George Floyd dies after police knelt on his neck (MOD NOTE IN POST #1)

Cupatae

2u2me wrote: »

So many otherwise rational and clear thinking people have been brainwashed by this ideology.
(Intersectionality)

Key mantra that keeps getting repeated
"You wouldn't know unless you lived it"

I've lived racism, I know what I'm talking about. Intersectionality is a crock of ****e.

Once you get the snowflakes on board and make the movement "cool" you get all sorts of misguided "activists" that are completely unbalanced and have no logical thought only regurgitate what the masses are shouting.

Id honestly say if you asked half the people what they are tryna achieve by this riot/protest they wouldnt be able to give a proper answer. But throw up BLM and a few instagram posts and away you go "legitimate" cause.

2u2me

Cupatae wrote: »

Once you get the snowflakes on board and make the movement "cool" you get all sorts of misguided "activists" that are completely unbalanced and have no logical thought only regurgitate what the masses are shouting.

Id honestly say if you asked half the people what they are tryna achieve by this riot/protest they wouldnt be able to give a proper answer. But throw up BLM and a few instagram posts and away you go "legitimate" cause.

One black person caught my eye watching a stream on reuters last night livestreaming outside the whitehouse.

He was shouting as loud as he could "What's the point in protest if we don't change the constitution" he was scrambling around shouting this and no one was paying attention to him.

completedit

I heard that too

Foxtrol

Cupatae wrote: »

Ive lived in both america and canada and haven't seen what you describe, definitely not to the extent you are implying either, i dont think just because your in Ireland you are in bubble, alot of what people are saying is on the money regardless of whether they have lived stateside or not.And on the flip side just cause u live in america your opinion shouldn't be taken as fact.

I'd argue it is pretty likely you didn't make close friendships with many POC then.

As I said already in this thread, I was in a complete bubble when I lived in Ireland and that continued when I moved to the US initially, the majority of my friend circle was Irish ex-pats. I thought the idea of 'white privilege' was a joke and leaned into the 'sure the Irish went through a lot of stuff too' mentality.

I fully agree you aren't automatically in a bubble if you live in Ireland and you also don't have to live in the US to understand. At the same time I see post after post here that stink of my line of thinking when I thought I knew what was going on in the US but really had no idea.

It is also obvious that many posters aren't even bothering to try to educate themselves, as time and again they post absolutely stupid things that could quickly be answered by a google. It is like they either can't or aren't bothered to wrap their heads around an issue that doesn't boil down to a single demand - like the water charges protest.

FatherTed

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Erm, looks like they may be recovering stolen goods tbh.

Right... and the looters were only picking up their online orders that were not delivered :rolleyes:

BorneTobyWilde

Say what you may, but since Trump made his speech, since he showed some steel the looting has stopped, that last two nights we've seen nothing, if there was we'd be looking at the clips on here, but I've seen no clips of anything new these past two nights

Snickers Man

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

People pulled me up here before for using the term Libtard but the guy in that video is a classic example.

I mean we could all see that coming.:D


One funny incident in a very nasty crisis.:mad:

Must be refreshing to see that it is not only the US military that endures "friendly fire" or "Blue on Blue" incidents. "BLUE LIVES MATTER, Y'ALL!!!"

Quote from the link given:
"Friendly fire
While the death toll among coalition forces engaging Iraqi combatants.. [in the war ensuing from the 2003 invasion of Iraq] ..was very low, a substantial number of deaths were caused by accidental attacks from other Allied units. Of the 148 US troops who died in battle, 24% were killed by friendly fire, a total of 35 service personnel.[201] A further 11 died in detonations of coalition munitions. Nine British military personnel were killed in a friendly fire incident when a USAF A-10 Thunderbolt II destroyed a group of two Warrior IFVs."

What would you call those guys? Miltards? Gruntards? Yanktards?

I only ask.

Nermal

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Fake news.

Eagerly awaiting apologies from the people who thanked a post full of nonsense.

Also looking forward to Twitter hiding every tweet mentioning tear gas.

How long will I have to wait?

Chris_Heilong

I condemn the Police for their corruption, I condemn the protesters for the violence and destruction, I condemn the Actors/companies supporting the rioters when they do not even understand what normal people go through and I condemn the Media for their propaganda twisting real events to fit an ideological narrative, none of this is acceptable.

Christy42

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Fake news.

1) Those protesters were not peaceful.
2) No tear gas was used.

And yet we have a lot of witnesses all reporting the same thing. We have 70 people holed up in a house terrified of the police apparently without looting the owner.

Hey let's wait for Donald to start giving out about the priests whose church he used for the stunt given they were in the crowd. I am sure the religious vote will love that.

Christy42

hotmail.com wrote: »

Is there not an exaggeration here about Trump's response as usual?

He actually hasn't done much at all and yet you'd swear he was dropping bombs on the protesters.

Obviously America has no issue dropping bombs, just as long as it's not their own country.

