Golf Lockdown Discussion ** No discussion of breaking Restrictions **

11521323

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

I'd guess the thinking is that it's all that's needed to have a functional and sociable round of golf. Presumably tennis is also limited to 2 people?
Whereas the team sports by definition have more people working in a unit.

That logic is flawed on so many levels.

ForeRight

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

I'd guess the thinking is that it's all that's needed to have a functional and sociable round of golf. Presumably tennis is also limited to 2 people?
Whereas the team sports by definition have more people working in a unit.

One is non contact limited to 2 the other 15 mauling each other. No matter what reasoning is given its bizarre stuff.

ForeRight

ForeRight wrote: »

One is non contact limited to 2 the other 15 mauling each other. No matter what reasoning is given its bizarre stuff.

The 2 household is for NI. Nothing has been communicated down here yet. They revert to 4 balls up North from 12th April when other type of training are allowed.

There is no reason why we need to have 2 balls when we reopen based on what else is being allowed from the same date.

First Up

ForeRight wrote: »

Groups must contain people from only 2 households.
Are we going to limit golf to 2 balls to accommodate this?

All while gaa lads and kids train in pods of 15 in a contact sport.

I think 2 balls are likely for the next while.

ForeRight

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The 2 household is for NI. Nothing has been communicated down here yet. They revert to 4 balls up North from 12th April when other type of training are allowed.

There is no reason why we need to have 2 balls when we reopen based on what else is being allowed from the same date.

Please god you’re right.

With golf being deemed “elitist” it’s funny nobody mentions how the elite don’t give it the go ahead earlier.

Benicetomonty

Hard to see Golf Ireland not going along with the same 2 household terminology as is in place in NI for the first few weeks. Harder to see clubs literally imposing a 2 person maximum on the booking system, which is the only thing a club will be able to do to patrol the measure.

Stacksey

In a few months time..

"Hey there can I please book a 4 ball for 3pm?"

"Oh sorry you will need to go to Northern Ireland for that, have a good day"

FixdePitchmark

ForeRight wrote: »

Please god you’re right.

With golf being deemed “elitist” it’s funny nobody mentions how the elite don’t give it the go ahead earlier.

Golfgate - was massive.

European commissioner basically doing what he liked all over Ireland and then
the arrogance in his approach to the outcome (initially).

The guest list was astonishing too - and even If I'm around golf and know how it is a place where at certain clubs - things are about connection etc.

Even I was given an insight the way Ireland works at the higher level , politicians , commissioners, property developers, banking lobbyists and the legal quarters in the one room.

Fair play - I'm sure it is a great society , but even if people claim golf is not elitist (and it is not for 95%) - it was the case of the 5 % ****ing it up for everyone.

The event was very damaging to the public perception of the game - and as crazy as it is. We are still suffering.

There were other events of arrogance around golf too. But that is the big one.

FixdePitchmark

ForeRight wrote: »

I’ve asked already but can someone explain to me why golf falls into the 2 household mixing outdoors rather than the sports pods of 15 catagory?

Is it fair to say golf enables far more mixing , due to the random nature of a time sheet.

If I play golf 3 times a week in the old set up of 4 balls I have had contacts of up to 9 people in just one week. Over a period of time even say 3 weeks I could be easily up to 27. Then say I am somehow travelling for golf also or in two clubs it get mental after a while.

If a team is training in a pod and not playing games - the theory is they are in the same group and stay in that group.

It is all bull**** - but perhaps that is their logic ?

ForeRight

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Is it fair to say golf enables far more mixing , due to the random nature of a time sheet.

If I play golf 3 times a week in the old set up of 4 balls I have had contacts of up to 9 people in just one week. Over a period of time even say 3 weeks I could be easily up to 27. Then say I am somehow travelling for golf also or in two clubs it get mental after a while.

If a team is training in a pod and not playing games - the theory is they are in the same group and stay in that group.

It is all bull**** - but perhaps that is their logic ?

