Covid and Obesity

rubadub

Sage Prickly Pub wrote: »

If you have to ask such a question, then there is very little hope.
A 'legal status' isn't required, a dose of common sense however, is.

I thought you were suggesting it should be illegal to sell. I now presume you are not if you are saying legal definitions are not required, as there is no common sense in selling rules without them.

Simple solution is to start banning sugar as an additive to processed foods

I just pointing out the difficulties with legal definitions, same as when I hear people suggest a high tax on "junk food" or "fast food".

4068ac1elhodqr

rubadub wrote: »

I thought you were suggesting it should be illegal to sell. I now presume you are not if you are saying legal definitions are not required, as there is no common sense in selling rules without them.

I just pointing out the difficulties with legal definitions, same as when I hear people suggest a high tax on "junk food" or "fast food".

Suffice to say it would not be the same challenge as discovering cold-fusion, as it would be to for any state head of public health (and/or their team) to knock out guidelines and criteria to form classifications. Ideally at EU-wide rollout.

rubadub

Sage Prickly Pub wrote: »

Suffice to say it would not be the same challenge as discovering cold-fusion, as it would be to for any state head of public health (and/or their team) to knock out guidelines and criteria to form classifications. Ideally at EU-wide rollout.

So you really are talking an all out ban!

Sage Prickly Pub wrote: »

If you have to ask such a question, then there is very little hope.
A 'legal status' isn't required, a dose of common sense however, is.

Common sense tells me a legal status most certainly is required. This is worse than the "tax junk food" people who have not given it much thought.

So frosties just change to having all their sugar added in the form of honey, and thats fine as its within the rules, they can probably carbon filter it to take the honey taste out, it would be too strong a taste at that level. All bakeries now have to use honey or some other sugar that qualifies. Restaurants all change to making food with alternative legal carbs.

All that really happens is the price goes up as they use alternative sugars, and the taste changes a bit.

4068ac1elhodqr

rubadub wrote: »

So you really are talking an all out ban!

Of course, or a good shove in the right direction. Just like ban on smoking in public, plastic bags (more of a habit force, than ban but with similar effect), tv ads banned for junk foods at daytime, and the very latest by some states: menthol-flavoured smokes: banned.

rubadub wrote: »

So frosties just change to having all their sugar added in the form of honey...
All that really happens is the price goes up as they use alternative sugars, and the taste changes a bit.

Honey ain't cheap, yes the price multiplier factor would be as good as a ban.
Anyone in this day and age buying 'frosties' on a weekly shopping list really does need their head checked or educated.

Stone Deaf 4evr

Sage Prickly Pub wrote: »

Of course, or a good shove in the right direction. Just like ban on smoking in public, plastic bags (more of a habit force, than ban but with similar effect), tv ads banned for junk foods at daytime, and the very latest by some states: menthol-flavoured smokes: banned.



Honey ain't cheap, yes the price multiplier factor would be as good as a ban.
Anyone in this day and age buying 'frosties' on a weekly shopping list really does need their head checked or educated.

But, they're GRRRR-EAT!

Mic 1972

splinter65 wrote: »

Do you honestly think there’s smokers out there striking a light and saying to themselves “ hopefully now this fag will cure my sore throat”? Lord save us. Alcoholics and heavy smokers know it’s bad for them. The campaigns only make them worse. It’s societies rejection of them that makes them give it up.

that's a very valid point, so why are we not making it difficult for people to eat unhealthy food? could we make junk food and sugar drinks a lot more expensive than healthier options?

GreeBo

splinter65 wrote: »

Do you honestly think there’s smokers out there striking a light and saying to themselves “ hopefully now this fag will cure my sore throat”? Lord save us. Alcoholics and heavy smokers know it’s bad for them. The campaigns only make them worse. It’s societies rejection of them that makes them give it up.

Where are the alcoholic positive and smokers positive trends?

Why only fat body positive?

I'm all for making people feel good about themselves, but not making them good about being fat.
Its shouldnt be body positive if your body is negative, it should, and always should imo, be about mental positivity.

cian68

Mic 1972 wrote: »

that's a very valid point, so why are we not making it difficult for people to eat unhealthy food? could we make junk food and sugar drinks a lot more expensive than healthier options?

I don't agree with big sugar taxes and the like at all. Poor people need little treats and pleasures to look forward to

Mic 1972

cian68 wrote: »

I don't agree with big sugar taxes and the like at all. Poor people need little treats and pleasures to look forward to

Poor people need proper education and a job

Don't assume all overweight people are just lazy or can't control themselves. Sometimes it's a medical issue, or a side effect of treatment for a medical issue.

I've put on two stone in the last six months due to medication I'm on. Weight gain is a known side effect. I hope to be off it soon and get back to my normal weight but right now there's nothing I can do about it. I know people notice when they haven't seen me for a while and it's not exactly a confidence boost.

I also have a friend who eats really healthily, plays sports, etc, and she went from a size 10 to a size 16 in less than a year as a result of a medical issue. She'll never get back to her old size no matter how much extra exercise she does.

Don't jump to assumptions when you see an overweight person.

