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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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    #1772
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    hmmm wrote: »
    "Tony made me do it, it wasn't my fault". Let's see what happens in the coming weeks.

    Meanwhile the rest of us will have to endure more restrictions because of the selfish actions of a few, as we try to keep the spread low.

    Yep the old east Berlin attitude is starting to rear it's head. The good, loyal citizens vs the evil dissidents.


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    #1773
    JoeA3
    Registered Users Posts: 7,441 ✭✭✭JoeA3


    Deleted User wrote: »
    You shouldn't be locked up but you are doing a disservice to your child putting her at risk. It's your own choice but I certainly wouldn't put my own child at risk the way you are.

    I'm sure you'll blame the HSE if any harm does come their way. A lot of people on this thread seem to have issues with personal responsibility.

    I don’t believe I am. In fact I think I am doing exactly the opposite to what you suggest. I AM taking some personal responsibility, I am not waiting for Leo to hold my hand.

    I can’t understand why some people are incapable of assessing relative risk on their own turf without relying on the Nanny state. How is it going to be any less risky in 1, 2, 6 weeks time (the completely arbitrary dates that Leo / Tony / NPHET have dictated) than it is now? There’s a 250k+ total population in my county. And from that total, approx 350 confirmed cases since this started, the vast majority of whom have probably long recovered. To my mind I’m in greater danger of getting bitten by a Rattle snake than contracting this virus in my locality.

    So for the sake of my sanity and more importantly my child’s wellbeing, we are getting our lives back to some normality while of course exercising a degree of common sense.


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    #1774
    dundalkfc10
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,719 ✭✭✭dundalkfc10


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Is it not reasonable to assume his actions are putting his child at risk? I'm just stating facts. I certainly wouldn't do that with my child. Maybe other other parents care less.

    Economy>all

    I'm a father and I disagree with 90% the Govt are doing but I wouldn't let me child mix with other kids at minute.


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    #1775
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    JoeA3 wrote: »
    I don’t believe I am. In fact I think I am doing exactly the opposite to what you suggest. I AM taking some personal responsibility, I am not waiting for Leo to hold my hand.

    I can’t understand why some people are incapable of assessing relative risk on their own turf without relying on the Nanny state. How is it going to be any less risky in 1, 2, 6 weeks time (the completely arbitrary dates that Leo / Tony / NPHET have dictated) than it is now? There’s a 250k+ total population in my county. And from that total, approx 350 confirmed cases since this started, the vast majority of whom have probably long recovered. To my mind I’m in greater danger of getting bitten by a Rattle snake than contracting this virus in my locality.

    So for the sake of my sanity and more importantly my child’s wellbeing, we are getting our lives back to some normality while of course exercising a degree of common sense.

    Ignore those eejits, they're miserable sods and misery loves company. There's nothing wrong with a child socializing if they're in misery over this, which I'm sure many are. Look after yourselves and ignore the usual shower who love to judge and berate people, it's all they have.


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    #1776
    jibber5000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 349 ✭✭jibber5000


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I think it's a bit sad that you are trivialising children's deaths for your.... reasons.

    Where in any literature has it said that multiple children are dying due to Covid induced Kawasaki disease?


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    #1777
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    jibber5000 wrote: »
    Where in any literature has it said that multiple children are dying due to Covid induced Kawasaki disease?

    There's been about 400 cases in the ages 0-14 in Ireland without a single fatality. Surely it's enough of a sample to decide that it's less harmful to children, thank God.


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    #1778
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    JoeA3 wrote: »
    I don’t believe I am. In fact I think I am doing exactly the opposite to what you suggest. I AM taking some personal responsibility, I am not waiting for Leo to hold my hand.

    I can’t understand why some people are incapable of assessing relative risk on their own turf without relying on the Nanny state. How is it going to be any less risky in 1, 2, 6 weeks time (the completely arbitrary dates that Leo / Tony / NPHET have dictated) than it is now? There’s a 250k+ total population in my county. And from that total, approx 350 confirmed cases since this started, the vast majority of whom have probably long recovered. To my mind I’m in greater danger of getting bitten by a Rattle snake than contracting this virus in my locality.

    So for the sake of my sanity and more importantly my child’s wellbeing, we are getting our lives back to some normality while of course exercising a degree of common sense.

    The fact that you think that you think you are more likely to get bitten by a rattlesnake in Ireland than catch covid-19 says it all.
    ...


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    #1779
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    The fact that you think that you think you are more likely to get bitten by a rattlesnake in Ireland than catch covid-19 says it all.
    ...

