Cycling on paths and other cycling issues (updated title)

AndrewJRenko

ewc78 wrote: »

Pretty much sums up the attitude and the arrogance of some of the cycling cult on here.

Yes indeed - they're all out of step except you and Sean.

meeeeh

Stark wrote: »

This is getting ridiculous. "Women don't want to cycle because they don't want to be associated with people from the internet". Yeah right. They don't cycle because they feel unsafe on the roads and in many cases get harassed frequently when they're out on bikes. Issues that should be fixed.

I was never harassed on a bike in my life (I grew up somewhere else but I don't think attitude towards women is worse in Ireland.) I'm also not particularly frightened where I cycle however I did see some teenage girls cycling the other day and their skills were worse than my seven year olds. That can't be blamed on harassment but on lack of initiative to actually learn cycle properly. However I said they don't want to be associated with certain cycling groups not that they don't want to cycle.

Just to add I'm not excusing harassment which I find despicable and I was a victim of some serious stuff im my teens and twenties but I never thought that was good enough excuse not try or do something.

TaurenDruid

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Abusers? Does your definition of 'abuser' include 'people who present facts and evidence that challenge my own personal prejudice?

If this were facebook or whatsapp, this would be where I'd insert the gif of the guy seated on a plane, doing the massive eyeroll and facepalm.

While Spook_ie is perfectly capable of answering for themselves, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that Spook_ie is probably talking about the Twitter users who called the I.T. article author a ****?

TaurenDruid

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Here's a challenge - you count the cyclists on the footpath and I'll count the drivers with a phone illegally in their hand or on their lap.

Who do you think is going to top the poll?

Neither drivers and cyclists should use a phone while driving or cycling. This thread, however, is about cycling on footpaths, not whataboutery.

AndrewJRenko

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

To help me to get to that conclusion, can you please tell me how often you see cyclists cycling dangerously on the footpath, with dangerously being the key word here?

Because for me, that is a very rare scenario.

Whether you think cyclists shouldn't cycle dangerously on footpaths has nothing to do with how often I see this happen. The lengths you will go to avoid answering my question are extraordinary. There's no trick or threat in it. Cyclists. Should. Not. Cycle. Dangerously. On Footpaths.

Strictly, they shouldn't be cycling on footpaths at all, but I'm not addressing what is merely obnoxious behaviour.

That said, I have no problem answering your question.

I walk to and from work every day Mon - Fri (rain or shine). It's about 40 minutes, from the Dublin 9 area to the North Side of the Quays.

Between this and walking around the area in which I live, I'd say I experience or see an incident of a cyclist cycling at a speed on a footpath that risks injury to a pedestrian (and themselves probably) in the event of a collision about 2 or 3 times a week on average. Generally not in the city centre itself. Along the route.


I'm not counting cyclists who go through pedestrian lights that are against them when pedestrians are trying to cross with the lights in their favour.

I'm not counting young kids on bikes, and I'm not counting cyclists who cycle relatively slowly on footpaths, but if you don't get out their way they'll cycle into you.

magicbastarder

any particular hotspots for it?
(i'm curious if mobhi road features because the cycle lanes there are a mess. or phibsboro.)

AndrewJRenko

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Neither drivers and cyclists should use a phone while driving or cycling. This thread, however, is about cycling on footpaths, not whataboutery.

If you reckon that a post is off topic, you should report it to the moderators and let them decide.

magicbastarder

magicbastarder wrote: »

any particular hotspots for it?
(i'm curious if mobhi road features because the cycle lanes there are a mess. or phibsboro.)

I'm sorry but the above is as specific as I will be about my route.



Just to ask a question, if the state of a cycle lane in a busy urban area is so bad that people don't want to use them, why don't they just walk, including getting off and walking on the footpath where they are not happy to use the road?



The alternative to cycling on the road if you don't want to is not inevitably cycling on the footpath.

magicbastarder

ecoli3136 wrote: »

I'm sorry but the above is as specific as I will be about my route.

OK; not sure why; i live near DCU so the above would be (would have been?) my main route towards the city.

magicbastarder

ecoli3136 wrote: »

Just to ask a question, if the state of a cycle lane in a busy urban area is so bad that people don't want to use them, why don't they just walk, including getting off and walking on the footpath where they are not happy to use the road?

some of the footpaths are so narrow that walking a bike along it, if they're any way busy, could be a faff.

also, if the cycle lanes are so bad that the only alternative is walking, we're debating the wrong thing.

Stark

meeeeh wrote: »

I was never harassed on a bike in my life (I grew up somewhere else but I don't think attitude towards women is worse in Ireland.) I'm also not particularly frightened where I cycle however I did see some teenage girls cycling the other day and their skills were worse than my seven year olds. That can't be blamed on harassment but on lack of initiative to actually learn cycle properly. However I said they don't want to be associated with certain cycling groups not that they don't want to cycle.

