Restore travel (and sanity) within Ireland

robbiezero

Breezin wrote: »

Given that a lot of people in such areas have kids living elsewhere, not least in Dublin, I wonder if the dirty looks will extend to those when they come back. Or perhaps they are immune.

I reckon in a few weeks/months, they will happily welcome anyone back into these areas. They will be glad of any bit of revenue coming into the area.

Breezin

Good idea from Spain - setting up 'green zones' for travel within Europe (but also applying within countries). Much more sensible than us turning our country into an open prison.

To obtain the green label... a region should prove that the virus is under control: that the region's hospitals are not saturated, that the growth rate of new infections is low and that tests are generalised.

... highway exits could remain closed in red areas.

na1

washman3 wrote: »

Give them special ethnic status and everything will be fine...;)


Oh wait...........

Do you mean people who just like to travel?

Breezin

Ulster no longer saying No just for the sake of it. Unrestricted travel until they cross the border to lockdown land and its daft 5k rule.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTslU3gdL1E

Wibbs

Why we didn't liaise and combine strategies with NI from the start like we did with the foot and mouth crisis I'll never know.

VonLuck

Breezin wrote: »

Ulster no longer saying No just for the sake of it. Unrestricted travel until they cross the border to lockdown land and its daft 5k rule.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTslU3gdL1E

But they can still travel freely within the Republic once they cross the border, so essentially unrestricted travel for the entire island.

Breezin

VonLuck wrote: »

But they can still travel freely within the Republic once they cross the border, so essentially unrestricted travel for the entire island.

Their government loves them.

Breezin

Joy unconfined amid lockdown easing as golfers get back in the swing of things

Taking the Mickey now. These lads are from Derry. Having crossed an international border, they are playing in Lisfannon, Co Donegal, which according to G Maps is 14 imperial miles away. Perfectly in order. More power to them.
Meanwhile, a member of the same club living 5.5km away in his or her own country can't play, because if they do everyone will die.
If you didn't laugh, you'd cry.

RGS

The suggestion that the travel limit contains the virus in an area is a modelling ideal.
It does not take account of the various locations and population density.

Within my 5km limit is the Bull Wall, Dollymount Beach and St. Annes Park, where children, dog walkers etc take their exercise.
My interaction in these locations is with a significant number of people I do not know whereas on the golf course, over 10kms away in North County Dublin, I can tell any tester/contact tracer the exact names of those I interacted with within 30 seconds.

So tracing my contacts from the golf course is easy but from the beach impossible.

The fact that people can still cross the border, travel where they want and return in the same day, whilst people here cant go 10km to see their siblings is not going down well.

Breezin

RGS wrote: »

The suggestion that the travel limit contains the virus in an area is a modelling ideal.
It does not take account of the various locations and population density.

Within my 5km limit is the Bull Wall, Dollymount Beach and St. Annes Park, where children, dog walkers etc take their exercise.
My interaction in these locations is with a significant number of people I do not know whereas on the golf course, over 10kms away in North County Dublin, I can tell any tester/contact tracer the exact names of those I interacted with within 30 seconds.

So tracing my contacts from the golf course is easy but from the beach impossible.

The fact that people can still cross the border, travel where they want and return in the same day, whilst people here cant go 10km to see their siblings is not going down well.

Yes, that's basic common sense. It's the same case that I have made for taking a motorcycle trip quite literally covered up to the eyeballs. I will meet possibly two people, socially distanced, and more possibly none (e.g. if I went for a spin up the Sallygap). If I stay at home and wander around beaches and parks I will be in contact with dozens. Daft.

The fact that The Irish Times ran this image and accompanying report without reference to the difference speaks volumes. Why is our media so supine in this regard?

JP Liz V1

manlad wrote: »

Parents live 45 mins away. I've not seen them since February, July is supposedly when I can go visit them again without restrictions. Doesn't seem fair at times. I'm reminded each day about the additional numbers of people who have lost their lives so its difficult to argue with it.