    Somehow I don't think it was meant literally but don't let that get in the way of your fit of fanaticism.


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    #1780
    Speakerboxx
    Registered Users Posts: 1,023 ✭✭✭Speakerboxx


    road_high wrote: »
    I honestly don’t care. If they want to “extend it” let them off. But they won’t because money is talking as it is always does and they can’t afford to extend the welfare payments meaning they can’t keep it going much longer if ditherers like Holohan would like to. It’s coming to an organic end

    I feel exactly the same. Enough is enough now. I be personally giving tony and co the two fingers to any other extensions he may introduce in the meantime. I am going to do my own thing in a safe manner and I'm not going be stopped either. I wont do anything that will harm anyone but i will use a bit of cop on as well with these restrictions. Some don't make any sense. If I cycle 10km solo outside the zone, who am I harming if i'm not near anyone while on a bike?


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    #1781
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    jibber5000 wrote: »
    Where in any literature has it said that multiple children are dying due to Covid induced Kawasaki disease?

    https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=Kawasaki+covid-19&btnG=#d=gs_qabs&u=%23p%3DuO1RBmSE8sMJ


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    #1782
    JoeA3
    Registered Users Posts: 7,441 ✭✭✭JoeA3


    Deleted User wrote: »
    The fact that you think that you think you are more likely to get bitten by a rattlesnake in Ireland than catch covid-19 says it all.
    ...

    Not. Enough. Facepalms.


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    #1783
    JoeA3
    Registered Users Posts: 7,441 ✭✭✭JoeA3


    Speakerboxx wrote: »
    I feel exactly the same. Enough is enough now. I be personally giving tony and co the two fingers to any other extensions he may introduce in the meantime. I am goin to do my own thing in a safe manner and I'm not going be stopped either. I wont do anything that will harm anyone but i will use a bit of cop on as well with these restrictions. Some don't make any sense. If i cycle 10km solo outside the zone, who am i harming if im not near anyone while on a bike?

    No one. As far as I can see loads of people have been doing likewise for weeks.


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    #1784
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=Kawasaki+covid-19&btnG=#d=gs_qabs&u=%23p%3DuO1RBmSE8sMJ

    Not a single one of the documents on Google scholar mentioned a fatality other than one in 1967 caused by Kawasaki but I did find this:


    A very rough estimation of incidence based on data from Bergamo, Italy, and New York State and a lot assumption is between 0.011%(95% CI: 0.009-0.014%)-0.31%(95% CI: 0.2-0.47%) of infected children.


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    #1785
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    Speakerboxx wrote: »
    I feel exactly the same. Enough is enough now. I be personally giving tony and co the two fingers to any other extensions he may introduce in the meantime. I am going to do my own thing in a safe manner and I'm not going be stopped either. I wont do anything that will harm anyone but i will use a bit of cop on as well with these restrictions. Some don't make any sense. If I cycle 10km solo outside the zone, who am I harming if i'm not near anyone while on a bike?

    I think some people are convinced there's like a 5km bubble that if they cross, a kitten somewhere dies of covid.


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    #1786
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    LiquidZeb wrote: »
    Not a single one of the documents on Google scholar mentioned a fatality other than one in 1967 caused by Kawasaki but I did find this:


    A very rough estimation of incidence based on data from Bergamo, Italy, and New York State and a lot assumption is between 0.011%(95% CI: 0.009-0.014%)-0.31%(95% CI: 0.2-0.47%) of infected children.

    Kawasaki's disease has a mortality rate of roughly 0.5%. I'm pretty sure there has been more than 200 cases in history.

    https://www.uptodate.com/contents/kawasaki-disease-clinical-features-and-diagnosis


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    #1787
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Kawasaki's disease has a mortality rate of roughly 0.5%. I'm pretty sure there has been more than 200 cases in history.

    It's about cases of Kawasaki in children who've contracted covid. If you're going to attach a link at least bloody read the contents first.


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    #1788
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    LiquidZeb wrote: »
    It's about cases of Kawasaki in children who've contracted covid. If you're going to attach a link at least bloody read the contents first.

    Pretty sure covid-19 wasn't around in 1967.


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    #1789
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Pretty sure covid-19 wasn't around in 1967.

    No the death in 1967 was from Kawasaki, not covid. That was the only fatality mentioned on the Google scholar link. The quote I attached was in relation to instances of Kawasaki as a result of covid. This really isn't that hard. Go back and read what you yourself attached.