Just to add I'm not excusing harassment which I find despicable and I was a victim of some serious stuff im my teens and twenties but I never thought that was good enough excuse not try or do something.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/harassment-adds-more-danger-for-women-cycling-in-dublin-1.4093485

A few stubborn people will plough through sure. But plenty will find dealing with **** regularly just too exhausting and will end up not bothering.

AndrewJRenko

TaurenDruid wrote: »

If this were facebook or whatsapp, this would be where I'd insert the gif of the guy seated on a plane, doing the massive eyeroll and facepalm.

While Spook_ie is perfectly capable of answering for themselves, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that Spook_ie is probably talking about the Twitter users who called the I.T. article author a ****?

Why did Spook_ie and you use the plural - users, abusers?

AndrewJRenko

ecoli3136 wrote: »

Whether you think cyclists shouldn't cycle dangerously on footpaths has nothing to do with how often I see this happen. The lengths you will go to avoid answering my question are extraordinary. There's no trick or threat in it. Cyclists. Should. Not. Cycle. Dangerously. On Footpaths.

Strictly, they shouldn't be cycling on footpaths at all, but I'm not addressing what is merely obnoxious behaviour.

That said, I have no problem answering your question.

I walk to and from work every day Mon - Fri (rain or shine). It's about 40 minutes, from the Dublin 9 area to the North Side of the Quays.

Between this and walking around the area in which I live, I'd say I experience or see an incident of a cyclist cycling at a speed on a footpath that risks injury to a pedestrian (and themselves probably) in the event of a collision about 2 or 3 times a week on average. Generally not in the city centre itself. Along the route.


I'm not counting cyclists who go through pedestrian lights that are against them when pedestrians are trying to cross with the lights in their favour.

I'm not counting young kids on bikes, and I'm not counting cyclists who cycle relatively slowly on footpaths, but if you don't get out their way they'll cycle into you.

Are you counting cyclists cycling with no pedestrians near them?

magicbastarder

magicbastarder wrote: »

some of the footpaths are so narrow that walking a bike along it, if they're any way busy, could be a faff.

also, if the cycle lanes are so bad that the only alternative is walking, we're debating the wrong thing.

Do you not see how odd that sounds? If the footpath is too narrow to walk a bike on it then how does that make it ok to cycle a bike on it?


I just don't know what you mean by faff. Inconvenience? Is that it? Inconvenient to walk so I must cycle instead? This is exactly what drives me nuts - people prioritising their own convenience against the world at large.



I'm talking about cyclists colliding with pedestrians on footpaths or creating the risk of a collision with pedestrians on footpaths.


Down the rabbit hole into narrow footpaths and inadequate cycle lanes we go.


Why can't cyclists, the majority of whom are probably responsible people, just accept that they should not cycle on footpaths?

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Are you counting cyclists cycling with no pedestrians near them?

No. You have to read my posts to understand them.

I'm out - this is surreal.

boardise

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

If you reckon that a post is off topic, you should report it to the moderators and let them decide.

Great to see you're a stickler for correct procedure Andy ol' chum.
We can assume you are similarly eager that cyclists obey correct procedure regarding illegal cycling on footpaths i.e they don't do it and they don't defend it being done. Progress at last. Welcome to the club of decent citizens who stand for properly regulated use of public roads and footpaths .
I thought you'd never come around but fair play to you -you've belatedly seen the light ...proper procedure is yer only man.

micar

ecoli3136 wrote: »

I walk to and from work every day Mon - Fri (rain or shine). It's about 40 minutes, from the Dublin 9 area to the North Side of the Quays.

magicbastarder wrote: »

any particular hotspots for it?
(i'm curious if mobhi road features because the cycle lanes there are a mess. or phibsboro.)

magicbastarder wrote: »

OK; not sure why; i live near DCU so the above would be (would have been?) my main route towards the city.

Well howdy neighbours .....

I live in D9 and beside DCU

Mobhi Road is a sh1t show for cycling both directions.

It's so bad that I do cycle on the footpath going uphill. The only time i cycle ever on the footpath.

@ecoli3136 ..... before you have a go at me for cycling up Mobhi Road on the footpath, borrow a bike and cycle up it a few times between 4.30pm and 6pm and see how you get on.

I'm sure you've walked up many times and know how wide the footpath is

Hurrache

I've been known to cycle on the footpath at times, such is the rebel I am when I seek to terrorise pedestrians.



Actually, no, it's when a pedestrian, or one of those damn joggers who prefers to run on tarmac, comes towards me on the dumb bike part, or I want to avoid a hole etc, and we all someone manage to pass each other without getting angry that we're on each others turf.

magicbastarder

ecoli3136 wrote: »

Do you not see how odd that sounds? If the footpath is too narrow to walk a bike on it then how does that make it ok to cycle a bike on it?

lest there be any confusion, i didn't excuse it. suggesting a reason is not the same as suggesting an excuse.

the reason is that someone walking alongside a bike will take up more space than cycling on it. i'm not saying that's safe.

AndrewJRenko

ecoli3136 wrote: »

No. You have to read my posts to understand them.

I read your post. It didn't say whether pedestrians were present or not.