I thought you could travel if visiting or caring for elderly relatives

Kivaro

It could be almost 3 months (August 10th - Phase 5) before a sizeable percentage of the population is allowed to visit Irish beaches i.e. when the 20 km rule is relaxed.

I can tell you that many Irish will go abroad and have their time on the beach while this ludicrous situation is in place.
There is no harm in allowing people who follow social distancing rules go to beaches in this country. There are enough of isolated beaches and inlets and hidden areas by the sea where you could be the only person there.

Imagine the scenario of Irish people traveling to Greece, Italy, Spain, France etc. and telling the locals that they cannot visit our own beaches in Ireland because of a magical made-up boundary.
It does not make sense. And many people in Ireland will respond accordingly.

Plumbthedepths

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

I thought you could travel if visiting or caring for elderly relatives

You can.

hmmm

Kivaro wrote: »

There is no harm in allowing people who follow social distancing rules go to beaches in this country. There are enough of isolated beaches and inlets and hidden areas by the sea where you could be the only person there.

There is a risk, or NPHET would have authorised it in phase 1. We saw from earlier in March how people did not go to "isolated beaches and inlets" and we ended up with mass congregations at honeypots.

It does not make sense. And many people in Ireland will respond accordingly.

Some will. Most won't. Because they have a bit of pride in doing their small bit for the country when asked.

Breezin

hmmm wrote: »

There is a risk, or NPHET would have authorised it in phase 1. We saw from earlier in March how people did not go to "isolated beaches and inlets" and we ended up with mass congregations at honeypots.


Some will. Most won't. Because they have a bit of pride in doing their small bit for the country when asked.

By your logic, because people did not go to isolated beaches (although I'm not sure how you could know this), we should ban them from going to isolated beaches. And we would be proud.

Breezin

In the future, reporting of this dreadful crime spree can be used to remind us of the hysteria around the simple act of travelling, or, as the more excitable would have it, the heinous crime of 'going for a spin'.

Coronavirus Ireland: Gardai outraged as numerous cars MILES outside lockdown limit sent home after baffling excuses at checkpoint

Families from Tallaght and Blanchardstown headed for the scenic Baravore in Glenmalure, Co. Wicklow, a staggering 26 times in total over their recommended 5km limit.

:eek:

When questioned, the driver admitted he was over 30km outside the 5km restrictions and was gone fishing for the day

.:eek:

Officers on patrol stopped a car in Wilkinstown, Meath who found 26 drums of kerosene in the back of the vehicle

. :eek:

A man transporting a mattress on the roof of his car was pulled over by baffled Gardai... The driver had only secured the mattress with duct tape

:eek:

Breezin

I've taken the liberty of quoting this post from the general restrictions thread. It perfectly summarises the absurdity and sheer stupidity of our policy on movement within the state.
Needless to say, there were the usual self-appointed oronvirus police on tut-tutting and calling her selfish.

sweetmaggie wrote: »

I'm just back in the Republic from 6 hours hiking in the North. It was the best day I've had since the beginning of these restrictions. I met a friend of mine from Rostrevor on the track to the mountains and we headed off from there. We met a few other groups of 6 Northern hikers all thrilled to bits to be back out in the great outdoors. Since yesterday you can go anywhere you like for exercise in the North within groups of 6.
Both Warrenpoint and Rostrevor were busy, lots of people about, coffee shops doing take out goods, plus you can sit outside , they all have tables and chairs out, supermarkets and small shops all open as well as garden centers. There was a real buzz.

The ironic thing about today is that my friend has already planned 2 trips to the South in the next few weeks to do some hiking and touring. He has a tent so will be self sufficient. He's delighted it will be so quiet in the South! Yet I live in Louth and we cant go further than 5km. Not until after July 20th, 2 months away, can anyone go further than 20km (the hikers I chatted to on the mountains today couldn't believe this ). I would have more chance of being stopped going 8km in the South than if I drive over the border to hike. Yet Northerners can come down here and travel anywhere they want.