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    #1790
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    LiquidZeb wrote: »
    It's about cases of Kawasaki in children who've contracted covid. If you're going to attach a link at least bloody read the contents first.

    What is the likelihood of multiple children contracting Kawasaki's disease whilst also suffering from covid-19?


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    #1791
    jibber5000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 349 ✭✭jibber5000


    Deleted User wrote: »
    https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=Kawasaki+covid-19&btnG=#d=gs_qabs&u=%23p%3DuO1RBmSE8sMJ

    From the European report it states only one death in Europe from Kawasaki linked Covid up to end of April out of 100 cases notified.


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    #1792
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    What is the likelihood of multiple children contracting Kawasaki's disease whilst also suffering from covid-19?

    It was there in the quote I attached in the first place, here it is again, now take your time and read it slowly.

    A very rough estimation of incidence based on data from Bergamo, Italy, and New York State and a lot assumption is between 0.011%(95% CI: 0.009-0.014%)-0.31%(95% CI: 0.2-0.47%) of infected children.


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    #1793
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    LiquidZeb wrote: »
    No the death in 1967 was from Kawasaki, not covid. That was the only fatality mentioned on the Google scholar link. The quote I attached was in relation to instances of Kawasaki as a result of covid. This really isn't that hard. Go back and read what you yourself attached.

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31094-1/fulltext


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    #1794
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    jibber5000 wrote: »
    From the European report it states only one death in Europe from Kawasaki linked Covid up to end of April out of 100 cases notified.

    Kids die from more than Kawasaki's. Spare a thought for the kids with CF.


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    #1795
    moonage
    Registered Users Posts: 820 ✭✭✭moonage


    The UK’s Kawasaki Disease Foundation issued a statement on April 28 which included the following:

    "Fewer cases of Kawasaki Disease than would be normally expected at this time of year are currently being seen – not more."

    https://www.societi.org.uk/kawasaki-disease-and-covid-19/


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    #1796
    jibber5000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 349 ✭✭jibber5000


    Deleted User wrote: »
    What is the likelihood of multiple children contracting Kawasaki's disease whilst also suffering from covid-19?

    "For the 9 detailed patients most had incomplete presentation for Kawasaki disease (with a mean 1.7 (+/-1.2) criteria per patient for the 5 non fever criterion) and only one had a classical form"

    Out of the 9 studied only one had classical Kawasaki. Out of the 9 if the mean is 1.7 out of the 5 non fever criterion, surely the actual diagnosis could be questioned in many of these cases?


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    #1797
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    moonage wrote: »
    The UK’s Kawasaki Disease Foundation issued a statement on April 28 which included the following:

    "Fewer cases of Kawasaki Disease than would be normally expected at this time of year are currently being seen – not more."

    https://www.societi.org.uk/kawasaki-disease-and-covid-19/

    That'll soften the cough of the panic merchant above.


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    #1798
    jibber5000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 349 ✭✭jibber5000


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Kids die from more than Kawasaki's. Spare a thought for the kids with CF.

    Any child with CF should be kept indoors away from other children, nobody is arguing that.

    Kawasaki was brought up by you earlier, hence the discussion.


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    #1799
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    jibber5000 wrote: »
    Any child with CF should be kept indoors away from other children, nobody is arguing that.

    Kawasaki was brought up by you earlier, hence the discussion.

    Hence he made it blindingly obvious he hadn't a clue what to do after linking Google scholar.


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    #1800
    jibber5000
    Closed Accounts Posts: 349 ✭✭jibber5000


    LiquidZeb wrote: »
    It was there in the quote I attached in the first place, here it is again, now take your time and read it slowly.

    A very rough estimation of incidence based on data from Bergamo, Italy, and New York State and a lot assumption is between 0.011%(95% CI: 0.009-0.014%)-0.31%(95% CI: 0.2-0.47%) of infected children.

    IF we extrapolate from those figures that say 1 in every 1000 infected child gets kawasaki and the mortality of Kawasaki is less than .5%, the mortality from covid induced kawasaki would be roughly 1/200,000.


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    #1801
    LiquidZeb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭LiquidZeb


    jibber5000 wrote: »
    IF we extrapolate from those figures that say 1 in every 1000 infected child gets kawasaki and the mortality of Kawasaki is less than .5%, the mortality from covid induced kawasaki would be roughly 1/200,000.

    And yet it was being framed as the bubonic plague 2.0 in a previous page. I understand the situation is scary but people need to develop a bit of perspective.


This discussion has been closed.
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