Journalism and Cycling 2: the difficult second album

Tombo2001

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/e-scooters-poll-ireland-5372780-Mar2021/

Poll on escooters, they seem to be loathed by motorists too. Still commenters manage to go on about cyclists on footpaths though!

Why do Motorists hate escooters so much?

Genuine question?

As a cyclist - I would acknowledge the the escooter is even more hated that the bike.

Seth Brundle

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Why do Motorists hate escooters so much?

Genuine question?

As a cyclist - I would acknowledge the the escooter is even more hated that the bike.

I think they (as a group) loathe scooters, bikes and whatever else that can require them to slow down or can be seen to pass them while they're sitting in traffic.
It's a dominance thing - them insulated from the world against what they perceive usually as an obstruction. At a face to face level, they wouldn't be as brave.

Thelonious Monk

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Why do Motorists hate escooters so much?

Genuine question?

As a cyclist - I would acknowledge the the escooter is even more hated that the bike.

They hate everything that might make them need to pay more attention when they're driving

MojoMaker

Yep - this ^^

MojoMaker

Also....multi-model transport platform? :rolleyes:

Tombo2001

The common refrain you hear is that they are 'lethal'......

The amount of thought that has gone into this viewpoint.....it says a lot about the human condition.

Macy0161

breezy1985 wrote: »

Do they migrate for winter?

V formation, 5 abreast, forcing motorists to close pass....

Thelonious Monk

Tombo2001 wrote: »

The common refrain you hear is that they are 'lethal'......

The amount of thought that has gone into this viewpoint.....it says a lot about the human condition.

Sure one of them nearly hit me the other day, and my granny nearly gets hit by cyclists on footpaths every time she leaves the house. They're nearly wrecking the place!

Seth Brundle

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Sure one of them nearly hit me the other day, and my granny nearly gets hit by cyclists on footpaths every time she leaves the house. They're nearly wrecking the place!

And that's only the ones she sees!
Can you imagine if she knew the number of cyclists nearly killing her that weren't wearing any high-viz?

magicbastarder

escooters too dangerous for our roads, says man in SUV which is over six foot tall.

Tombo2001

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Sure one of them nearly hit me the other day, and my granny nearly gets hit by cyclists on footpaths every time she leaves the house. They're nearly wrecking the place!

Sure its only a matter of time before someone gets killed on one.

Like seriously lads, someone being killed on our roads - thats how dangerous they are.

Thelonious Monk

there's 100 comments on the article about e-scooters many talking about how dangerous they are, and 2 RIPs in the article about a woman in her 20s dying in a car crash. That says it all really.

CramCycle

I heard one escooter, programmed personally by Bill Gates, rose up against it's owner, threw him off head first in to traffic at slightly great than walking speed, and then took of for the hills of Wicklow. Rumour is it lies flat in the heather around the Sally Gap to conserve battery power but Gardai have warned it could run into your ankles if you startle it so keep back if you see it.

magicbastarder

not about cycling, but an interesting read given the portion of blame laid on the driver; despite the fact the pedestrian was crossing against a red pedestrian light, the driver was found to be more responsible as he was not paying attention to possible hazards.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/award-to-woman-knocked-down-crossing-dublin-street-increased-to-372-000-1.4502453

Eamonnator

magicbastarder wrote: »

not about cycling, but an interesting read given the portion of blame laid on the driver; despite the fact the pedestrian was crossing against a red pedestrian light, the driver was found to be more responsible as he was not paying attention to possible hazards.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/award-to-woman-knocked-down-crossing-dublin-street-increased-to-372-000-1.4502453

Ped shouldn't have crossed. The driver should have been driving in such a manner as to be able to stop if somebody crossed. The collision was the driver's fault.

buffalo

The Indo most-read cycling articles list at present:

It really is a case of "if you build it, they will come" but this time, instead of induced demand with private cars, we're talking about bikes

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2021/mar/12/europe-cycling-post-covid-recovery-plans

The numbers are remarkable

• 1 billion spent
• Nearly 1,000km's of new bike infrastructure
• Massive increase in women cycling
• In a survey spanning 21 European cities, 64% of respondents said they did not want to return to pre-Covid air pollution levels, which are illegally high in many cities. Three-quarters were willing to reallocate public space from cars to active travel to achieve this, while 21% said they planned to cycle more after lockdown, and 35% planned to walk more.

The impact has been even more remarkable

• Barcelona is aiming for a 300km bike network by 2024 as recent investment has grown bike use to 10% beyond pre-pandemic usage
• Milan’s Strade Aperte programme was launched in April 2020 with a proposed 22 miles of new protected cycle lanes and pedestrian priority areas. The cycle route on Corso Buenos Aires is now the busiest in town, used by as many as 10,000 cyclists a day, an increase of 122% in a few months. Milan has now expanded Strade Aperte to 42 miles and is aiming for 62 miles by this summer.
• Paris, cycling has grown by 70% due to 50km of lanes installed early in the pandemic. Plans for a total of 200km of infrastructure are progressing.
• Lisbon is doubling its network from 100 to 200km. Cycling has grown by 25%.
• London has installed or started work on 62 miles of cycle routes since the start of the pandemic, and Transport for London data from January shows cycling has increased by 22% in outer London since 2019. Almost half of all journeys in London were made by cycling and walking from April to June 2020, up from 29% before the pandemic.
• Brussels trialled 37 miles of pop-up cycle routes in 2020, increasing “active cyclists” by 87%, and Belgium is now looking to extend its cycle highway plans between towns and cities.
• Krakow installed a handful of cycle paths that doubled cycling levels last summer, with many people switching from public transport to bikes. The city has now developed a five-year plan to expand the cycle network further.

