Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

facehugger99

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

What exactly do people think the agenda is here?

I can understand frustration with the measures we have in place, It gets to me at times as well, but the idea that Tony Holohan has some unspecified agenda to keep the country closed makes no sense to me.

Cover your arse.

Even if it costs the country billions of euros and hundreds of thousands of jobs.

Ginger n Lemon

Pitch n Putt wrote: »

The agenda of taking months to open the country incase something might happen like a second wave.

The agenda of making the general population so fearful they can’t live their daily lives without apprehension.

They talk daily like this virus is everywhere when in reality it’s pretty well controlled here now.

Some people under the impression from all this that if you contract the virus that’s it your dead. Again not even near the truth.

Tell us the actual active cases daily instead of saying 23/24 thousand cases.

Tell the people over 19 thousand of the cases are recovered.

Stop the negative and one sided agenda

That there is the most infuriating. Today RTE and Virgin media news will say "there are now 5 million cases of covid19"

Reality is below:

2,740,115
Currently Infected Patients


2,364,787
Cases which had an outcome:2,034,790 (86%)
Recovered / Discharged

329,997 (14%)
Deaths

How can they justify their 160 euro TV licence bill is beyond me. Barely deserve 16 euros for their woeful performance this year.

PS live cases worldwide represent 0.03% of planets population. Thats one in every 3,200 people currently infected. 1/3200. This pandemic is truly not worth kids missing out on 6 months of education and socialising and hundreds of thousands losing their jobs.

stephenjmcd

HSE Operations report issued

As of 8pm last night 49 patients in ICU with confirmed covid

Likewise as of 8pm 313 confimed covid patients in acute hospitals, down from 364 24hrs previous. A very large drop in confirmed cases in hosptial settings yesterday.

If those numbers are continuing to drop in 2 weeks time when this is reviewed they'll be extremely low and wont be a reason to drag out any reopening until August

is_that_so

stephenjmcd wrote: »

HSE Operations report issued

As of 8pm last night 49 patients in ICU with confirmed covid

Likewise as of 8pm 313 confimed covid patients in acute hospitals, down from 364 24hrs previous. A very large drop in confirmed cases in hospital settings yesterday.

Anne O'Connor has spoken about large numbers of people waiting to be moved from hospitals. A resolution to that may also be part of that decline. I don't think the roadmap as published will change but there may be a lot more activity in Phases 2-4.

Kermit.de.frog

stephenjmcd wrote: »

HSE Operations report issued

As of 8pm last night 49 patients in ICU with confirmed covid

Likewise as of 8pm 313 confimed covid patients in acute hospitals, down from 364 24hrs previous. A very large drop in confirmed cases in hosptial settings yesterday.

If those numbers are continuing to drop in 2 weeks time when this is reviewed they'll be extremely low and wont be a reason to drag out any reopening until August

The measures are working. Which is why they need to remain in place as long as possible.

This will give us a lower base in to the Autumn and more time to have counter measures like robust track and trace in place.

It's the best example of how the measures work and I applaud you in highlighting this success.

seamusk84

stephenjmcd wrote: »

HSE Operations report issued

As of 8pm last night 49 patients in ICU with confirmed covid

Likewise as of 8pm 313 confimed covid patients in acute hospitals, down from 364 24hrs previous. A very large drop in confirmed cases in hosptial settings yesterday.

If those numbers are continuing to drop in 2 weeks time when this is reviewed they'll be extremely low and wont be a reason to drag out any reopening until August

Here's hoping.

I was delighted to hear that close to half the pubs will be opening under their restaurant licenses on June 29th.

I swear to god if the Government and Tony Hulahoop enact some sh**te to stop them I will hit the roof.

By June 29th on current trends the virus will effectively be stamped out of the general community.

is_that_so

facehugger99 wrote: »

Cover your arse.

Even if it costs the country billions of euros and hundreds of thousands of jobs.

Even in the "much-lauded" and open Sweden, their economy is in the toilet. Chalk it all down to an unavoidable event of nature and move on with the aftermath.

stephenjmcd

is_that_so wrote: »

Anne O'Connor has spoken about large numbers of people waiting to be moved from hospitals. A resolution to that may also be part of that decline.

