Aer Lingus Fleet/ Routes Discussion Pt 2 (ALL possible routes included)

goingnowhere

All seats except exit rows recline

Locker10a

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121344960#Comment_121344960

It’s the same seat at BA , EZY etc it’s been well discussed here.

EchoIndia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121341989#Comment_121341989

Of course age is only one factor and as long as interiors are up-to-date aircraft can serve for 30 years or more. Delta, United, LH and BA are examples of airlines that use some aircraft to the end of their useful life.

Captain_Crash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121345315#Comment_121345315

I know it’s pedantic, but I’m pedantic at times 🙈 but it’s the rows before an exit that don’t recline! So on a 320 the exit rows are 12 & 13 meaning it’s 11 & 12 that don’t slip back! Again, yes pedantic but that’s me 😂😂

Tenger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121344730#Comment_121344730

I didn't realise the A320 was obsolete while the B737 was cutting edge tech........... 🤣

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121347297#Comment_121347297

You're only half right though as 12 is an exit row... so the first exit row and the one before it.

If you're going to be pedantic, like... 😎

goingnowhere

True enough row 13 rules completely, best leg room + recline

Captain_Crash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121347828#Comment_121347828

Touché 😂😂

kub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121347623#Comment_121347623

I am obviously referring to the age of usual few planes EI operate out of Cork, compared with RYR.

I know you more refined aviation enthusiasts, will say age does not matter but it is great to see at long last a NEO operating at Cork

john boye

At long last? They've only been in Dublin a few months!

California Dreamer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121349173#Comment_121349173

It didn't matter to Ryanair when they operated a fleet of 20 732 buckets that were flown to within an inch of their lives!

Meanwhile, Ryanairs oldest 738 is just over 19 years old compared to Aer Lingus's oldest 320 is 22 years old. So not much in it.

kub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121349354#Comment_121349354

A few months ?

EI- NSA according to flighradar was new in January 2022, that is more than a few months old.

kub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121349538#Comment_121349538

I am not sure of the relevance of ancient 737-200s.

My point is solely this, the fleet that RYR operate compared with the fleet the EI used to, before the arrival of NSA, was much more modern than the EI ones

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121350721#Comment_121350721

EI NSA has been operating from DUB since Sept 2022. It was meant to go to Smartavia. So hasn’t been with EI since Jan 2022.

Makes sense to put the two NEO on high demand DUB LHR first. SNN & NOC happened to see it before ORK as there LHR routes are operated by DUB a/c and crew. There was only 2 in service until NSC and NSD arrived recently.

Also Ryanair don’t have MAX based in ORK they come from other bases.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121350734#Comment_121350734

Also Ryanair started receiving MAX before EI started receiving NEO. So obviously there going to be newer. Cork has no long haul so wasn’t going to see the 321 NEO LR. So not surprised it’s only seeing the NEO now

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121350734#Comment_121350734

Unless you saw MAXs in Cork, you've no idea how old they are. The last few FR 738s I was on this year were 14-15 years old.

EIs youngest A320 CEOs were delivered in 2017.

Plus, EI and FR will rotate aircraft around bases regularly, so it's random how old the aircraft your getting is.

kevinandrew

The average age of the Ryanair fleet is currently 11 years, at Aer Lingus it’s 12.8 years so there isn’t that much in it to be honest. Also, Aer Lingus received their first A321neo two years before Ryanair started MAX operations.

As for the A320neo, it’s been placed on LHR primarily because of the lower landing fees they have there for next generation aircraft. It was calculated that the savings in this alone were worth millions to Aer Lingus every year. Once you factor in the higher seat density and general efficiency of the new aircraft, it’s a winner the airline.

Once all Heathrow services are operated by the A320neo, we’ll hopefully see more added to the fleet for wider fleet replacement.

Tenger

I think we should skip/move on from the "who's got the younger aircraft" conversation.

I don't think its worth getting pedantic or snarky with each over.

john boye

It's especially odd when you consider how uncomfortable the newer aircraft can be to travel on.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121354138#Comment_121354138

Id say move on now from it. I agree with Tenger above.

ohigg84

Deviating off topic, but considering that Saudia is reverting back to it's iconic 1970s liveries, albeit in slightly updated font styling etc. , will we see more airlines going back to retro.

Imagine how cool it would be if EI went back to it's iconic 1970s/80s livery, probably EI's best livery ever.

