Flightradar24 (and other trackers) Thread Part IV

HeidiHeidi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165619#Comment_121165619

Is Washington not transatlantic?

JCX BXC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121164736#Comment_121164736

Why so angry?

You haven't posted the reason that aircraft can't use 28L in poor visibility, the you state that it's obvious why it isn't used today, it's not foggy! It's windy. Why can't it be used during strong wind?

Noccy_Mondy

Sorry, I meant to sag that the only takeoffs on 28L seem to be transatlantic, they're using 16 aswell.

moonshy2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165610#Comment_121165610

Ok I’ll be fair and save you having to rewind the topic for my previous explanation.

The ILS is fully commissioned to CATIII capability.

The IAA, however, have dictated to both ANI and the daa that they must submit new joint procedures on LVP operations on the northern runway. Both had previously submitted their own procedures, as is normal, but neither have the staff at the moment to allow them to work on an entirely new joint one as they can take several months to do.

This means whenever the airport has cloud or visibility issues the northern runway must close as it is not legally permitted to operate.

EchoIndia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165559#Comment_121165559

Runway length. Runway 16/34 is short by the standards of most airports and some flights either require or prefer to use the longer available runway, though that may incur some delay till they can be fitted into the traffic sequence. It's runway 10R when used in an easterly direction, of course.

EchoIndia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165692#Comment_121165692

Thanks for that. The number of providers of good information, as opposed to posers of questions, in the aviation threads is pretty small these days.

moonshy2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165559#Comment_121165559

Performances issues, each aircraft is individual with different loads be it fuel, pax, cargo etc. Also if it’s right the captain can decide that they want the extra length as a safety cushion. 16 used to be favoured as it was 60m wide but at the recent resurfacing they only did it to the international standard of 45m. So there’s less benefit to using 16 over 28 if the wind is between the two.

Also don’t compare 787s with 330s or other wide bodies all have different performances and weights and different operators operating procedures.

Noccy_Mondy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165722#Comment_121165722

The comparison was merely for context :)

ninebeanrows

The semantics about 10 or 28

16 or 34 are silly

We all know what we are discussing

Any matrix you view a 150 degree wind gusting 40kt is a sig or severe cross wind

On 28 or 10 whatever yer persuasion we all have a ruler

Every aircraft has limits

Youd hope ATC arent pressured by ppl to keep runways open in bad conds

EchoIndia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165810#Comment_121165810

Yes, and let's apply the media terminology of calling any paved area at an airport "the runway". Much easier for all concerned.

ninebeanrows

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165896#Comment_121165896

Dont get it?

Every person on here knows how to use a ruler

Ppl know opposite of 34 or 28

Ppl also understand the points dub airport will go to stretch rules

ninebeanrows

Use of 34 is costly and slow

But dont jeopardise safety

moonshy2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165633#Comment_121165633

I have previously though, the last time this came up in this very topic.

As to the 2nd part of your post, have you heard of crosswind limitations ? It is both windy and chucking it down, therefore reducing the aforementioned crosswind limit because the runway surface is wet. Essentially as soon as the wind started gusting mid 30s the runway was in trouble.

You are confusing anger with frustration. The frustration of having to explain something yet again when the exact same incorrect statement is made not long after the last time it was made.

ninebeanrows

And the ICAO matrix

EIDW must act on safety not decisions on their runway direction

A 40kt wind at 150 on a 100 runway is a nono

Economics101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165692#Comment_121165692

Thanks for that. So its the IAA , not the DAA who should have to answer a few questions.

JCX BXC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121166004#Comment_121166004

I know why they switched to RWY16, I was never asking that.

I was only ever interested in why RWY10L/28R (Northern Runway) came out of use this morning, hours before the switch to RWY16. Reading the METARS I could not see any poor visibility or cloud base when they switched to single runway ops, maybe some was forecast? Also well aware the runway is equipped with ILS, despite restrictions in LVP's.

On a side note, is the runway also restricted during RVP's? (reduced visibility procedures)

moonshy2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121166061#Comment_121166061

From what we have been told RVP and LVP are not allowed on the North runway yet for the same reason. Really messes up our schedule.