07Lapierre

Hurrache wrote: »

I would always cycle on the road if that is the only "cycle lane" available.

Hurrache

I usually don't use them either, but there's one particular spot in which it's actually easier to use it rather than stay on the road during rush hour.

Staying on the road brings you to one of those giant roundabouts which has 3 lanes coming into it from 3 directions, and due to its size vehicles don't have to slow down too much to get around it. If you use the shared lane like that in the pic, it's on the other side of the road as you approach the roundabout, so you're facing oncoming traffic, and there's no roundabout exit or entrance on that size so you can skip right by the roundabout.

AndrewJRenko

boardise wrote: »

Great to see you're a stickler for correct procedure Andy ol' chum.
We can assume you are similarly eager that cyclists obey correct procedure regarding illegal cycling on footpaths i.e they don't do it and they don't defend it being done. Progress at last. Welcome to the club of decent citizens who stand for properly regulated use of public roads and footpaths .
I thought you'd never come around but fair play to you -you've belatedly seen the light ...proper procedure is yer only man.

You can assume whatever you like, but you know what they say about those who ASSume?

Anyway, what's your club policy on the drivers who kill close to one pedestrian each week on average?

Spook_ie

TaurenDruid wrote: »

If this were facebook or whatsapp, this would be where I'd insert the gif of the guy seated on a plane, doing the massive eyeroll and facepalm.

While Spook_ie is perfectly capable of answering for themselves, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that Spook_ie is probably talking about the Twitter users who called the I.T. article author a ****?

couldn'tfind one on an aeroplane this'll have to do

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Why did Spook_ie and you use the plural - users, abusers?

Because to my non paranoid mind this

Abuse
But then there was the abuse. I was called a c**t. I was told that I had “proven” that I was anticyclist by failing to condemn the behaviour of motorists (I did); that I wanted someone to hate and had decided to demonise cyclists; perhaps most ludicrously of all, that I was condoning child abuse.

Suggests multiple tweets likely from more than one twitter account.

DoraDelite

Stark wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/harassment-adds-more-danger-for-women-cycling-in-dublin-1.4093485

A few stubborn people will plough through sure. But plenty will find dealing with **** regularly just too exhausting and will end up not bothering.

I agree with Stark, it says a lot about our cycling infrastructure and attitudes to people cycling, particularly women and kids. Note a comparison in figures: https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2015/03/08/women-cycling-make-it-happen/

I am mainly a pedestrian around Dublin, walking most places for the last 15 years including to work and back. At no point have I ever felt endangered by cyclists on the footpath, from observing what passes as cycling infrastructure, I know the spots where cyclist will use a footpath as it's safer.

I have cycled occasionally over the past 10 years or so but decided since 2018 to cycle more of the 5-10k journeys that I would normally drive and since lockdown, I have not driven my car at all.

The biggest thing I have learned since doing this, is that cycling around Dublin in not for the faint of heart, the roads are full of aggressive bullies who are not afraid of using their cars/vans/buses as a weapon to intimidate and bully everyone else off the road. This, by and large is one of the main reasons women are afraid to cycle around the city, in fact one of the few places you'd see a woman on a bike is on the segregated S2S. I have seen more in recent weeks but I am hoping that they don't get bullied off the road as the summer goes on.

Just anecdotally, since lockdown, I decided to count all the incidents of harassment directed at me, I have made 3 reports to the Gardai for dangerous driving in Dublin. I also have counted 7 other incidents or deliberate endangerment/harassment but didn't get the registrations to report. Cyclists on footpaths are really not the problem.

And don't even get me started on cars driving on/parking on/blocking footpaths

AndrewJRenko

Spook_ie wrote: »

Because to my non paranoid mind this


Suggests multiple tweets likely from more than one twitter account.

Only one of those points is abuse though. The rest are just people who have a different opinion to Brian.

meeeeh

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Only one of those points is abuse though. The rest are just people who have a different opinion to Brian.

You consider someone accusing you of condoning child abuse a difference of opinion? If you were accused of something like that would it be a difference of opinion to you?

Do you think child abuse is something we can deal lightly with. But then again I'm not surprised.

Zebra3

Jaysus, child abuse is now in the thread. :rolleyes:

meeeeh

Zebra3 wrote: »

Jaysus, child abuse is now in the thread. :rolleyes:

It's not child abuse anymore It's different opinion.

AndrewJRenko

meeeeh wrote: »

You consider someone accusing you of condoning child abuse a difference of opinion? If you were accused of something like that would it be a difference of opinion to you?

Do you think child abuse is something we can deal lightly with. But then again I'm not surprised.

Well, yes. I'm not saying it is right. I'm not saying it is nice. I'm not saying that I agree with it.

But it doesn't seem to me to be abuse in itself.

meeeeh

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Well, yes. I'm not saying it is right. I'm not saying it is nice. I'm not saying that I agree with it.

But it doesn't seem to me to be abuse in itself.

I'd prefer to be called a cu*t. You can't throw that kind of allegation around lightly. Anyway what ever the accusation they won't win many people on your side.