Covid19 Part XVIII-25,473 in ROI(1,736 deaths) 5,760 in NI (551 deaths)(30/06)Read OP

stephenjmcd

Stheno wrote: »

Before anyone goes into ICU/ on a ventilator, doctors will assess if it is in the patients best interest is my understanding, and if it is not they will not be put on one

I know someone who was on a ventilator for 5 weeks and is now learning to walk again

Yeah that's it the patients are assessed, now some patients if they're older might have a DNR declared so they wouldn't be moved to ICU or go on a ventilator.

But it's an incredibly invasive thing to be on so if it's not in the patients best interests they wont do it.

eagle eye

Plumbthedepths wrote:

If you were driving on a busy road looking at people laying on the grass trying to work out how far apart they were you clearly were not paying attention to the road. You whether you like it or not were the danger in that setting. Driving without due care and attention is an offence under the law.

I was stopping quite a lot to let people finish crossing the road. As a result I got to identify those two groups, there was a lot more people there but I only got time to count those two groups.
You weren't there, you haven't a clue what it was like. Kinda like the way you have treated the whole covid-19 pandemic, imagining things that suit your ludicrous point of view and deciding you're right.

JoChervil

growleaves wrote: »

It's relevant to Brazil, which is in the Southern Hemisphere. Can you not make the distinction between the application of a fact to one part of a statement but not the other part of that statement without it being spelled out? Not here to spoon-feed people.

If it is relevant only to one country and situation is bad in both, so their hemispheres have nothing to do with it.



You removed your sentence about Iceland and my response was to this one, so again everything seems OK...

So how Iceland is relevant in this discussion then?

My pet hate is manipulation...

GazzaL

What a glorious bank holiday weekend! You couldn't ask for better weather to socialise outdoors with friends and family. The beautiful smell of barbecues will fill the air soon enough. I bought a Keeling's fruit platter this morning that's already been demolished, juicy strawberries, raspberries, blueberries, and grapes. Deliciously sweet in contrast to the salty tears of the pro lockdown doom mongers.

Ago1960

s1ippy wrote: »

Not to come off as a doom merchant but we don't tend to put people on them unless they're younger. I know two elderly people and a young woman with a disability who passed away with no ventilator intervention but one man in his 40s who recovered after being in a coma on one for two weeks.

It's good to know that people who think that they are God are making these decisions and that the decision is not based on need but on who these people choose to give a chance of surviving

Stheno

ACitizenErased wrote: »

One thing to note from the HSE updates is we seem to have an incredibly high ventilation survival rate. Apparently the average survival rate is 20%, yet we see ventilator numbers decreasing with no reported ICU deaths.

Here's what I was referencing earlier

Fully accepting the pitfalls that exist with international league tables, Dr Rory Dwyer, a critical care consultant at Beaumont Hospital, has, however, drawn other lessons from the numbers.

His analysis of raw figures from the Health Protection Surveillance Centre and figures from a UK audit indicate that 23 per cent of patients in Irish ICU wards died, compared to 46 per cent in the UK.

The median age is the same in both countries – 60 years. So were the same type of patients “equally sick”? Dr Dwyer looked at ventilator numbers. Again, the differences are stark: 33 per cent (Ireland) mortality to 58 per cent (UK).

Trying to explain the gap, Dwyer believes Irish ICU units were not overwhelmed, though some came close. “It was really because of lockdown, and everybody geared up and was able to cope with what arrived.”

It appears that we have had almost half the level of mortality for those on ventilators compared to the UK

From https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/making-sense-of-conflicting-data-around-covid-19-deaths-1.4265947

Plumbthedepths

eagle eye wrote: »

I was stopping quite a lot to let people finish crossing the road. As a result I got to identify those two groups, there was a lot more people there but I only got time to count those two groups.
You weren't there, you haven't a clue what it was like. Kinda like the way you have treated the whole covid-19 pandemic, imagining things that suit your ludicrous point of view and deciding you're right.

You seem incredibly risk averse, tbh it's not a healthy way to live.

ACitizenErased

Stheno wrote: »

Here's what I was referencing earlier



It appears that we have had almost half the level of mortality for those on ventilators compared to the UK

From https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/making-sense-of-conflicting-data-around-covid-19-deaths-1.4265947

Impressive, although have to take into account how doctors are choosing who to ventilate.

eagle eye

Plumbthedepths wrote:

You seem incredibly risk averse, tbh it's not a healthy way to live.

So funny how you change from calling me a dangerous driver in one post to overly cautious in the next.

Plumbthedepths

Ago1960 wrote: »

It's good to know that people who think that they are God are making these decisions and that the decision is not based on need but on who these people choose to give a chance of surviving

The medical profession makes decisions like this all the time.
Likely best outcome. It's a sensible use of resources and to what the quality of life maybe.

Cork Boy 53

KindOfIrish wrote: »

Congratulations Ireland! here come first political prisoners.https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0530/1143602-salthill-galway-altercation/

How the **** are a a group of scrotes in Salthill fighting among themselves and then obstructing gardai considered as political prisoners?

Plumbthedepths

eagle eye wrote: »

So funny how you change from calling me a dangerous driver in one post to overly cautious in the next.

I didn't call you a dangerous driver. You claimed you were driving very slowly on a busy road. You weren't at risk, the people on the road were at risk from your driving behaviour.I said you were driving without due care and attention. Yes from your previous comments you are overly risk adverse. It's not healthy that's my opinion.

eagle eye

Plumbthedepths wrote:

I didn't call you a dangerous driver. You claimed you were driving very slowly on a busy road. I said you were driving without due care and attention. Yes from your previous comments you are overly risk adverse. It's not healthy that's my opinion.