Partially but I doubt it. I wouldn't think that many care settings would be accepting in people from a hosptial setting at the moment given the potential risk. Now that's not to say some aren't being discharged out, I'm sure some are but I'd imagine it's a very cautious approach with a trickle being moved, I could well be wrong.

It'll be interesting to see if theres a sharp decline again today, if there is then yeah I'd be inclined to agree that if services are getting back up and running then we're seeing patients move on that were ready to leave a while ago.

Hopefully the 313 can go below 300 by tonight

prunudo

ixoy wrote: »

I think "the new normal" is my most hated phrase out of all of this.

It's the new 'going forward'

Also to say, i think some are guilty of over thinking Tony Holohan's agenda. All he cares about is ensuring he doesn't end up in hot water again like after cervical check controversy. He doesn't care about economic or easing restrictions. His point of view is solely based from a medical viewpoint.

Ginger n Lemon

stephenjmcd wrote: »

HSE Operations report issued

As of 8pm last night 49 patients in ICU with confirmed covid

Likewise as of 8pm 313 confimed covid patients in acute hospitals, down from 364 24hrs previous. A very large drop in confirmed cases in hosptial settings yesterday.

If those numbers are continuing to drop in 2 weeks time when this is reviewed they'll be extremely low and wont be a reason to drag out any reopening until August

Absolute peanuts. Why do we need to "borrow more" when our hospitals and ICU are at 15% capacity? When last week 37k were tested for covid out of 105k capacity......

How can anyone justify lockdown beyond 8th of June? We need empty hospitals?? Really? Its like owning a car and not driving it, this is getting too idiotic now.

polesheep

uli84 wrote: »

Shops are desperate to open, Homestore and More is opening now but:

“ In accordance with government guidelines, we have repurposed our stores and are not selling homeware in store at the present time. We have closed furniture, bedding, curtains, crockery or other such departments.

We are selling permitted items only including cleaning, garden, pet, electrical and cycling.”

How ridiculous is that? Do they seriously think that people will come in thousands to my local which is never busy anyways to buy bedding?

You can buy bedding plants but you can't buy bedding.:rolleyes:

ZX7R

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

Nice to see that the Irish Times has figured out why so many lockdowners are happy ———-

A significant minority of people in receipt of the €350 pandemic unemployment payment were paid less than €300 a week before the payment was introduced, a Government report has said, as questions continue about the future of the payment.The report, compiled by the Department of Business, raises concerns about “significant disincentive effects associated with the pandemic unemployment payment with 38 per cent of recipients previously earning less than €300 per week”.

With almost 600,000 people receiving the special payment, it means that over 200,000 people are better off unemployed than they were while working. That number includes many people who were working part-time in the hospitality industry.

In the last 3 weeks there has been a large uptake from small business for the wage subsidy scheme ,on average 10 thousand a week for the last 3 weeks have been stitched from the covid-19 payment back to subsidized wages.
When a business goes on the scheme the employee are returned to the books and revenue is notified.

Revenue then contacts the department of employment and social affairs.
If a employee refuses to return to subsidized wages they are aloud to make a case why in the time of the duration while the case is being made the person is aloud to receive the covid-19 payment.

When a case officer makes a decision,
In a case where the person who's case is deemed they should return to subsidized wage payment and refuse they are then reassessed to time frame for making a claim as normal from leaving there job and will receive a standard payment after 9 weeks

If a case officer decides that the employee has made a fair case they would be aloud to retain there covid-19 payment for the duration of it's payment.

So for those who believe they can refuse to return to a subsidised wage from there employer just because they get more money on the covid-19 payment than working are in for a bit of a shock.

polesheep

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Does not matter. If it's required, it's required.

State bankruptcy and an international bailout will be more likely if people refuse to follow rules.

So, in my view what you'd be better off doing is making sure people follow the rules and encouraging everyone to so.

It's in everyone's interest ultimately.

But if cases and deaths spike, as sure as night follows day, restrictions will be implemented again.

Not a snowballs' chance in Hell that they will be adhered to.

stephenjmcd

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Absolute peanuts. Why do we need to "borrow more" when our hospitals and ICU are at 15% capacity? When last week 37k were tested for covid out of 105k capacity......

How can anyone justify lockdown beyond 8th of June? We need empty hospitals?? Really? Its like owning a car and not driving it, this is getting too idiotic now.

Just to clarify hospitals aren't empty per say. They aren't full but they certainly aren't empty but I see the point your making.