I can see your thinking but you should have no close contacts after golf no matter where or how many different playing partners you have.
It’s comparing non contact sport to contact.
We know it’s bull**** I don’t know why I’m even wondering as logic is long gone out the window I suppose.

antgal23

I feel leadership and common sense have been in short supply at government level the past few months

The vaccine rollout really exposed our elected politicians for what they are : glorified EU civil servants who are out for themselves

Too many elected officials officials giving too many unelected officials too much recognition and tv time

benny79

antgal23 wrote: »

I feel leadership and common sense have been in short supply at government level the past few months

The vaccine rollout really exposed our elected politicians for what they are : glorified EU civil servants who are out for themselves

Too many elected officials officials giving too many unelected officials too much recognition and tv time

Its sadly been that way for years! and I cant see it changing in my life time..

Salvadoor

The amount of utter bull**** on this thread lately by all the amateur epidemiologists is ridiculous.

ShivasIrons

There is lots of attacks on Golf Ireland going on and I'm not their biggest fan but none of the stick they are getting on this subject is warranted.


As far as I can see the charge is they did no lobbying on behalf of golf. But what the criticism really is, is they weren't shouting loudly enough to tell people what they were doing. It would seem to be more preferable to some that you tell them you are doing something, rather than actually doing something.


Mark Kenneally, the CEO of Golf Ireland, was formerly the chief of staff in the Department of the Taoiseach, he is one of the most politically connected people in the country, he knows how to lobby and who to lobby, you can be certain that he was working all the back channels that you can imagine and probably some you can't making the case for golf.



This could even be seen in the Taoiseach's address yesterday, golf was one of the few sports mentioned in the speech. Why would golf and not track and field or archery etc be mentioned? Because, the case has been made for it.




Another thing that needs to be addressed in this thread is that there was transmission around golf, because golf was being played, in the run up to Christmas. I know quite a number of clubs where cases were transmitted. Clubhouses were the main reason but also shared taxi rides and car journeys were also a factor. To prevent this, clubhouses are closed and the number of households that can play together are limited to cut down on sharing journeys.



There are reasons behind all the decisions, just take a little time to see what the reasons are before lambasting them. There is more cases of the virus around now then when we opened up in December and it didn't take long for us then to go from being the best in Europe to the worst in the world. Which is better, opening up 2 weeks too early or 2 weeks too late? I can wait a few more weeks.

boardise

ShivasIrons wrote: »

There is lots of attacks on Golf Ireland going on and I'm not their biggest fan but none of the stick they are getting on this subject is warranted.


As far as I can see the charge is they did no lobbying on behalf of golf. But what the criticism really is, is they weren't shouting loudly enough to tell people what they were doing. It would seem to be more preferable to some that you tell them you are doing something, rather than actually doing something.


Mark Kenneally, the CEO of Golf Ireland, was formerly the chief of staff in the Department of the Taoiseach, he is one of the most politically connected people in the country, he knows how to lobby and who to lobby, you can be certain that he was working all the back channels that you can imagine and probably some you can't making the case for golf.



This could even be seen in the Taoiseach's address yesterday, golf was one of the few sports mentioned in the speech. Why would golf and not track and field or archery etc be mentioned? Because, the case has been made for it.




Another thing that needs to be addressed in this thread is that there was transmission around golf, because golf was being played, in the run up to Christmas. I know quite a number of clubs where cases were transmitted. Clubhouses were the main reason but also shared taxi rides and car journeys were also a factor. To prevent this, clubhouses are closed and the number of households that can play together are limited to cut down on sharing journeys.



There are reasons behind all the decisions, just take a little time to see what the reasons are before lambasting them. There is more cases of the virus around now then when we opened up in December and it didn't take long for us then to go from being the best in Europe to the worst in the world. Which is better, opening up 2 weeks too early or 2 weeks too late? I can wait a few more weeks.

Some lobbying.
They had a cast iron case and couldn't make it stick -from away back .

