Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

Ginger n Lemon

Well

"CYPRUS CONTINUES REOPENING

More children returned to school in Cyprus on Thursday, as part of the second phase of lockdown relaxation. Primary schools and high schools are open again, with classes split into smaller groups.

The country is also drafting its plans for the summer holiday season and plans to reopen its airport June 9, Deputy Tourism Minister Savvas Perdios said. It is expected to announce its plan for tourism on Friday."

So, why do you think that is? because money ran out......

"CYPRUS SEEKS CREDIT

Cyprus is the first country in the eurozone to publicly declare its intention to seek support from the European Stability Mechanism’s designated pandemic credit line, according to local media.

Cyprus plans to raise an amount equal to 2 percent of its GDP, about €400 million."

Its only a matter of time Leo & Co claim a win over the virus and start opening up ahead of schedule, while simultaneously asking EU for money. What a co incidence

is_that_so

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Its only a matter of time Leo & Co claim a win over the virus and start opening up ahead of schedule, while simultaneously asking EU for money. What a co incidence

At that point it will be Leo, Michael and probably Eamonn & Co.

Kermit.de.frog

stephenjmcd wrote: »

I wouldn't even bother at this stage. Its quite clear that said poster is happy to see the country potentially remain in what is more or less a lockdown with many businesses closed and some wont ever reopen. The cost of this they're happy to take as a bailout and another few years of higher taxes and austerity again....it clearly wont effect him/her so they couldn't care less about those that it would hit harder.

We'll probably be told we're awful people for wanting to go back to work and back to seeing our families and not waiting another 2-3 months to do so.

You make a lot of absurd assumptions as usual.

I don't want anywhere in a 'lockdown'. The exact opposite.

I'll repeat but I know you don't absorb it because you are infected with short termism.

If this country has to close down again in the late Autumn then you will know what a financial disaster looks like. This will be a picnic by comparison.

Yet you want the short term gain without stopping to think about the medium term consequences.

If we open up too soon we leave ourselves increasingly exposed to that second wave.

A second wave may not happen but that is a high impact event and not something to take foolish risks over.

Contrary to what you seem to think I and others don't want to be on this thread in September saying 'we told you so'.

Yet some are advocating a position that brings maximum risk and exposure in return for what?

Being able to get the hair done , visit a restaurant or pub, drive 100 miles...?

Is that the sword you want to die on?

I don't think it is!

A sensible cautious approach is best for this country and maybe we can avoid the tears later on.

polesheep

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

You make a lot of absurd assumptions as usual.

I don't want anywhere in a 'lockdown'. The exact opposite.

I'll repeat but I know you don't absorb it because you are infected with short termism.

If this country has to close down again in the late Autumn then you will know what a financial disaster looks like. This will be a picnic by comparison.

Yet you want the short term gain without stopping to think about the medium term consequences.

If we open up too soon we leave ourselves increasingly exposed to that second wave.

A second wave may not happen but that is a high impact event and not something to take foolish risks over.

Contrary to what you seem to think I and others don't want to be on this thread in September saying 'we told you so'.

Yet some are advocating a position that brings maximum risk and exposure in return for what?

Being able to get the hair done , visit a restaurant or pub, drive 100 miles...?

Is that the sword you want to die on?

I don't think it is!

A sensible cautious approach is best for this country and maybe we can avoid the tears later on.

This will not happen. We know now for certain who is at risk. If Covid-19 comes back, a different approach will be taken that will allow those at least risk to carry on. You got one lockdown, I hope you enjoyed it because you won't get another.

Ginger n Lemon

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Well

"CYPRUS CONTINUES REOPENING

More children returned to school in Cyprus on Thursday, as part of the second phase of lockdown relaxation. Primary schools and high schools are open again, with classes split into smaller groups.

The country is also drafting its plans for the summer holiday season and plans to reopen its airport June 9, Deputy Tourism Minister Savvas Perdios said. It is expected to announce its plan for tourism on Friday."

So, why do you think that is? because money ran out......

"CYPRUS SEEKS CREDIT

Cyprus is the first country in the eurozone to publicly declare its intention to seek support from the European Stability Mechanism’s designated pandemic credit line, according to local media.

Cyprus plans to raise an amount equal to 2 percent of its GDP, about €400 million."

Its only a matter of time Leo & Co claim a win over the virus and start opening up ahead of schedule, while simultaneously asking EU for money. What a co incidence

You don't believe we should take money from the EU at zero interest rate?