In the hospitals as of 8pm there were 961 general beds available across the system compared to 1202 same time last week.

There were 126 Critical ICU beds available. 281 are currently occupied , of the 281, 49 are covid postive patients.
We have 529 critical care beds are per the report with current ability to open and staff 418

polesheep

VonLuck wrote: »

So it's anecdotal evidence...

Anyone that I've spoken to has said they're sticking to the 5km limit. Does that mean most people are obeying the restrictions?

Most people I've spoke to aren't. I suppose it depends on who you speak to.

road_high

What's Varadkar up to here? Trying to sit on both sides of the fence I assume.
http://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/coronavirus/leo-varadkar-promises-to-fast-track-road-out-of-lockdown-if-its-safe-to-do-so/ar-BB14phPf?ocid=ientp

polesheep

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Fully agree.

Elderly are dying, 90% with underlying conditions such as lung disease, heart disease, cancer, unfortunately, with covid on their death certificates.

So 5 million population of Ireland has to stay at home, children cant go to schools, officer workers cant go to the office, we must create 30bn budget deficit and increase retirement age & taxes in October, people can't avail of cancer screening indefinitely until HSE boss says otherwise, we cant hug our parents/grandparents, 15-20% long term unemployment created, university students cant socialize or attend classes with majority going "online", we tell all our hospitality sector to reduce capacity by 50%, lay off 50% of staff, businesses are shutting down and we say "oh they had high rents".

Where is the "normal" part in any of this??

It's like reliving Orsen Welles broadcast of War of the Worlds. He proved in 1938 that people could be panicked and driven to irrational behaviour through a fearful broadcast, and Leo Varadkar proved it again in 2020. A cold analysis of these lockdowns will prove it to have been the biggest case of mass hysteria that the country has ever seen. It could have been handled so much more quietly and simply.

polesheep

is_that_so wrote: »

Anne O'Connor has spoken about large numbers of people waiting to be moved from hospitals. A resolution to that may also be part of that decline. I don't think the roadmap as published will change but there may be a lot more activity in Phases 2-4.

Therefore the previous non-resolution of it must have led to increased numbers being reported.

polesheep

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The measures are working. Which is why they need to remain in place as long as possible.

This will give us a lower base in to the Autumn and more time to have counter measures like robust track and trace in place.

It's the best example of how the measures work and I applaud you in highlighting this success.

Because I didn't leave my house yesterday I didn't get hit by a bus. Therefore my measures worked. Any chance of a round of applause?

Ginger n Lemon

Seriously

"MORE THAN 50,000 people are waiting for eye care appointments from the HSE, including patients with deteriorating conditions such as glaucoma, while concerns are also being raised that treatments and procedures will be further delayed as a result of Covid-19.

The latest figures from the Department of Health show that 41,401 people are waiting for an outpatient appointment, with 12,414 of those waiting more than 18 months for their appointment."

https://www.thejournal.ie/50000-people-waiting-for-eye-care-appointment-5103723-May2020/

If we will depend on HSE progress to lift restrictions then we ll get out of lockdown in the mid 2021. Disastrous.

Hurrache

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Lol. We have nobel prize winning scientists telling us lockdowns are of little use, we have Israeli mathematicians proving to us lockdowns are of little use, now we have JPM telling us lockdowns are useless. We even have a Wuhan study that shows lockdowns are useless and social distancing wouldve done the job. (all these studies/analysis cover 30 + developed countries)

Leo was talking in the dail recently "We will reshape our society as we come out of this crisis, our children will avail of online education, our citizens will avail of E health, our air will become cleaner as people get used to working from home"

Basically wants our society to become socially awkward with children having minimal interaction, people staying at home etc. Very worrying.

Now we have below nonsense, any other countries coming out with this BS?

"Employers have been warned they should limit gatherings of staff or meetings in a room to no more than two hours to minimise the risk of workers having to stay at home if one of them tests positive for the coronavirus.

The rule applies to workers in a "closed space" like an office who are together for more than two hours if one of them is found to be diagnosed with the virus."

https://www.independent.ie/incoming/coronavirus-ireland-live-updates-number-of-cases-worldwide-crosses-5m-mark-39223123.html

Health officials in this country are losing the plot. Assume that everybody has covid (even though test positive rate is 2.5% 2.5%!!!)