There's no one claiming there's NO risk -the point is it's negligible compared to what's going on generally .
The cases you claim to know about were from a time when the virus was surging -that's not the position now .At least a third if not a half of the counties report numbers that are way down below 10 cases a day for the last two/three weeks. The chances of contracting the virus from time and space controlled golf are minuscule. The nonsensicality around all of this is hard to take.

antgal23

ShivasIrons wrote: »

There is lots of attacks on Golf Ireland going on and I'm not their biggest fan but none of the stick they are getting on this subject is warranted.


As far as I can see the charge is they did no lobbying on behalf of golf. But what the criticism really is, is they weren't shouting loudly enough to tell people what they were doing. It would seem to be more preferable to some that you tell them you are doing something, rather than actually doing something.


Mark Kenneally, the CEO of Golf Ireland, was formerly the chief of staff in the Department of the Taoiseach, he is one of the most politically connected people in the country, he knows how to lobby and who to lobby, you can be certain that he was working all the back channels that you can imagine and probably some you can't making the case for golf.



This could even be seen in the Taoiseach's address yesterday, golf was one of the few sports mentioned in the speech. Why would golf and not track and field or archery etc be mentioned? Because, the case has been made for it.




Another thing that needs to be addressed in this thread is that there was transmission around golf, because golf was being played, in the run up to Christmas. I know quite a number of clubs where cases were transmitted. Clubhouses were the main reason but also shared taxi rides and car journeys were also a factor. To prevent this, clubhouses are closed and the number of households that can play together are limited to cut down on sharing journeys.



There are reasons behind all the decisions, just take a little time to see what the reasons are before lambasting them. There is more cases of the virus around now then when we opened up in December and it didn't take long for us then to go from being the best in Europe to the worst in the world. Which is better, opening up 2 weeks too early or 2 weeks too late? I can wait a few more weeks.[/QUOTE

I appreciate your post however I disagree with some points.

1/ let's not confuse socialising in clubhouses with people who play golf - I played golf in December but didn't enter the clubhouse for a pint, in fact most golfers who play regularly would choose 18 holes over accessing the 19th

2/ different variant = more cases but the median age is 30,
with the median age of deaths and hospitalisations 70. Unless 30 year olds have to go to hospital and with the vaccine to the older cohort why not open things up quicker?

3

blue note

ShivasIrons wrote: »

There is lots of attacks on Golf Ireland going on and I'm not their biggest fan but none of the stick they are getting on this subject is warranted.


As far as I can see the charge is they did no lobbying on behalf of golf. But what the criticism really is, is they weren't shouting loudly enough to tell people what they were doing. It would seem to be more preferable to some that you tell them you are doing something, rather than actually doing something.


Mark Kenneally, the CEO of Golf Ireland, was formerly the chief of staff in the Department of the Taoiseach, he is one of the most politically connected people in the country, he knows how to lobby and who to lobby, you can be certain that he was working all the back channels that you can imagine and probably some you can't making the case for golf.



This could even be seen in the Taoiseach's address yesterday, golf was one of the few sports mentioned in the speech. Why would golf and not track and field or archery etc be mentioned? Because, the case has been made for it.




Another thing that needs to be addressed in this thread is that there was transmission around golf, because golf was being played, in the run up to Christmas. I know quite a number of clubs where cases were transmitted. Clubhouses were the main reason but also shared taxi rides and car journeys were also a factor. To prevent this, clubhouses are closed and the number of households that can play together are limited to cut down on sharing journeys.



There are reasons behind all the decisions, just take a little time to see what the reasons are before lambasting them. There is more cases of the virus around now then when we opened up in December and it didn't take long for us then to go from being the best in Europe to the worst in the world. Which is better, opening up 2 weeks too early or 2 weeks too late? I can wait a few more weeks.

Very good post. You're spot on that the problem wasn't the lack of lobbying from Golf Ireland. People wanted to see golf Ireland on Twitter or quoted in the independent putting pressure on the government to make an exception for them. You could argue that that would have enraged non-golfers that they were looking for special treatment and I'd agree with you. I think it would and would have been harmful to getting golf back up and running.