Jackman25

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

You make a lot of absurd assumptions as usual.

I don't want anywhere in a 'lockdown'. The exact opposite.

I'll repeat but I know you don't absorb it because you are infected with short termism.

If this country has to close down again in the late Autumn then you will know what a financial disaster looks like. This will be a picnic by comparison.

Yet you want the short term gain without stopping to think about the medium term consequences.

If we open up too soon we leave ourselves increasingly exposed to that second wave.

A second wave may not happen but that is a high impact event and not something to take foolish risks over.

Contrary to what you seem to think I and others don't want to be on this thread in September saying 'we told you so'.

Yet some are advocating a position that brings maximum risk and exposure in return for what?

Being able to get the hair done , visit a restaurant or pub, drive 100 miles...?

Is that the sword you want to die on?

I don't think it is!

A sensible cautious approach is best for this country and maybe we can avoid the tears later on.

F**king ridiculous at this point that you are still bleating this ****e.

AdamD

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

You make a lot of absurd assumptions as usual.

I don't want anywhere in a 'lockdown'. The exact opposite.

I'll repeat but I know you don't absorb it because you are infected with short termism.

If this country has to close down again in the late Autumn then you will know what a financial disaster looks like. This will be a picnic by comparison.

Yet you want the short term gain without stopping to think about the medium term consequences.

If we open up too soon we leave ourselves increasingly exposed to that second wave.

A second wave may not happen but that is a high impact event and not something to take foolish risks over.

Contrary to what you seem to think I and others don't want to be on this thread in September saying 'we told you so'.

Yet some are advocating a position that brings maximum risk and exposure in return for what?

Being able to get the hair done , visit a restaurant or pub, drive 100 miles...?

Is that the sword you want to die on?

I don't think it is!

A sensible cautious approach is best for this country and maybe we can avoid the tears later on.

Why would opening up in July increase the risk of a second wave over opening up in August?

robbiezero

Mic 1972 wrote: »

From everywhere outside this board

Weird, this board is the only place I see people talking about the pandemic "riding high" in Autumn.

MrDavid1976

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Well

"CYPRUS CONTINUES REOPENING

More children returned to school in Cyprus on Thursday, as part of the second phase of lockdown relaxation. Primary schools and high schools are open again, with classes split into smaller groups.

The country is also drafting its plans for the summer holiday season and plans to reopen its airport June 9, Deputy Tourism Minister Savvas Perdios said. It is expected to announce its plan for tourism on Friday."

So, why do you think that is? because money ran out......

"CYPRUS SEEKS CREDIT

Cyprus is the first country in the eurozone to publicly declare its intention to seek support from the European Stability Mechanism’s designated pandemic credit line, according to local media.

Cyprus plans to raise an amount equal to 2 percent of its GDP, about €400 million."

Its only a matter of time Leo & Co claim a win over the virus and start opening up ahead of schedule, while simultaneously asking EU for money. What a co incidence

Those Cypriots really don’t care about their children. Neither do the Greeks, Italians, Germans, Austrians, Czechs, Slovakians

FishOnABike

Mic 1972 wrote: »

Lifting restrictions means the numbers will slowly increase, Autumn is an estimate of when the pandemic will ride high again. Nobody pinpointed August as a square one moment. And by the way August is not even an Autumn month

The cumulative number of cases will rise unless there are absolutely no new cases .

Daily new cases can be expected to rise.

Number of active cases may rise or may continue to fall depending on whether the number of new cases is greater or less than the number of closed cases daily.

The Rt was figured to be just under 0.5 going into phase 1 so there is some wriggle room for the number of new daily cases to increase slightly while the number of active cases would continue to decline (albeit at a reduced rate).

It is something that needs to be monitored closely though, and reacted to quickly if it starts to go the wrong way.

stephenjmcd

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

You make a lot of absurd assumptions as usual.

I don't want anywhere in a 'lockdown'. The exact opposite.

I'll repeat but I know you don't absorb it because you are infected with short termism.

If this country has to close down again in the late Autumn then you will know what a financial disaster looks like. This will be a picnic by comparison.

Yet you want the short term gain without stopping to think about the medium term consequences.

If we open up too soon we leave ourselves increasingly exposed to that second wave.

A second wave may not happen but that is a high impact event and not something to take foolish risks over.

Contrary to what you seem to think I and others don't want to be on this thread in September saying 'we told you so'.

Yet some are advocating a position that brings maximum risk and exposure in return for what?