Tenger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121164777#Comment_121164777

wind conditions can change from minute to minute. Once they make the decision to divert its generally not a good decision to turn and go back. Because that can lead to mistakes. "get-there-itis" has causes lots of accidents over the years

Tenger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165944#Comment_121165944

This board get lots of visitors during period of diversions, weather events and incidents.

Not everyone will realise the 16 and 34 are the same piece of runway.

Not everyone will realise that 28R is the "new runway" while 28L is the "old runway".

Not everyone will realise that the "new" runway has the same wind limitations as the "old runway".

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121164736#Comment_121164736

"Maybe the responses are the reason why no one with knowledge of how the airport operates posts here anymore. Instead all you get is uneducated guesswork and opinions."

Maybe start a Dublin Airport dedicated thread?

Acosta

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121166195#Comment_121166195

Indeed, which is why they would usually hold for a while after a first attempt to see if conditions change.

stephenjmcd

2 go arounds in DUB just now

FR5564 from Glasgow & FR119 from LGW

Both look to be heading for another go at it

Qaanaaq

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121166061#Comment_121166061

I would take a guess that it is based on the forecast too, not just the current weather at that moment. So if there is a period of, or probability of low cloud in the forecast then that might explain it. But this is just a theory, i don't have any actual insight in this.

Chris_5339762

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121165722#Comment_121165722

I think I've read on here as well that procedural issues exist with some of the Qatar ones? They only have their pilots trained up on the regular runways, not for takeoff etc on 16 or 34.

moonshy2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121166673#Comment_121166673

Yeah previous company I worked for some of the pilots only had charts for 28 or 10 and would refuse to take 16 or 34. On occasion it caused a diversion.

bikeman1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121166673#Comment_121166673

Well the Qatar landed and departed on RWY 16 today. Emirates did the same.

The bigger challenge is the “smaller” aircraft that are too the max of their limitations departing on a wet day like the 321neo which will need the longer runway and would not be in limits for 16/34. All of this is controlled by the aircraft type limits and company SOPs and by the captain. They do it to safely operate the aircraft.

EchoIndia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121166673#Comment_121166673

I think (not sure where I heard it) that for Emirates, runway 16 is a captain-only landing. These days the weather is almost always bad when it's used, of course.

goodlad_ourvlad

some day out at Dublin yesterday... lots of stressed controllers and pilots.

There were crosswinds on both runways for most of the day until the wind swung around to 150 degrees.... it was just that it was gusting worse on 10R which made it un-suable by a lot of aircraft except heavies taking off

I counted 7 go arounds due to a mixture of conditions and aircraft not lining up/vacating the runway fast enough. The Qatar being told to expedite vacating the runway was quite funny "speed up, don't slow down" :-D

The western hold (over Kells) wasn't full to capacity because of wind and icing conditions at certain levels in the stack, 2 or 3 planes requested the hold be moved to avoid weather or be moved to the eastern hold over the Irish sea. Moving the hold was looked into but was stopped as it would require too much co-ordination.... there were flights being held just outside the Shannon FIR at one point also.

It's been mentioned already about differing flight procedures etc... for as to why some trans-atlantic A/C could/couldn't take off from RWY16 and others were doing 10R.... what I noticed was the wind had swung round fully to 150 degrees when the AerLingus 330's etc.. took off from 16 (i.e. pretty much directly into the wind) .... one of the 330's had a ground speed of 86knts while it got up past 1000 ft...so it had plenty of wind to lift it.

The Air Transat and Aer Lingus 320 neo which took off from 10R got whipped sideways by the wind as soon as the front wheels left the ground.

Kat1170

FR310 London STN to Shannon SNN looks to be diverting to DUBLIN

FR1349 Fuerteventura to Shannon looks to be diverting to Dublin as well.

FR5224 Liverpool to Shannon also diverting.

Looks to be fog related according to Google weather.

JCX BXC

Temporarily no CAT II ILS approaches available into Shannon so aircraft were unable to land in foggy conditions.