And you're also spot on about transmissions. What matters with a restriction is the bottom line - what effect will it have on cases? If societies are going to have outings and prize giving ceremonies after at someone's house, you have to factor it in. People are going to travel together and you have to factor it in. And if you open up golf you'll have to open up other things with similar risks and they'll have the transmissions not linked directly to the activity as well which will have to be factored in. You can still arrive at the conclusion that opening up is the right decision and it will be an opinion worth reading. But someone who just says there's no transmissions from golf therefore it should be open is best ignored.

11521323

Lads anyone know of a good driving range in NI close to the border on the East side?

willabur

11521323 wrote: »

Lads anyone know of a good driving range in NI close to the border on the East side?

Mod snip, flaming post

Rikand

I bet Slave1 thought he was getting a cushy number when he took the modship here not so long ago :pac:

Break80

Rikand wrote: »

I bet Slave1 thought he was getting a cushy number when he took the modship here not so long ago :pac:

And me as Captain of The Society this year.
We are down to 3 outings now.
If it's members only to Sept we are fcked.

Seve OB

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Is it fair to say golf enables far more mixing , due to the random nature of a time sheet.

If I play golf 3 times a week in the old set up of 4 balls I have had contacts of up to 9 people in just one week. Over a period of time even say 3 weeks I could be easily up to 27. Then say I am somehow travelling for golf also or in two clubs it get mental after a while.

If a team is training in a pod and not playing games - the theory is they are in the same group and stay in that group.

It is all bull**** - but perhaps that is their logic ?

I’d say I’ve easily had close contact with a couple of hundred people over the last week.

It was only a couple of trips to Dunnes though

billy3sheets

Break80 wrote: »

And me as Captain of The Society this year.
We are down to 3 outings now.
If it's members only to Sept we are fcked.

I'm secretary of a society too. We play a Saturday from March to October and have bookings in place up to July. I have my doubts that clubs will honour these. It might be possible to move some dates to Friday. We would expect to have 16-20 or so out at an average cost of 35. So that would be 600-700 in fees alone to a club.
Probably a separate thread but it will be interesting to see what the impact of covid is on golf societies and the knock-on effect to clubs and golf in general. Society golf is how many get a taste forthe game, a sort of gateway drug if you like.

FixdePitchmark

Seve OB wrote: »

I’d say I’ve easily had close contact with a couple of hundred people over the last week.

It was only a couple of trips to Dunnes though

To be honest - I would agree that shopping is and was a problem too - and was out of hand at various points.

People were making ridiculous multiple journeys to shops and they were very full and many of them not safe spaces.

But not sure what that has to do with the return of sports. For what ever reason. The government categorized certain areas into necessary and others not. It was all about minimizing close contact.

I guess the good news is that we are just about at a point where what is deemed unnecessary is just about to open and freedom of movement is returning. But both are still being controlled.

Anyway - I guess we are going over old ground . Even If I agree or disagree with various parts of open or closed , I got the logic, I got the 5km concept.

But would agree with you - shopping was way worse than golf - but I guess shopping is necessary when people were shopping for food - trying to make it a singular journey. But this was not the case.

Benny Cake

The bogey men podcast released today was excellent. Really conveyed my sentiments on the Current situation. I'd highly reccomend people have a listen. I think weare being used as a political football in the wake of the golfgate scandal. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the risks associated with golf from a COVID perspective. Very frustrating...

Scott Tenorman

ShivasIrons wrote: »

There is lots of attacks on Golf Ireland going on and I'm not their biggest fan but none of the stick they are getting on this subject is warranted.


As far as I can see the charge is they did no lobbying on behalf of golf. But what the criticism really is, is they weren't shouting loudly enough to tell people what they were doing. It would seem to be more preferable to some that you tell them you are doing something, rather than actually doing something.


Mark Kenneally, the CEO of Golf Ireland, was formerly the chief of staff in the Department of the Taoiseach, he is one of the most politically connected people in the country, he knows how to lobby and who to lobby, you can be certain that he was working all the back channels that you can imagine and probably some you can't making the case for golf.