Being able to get the hair done , visit a restaurant or pub, drive 100 miles...?

Is that the sword you want to die on?

I don't think it is!

A sensible cautious approach is best for this country and maybe we can avoid the tears later on.

As I expected you didn't disappoint in your reply. I'll bow down to your all knowing superiority, Kermit for Taoiseach, minister for finance, minister for health and probably every other cabinet position

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

You don't believe we should take money from the EU at zero interest rate?

I dont believe in asking for money no. Are we beggars now? Are we Greece/Cyprus?

Have we lost all self respect - please help us we are Irish we only have potatoes?

We had 6 - 10% GDP growth every year for the last 5 years, and now after a 2 month "pandemic" that has claimed 0.03% of our population we need to reach out our hand and ask for money?

Need to open up the country much quicker in line with every other sensible EU country and get on with it. We are getting to much worse than "slowest kid in the class" with every day passing by.

At this rate we ll be like Kenny from southpark.

Kermit.de.frog

polesheep wrote: »

This will not happen. We know now for certain who is at risk. If Covid-19 comes back, a different approach will be taken that will allow those at least risk to carry on. You got one lockdown, I hope you enjoyed it because you won't get another.

Once again we have mindless distortion of people's view.

Nobody, absolutely nobody, has ever implied they 'enjoy' or want to see restrictions on people's lives.

It seems inevitable again if the disease suppression fails. Transmission has to be interrupted in the population. No getting away from that.

Kermit.de.frog

stephenjmcd wrote: »

I'll bow down to your all knowing superiority, Kermit for Taoiseach, minister for finance, minister for health and probably every other cabinet position

That's a good idea

Ginger n Lemon

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

I dont believe in asking for money no. Are we beggars now? Are we Greece/Cyprus?

Have we lost all self respect - please help us we are Irish we only have potatoes?

We had 6 - 10% GDP growth every year for the last 5 years, and now after a 2 month "pandemic" that has claimed 0.03% of our population we need to reach out our hand and ask for money?

Need to open up the country much quicker in line with every other sensible EU country and get on with it. We are getting to much worse than "slowest kid in the class" with every day passing by.

At this rate we ll be like Kenny from southpark.

Money at zero interest rate is free money. And its money the ECB is creating through a simple accounting mechanism. And last time I checked we are part of the ECB. So its our money, at least some of it. How is that putting our hand out? Monetary policy is not anything like a household or business budget

LiquidZeb

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

Those Cypriots really don’t care about their children. Neither do the Greeks, Italians, Germans, Austrians, Czechs, Slovakians

Were the only country in the world that loves their kids and grandparents. We love our kids so much we're going to saddle them with reams of debt and laugh it off.

VillageIdiot71

Jackman25 wrote: »

F**king ridiculous at this point that you are still bleating this ****e.

Absolutely.

Folk arguing for strong restrictions need to acknowledge the real, serious, impacts of what they contend.

And they need to stop glossing over it, with nonsense about trips to hairdressers.

We seem to be heading for a €30 billion deficit. We can't just borrow €30 billion every year, particularly while a large amount of people cannot contribute to the financial up keep of the country.

And that's not about hairdressing. Its about being able to afford hospitals, schools and everything else. Harping on about hair only makes it look like the poster can't deal with the full picture.

paw patrol

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Once again we have mindless distortion of people's view.

Nobody, absolutely nobody, has ever implied they 'enjoy' or want to see restrictions on people's lives.

It seems inevitable again if the disease suppression fails. Transmission has to be interrupted in the population. No getting away from that.

this may seem odd considering you are on boards so much:

but have you read boards lately - a significant amount of people including yourself with this beautiful missive below "want to see restrictions on people's lives" (to quote you yourself)

so yeah , they are plenty . Misery guts who want to see others lives curtailed .

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Following on from the pubs thread what's the thoughts on betting shops not reopening?

Whatever about anything else I despise betting shops because they are positioned to prey on the most vulnerable (normally in the poorest areas and every one of them is beside a pub).

I know some jobs would be lost but i'd happily see them closed.

I think they have been in decline anyway with online gambling etc.

Thoughts? Will they all reopen you reckon?

EDIT: this is not about banning gambling, it's about the shops

Kermit.de.frog

That's totally irrelevant to this thread, not sure what point you're trying to make.

