Donegal to expose some pubs pouring pints.

I appreciate some people would prefer social distancing but you need realise thats not how we've been building our modern world over the last 100 years.

Public transport is an issue regardless. This morning you've people waiting at bus stops heading to work and the buses cant stop because they're "full" with about 15 people on board. It all comes down to social distancing wont be possible on public transport and demand this morning proves it.

Ginger n Lemon

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Public transport is an issue regardless. This morning you've people waiting at bus stops heading to work and the buses cant stop because they're "full" with about 15 people on board. It all comes down to social distancing wont be possible on public transport and demand this morning proves it.

Absolutely, and we are just at phase 1... can easily see some public unrest at these bus stops/busses now, that will likely cause harm and force government to come out and reduce social distancing to 1 metre (a bit like what they are doing in Denmark and Czech republic)

CalamariFritti

Deleted User wrote: »

way back 10 weeks ago the message was clear, 2km for exercise only, but travel further to shops was permitted. This meant you wouldn't be stuck doing your weekly shopping in the local Spar ! This was actually made clear by Leo Varadkar himself after a few people at the beginning were confused. I cant believe at this stage people still don't undertand that.

Thats not 100% fair on me. I was pretty sure I had understood it right. I had read the text of the regulation/law. But when challenged on the spot by a guard what was I going to do?

Deleted User wrote: »

Whether the Gardai decide to challenge you on what shops you go to and what you buy is up to them (I certainly hadn't heard this from anyone)
..........but if they did that I would challenge them back. Are they going to arrest you because you are driving to Lidl instead of Spar? I couldnt afford to do a weekly shop in Spar!
You need to be prepared and have answers ready in case you're stopped at checkpoints.

Having said that I drove from Louth to Kildare yesterday to visit my sister. Its 1.5 hours away and after 10 weeks of being on my own during this lockdown I had enough. Best thing ever! Get on with your lives

I think this is where I failed. I dint think I was going to be challenged like that and had nothing prepared. So all I could come up with was that I wasn't prepared to go through my shopping list with the member and that I didnt think the law gave them that permission. That wasn't received well and eventually I was threatened with a report to DPP.

I was able to defuse the situation later but the member sounded dead serious.