This could even be seen in the Taoiseach's address yesterday, golf was one of the few sports mentioned in the speech. Why would golf and not track and field or archery etc be mentioned? Because, the case has been made for it.




Another thing that needs to be addressed in this thread is that there was transmission around golf, because golf was being played, in the run up to Christmas. I know quite a number of clubs where cases were transmitted. Clubhouses were the main reason but also shared taxi rides and car journeys were also a factor. To prevent this, clubhouses are closed and the number of households that can play together are limited to cut down on sharing journeys.



There are reasons behind all the decisions, just take a little time to see what the reasons are before lambasting them. There is more cases of the virus around now then when we opened up in December and it didn't take long for us then to go from being the best in Europe to the worst in the world. Which is better, opening up 2 weeks too early or 2 weeks too late? I can wait a few more weeks.

Golf Ireland are being criticised because they have utterly failed in their lobbying- golf in Ireland has been closed more than anywhere in the planet despite it being safe. That is is piss poor.

And their communication with their members has been laughable- short statements when we have to close, nothing at all, then a short statement when we are told to reopen. Not good enough.

opinionated3

ShivasIrons wrote: »

There is lots of attacks on Golf Ireland going on and I'm not their biggest fan but none of the stick they are getting on this subject is warranted.


As far as I can see the charge is they did no lobbying on behalf of golf. But what the criticism really is, is they weren't shouting loudly enough to tell people what they were doing. It would seem to be more preferable to some that you tell them you are doing something, rather than actually doing something.


Mark Kenneally, the CEO of Golf Ireland, was formerly the chief of staff in the Department of the Taoiseach, he is one of the most politically connected people in the country, he knows how to lobby and who to lobby, you can be certain that he was working all the back channels that you can imagine and probably some you can't making the case for golf.



This could even be seen in the Taoiseach's address yesterday, golf was one of the few sports mentioned in the speech. Why would golf and not track and field or archery etc be mentioned? Because, the case has been made for it.




Another thing that needs to be addressed in this thread is that there was transmission around golf, because golf was being played, in the run up to Christmas. I know quite a number of clubs where cases were transmitted. Clubhouses were the main reason but also shared taxi rides and car journeys were also a factor. To prevent this, clubhouses are closed and the number of households that can play together are limited to cut down on sharing journeys.



There are reasons behind all the decisions, just take a little time to see what the reasons are before lambasting them. There is more cases of the virus around now then when we opened up in December and it didn't take long for us then to go from being the best in Europe to the worst in the world. Which is better, opening up 2 weeks too early or 2 weeks too late? I can wait a few more weeks.

You'll have to name those clubs that had evidence of transmission cases because I haven't heard of any. And were those cases logged with the HSE? Because again, I didn't hear any mention of golf club related outbreaks in their memos.
Golf Ireland failed in most peoples eyes because justifying golf as a covid safe activity should be like shooting fish in a barrel. And yet we still ended up behind team sports and lumped in with the zoo FFS.

dan_ep82

I can understand Golf Ireland using a quieter approach to lobbying for the reopening. It probably is the best way to approach it rather than holding a protest or appearing on every radio station.

However, from a GUI members point of view the lobbying has been so quiet you'd be forgiven for thinking it didn't exist at all. I don't need to hear what they are doing from the media or social media. What I did expect was some updates on what they were doing or trying to during the closure, instead we get silence.

ForeRight

My friends father is heavily involved with golf Ireland and he told me last night that Golf Ireland set to announce golf in single one ball only for the first 2 weeks from April 26th in the republic.

getoffthepot

Scott Tenorman wrote: »

Golf Ireland are being criticised because they have utterly failed in their lobbying- golf in Ireland has been closed more than anywhere in the planet despite it being safe. That is is piss poor.

And their communication with their members has been laughable- short statements when we have to close, nothing at all, then a short statement when we are told to reopen. Not good enough.

My understanding from an official in our club is that golf Ireland haven't even communicated with clubs except around inter club competitions. poor show when that's their top priority.
Optics are important.