Padre_Pio

Flying Fox wrote: »

Don't assume all overweight people are just lazy or can't control themselves. Sometimes it's a medical issue, or a side effect of treatment for a medical issue.

It's rarely a medical condition though.

Obesity is rare 100 years ago. All this talk about genetics or medical conditions, or big bones is b*llocks. For the 99.9% they're fat because they eat too much food, or calorie dense foods and don't exercise.

Not taking about getting a six pack either, just not being classed as overweight or obese.

smurfjed

I thought that this thread was about OBESITY AND COVID, does obesity impact a persons ability to fight and survive this virus?

That fear alone is enough to get me off my arse and walking 5kms everyday.

smurfjed

smurfjed wrote: »

I thought that this thread was about OBESITY AND COVID, does obesity impact a persons ability to fight and survive this virus?

That fear alone is enough to get me off my arse and walking 5kms everyday.

You’re too late now surely. This virus isn’t coming, it’s already here.

smurfjed

Never too late, this virus is here to stay.

bigar

Rodin wrote: »

That's a disgrace

Maggie De Block is one of the most respected politicians in Belgium as is very popular. She has a reputation for getting things done and was the first politician in Belgian who clearly stated everyone should stay home. Once she made the statement everyone started taking things seriously.

Just judging people on appearance is futile and despicable.

Mic 1972

Flying Fox wrote: »

Don't assume all overweight people are just lazy or can't control themselves. Sometimes it's a medical issue, or a side effect of treatment for a medical issue.

I've put on two stone in the last six months due to medication I'm on. Weight gain is a known side effect. I hope to be off it soon and get back to my normal weight but right now there's nothing I can do about it. I know people notice when they haven't seen me for a while and it's not exactly a confidence boost.

I also have a friend who eats really healthily, plays sports, etc, and she went from a size 10 to a size 16 in less than a year as a result of a medical issue. She'll never get back to her old size no matter how much extra exercise she does.

Don't jump to assumptions when you see an overweight person.

I put on a little weight when i was on cortisone a year ago, but I lost it shortly after the treatment was finished. I would say most people who are overweight are in fact over eating

Padre_Pio

smurfjed wrote: »

I thought that this thread was about OBESITY AND COVID, does obesity impact a persons ability to fight and survive this virus?

That fear alone is enough to get me off my arse and walking 5kms everyday.

Heard something that the virus is attracted by something in fat cells which are similar to cells found in the lungs.

Excess weight hinders your ability to breathe lying down, so you may need a ventilator sooner than others.

Don't know about the accuracy, but here's an article https://theconversation.com/coronavirus-linked-to-greater-risk-of-life-threatening-infection-in-people-with-obesity-137342

GreeBo

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

You’re too late now surely. This virus isn’t coming, it’s already here.

Surely it's only too late if you've already caught it?

GreeBo

GreeBo wrote: »

Surely it's only too late if you've already caught it?

Only a matter of time surely?

fr336

smurfjed wrote: »

I thought that this thread was about OBESITY AND COVID, does obesity impact a persons ability to fight and survive this virus?

That fear alone is enough to get me off my arse and walking 5kms everyday.

Walking and running will obviously get you fitter but in terms of weight loss it has to come from a proper food and drink revamp in your diet. I did it the most uncomplicated way you can imagine - one day instantly cut out all bad food and drink and started losing a pound a week. With exercise it was two pounds. Every week like clockwork. I'm sure being male helped.

rubadub

Sage Prickly Pub wrote: »

state head of public health (and/or their team) to knock out guidelines and criteria to form classifications.

Sage Prickly Pub wrote: »

Of course, or a good shove in the right direction.

I could not imagine any head of public health daring to ban all sugar from processed food. The repercussions are huge. This is why I was asking for definitions, there will be stuff included you might not have thought of, like bog standard bread. Unintended consequences.

The wine lobby is meant to be very powerful, I've been told that is why ingredients are not listed on alcohol. Using an alternative "natural unprocessed sugar" will greatly effect the taste of wine. Many beers & spirits would use it too. This is presuming you include drinks. Energy drinks gone. Complan (depending on the processed sugars you include)

Can people still buy bags of sugar? is it only a processed food if there are 2 or more ingredients? if so that is icing sugar gone. Jam, ketchup, mayo, pasta sauce, baked beans, some tinned fruit, I could go on all day.

Energy drinks taken by fit atheletes gone, glucose tablets favoured by avid cyclists.

Sage Prickly Pub wrote: »

Honey ain't cheap, yes the price multiplier factor would be as good as a ban.

You have not listed what sugars are proposed to be banned or not, sucrose would be your table sugar, but glucose, maltose, lactose etc. If honey is one of the few allowed prices will soar, there are only so many bees! so those eating for health reasons suffer that cost rise. If you want to put a sin tax on sugar then do that, we could do with more tax at the moment, just increasing the price of a sugar with neglibile nutritional benefits over sugar is not a great idea IMO.

It's like this nonsense MUP on alcohol, many people wrongly think its a tax, but it's not, it's the retailers who profit, the producers who specialise in making affordable alcohol suffer, as do the poor people who can only afford that alcohol. If excise duty raised instead we could get billions in tax per year, and ALL peoples alcohol would increase in price -though the poorer people would still feel it more in the pocket.