The 1960s livery is gorgeous too, but the 70s/80s livery is just stunning.

kevinandrew

Liveries play second fiddle to the overall brand for most airlines these days. The logo or brand mark and how it’s implemented across the business is the most important element. Aer Lingus paid special attention to how its new brand looked on digital platforms, they changed them all overnight the day after it was announced. It was one of the few occasions Aer Lingus showed speed and consistency to be honest. It’s taken them much longer to phase out the old shamrock on things like table cloths or even getting outstations to use the new logo on departure screens.

Aer Lingus has never been a trend setter when it comes to branding. While past liveries have been stylish, they were all very much of their time. I do think retro will be big in the next decade or two, so I wouldn’t be surprised if the next big rebrand does take heavy influences from the past. The 70s/80s livery and colour palette would be the most useful.

Sexual Chocolate

Anyone hear if IAG intend on putting in an order for EI or BA at the Dubai Airshow this year ?

Lockheed

While nothing has been announced this year, I imagine Boeing is being heavily considered at this point. If EI do proceed to order the A330neo, they will be the only airline operating that type within IAG making them an outlier, support-wise. The organisational pressure is there to make the switch to the 787 Dreamliner, which I think is the superior product anyway.

john boye

Only thing I think that is in Airbus favour is that changing LH type from Airbus to Boeing just seems like too big a change for this EI to consider. I can easily see them just keeping the status quo going.

Noxegon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121390117#Comment_121390117

Not if they go not 9-across seating in the back.

Jamie2k9

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121390117#Comment_121390117

IB will eventually have to replace there A332/3 fleet. Not checked how old they are or if they have future plan.

Still cant see the switch but anything is possible.

goingnowhere

KLM have jumped to Airbus, one of the drivers was quicker delivery, A350 backlog seems to be moving faster

BA and IB fly A350's so wouldn't be a stretch for EI.

787 as designed is a great plane, that was 8 seats in the back, its horrible with 9 (flown both and once you have you really don't want the 9 seat version)

kevinandrew

I think the engine options are proving to be a sticking point when it comes to wide body fleet renewal at Aer Lingus. Airbus can only offer Rolls Royce on the A330neo and A350 family; they’re expensive, suffering from reliability issues and are said to be maintenance heavy. I think Aer Lingus would have ordered the A330neo years ago if Airbus had been able to offer GE as an engine type, it would have been a no brainer.

The 787-10 is proving a very popular transatlantic machine, it could enable Aer Lingus to comfortably operate a 3-class cabin without losing any seats over its current 2-class A333. They’d be looking at something like 318 seats in 3-class which or 344 in a 2-class. The additional revenue from this alone would be tempting. The aircraft is also available with GE engines, the long time manufacturer of choice for Aer Lingus.

The A330neo would be a like for like replacement, same number of seats in 2-class, less in a 3-class, same pilot and cabin crew pool, largely the same maintenance costs, could probably be introduced relatively quickly. Downside would be capacity limitations and engine costs with Rolls Royce being the only provider, no other IAG carrier has experience with them or seems interested.

So Aer Lingus (and IAG) will have to weigh up the costs of having a completely different type and all the costs that come with it like pilot retraining, maintenance etc. compared to a type they are well experienced with but has an all new engine which will have its own ongoing costs and potential reliability issues, limited growth, potentially even a cut in capacity if the airline is interested in introducing a premium economy product.

sandbelter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121390555#Comment_121390555

Iberia's A330 fleet is roughly same age. you could argue there is a joint RFP on the way but the A350 suits IB. Its a better fit offering flexibility EI doesn't need as it seems to operate better at "hot and high" such as Madrid, Bogota and Quito with the larger A350-1000 suiting Buenos Aires, Mexico City and few more of their busier routes a well.

I would expect IB to order A350-1000's in due course, IB currently have 4 A359's on order as well. Over time, I expect IB will use the deliveries to displace the current fleet of 14 A332 and 8 A333. Ultimately I see IB with a mixture of A321xlr, A359 and A351.

I could see the the 8 A333 (GE powered) at IB making their way to EIN as an interim measure.

Then there's the 10 B788, 12 B789 + 8 B789 on order if the Air Europa deal goes through.

All up, I'd be surprised if we see an order before 2026: as,

EIN will want to see how the A321XLR pans out and when it's delivered.

RR exclusivity on the A350 expires in 2031, by 2026 we'll know if GE are prepared to build an engine...but I think the door is closing on this...the AFR/KLM and potential Turkish order and earlier Qantas order have taken big GE A330 operators off the table.....I hate to say this but the business case for a GE engine is starting to sag.

And then...does anyone know where IAG are putting the 737 max?