Meanwhile in Galway, we get a protected bit of road that cyclists are not allowed into

tomasrojo

Macy0161 wrote: »

V formation, 5 abreast, forcing motorists to close pass....

They scoot around in vast murmurations, occasionally forming, for the lens of a lucky and patient photographer, the outline of a giant scooter.

tomasrojo

Deleted User wrote: »

Meanwhile in Galway, we get a protected bit of road that cyclists are not allowed into

Galway does seem to have almost nothing for active travel for years. I was taken aback when I moved there by how inadequate even the bus services were. Terryland reminded me of the worst-designed parts of Orange County. Woodquay is a parking lot stamped over and obliterating a potentially very attractive liveable community.

But they seem to be about to fix up Woodquay, and, my particular grá, the greenway over the old Corrib railway bridge looks as if it might go ahead.
https://twitter.com/paulinegalway/status/1370299078270189570

tomasrojo

(I really like Galway, just to be clear!)

Kaisr Sose

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/drunk-cyclist-kept-falling-off-his-bike-in-front-of-officer-40197357.html

A rare conviction...

The cyclist had one arm in cast and gave that as the reason for falling. I wonder how they ended up needing the ccast? :-)
It does prove the point that you can be convicted for drunk cycling, but there is no statutory threshold for blood alcohol level. It gets down to the view of the Gardaí at the time of arrest. Maybe they should look to taking the subjectivity out of it?

breezy1985

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/drunk-cyclist-kept-falling-off-his-bike-in-front-of-officer-40197357.html

A rare conviction...

The cyclist had one arm in cast and gave that as the reason for falling. I wonder how they ended up needing the ccast? :-)
It does prove the point that you can be convicted for drunk cycling, but there is no statutory threshold for blood alcohol level. It gets down to the view of the Gardaí at the time of arrest. Maybe they should look to taking the subjectivity out of it?

In reality he got done for been a muppet to a guard who was trying to be helpful and look after his safety

Macy0161

breezy1985 wrote: »

In reality he got done for been a muppet to a guard who was trying to be helpful and look after his safety

Yes, ultimately like a lot of Garda judgement based fines, he failed the "don't be a dick" test.

Kaisr Sose

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/drunk-cyclist-kept-falling-off-his-bike-in-front-of-officer-40197357.html

It does prove the point that you can be convicted for drunk cycling, but there is no statutory threshold for blood alcohol level. It gets down to the view of the Gardaí at the time of arrest. Maybe they should look to taking the subjectivity out of it?

Absolutely, should be breathalyzed if alcohol is suspected of being taken, end of, regardless of mode of transport.

There is no defending drinking and controlling a mode of transport while under the influence.

AndrewJRenko

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Absolutely, should be breathalyzed if alcohol is suspected of being taken, end of, regardless of mode of transport.

There is no defending drinking and controlling a mode of transport while under the influence.

Not defending it, but of all the problems we have on the road, this is a long way down the list of things that need to be fixed.

RobbieMD

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/drunk-cyclist-kept-falling-off-his-bike-in-front-of-officer-40197357.html

A rare conviction...

The cyclist had one arm in cast and gave that as the reason for falling. I wonder how they ended up needing the ccast? :-)
It does prove the point that you can be convicted for drunk cycling, but there is no statutory threshold for blood alcohol level. It gets down to the view of the Gardaí at the time of arrest. Maybe they should look to taking the subjectivity out of it?

Regular drunken driving in a car for example can also be prosecuted without any blood/urine/breath test results handed into the court. It’s referred to as drunken driving simplicitor. It’s not done much anymore but was in the past.

My understanding regarding drunk cycling is that the main reasoning for alcohol level testing is to correlate the disqualification in line with the test results. The higher the level, the longer the ban. This doesn’t apply to drunken cycling. No testing happens after arrest and there is no provision that enables the Garda to demand a roadside breath sample to aid that Garda in determining how impaired a cyclist might be. In essence the only evidence the Garda can present to the court are their observations of impaired cycling and any admissions made by the cyclist after caution. In this case, the defendant admitted drinking alcohol.

RobbieMD

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Not defending it, but of all the problems we have on the road, this is a long way down the list of things that need to be fixed.

I would imagine the prosecuting Garda would agree, but he wasn’t left much option when the defendant refused to lock up the bike and walk home. I can’t imagine a driver would be shown the same leniency if caught in similar circumstances, and rightly so.

AndrewJRenko

RobbieMD wrote: »

I would imagine the prosecuting Garda would agree, but he wasn’t left much option when the defendant refused to lock up the bike and walk home. I can’t imagine a driver would be shown the same leniency if caught in similar circumstances, and rightly so.

I've no complaint about the actions of the Garda.

p15574

Yesterday's letters page in the Indo:
Green Party’s e-bike plans shortsighted and dangerous
A few buzzword bingo terms, uncorrected by the Indo, eg "road tax", "insurance" and "driving test". also this: "the number of road traffic offences and accidents involving e-scooters has significantly increased over the past two years according to recent figures released"..."shudder to imagine the ensuant veritable explosion in road traffic accidents"

...but no comment on the zero deaths due to scooters, compared to the many hundreds every year due to motorists.

buffalo

p15574 wrote: »

the number of road traffic offences and accidents involving e-scooters has significantly increased over the past two years according to recent figures released

I wonder why there weren't many accidents involving e-scooters a few years ago? IT IS A MYSTERY