Bicycles, Phoenix Park and traffic

Giruilla

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Walking 3 or 4 km isn't a problem for most of the population.
Anyway nothing's stopping you driving there, or anyone else, enjoy the traffic jams.

I'm within walking distance to park, but I'm not a complete pr*ck and actually have sympathy for people in circumstances different from my own

beauf

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

The walk from Memorial Gardens to and from Chapelizod along the Liffey is great. Parking at the Islandbridge end. If you want to, you can cross the road to the Pheeno aswell. And stroll around the Gardens too.

There are options other than driving through the Park.

More than 5k away...

Spanish Eyes

beauf wrote: »

More than 5k away...

Sorry about that. Just within my catchment. But when you can you should give it a try. Was great when the rowing clubs were out too. Cycle and walking track along the river, no cars. Lovely.

KevRossi

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Cannot understand why vehicular traffic was never moved to the periphery North Road. Leave the main avenue free, widen the paths, make it great for walkers and cyclists.

Using North Road for vehicles maintains access. Does anyone agree with me?

I'd agree, but it would do nothing in the long run. You need proper cycling and public transport for people to get there in an alternative way.

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I'm slagging them because they're knowingly setting out to sit in traffic like that for hours. I just don't get the mentality, why put yourself through that.

The same people would be sitting in a queue to get into Blanchardstown or Dundrum shopping centres if there was no COVID.

beauf

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Sorry about that. Just within my catchment. But when you can you should give it a try. Was great when the rowing clubs were out too. Cycle and walking track along the river, no cars. Lovely.

Familiar with it. The rowing coaches cycle up and down.

Mercian Pro

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Cannot understand why vehicular traffic was never moved to the periphery North Road. Leave the main avenue free, widen the paths, make it great for walkers and cyclists.
Using North Road for vehicles maintains access. Does anyone agree with me?

Couldn't disagree more! The 9.3km circuit of the perimeter is a great training route and is keeping me sane these weeks. Plenty of other cyclists are doing the same and not just at weekends. On the other hand, Chesterfield Avenue is flat, relatively boring and has virtually no shelter from headwinds. Not once in 64 circuits over the last month have I been tempted to head up or down the Avenue. Keep your hands off, and cars away from the North Road

plodder

Mercian Pro wrote: »

Couldn't disagree more! The 9.3km circuit of the perimeter is a great training route and is keeping me sane these weeks. Plenty of other cyclists are doing the same and not just at weekends. On the other hand, Chesterfield Avenue is flat, relatively boring and has virtually no shelter from headwinds. Not once in 64 circuits over the last month have I been tempted to head up or down the Avenue. Keep your hands off, and cars away from the North Road

You wouldn't be stopped from using the perimeter circuit though. If you accept that the North road (and other peripheral routes) are not for through traffic but just for access to locations in the park, then it's not hard to imagine that those routes would still be okay for cyclists.

Mercian Pro

plodder wrote: »

You wouldn't be stopped from using the perimeter circuit though. If you accept that the North road (and other peripheral routes) are not for through traffic but just for access to locations in the park, then it's not hard to imagine that those rout0es would still be okay for cyclists.

I was responding to Spanish Eye's suggestion that the main avenue be closed and that all through traffic would use the North Road instead.

beauf

beauf wrote: »

The point is the park can't handle the number of people on a busy day. Cars or walking makes no difference.

Nonsense, the park can handle double even triple the number of people, it's the cars that cause the problem. It's one of the biggest city centre parks on the planet ffs

beauf

Deleted User wrote: »

Nonsense, the park can handle double even triple the number of people, it's the cars that cause the problem. It's one of the biggest city centre parks on the planet ffs

The reason they brought in restrictions was so many pedestrians and cyclists were using it. That's before the reintroduction of Cars.

Current cycling and pedestrian usage has raised significant new road safety issues not experienced before to this extent and these will be exacerbated with the reintroduction of vehicles into the Phoenix Park.

Thargor

"Road Safety Issues" before cars were reintroduced? Looks like the same old cognitive dissonance we love in this country of equating a minor inconvenience of a cyclist coming near a pedestrian with getting hit by cars.

beauf

Maybe they though someone getting killed wasn't a minor inconvenience.

Thargor

Who got killed?

Heart Break Kid

Thargor wrote: »

Who got killed?

There was an accident on the kilmainham side at the gate. Cyclist attempted to turn right (no right turns, but cyclists still do it) was reported that he timed it wrong and was hit. Car was around 55km and clipped his pedal and unfortunately didn’t survive it.

White bike at the gate as a memorial.

Tombo2001

Mercian Pro wrote: »

Couldn't disagree more! The 9.3km circuit of the perimeter is a great training route and is keeping me sane these weeks. Plenty of other cyclists are doing the same and not just at weekends. On the other hand, Chesterfield Avenue is flat, relatively boring and has virtually no shelter from headwinds. Not once in 64 circuits over the last month have I been tempted to head up or down the Avenue. Keep your hands off, and cars away from the North Road

The perimeter all the way for me.....except for those damn speed bumps, they are so uncomfortable.

Chesterfield is like being on the hard shoulder of the Naas Dualcarriageway.

beauf

Thargor wrote: »

Who got killed?

Sadly a fatal collision between cyclist an pedestrian on cycle path on Chesterfield Avenue 2017.

It was an accident waiting to happen with the layout of the paths. The lockdown only made that worse. Which is why they changed the layout to what it is today, an on the road cycle path on the Ave. Its mostly an issue when the park is very busy, which isn't very often. But as the tragic accident above illustrates, it could happen at quiet times also. I'm sure there's been other collisions that have not made it to the media. Anyway the OPW are very reluctant to change their minds, on anything. That they changed the paths after decades of people complaining about them, suggested there was good reason.

