Ahmaud Arbery

Tokyo

Mod: @Kidchameleon - you're entitled to a differing opinion, but the way you are presenting it (one liner responses, taking the contrary stance no matter what) is leading me to strongly believe that you are trying to wind people up. Consider your posts carefully.

Other posters, take equal consideration with your responses.

Overheal

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Not true.

https://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/2010/title-17/chapter-4/article-4/17-4-60/

"In Georgia, the law states that a private person may arrest someone if a crime is committed in his presence or “within his immediate knowledge.” But if it is a felony, the citizen can stop someone from escaping if the citizen has “reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion.”

https://www.georgiacriminallawyer.com/theft-by-taking

"The penalty for theft by taking can either be a misdemeanor or felony in Georgia. When the theft involves property valued at $500 or less, then the crime will be deemed a misdemeanor in Georgia. The consequences of a misdemeanor include a fine of no more than $1,000 and a jail sentence of no more than 12 months."

Unfortunately for the people supporting Arbery, all of the boxes are ticked in favor of the McMichaels. I hope they get a fair trial.

Nope.

They didn’t witness a felony, or get told about a felony, or suspect a felony in progress.

The police report is clear, the McMichaels told responding officers they saw Arbery run past their house several homes up the street. They decided to give chase because they suspected him as being the culprit of a previous theft. Not because they suspected an active felony was in progress. Not because anyone asked for their help. The first person to call 911 upon seeing Arbery at 220 Satilla Dr was not one of the 3 men charged with murder and did not contact them for any vigilante assistance.

https://www.nytimes.com/video/us/100000007142853/ahmaud-arbery-video-911-georgia.html

Overheal

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Image from the Satilla Shores Neighborhood watch Facebook page. IMHO, give extra weight to the McMichaels having reasonable suspicion.

This just shows they wanted to catch someone on suspicion of a previous crime. Further erodes the citizens arrest argument.

Overheal

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Also in your post:

"Enters upon the land or premises of another person or into any part of any vehicle, railroad car, aircraft, or watercraft of another person after receiving, prior to such entry, notice from the owner, rightful occupant, or, upon proper identification, an authorized representative of the owner or rightful occupant that such entry is forbidden; or"

There was notice from the owner not to enter & Arbery ignored it many times.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8308785/Man-called-police-Ahmaud-Arbery-says-suspicious-saggy-pants.html

The current owner, Larry English Jr., bought it in June 2016 for $120,000 and has built the majority of the structure which has a sign posted outside, warning: 'Trespassers will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.'

I have doubts about this. Daily Mail reports a sign up there weeks after the killings?

If it was up beforehand, then, lots of people not just Arbery are guilty of a misdemeanor. A misdemeanor the Arbery’s didn’t witness that day. No other trespassers were given a citizens arrest.

Digs the hole deeper for their case if anything. The actual date the sign was posted will be testimony in court either way.

Overheal

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Criminal Trespass, informed by the neighbor who we see in the video. All residents were sharing information regarding the spate of crime (see neighborhood watch screengrab linked earlier)

He was on the phone with 911. How did he inform the McMichaels? Do you have confirmation of this or just speculation? Police report states different.

Overheal

ELM327 wrote: »

They have immediate knowledge, did you not see the local area watch facebook and the communication with property owner.
Do keep up.

That’s not immediate knowledge. Both the post and the communication would have happened at least days before the incident.

ohnonotgmail

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

here you go. I'm happy to do your thinking for you. will a decision of The Supreme Court of Georgia suffice? i have bolded the relevant parts to assist you further.

https://law.justia.com/cases/georgia/supreme-court/1977/31907-1.html

Overheal wrote: »

That’s not immediate knowledge. Both the post and the communication would have happened at least days before the incident.

KC has been strangely quiet since i posted the supreme court decision above. as they did not see him commit any crime they did not have immediate knowledge that he committed a crime so they had no basis for a citizens arrest.

Kidchameleon

At the risk of getting banned I'm going to leave the discussion. I am not trying to wind anyone up, I simply do not believe the mainstream narrative on this (and have provided reasons and links all the way along).

Anyway..

It will be interesting to see the results of the investigation. I am available on PM if anyone has any queries. I have all videos/links/images backed up on my laptop in case they disappear off the net (I have found this is happening with this case in particular), if anything is needed let me know. Peace all and RIP Mr. Arbery.

ohnonotgmail

Kidchameleon wrote: »

At the risk of getting banned I'm going to leave the discussion. I am not trying to wind anyone up, I simply do not believe the mainstream narrative on this (and have provided reasons and links all the way along).

Anyway..

It will be interesting to see the results of the investigation. I am available on PM if anyone has any queries. I have all videos/links/images backed up on my laptop in case they disappear off the net (I have found this is happening with this case in particular), if anything is needed let me know. Peace all and RIP Mr. Arbery.