Your opinion is based off very little information. I go to the shop every week. I bring my dogs and kids for walks daily.
I'm careful because I don't want to contract a virus that kills people. I could be asymptomatic but my wife or kids might not be. Imagine if you were one of the unlucky people whose kid got very sick and died or had organ problems for the rest of their lives. Could you forgive yourself if you knew it was you who brought the virus home? I certainly couldn't.
My life is normally very active and will be again. What you call risk averse I call cautious and common sense.

I never said the road was busy with cars and what you quoted was me clarifying that and saying it was busy with people.

Away With The Fairies

s1ippy wrote: »

She had underlying conditions, my guess is that her quality of life was deemed to have not been high enough had she survived and she had no family to advocate for her. I don't know for sure. She died in March.

That's horrible.

KindOfIrish

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

How the **** are a a group of scrotes in Salthill fighting among themselves and then obstructing gardai considered as political prisoners?

Have you not been taught in school not to lie? Nobody has been fighting among themselves. Your fellow citizens, not group of "scrotes", have been enjoying their own land, then nazi police started enforcing rules imposed by unelected junta.

fritzelly

KindOfIrish wrote: »

Have you not been taught in school not to lie? Nobody has been fighting among themselves. Your fellow citizens, not group of "scrotes", have been enjoying their own land, then nazi police started enforcing rules imposed by unelected junta.

Hello Gemma

petes

KindOfIrish wrote: »

Have you not been taught in school not to lie? Nobody has been fighting among themselves. Your fellow citizens, not group of "scrotes", have been enjoying their own land, then nazi police started enforcing rules imposed by unelected junta.

What are you on about?

Cork Boy 53

petes wrote: »

What are you on about?

On the wacky baccy I`d say.

KindOfIrish

KindOfIrish wrote: »

Congratulations Ireland! here come first political prisoners.https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0530/1143602-salthill-galway-altercation/

Couple of pricks arrested for fighting are political prisoners.

Unfortunate evidence that home schooling is failing some people.

Cork Boy 53

KindOfIrish wrote: »

Have you not been taught in school not to lie? Nobody has been fighting among themselves. Your fellow citizens, not group of "scrotes", have been enjoying their own land, then nazi police started enforcing rules imposed by unelected junta.

The gardai should have cracked a few heads in Salthill last night. Might have knocked some sense into those drunken waster scrotes which is what they are.

KathleenGrant

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

That's horrible.

Scenarios like that were discussed from Italy and Spain. It is truly horrible.

Speak Now

GazzaL wrote: »

What a glorious bank holiday weekend! You couldn't ask for better weather to socialise outdoors with friends and family. The beautiful smell of barbecues will fill the air soon enough. I bought a Keeling's fruit platter this morning that's already been demolished, juicy strawberries, raspberries, blueberries, and grapes. Deliciously sweet in contrast to the salty tears of the pro lockdown doom mongers.

Bonus points for Keelings

Away With The Fairies

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

That's horrible.

Those who’s condition warrants ventilation may not always be ventilated, even when there is loads of capacity. and no coronavirus. Underlying conditions and quality of life will play into the decision. Long term ventilation is very tough on the body and when there is very little chance of survival or having any quality of life, the serious medical intervention may not be the best option for the patient. The best decision is often to make them as comfortable as possible and let them slip away. Death is not necessarily a bad thing and when there is no chance of survival in the long term with any quality of life, why prolong suffering.

ACitizenErased

Sweden reporting 0 deaths, weekend reporting me thinks

Clonmel1000

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Sweden reporting 0 deaths, weekend reporting me thinks

Or could be the dreaded 2nd 3rd 4th wave who knows.

ACitizenErased

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Sweden reporting 0 deaths, weekend reporting me thinks

Sweden is very low every Sunday

Rob A. Bank

A cautionary tale from Spain.

"A single birthday party has been linked to a sudden spike in coronavirus cases in a Spanish town, with every single person who attended the party having become infected with the virus.

A birthday party held in Lleida, Catalonia, resulted in all 20 people who attended becoming infected, the Telegraph newspaper reported, prompting Spanish health authorities to postpone the region's schedule for easing the lockdown.

The Lleida area subsequently saw the number of new cases rise from 45 between May 7 and May 13, to 142 between May 14 and 21."

https://www.businessinsider.com/birthday-party-in-spain-linked-to-outbreak-of-coronavirus-cases-2020-5?r=US&IR=T

Rob A. Bank

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

A cautionary tale from Spain.

"A single birthday party has been linked to a sudden spike in coronavirus cases in a Spanish town, with every single person who attended the party having become infected with the virus.

A birthday party held in Lleida, Catalonia, resulted in all 20 people who attended becoming infected, the Telegraph newspaper reported, prompting Spanish health authorities to postpone the region's schedule for easing the lockdown.

The Lleida area subsequently saw the number of new cases rise from 45 between May 7 and May 13, to 142 between May 14 and 21."

https://www.businessinsider.com/birthday-party-in-spain-linked-to-outbreak-of-coronavirus-cases-2020-5?r=US&IR=T

Try posting that in the restrictions thread, they'll love you for it. Amazing how they ignore Portugal when talking about countries reopening.

bb1234567

Sweden reports almost no deaths every weekend. Deaths are stable at about 400 per week , quite high but not growing much

An Ciarraioch

Portugal where masks are mandatory on public transport and in shops?