I mean I just mentioned the one outside his house that he was annoyed was in his way. He is meant to be the leader. He is meant to be the one unifying everyone. Or at least giving it a go. Quoting a racist police chief was probably not the way to calm everyone if we are really being honest with ourselves.

There is precedent as Philli has dropped bombs on itself I believe.

Faugheen

I see more people are upset with the protesters than the man who was killed by police.

Quantum Erasure

Foxtrol wrote: »

Why would they apologise?

I don't feel the need to apologise, however my time in the US has educated me on the issues facing those communities in a way I could never be sitting in the bubble in Ireland.

Should they feel Brit guilt? Should you feel white guilt? Should I?

ELM327

I think that the time is nigh for a meaningful response from Trump

As a Trump fan, I'd expect him to get tough by now. If the looting is allowed continue without white house intervention, it won't look good in November

BorneTobyWilde

Trump got to Church pretty fast on the back of people telling him what he did was a stunt at the White House church.


https://twitter.com/FLOTUS/status/1267929157654269955

Corholio

Nermal wrote: »

Eagerly awaiting apologies from the people who thanked a post full of nonsense.

Also looking forward to Twitter hiding every tweet mentioning tear gas.

How long will I have to wait?

Plenty of accounts from people who said there was, reporter from Yahoo clearly shows an agent in his video that was affecting people. Lots of accounts of people struggling to breathe, coughing up heavily etc. A statement from Park Service is some reach as some sort of 'evidence'. They said that pepper balls were used which is a riot control agent i.e. tear gas. There isn't one form of 'tear gas', it's a term used to umbrella any chemical agent of riot control.

Foxtrol

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

I condemn the Police for there corruption, I condemn the protesters for they violence and destruction, I condemn the Actors/companies supporting the rioters when they do not even understand what normal people go through and I condemn the Media for their propaganda twisting real events to fit an ideological narrative, none of this is acceptable.

Links to actors & companies supporting rioters?

~Rebel~

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Fake news.

1) Those protesters were not peaceful.
2) No tear gas was used.

...there’s literally news reportage live from the event...

Here’s one weirdly cut together piece, but the details from the live correspondent are clear;
https://www.instagram.com/p/CA9i6sSgj9p/?igshid=tjtpw9260jem

Christy42

I see the lapd chief saying that Floyd's death is on the looters hands. I mean, what can you say at this point. There is a lot you can blame the looters for. That is not one of them.

Foxtrol

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

Should they feel Brit guilt? Should you feel white guilt? Should I?

Has anyone claimed anyone should feel guilt?

Being asked to educate yourself and take action is not the same as being asked to feel guilty.

Yanks shouldn't feel 'Brit guilt' but they should educate themselves on what happened in the north before they branded everyone that disagreed or protested the actions of the RUC/British army in the north a terrorist

Gregor Samsa

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Fake news.

1) Those protesters were not peaceful.
2) No tear gas was used.

The police admittedly fired smoke bombs and pepper balls (projectiles that contain pepper spray). The effects of them both aren't dissimilar to tear gas. Yeah, it's not literally tear gas, but does that really make it fake news?

It's like someone saying the police had "guns", and you claiming it's fake news because they were actually brandishing rifles.

Technically inacccurate news, maybe. Pedantically incorrect news maybe. But not actually fake as in totally made up.

Edit: Actually, I'm even being too kind to you. Tear Gas is an informal, general term for lachrymators - substances that irritate the eyes and causes tears to flow - not a particular chemical. Pepper Spray is a lachrymator. Maybe the police are equating Tear Gas specifically with CS gas (another lachrymator). If so, that's some fine hair splitting.

Foxtrol

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Trump got to Church pretty fast on the back of people telling him what he did was a stunt at the White House church.


https://twitter.com/FLOTUS/status/1267929157654269955

And the church isn't happy (like Melania during the visit)

https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/1267927672262451201?s=20

Foxtrol

Nermal wrote: »

Eagerly awaiting apologies from the people who thanked a post full of nonsense.

Also looking forward to Twitter hiding every tweet mentioning tear gas.

How long will I have to wait?

You have to incredibly gullible to believe that statement.

Even if you disbelieve you eyes on the recording and believe there was a vast conspiracy of dozens of reporters on the ground, including international reporters, to lie about what happened you have to believe cowardly bunker baby Trump planned to walk through the protesters to get to the church - which would never happen even if he demanded it

Melanchthon

joe40 wrote: »

The RUC in the north have been totally transformed. They even changed "force" to "service"
Why did that happen, because there was systemic secterianism. The evidence wasn't any one single act it was the totality of the actions. The way that one community had no faith in the organization.
In their defense I'm sure there were good officers in the RUC and they were under constant attack. Many were killed or maimed.
In America the response would have been give more guns, build bigger walls, and that was done.
But that is not a solution, why is that so difficult to understand.
The actual solutions are complex and multifaceted, and also unique to each situation.