Met no checkpoints at all today, once you get over the border there are no police and no restrictions. People are treated like adults. Nobody is flaunting social distancing, even on the hills. I'd strongly recommend anyone who is feeling depressed and restricted and who lives in Louth, Donegal or other border counties to head North for a day out away from the oppressiveness here.

VonLuck

Breezin wrote: »

I've taken the liberty of quoting this post from the general restrictions thread. It perfectly summarises the absurdity and sheer stupidity of our policy on within the state.
Needless to say, there were the usual self-appointed oronvirus police on tut-tutting and calling her selfish.

Which aspects do you find absurd? It's understandable that two different states have different measures in place.

Breezin

VonLuck wrote: »

Which aspects do you find absurd? It's understandable that two different states have different measures in place.

1. The fact that citizens of this state cannot move freely, while a fifth of the population of the island can, is absurd. It makes a nonsense of the notion that we can stop the virus spreading by stopping people travelling.
2. The fact that someone on an island of such small size can encounter such divergent policies is absurd. The virus doesn't do borders, and as we all know we have, in human terms, one of the most porous borders there is.
3. The very fact of the travel ban is itself absurd. There is zero evidence that travel, conducted with careful social distancing, contributes to transmission of the virus. We are now an outlier in Europe on this, as on other policies, because we are blindly wedded to the hard lockdown. Vast resources are being devoted to policing the internal travel ban, when they could be more usefully targeted at flagrant breaches of social distancing.

Breezin

From the Guardian:
Ireland

Some flights and ferry services continue to operate between Ireland and the UK – although all arrivals are subject to 14 days’ self-isolation and must provide details of accommodation while in Ireland. UK nationals will be exempt from self-isolation procedure on return home – a start and end date, and whether transit through Ireland is permitted, has not been confirmed.

So, in the absence of clarification to the contrary, it seems that if you are British there may be nothing stopping you driving any distance to wherever you choose to stay.

Ballso

Get a blog, nobody cares

Breezin

Ballso wrote: »

nobody cares

If so, they must be happy for people to be allowed to travel without restriction.


I'd say most would go for this:

The latest findings from the population wide survey, the Corona Citizens’ Science Study has found that 8 out of 10 people (84%) would consider installing a contact tracing app if it contributed to an easing of restrictions imposed to stop the spread of the virus.

alta stare

Ballso wrote: »

Get a blog, nobody cares

Yet you cared enough to post here....yeah good lad.

Breezin

Hope at last. From the Journal:

FIANNA FÁIL LEADER Micheál Martin has said he does not agree with the 5km or the 20km limit set out under the first two phases of the government’s roadmap for reopening the economy.

... On the travel restrictions, Martin said “there is no remaining serious justification for the 5 kilometre limit”.

“The public health concern is how people behave around others – not how far they are from their home. In fact, the research shows that this limit may in fact be forcing people in urban areas into more crowded situations.”

Green Party leader Eamon Ryan also raised the issue of the 20km rule, stating that loosening of it would on 5 June would help the tourism sector.

Breezin

Elite athletes want to be made an exception to distance restrictions. I don't see the logic. Lots of people, businesses and activities are 'losing ground' compared to Europe.

Really it's just a bit of nuance and flexibility to be shown to approximately 200 Olympic and Paralympic athletes throughout the country.

This is completely tone-deaf. It's time for a bit of nuance, flexibility and common sense for all of us, not just the elite. There actually are more important things than winning in the Olympics.

Breezin

Meanwhile, what an absolute waste of time and money:

Yesterday more than 100 vehicles were forced to return home from Magheramore and Brittas Bay beaches.

The vehicles had come from various locations, including Dundalk and several parts of Dublin.

More than 40 fines were also issued to motorists who had parked their vehicles illegally.

Breezin

Sense slowing creeping back into policing the lockdown.



Garda to scale down Covid-19 enforcement for June bank holiday

Breezin

A little bit more hope. Still no sense in waiting...


https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/move-to-scrap-travel-limit-from-june-29-to-save-summer-39247219.html