I'll repeat, nobody wants to see restrictions on people (no one I'm aware of here anyway)

lawrencesummers

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

No no, whats clear is

But, as our next chart shows, there’s little correlation between the severity of a nation’s restrictions and whether it managed to curb excess fatalities — a measure that looks at the overall number of deaths compared with normal trends...

That is clear.

You need to understand that people die every day, and because 10 more die today with "covid" on a certificate doesnt mean that it wouldve been 100 if you were getting a haircut yesterday. When you get this understanding we can proceed further.

I can understand your simplistic haircut analogy if you can accept that because 100 have died its not possible to prove it wouldn't have been 1000 dead had nothing been done, but the medically scientific research and analysis says it would have been.

We have seen high case numbers where restrictions have not been in place.
We know that higher case numbers means more deaths.
We know the mortality rate is anything up to 3%
So the less restrictions the more spread, the more spread the more dead.
You can insist on putting two and two together and getting 3 but your always going to be wrong.

The severity of restrictions is only one aspect, there are a significant number of other aspects that have to be considered. Testing, population density, initiation of restrictions, recorded first death, actual first death.

In this piece the severity of restrictions is an opinion they have formed, and it makes up a valuable measure in a suite of measures that some nations have used to combat this but not the only one.

lawrencesummers

VillageIdiot71 wrote: »

Absolutely.

Folk arguing for strong restrictions need to acknowledge the real, serious, impacts of what they contend.

And they need to stop glossing over it, with nonsense about trips to hairdressers.

We seem to be heading for a €30 billion deficit. We can't just borrow €30 billion every year, particularly while a large amount of people cannot contribute to the financial up keep of the country.

And that's not about hairdressing. Its about being able to afford hospitals, schools and everything else. Harping on about hair only makes it look like the poster can't deal with the full picture.

Who said anything about borrowing that amount every year.

Nermal

lawrencesummers wrote: »

We know the mortality rate is anything up to 3%

Not just wrong, wrong by an order of magnitude.

MrDavid1976

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Who said anything about borrowing that amount every year.

The head of the Health Department said this is here for years and they are not only advising on a lockdown but also want people to never spend two hours in the company of someone else.

paw patrol

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

That's totally irrelevant to this thread, not sure what point you're trying to make.

I'll repeat, nobody wants to see restrictions on people (no one I'm aware of here anyway)

read your own post. :rolleyes:

LiquidZeb

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

That's totally irrelevant to this thread, not sure what point you're trying to make.

I'll repeat, nobody wants to see restrictions on people (no one I'm aware of here anyway)

No you only called for the demolition of an entire industry because you don't approve of it.

setanta1984

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

A sensible cautious approach is best for this country and maybe we can avoid the tears later on.

I know most responses are antagonistic towards you, but this is a sincere question if you (or anyone) could answer it -

Why is a reopening plan of 2-3 months best for this country, but not any other country in Europe?
What is different about Ireland, and Ireland only? Nobody elses plan is even vaguely similar?

Kermit.de.frog

LiquidZeb wrote: »

No you only called for the demolition of an entire industry because you don't approve of it.

Market forces closing outlets of any type is totally irrelevant as are my views on bookies.

Next!

:cool:

LiquidZeb

setanta1984 wrote: »

I know most responses are antagonistic towards you, but this is a sincere question if you (or anyone) could answer it -

Why is a reopening plan of 2-3 months best for this country, but not any other country in Europe?
What is different about Ireland, and Ireland only? Nobody elses plan is even vaguely similar?

Good luck getting a straight answer, all you'll get is emotional guff and deflection.

NegativeCreep

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Market forces closing outlets of any type is totally irrelevant as are my views on bookies.

Next!

:cool:

The market isn’t forcing anything to close. Lockdown is.

Also using the cool emoji doesn’t make you cool

castletownman

From what I have seen some places aren't putting much thought into their social distancing measures.

There are two Subways near me, both in petrol stations at either end of town but one has at least twice the floor-space as the other (it's part of one of those modern forecourts along with a Burger King and a cafe- the former of which is still closed).

Of course, they only re-opened one for now, the one with the smaller floor-space. A very tight fit, especially as it generally does a good trade for people getting fuel anyway. Was in there for lunch- I haven't had a subway in what feels like forever- and it was noticeable that social distancing wasn't really working. Now it didn't help that there was a pocket of chaps in getting ice-cream on a day like today, but I don't see how pubs can be treated as the biggest scapegoats (without even being allowed open till well later in play), when there are other businesses opening and turning a blind eye to spacing themselves.