So sick and tired of these "if one of them tests positive" these damn ifs. if I get hit a by bus, should I stay at home to be safe? nonsense.

With this virus, there's always research implying the opposite, you can't be selective about what you use

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/20/us/coronavirus-distancing-deaths.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur

From researchers at Columbia University.

Lockdown Delays Cost at Least 36,000 Lives, Data Show
Even small differences in timing would have prevented the worst exponential growth, which by April had subsumed New York City, New Orleans and other major cities, researchers found.

road_high

Good on HomeStores - showing this up for the farce that it is
https://www.facebook.com/132593193472293/posts/3177390698992512/

Micky 32

ixoy wrote: »

I think "the new normal" is my most hated phrase out of all of this.

Don’t forget the “ in for a rude awakening” or “ in for a shock” boloxology.

polesheep

road_high wrote: »

What's Varadkar up to here? Trying to sit on both sides of the fence I assume.
http://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/coronavirus/leo-varadkar-promises-to-fast-track-road-out-of-lockdown-if-its-safe-to-do-so/ar-BB14phPf?ocid=ientp

He's saying that he'll speed things up if the data is right but that he relies on the CMO and Nphet for that data. In other words, don't blame me blame the CMO and Nphet. And so, it begins.

Ginger n Lemon

Hurrache wrote: »

With this virus, there's always research implying the opposite, you can't be selective about what you use

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/20/us/coronavirus-distancing-deaths.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur

From researches at Columbia University.

Ofcourse, Neil Ferguson model claims to have saved 400 000 + lives in UK.

Ofcourse there is the other side of the story. Whether that side is reasonable or credible is a completely another matter.

Tony & co saved 39,000 lives in Ireland alone. There is definitely another story to all of this.

Here is another side of story predicting 96,000 dead Swedes by end of next month. So ofcourse there is another side of every story and research, its just it does tend lack a lot of credibility and this has been proven.

"The model stressed its own urgency as well. Sweden would have to adopt a lockdown policy similar to the rest of Europe immediately if it wished to avert catastrophe. As the authors explained, under “conservative” estimates using their model “the current Swedish public-health strategy will result in a peak intensive-care load in May that exceeds pre-pandemic capacity by over 40-fold, with a median mortality of 96,000 (95% CI 52,000 to 183,000)” being realized by the end of June."

https://www.aier.org/article/imperial-college-model-applied-to-sweden-yields-preposterous-results/

iamwhoiam

I think some of the problem is that NPHET are all clucking together in the hen house and making each other nervous of the the big bad fox out there
They talk all day about data , R , deaths , cases, tracking , tracing , deaths , ICU beds , isolation , deaths , children , mask, gloves, deaths , and numbers
They have lost grip on reality and on whats actually going on and are caught in the bubble of fear .
Outside the people have lost the fear of the fox and are facing him head on and looking him in the eye .We know that people are struggling and kids are getting more and more anxious and we know that fear will not beat us .NPHET are still collectively in the throes of fear and cannot see beyond it because they all hang around with each other worrying and fretting .

NIMAN

road_high wrote: »

Good on HomeStores - showing this up for the farce that it is
https://www.facebook.com/132593193472293/posts/3177390698992512/

I don't do FB, what are they saying?

Mic 1972

polesheep wrote: »

It's like reliving Orsen Welles broadcast of War of the Worlds. He proved in 1938 that people could be panicked and driven to irrational behaviour through a fearful broadcast, and Leo Varadkar proved it again in 2021. A cold analysis of these lockdowns will prove it to have been the biggest case of mass hysteria that the country has ever seen. It could have been handled so much more quietly and simply.

Ireland didn't have it as rough as Italy or Spain purely because of restrictions put in place timely. When second wave comes, if we decide not to go into lock down again, get ready for the real deal

road_high

NIMAN wrote: »

I don't do FB, what are they saying?

That they're re-opening but farcically shutting off areas of items they're not permitted to sell. You couldn't make it up but i feel the start of an avanlanche coming.

NIMAN

Covid will be an answer to many difficult questions over the coming years.

"What about the lack of money for (insert X here)" - sorry we had to pay everyone to sit at home

"What about the hospital waiting lists" - sorry Covid was more important and has set us back years

"What about the huge increase in people dying from cancers that weren't spotted" - sorry we had to stop all appts cos of Covid.