**This is not a commentary on moderation just my personal thoughts but... its a shame that I have backed everything up, tried to clarify peoples arguments, attempted to have a proper discussion yet I am the one to get a warning. I understand I may have looked a little "soapboxy" but when emotions are raw like like this, it can get that way. The people who shout the loudest get to stay regardless of weather they are right or wrong. Unreal.

do you believe the Georgia Supreme Court Decision i posted that shows they had no basis to make a citizens arrest?

Gatling

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I have all videos/links/images backed up on my laptop in case they disappear off the net (I have found this is happening with this case in particular), if anything is needed let me know

Are you actually for real .

So it's now it's the drinking from the koolaide fountain conspiracy theories .

Yeah go

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Kidchameleon wrote: »

At the risk of getting banned I'm going to leave the discussion. I am not trying to wind anyone up, I simply do not believe the mainstream narrative on this (and have provided reasons and links all the way along).

Anyway..

It will be interesting to see the results of the investigation. I am available on PM if anyone has any queries. I have all videos/links/images backed up on my laptop in case they disappear off the net (I have found this is happening with this case in particular), if anything is needed let me know. Peace all and RIP Mr. Arbery.

Yes, this is the place to go for quality information on the case.

Kidchameleon

Kidchameleon wrote: »

At the risk of getting banned I'm going to leave the discussion. I am not trying to wind anyone up, I simply do not believe the mainstream narrative on this (and have provided reasons and links all the way along).

Anyway..

It will be interesting to see the results of the investigation. I am available on PM if anyone has any queries. I have all videos/links/images backed up on my laptop in case they disappear off the net (I have found this is happening with this case in particular), if anything is needed let me know. Peace all and RIP Mr. Arbery.

Our very own Library of Alexandria.

Kidchameleon

This is interesting. More posts on the Satilla Shores neighborhood watch group (have tried and failed to find them unredacted) Most interestingly, the people seem to have been in constant contact with the police. This is strange as the media seem to be giving off the impression that there was no crime/reported burglaries in the area.



https://www.news4jax.com/news/georgia/2020/05/22/a-look-at-the-satilla-shores-facebook-group-mentioned-in-the-ahmaud-arbery-investigation/

Gatling

Kidchameleon wrote: »

This is strange as the media seem to be giving off the impression that there was no crime/reported burglaries in the area.

The police stated it ,and the klan claimed there was multiple break-in's yet zero evidence to back up the claim ,

Other than redacted FB posts and we all know of it's on facebook it must be true lol

martingriff

Kidchameleon wrote: »

This is interesting. More posts on the Satilla Shores neighborhood watch group (have tried and failed to find them unredacted) Most interestingly, the people seem to have been in constant contact with the police. This is strange as the media seem to be giving off the impression that there was no crime/reported burglaries in the area.



https://www.news4jax.com/news/georgia/2020/05/22/a-look-at-the-satilla-shores-facebook-group-mentioned-in-the-ahmaud-arbery-investigation/

So what crimes had been committed. Did Arbery commit them is there a shed of evidence he had. You seem to want to justify this in some way to what give them a tap on the wrist what you did was very bad do not do it again and off you go. 2 men went into trucks with shotguns shouting to stop while having the shotguns out. If that was me I be doing 1 of 2 things. I either get out of range of the guns and if not possible get those guns away from pointing at me.

Before you ask no I would not stop and just talk with 2 people I do not know who are coming after me with shotguns

joe40

Kidchameleon wrote: »

This is interesting. More posts on the Satilla Shores neighborhood watch group (have tried and failed to find them unredacted) Most interestingly, the people seem to have been in constant contact with the police. This is strange as the media seem to be giving off the impression that there was no crime/reported burglaries in the area.



https://www.news4jax.com/news/georgia/2020/05/22/a-look-at-the-satilla-shores-facebook-group-mentioned-in-the-ahmaud-arbery-investigation/

McDaniels reported a gun stolen from his unlocked vehicle.
Maybe not a crime in gun loving America but still what kind of clown leaves a gun in an unlocked vehicle.
Some mindsets I'll never understand.

Kidchameleon

Gatling wrote: »

The police stated it ,and the klan claimed there was multiple break-in's yet zero evidence to back up the claim ,

Other than redacted FB posts and we all know of it's on facebook it must be true lol

Your probably right, there was probably nothing going on in that neighborhood at all. I wonder why the residents felt the need to call the police and post about things like that on Facebook? Strange.

Kidchameleon

joe40 wrote: »

McDaniels reported a gun stolen from his unlocked vehicle.
Maybe not a crime in gun loving America but still what kind of clown leaves a gun in an unlocked vehicle.
Some mindsets I'll never understand.

100% agreed it was not a good idea to leave a gun in an unlocked car. I also think whoever took it is equally as stupid and possibly had far worse intentions.