Mic 1972 wrote: »

could we make junk food and sugar drinks a lot more expensive than healthier options?

Sugar already has a tax, the definition does not hit fruit juices which some would think is unfair, some people might have turned from 5% sugar cidona to 11% sugar apple juice. Yes it is naturally occuring in apple juice but I bet many doctors would prefer you drinking a litre of cidona over a litre of apple juice. There are also VAT difference on some foods.

Junk food is hard to define as I was saying already, since many items might fall into it that you might not consider junk. That can be good in a way though as many are ignorant about what they eat. e.g. in work a young guy was looking at people eating burgers from the chipper and saying he would not be eating chipper food as it was unhealthy, as he tucked into his breaded chicken fillet white baguette with lashing of mayo, a can of regular coke and a full size bar for after.

When Leo mentioned how much "takeaway food" is consumed as a % of overall food many were shocked and did not believe it. But they equated "takeaway" as burger/pizza/chips/chicken balls, when really it includes takeaway salads, wraps etc.

ronano

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

More bloody mental health. If someone wants to lose weight then that’s the last thing to be looking at. Such a buzzword for everything these days.

I partly agree with you however the mental health services across the board are grossly underfunded, understaffed and inadequate to provide comprehensive and appropriate mental health interventions. Society and government like to use it as a near catch all but the government never deliver on their aims.

4068ac1elhodqr

rubadub wrote: »

You have not listed what sugars are proposed to be banned or not

It's not that simple, and would be a case by case basis, on 'added sugar' foods. However foods that fall under current tax surcharge 'high-sugar classification' would be an ideal starting point.

Would likely need to start with Ad bans (such as in Singapore) for fizzy junk. Then location bans: schools, smaller supermarkets and workplaces. The uk's NHS have recently rolled out blanket ban of fizzies.

One hosital over in Manc, went the full hog and become the first English hospital to ban all sugary food and drinks for all staff and patients.

July 2018, Tameside hospital has taken sugar off the menu — literally. All added sugar has been removed from its restaurant, and the only drinks you can buy are tea, coffee, milk, and water

What's the alternative for these folks, face a nautural purge of sorts? So be it:

A recent figure showed that 20% of COVID hospitalisations are people with DT2. Obesity would be an additional factor, as skinnies can be diabetic(2) due to a very poor diets.
By 2030 10% of the planet will have DT2.

ronano

ronano wrote: »

I partly agree with you however the mental health services across the board are grossly underfunded, understaffed and inadequate to provide comprehensive and appropriate mental health interventions. Society and government like to use it as a near catch all but the government never deliver on their aims.

Put probably is under funded, everything is. But if they only had genuine mental health cases to deal with then the funding might go further, rather than people using it as a fashion tying up the system.

Wibbs

fr336 wrote: »

I'm sure being male helped.

A good point Fr and it does. Way more testosterone for a start. Testosterone builds muscle and burns fat out of the gate(though to be fair obesity reduces the levels). Men start off with far more lean tissue anyway and have less subcutaneous fat and store ours in the belly for the most part. We also retain a more constant hormone profile over the days and years even decades. Women have hormones all over the place in level and more of them. Some of which promote fat build up. Then they have pregnancy on top which throws the hormone thing up in the air. Plus women have far more pressure on their self image and bodies, something which has been present throughout history. They also suffer more from eating disorders.

PTH2009

On the border line between Medium and large

Been walking a lot since lockdown and wearing a slimmer belt while doing it. Helps a lot keeping the weight down

wadacrack

34 year-old 2 months on ICU. Glad he made a good recovery but this should be a lesson for people with obesity.

"Blian has no underlaying health conditions and why COVID-19 affected him so badly remains a mystery. “It’s just so strange. I don’t know if we will ever find an answer. He was one of the sickest patients they had ever seen"

This is extremely strange. He is significantly over weight. Their seems to be a denial about obesity and its health complications in this country



https://www.derryjournal.com/news/people/it-miracle-only-explanation-2900044

GooglePlus

The overeating and lack of activity that brings on weight gain is a serious mental health issue and one I've faced myself.

There's been plenty of time for people to drop weight since the start of the year but with everything that's going on around people, it probably hasn't been the easiest thing in the world.

It's very similar to alcoholism, people will eat and sit on the couch all day knowing full well it's killing them but the short term mental reward that sugar brings has a serious hold over them.

wadacrack

GooglePlus wrote: »

The overeating and lack of activity that brings on weight gain is a serious mental health issue and one I've faced myself.

There's been plenty of time for people to drop weight since the start of the year but with everything that's going on around people, it probably hasn't been the easiest thing in the world.

It's very similar to alcoholism, people will eat and sit on the couch all day knowing full well it's killing them but the short term mental reward that sugar brings has a serious hold over them.

People relationship with food needs to become a discussion in the mainstream. Denial about the problem not helping people's mental and physical health

Blush_01

wadacrack wrote: »

Theirs been no hatred of overweight people in society

Suuuuuure....