The problems in American society and the obvious anger will not be solved by more force or putting the blame on black communities. That has been done and is not working.

I work in a school in the north, the PSNI come in regularly to talk to kids about safety issues, believe me that would not have happened in the 80s.

I don't have answers no single person does. But anyone shouting about soldiers on the street have learned nothing from history. We, in this country should know better than most.

Thats a way to simplistic answer though, you see accusations and protests of racist policing and heavy handed actions in areas that have black police chiefs and a majority or significant proportion black officers.
The RUC was 1/2% Catholic, somewhere like Atlanta has loads of black police but they are lumped in together.
These issues came more prominent at a time when Obama was in power, making a comparison to Northern Ireland just doesn't work on a million different levels, at least to some extent the Catholic community self-policed in the absence of legitimate authority, in the states you end up with Chicago and Baltimore having death rates higher than the troubles.

A PSNI style transformation might be beneficial but lets not pretend it will solve all the issues, the PSNI is genuinely pretty good, they are a militarized police force and have access to plastic bullets and machine guns and spend a lot of the time in armored vehicles wearing bullet proof vests, yet the people holding up the PSNI as a model of better policing will say a heavily armed militarized police force is one of the key roots of the problem, its just contradictory

Edit: to be clear you can see loads of shocking US police actions and some of them definitely need a lot more training but on the flip side not seen much practical stuff about reforming the huge amounts of different forces that operate in places with loads of guns

Christy42

Christy42 wrote: »

I see the lapd chief saying that Floyd's death is on the looters hands. I mean, what can you say at this point. There is a lot you can blame the looters for. That is not one of them.

Stuff doesn't have to make sense anymore..it's grand..

Melanchthon

Melanchthon wrote: »

Thats a way to simplistic answer though, you see accusations and protests of racist policing and heavy handed actions in areas that have black police chiefs and a majority or significant proportion black officers.
The RUC was 1/2% Catholic, somewhere like Atlanta has loads of black police but they are lumped in together.
These issues came more prominent at a time when Obama was in power, making a comparison to Northern Ireland just doesn't work on a million different levels, at least to some extent the Catholic community self-policed in the absence of legitimate authority, in the states you end up with Chicago and Baltimore having death rates higher than the troubles.

A PSNI style transformation might be beneficial but lets not pretend it will solve all the issues, the PSNI is genuinely pretty good, they are a militarized police force and have access to plastic bullets and machine guns and spend a lot of the time in armored vehicles wearing bullet proof vests, yet the people holding up the PSNI as a model of better policing will say a heavily armed militarized police force is one of the key roots of the problem, its just contradictory

Yeah, the NYPD chief was saying it's a majority minority force..

Like, that picture of the white girl giving the black cop the finger over black lives matter.. the world's gone mad..

hetuzozaho

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Trump got to Church pretty fast on the back of people telling him what he did was a stunt at the White House church.


https://twitter.com/FLOTUS/status/1267929157654269955

That first pic has a real evil looking vibe! :pac:

Doctor Jimbob

hetuzozaho wrote: »

That first pic has a real evil looking vibe! :pac:

He looks like a child who's been dragged somewhere against their will.

Foxtrol

Melanchthon wrote: »

Thats a way to simplistic answer though, you see accusations and protests of racist policing and heavy handed actions in areas that have black police chiefs and a majority or significant proportion black officers.
The RUC was 1/2% Catholic, somewhere like Atlanta has loads of black police but they are lumped in together.

Putting a black man in charge isn't going to change culture bred in for generations.

These issues came more prominent at a time when Obama was in power, making a comparison to Northern Ireland just doesn't work on a million different levels, at least to some extent the Catholic community self-policed in the absence of legitimate authority, in the states you end up with Chicago and Baltimore having death rates higher than the troubles.

They became more prominent during the Obama due to him enforcing body cameras and people having phones with cameras. It is much easier for people to be outraged by what they see.

A PSNI style transformation might be beneficial but lets not pretend it will solve all the issues, the PSNI is genuinely pretty good, they are a militarized police force and have access to plastic bullets and machine guns and spend a lot of the time in armored vehicles wearing bullet proof vests, yet the people holding up the PSNI as a model of better policing will say a heavily armed militarized police force is one of the key roots of the problem, its just contradictory

They aren't perfect now but compare them to what they were a few decades ago.

Edit: to be clear you can see loads of shocking US police actions and some of them definitely need a lot more training but on the flip side not seen much practical stuff about reforming the huge amounts of different forces that operate in places with loads of guns

There are plenty of practical stuff that can be done that are common practice in most countries - independent oversight (not cops investigating cops), get rid of qualified immunity for police, set a federal level of reasonably force, banning choke holds, banning shooting into moving vehicles.

shaveAbullock

Protest in Dublin cancelled.
Not because of fear for public safety but because of fears of prosecution....
https://twitter.com/blmprotestdub/status/1268117690239143938