Kidchameleon

martingriff wrote: »

So what crimes had been committed. Did Arbery commit them is there a shed of evidence he had. You seem to want to justify this in some way to what give them a tap on the wrist what you did was very bad do not do it again and off you go. 2 men went into trucks with shotguns shouting to stop while having the shotguns out. If that was me I be doing 1 of 2 things. I either get out of range of the guns and if not possible get those guns away from pointing at me.

Before you ask no I would not stop and just talk with 2 people I do not know who are coming after me with shotguns

You could be right. Arbery could be a complete saint for all we know. His criminal past could well have been that, his past. I just hope that justice is doled out fairly and not to appease tensions. If these men are innocent then release them, if they are not, throw the book at them. We shall see.

joe40

Kidchameleon wrote: »

100% agreed it was not a good idea to leave a gun in an unlocked car. I also think whoever took it is equally as stupid and possibly had far worse intentions.

Yeah, but we don't know who took it.

Gatling

[quote="Kidchameleon;113577595" I wonder why the residents felt the need to call the police and post about things like that on Facebook.[/quote]

Black man seen in the white neighborhood quick call the fat sacked cop to eradicate the Blackman

Gatling

joe40 wrote: »

Yeah, but we don't know who took it.

We don't even know if there was a actually a gun at all in the first place

pjohnson

Kidchameleon wrote: »

100% agreed it was not a good idea to leave a gun in an unlocked car. I also think whoever took it is equally as stupid and possibly had far worse intentions.

Well that seems unlikely considering what McMichaels neighbourhood hunting habits are.

Guy:Incognito

Kidchameleon wrote: »

If these men are innocent then release them, if they are not, throw the book at them. We shall see.

Whether they manage to get off on a technicality or not, they killed the guy.
They decided to chase him , they decided to block the road he was running up while the other car herded him towards them. Travis McMichael decided to move from where he was to go towards where Arbery was running to when he went around the opposite side of the car to avoid him.

Seeing as we're trying so hard to show how peoples actions lead to what happens to them after , this is squarely on them.

Kidchameleon

Gatling wrote: »

We don't even know it there was a actually a gun at all in the first place

With all due respect, I think that may be a bit conspiratorial.


Would I be right in saying that you feel the gun being stolen might have been a cover story told by Travis McMichael? To give him an excuse to go after Arbery? Please correct me if I am wrong.


I personally think it is safe to assume that a gun was stolen. As far as I remember it was reported missing on the 11th of February. This and in conjunction with all of the reported sightings of trespassing and shady activity in the area (please see the linked report on the neighborhood watch group) certainly seems to back that up.


Again, I'm just trying to apply my own logic and probability to the situation, and I am discussing it with you with all respect and courtesy.

Kidchameleon

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Whether they manage to get off on a technicality or not, they killed the guy.
They decided to chase him , they decided to block the road he was running up while the other car herded him towards them. Travis McMichael decided to move from where he was to go towards where Arbery was running to when he went around the opposite side of the car to avoid him.

Seeing as we're trying so hard to show how peoples actions lead to what happens to them after , this is squarely on them.

Yeah you could be right. I'm sure at the trial, the footage will be poured over meticulously and analyzed without bias (and I'm not suggesting you or I are being biased, just giving our own analysis) and a verdict will be reached that is fair. Lets wait and see.

osarusan

Kidchameleon wrote: »

As far as I remember it was reported missing on the 11th of February.

That was on Jan 1st.


On Feb 11th, the motion-sensor (or sensor-activated camera, something like that) in the unfinished house was set off, the owner English called a neighbour called Perez to have a look - on his way to have a look he ran into Travis McMichael, and arriving at the unfinished house they came across Arbery coming out of the house/yard.


It was on this occasion that McMichael said Arbery made some motion that McMichael thought was him reaching for/gesturing that he had a gun in his shorts.

Gatling

Kidchameleon wrote: »

With all due respect, I think that may be a bit conspiratorial.

No .

Remember people claimed that he

Was armed with a hammer -lie

We was wearing heavy work boots - lie

He attacked 3 armed men first -lie

He was trying to emulate the columbine massacre -lie


So yeah it's pretty likely there was no gun stolen from McDaniels

ohnonotgmail

Kidchameleon wrote: »

This is interesting. More posts on the Satilla Shores neighborhood watch group (have tried and failed to find them unredacted) Most interestingly, the people seem to have been in constant contact with the police. This is strange as the media seem to be giving off the impression that there was no crime/reported burglaries in the area.



https://www.news4jax.com/news/georgia/2020/05/22/a-look-at-the-satilla-shores-facebook-group-mentioned-in-the-ahmaud-arbery-investigation/

how is this relevant to 2 armed white men killing an unarmed black man in an illegitimate citizens arrest? do you think it excuses their behaviour in some way?

Gatling

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

how is this relevant to 2 armed white men killing an unarmed black man in an illegitimate citizens arrest? do you think it excuses their behaviour in some way?

It's another not so veiled let's blame the victim post