Tombo2001

beauf wrote: »

Sadly a fatal collision between cyclist an pedestrian on cycle path on Chesterfield Avenue 2017.

It was an accident waiting to happen with the layout of the paths. The lockdown only made that worse. Which is why they changed the layout to what it is today, an on the road cycle path on the Ave. Its mostly an issue when the park is very busy, which isn't very often. But as the tragic accident above illustrates, it could happen at quiet times also. I'm sure there's been other collisions that have not made it to the media. Anyway the OPW are very reluctant to change their minds, on anything. That they changed the paths after decades of people complaining about them, suggested there was good reason.

Poor lighting also contributed to this.

On the bike path it was difficult enough to see at night. On the inner footpath its very dark, which apart from anything else makes it a dangerous place to be from the point of crime (potential mugging). So of course you head for the cycle path.

There are very few pedestrians (maybe dog walkers?) in the Park at night but there would be a lot of joggers and running clubs.

beauf

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Poor lighting also contributed to this.

On the bike path it was difficult enough to see at night. On the inner footpath its very dark, which apart from anything else makes it a dangerous place to be from the point of crime (potential mugging). So of course you head for the cycle path.

There are very few pedestrians (maybe dog walkers?) in the Park at night but there would be a lot of joggers and running clubs.

Over the years I have a few near misses with Ninja runners and Dog walkers. Special treat is those with a dog on a lead across the cycle path, all in black, no lights.
There are lights on the cycle path. But regardless of this had to upgrade my cycle lights, as even going slowly, 15kmph my cone of light ahead gave my barely enough time to react to ninjas.
I've also had the stuffing scared out of me when deer standing just off the path and out of the cone of the lights, (mine or street light), snort or grunt, just as I pass.

trellheim

I like the new cycle paths. Specifically at the moment the path outside the magazine fort (the dedicated lanes) are hard at the moment due so many leaves and plonkers parking on them still

beauf

trellheim wrote: »

I like the new cycle paths. Specifically at the moment the path outside the magazine fort (the dedicated lanes) are hard at the moment due so many leaves and plonkers parking on them still

Time of year, leaves, luas tracks, man hole covers. Take it handy....:)

trellheim

beauf wrote: »

Time of year, leaves, luas tracks, man hole covers. Take it handy....:)

Oh indeed lol

Dr_Colossus

Mercian Pro wrote: »

Couldn't disagree more! The 9.3km circuit of the perimeter is a great training route and is keeping me sane these weeks. Plenty of other cyclists are doing the same and not just at weekends. On the other hand, Chesterfield Avenue is flat, relatively boring and has virtually no shelter from headwinds. Not once in 64 circuits over the last month have I been tempted to head up or down the Avenue. Keep your hands off, and cars away from the North Road

Tombo2001 wrote: »

The perimeter all the way for me.....except for those damn speed bumps, they are so uncomfortable.

Chesterfield is like being on the hard shoulder of the Naas Dualcarriageway.

Jees I hate the North Road for cycling and even driving on, surface is terrible and made worse by the ridiculous speed bumps. Because there's a token cycle track towards the Castleknock entrance you then get cars beeping and close passing when cycling on the road

I quite like Chesterfield Avenue, use it twice daily for commuting under normal conditions and the repurpose of the hard shoulder into the cycle lane has been the best development yet. Decent surface and adequate space to overtake if needs be, would like to see the unsightly cones removed and more permanent barriers installed and priority given to cyclists at the roundabouts.

Any time I've gone for a spin outside of commuting in the park I've gone down Chesterfield Avenue and then along the south perimeter with it's rolling hills and windings bends, nice spot.

Mercian Pro

I suppose a lot depends on whether you're commuting or just out enjoying a spin. As mentioned here before, the rough section from the Zoo to the Hole in the Wall is due to be resurfaced shortly and I'm hopeful the ramps will be modified at the same time. I've never had a problem with cars beside the off-road cycle path but I normally wouldn't be there at rush hour.

tomasrojo

Side gates might be closing again, and a bus service introduced inside the park:
https://twitter.com/John_Kilraine/status/1348602637793566721

Thelonious Monk

With all the uproar that will ensue is there any point even? At this stage they should probably just let it carry on being a free for all until it becomes obvious to even the most pro-drive-wherever-i-want crowd see that it's just not working.

tomasrojo

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

With all the uproar that will ensue is there any point even? At this stage they should probably just let it carry on being a free for all until it becomes obvious to even the most pro-drive-wherever-i-want crowd see that it's just not working.

Maybe that more or less has just happened? At least to the people who have to manage the free-for-all.

magicbastarder

there was a recent suggestion to increase the lighting in the park to allow more people to exercise there, but it's not being welcomed by certain quarters:

https://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/html5/#/radio1/21891826

(i would agree wholeheartedly with his analysis FWIW)

cgcsb

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

With all the uproar that will ensue is there any point even? At this stage they should probably just let it carry on being a free for all until it becomes obvious to even the most pro-drive-wherever-i-want crowd see that it's just not working.

We're passed that I think. The folks parking their mom-wagons up on the paths and on the grass are now beeping and tutting at eachother.

cgcsb

Interesting how the bus service would function of the Parkgate Street Entrance is still chockers with through traffic.

beauf

tomasrojo wrote: »

Side gates might be closing again, and a bus service introduced inside the park:
https://twitter.com/John_Kilraine/status/1348602637793566721

It's not the first time though. They tried this in the 90's and the bus just got stuck in all the traffic. The problems in the park are not just commuter's arguably its worse at the weekends.

Still well worth trying and making it work. This is the time to do it for sure.