Covid19 Part XVIII-25,473 in ROI(1,736 deaths) 5,760 in NI (551 deaths)(30/06)Read OP

gmisk

Mwengwe wrote: »

why don't you just marry him...

Joe Rogan for hypochondriacs

Hypojohndriacs

Look he makes some decent points but he is not qualified to be spouting the stuff he is.
He should stick to videos about washing hands.
He is not a virologist he is not a relevant Dr.

Boggles

ACitizenErased wrote: »

And if it’s 1 fella he has resulted in a cluster of 6 and possibly even more. Superspreaders have to be stopped.

How do you differentiate between a super spreader and a non spreader before they become either?

The only way to help prevent it, is mandatory quarantine or cut off the island.

We are going down the blind whack a mole model. Which won't work for obvious reasons.

LiquidZeb

Boggles wrote: »

We have had several cases from overseas travel.

What am I missing here, why is the Iraqi fella being singled out?

Because the anti immigrant crowd now have the chance to get the torch and pitchfork out and disguise their rhetoric as public health concern.

polesheep

ACitizenErased wrote: »

I said it here yesterday and I’ll say it again. The numbers are there to back it up - this virus is predominantly affecting the Dublin region. The CMO acts as if the country’s ****ed when over 2/3rds of the cases since Thursday are from 3 counties (Dublin, Kildare, Wicklow). A bit of context would be helpful.

Context is key. The area of Chapelizod in Dublin has a shockingly high level of cases and deaths from Covid19, considering that it has a population of around 3,000. Yet when you drill down into it and take note of the fact that it has three nursing homes (including Saint Mary's in the Park) and a number of care homes, the figures take on a new meaning.

Mwengwe

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

I think they are implying that they’ve been cutting hair on the QT but nobody is gonna admit to getting them to cut their hair so for now, I’d take it they haven’t been.

The post doesn’t say when his brother got back. What I’ve heard is a child in the family cane down with what they thought was a chest infection, tested positive and then 20 contacts tested resulting in 6 confirmed.

Last Friday the barbers posted they were opening Monday. Then they post they won’t be opening. TI know the location, it’s a small area approx 15-20ft x approx 8ft in an arcade with the exit to Tesco right beside it. I don’t know if they’ve been in there doing work to get the place ready for opening.

It’s months since I went to Tesco but I had to queue alongside this shop as the Tesco entrance was further down. Dunno if all that’s changed with shops in arcade reopening.

It's still the same system. There's been no activity in the barbers that I've seen. I see no reason why the system would change. I doubt you'd be at risk from queueing beside the barbers for half a minute even if there were infected people in there, it's not quite that infectious.

ACitizenErased

polesheep wrote: »

Context is key. The area of Chapelizod in Dublin has a shockingly high level of cases and deaths from Covid19, considering that it has a population of around 3,000. Yet when you drill down into it and take note of the fact that it has three nursing homes (including Saint Mary's in the Park) and a number of care homes, the figures take on a new meaning.

They need to make this information public, people need to know where the cases are coming from.

LiquidZeb

LiquidZeb wrote: »

Because the anti immigrant crowd now have the chance to get the torch and pitchfork out and disguise their rhetoric as public health concern.

It’s a very successful barbers. Always busy and they’re good at what they do. It wouldn’t be so successful if everyone is anti immigrant as you love to spout. Wind your neck in.

But Sligo is a small town and everyone does know everyone so if people say they were spotted out and about and then it turns out that 6 of their immediate cluster are now infected, you can see why others are worried that may have been in contact with them too.

Mwengwe

Boggles wrote: »

They had a case on the 17th of this month.

Was there pitch forks for that person?

It was just one case, this is a cluster. It's a perfect storm of elements : the back-slapping 'we're doing so well in Sligo!' element, the 'back-street barbers' rumours that have been flying around since all hairdressers were closed, the contentious travel/quarantine debate, add a dash of racism, loads of angry people cooped up in lockdown twitching their curtains and spreading rumours...

One colourful detail added to the rumours was that when they were in the hospital they were mocking/making fun of the nurses wearing PPE gear. Does anyone really believe that to be true? And who would have witnessed it if it were true? People are morons.

polesheep

ACitizenErased wrote: »

They need to make this information public, people need to know where the cases are coming from.

There is a lot of information that should be made public, but when you do that it becomes more difficult to control the narrative.;)

LiquidZeb

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

It’s a very successful barbers. Always busy and they’re good at what they do. It wouldn’t be so successful if everyone is anti immigrant as you love to spout. Wind your neck in.

But Sligo is a small town and everyone does know everyone so if people say they were spotted out and about and then it turns out that 6 of their immediate cluster are now infected, you can see why others are worried that may have been in contact with them too.

I'll keep my neck wound out thanks very much. What I'm saying is that you'll have the usual crew of anti immigration posters making hay while the Suns shining. It wasnt meant as an insult against Sligo so calm down.

Drumpot

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Perhaps nonsense was harsh, but he does seem to have a very negative outlook on the whole thing.

None of that makes him an expert on Covid 19. That's not me having a go at his education or what he's done in life in general. What exactly about his education and work history makes him an expert on Covid? Medicine is a very broad field.

I'm not going to post a link to my qualifications for obvious reasons but I'm educated to M.Sc. level in a biology subject. One thing I've learned is that despite being well educated in the area I know next to nothing about topics that from an outside glance would seem closely related to my field of study.

You're making plenty of personal attacks yourself there.

What exactly is positive about the pandemic ? Is this your issue with him, that he’s not always positive about the outlook? If you watched his videos you would know there are actually positive ones when the news is positive. Why should he paint bad news as good and why does it matter if it’s mostly fact based information with a bit of his own sentiments?

He’s stating facts, reporting where these facts (and sources) come from and giving people the chance to objectively assess the information themselves. Have you assessed what he said or is it that you just don’t like how he says it?

And yes, I’m attacking people in general for lack of capacity for critical thinking. A lot of are People focusing on how they feel about information, how it’s presented and more on how it suits them, then actually Critically looking at the information.

I’m sorry but Dr John is very educated and informed on the topic, unless you can actually state why he’s a bad source for information I will take it that for whatever reason you just don’t like him. That seems to be the case with people in here, they don’t like him because they don’t like him, nothing to do with his competency on the subject.

Mwengwe

Mwengwe wrote: »

It's still the same system. There's been no activity in the barbers that I've seen. I see no reason why the system would change. I doubt you'd be at risk from queueing beside the barbers for half a minute even if there were infected people in there, it's not quite that infectious.

Oh I know, I get that.

Drumpot

gmisk wrote: »

Hypojohndriacs

Look he makes some decent points but he is not qualified to be spouting the stuff he is.
He should stick to videos about washing hands.
He is not a virologist he is not a relevant Dr.

So nobody really can say why he’s a bad source, just that he’s not a virologist and can be quite negative about a global pandemic? I didn’t realise that everybody on here got all their information directly from scientists at the frontline of researching The virus.

Doctor Jimbob

Drumpot wrote: »

What exactly is positive about the pandemic ? Is this your issue with him, that he’s not always positive about the outlook? If you watched his videos you would know there are actually positive ones when the news is positive. Why should he paint bad news as good and why does it matter if it’s mostly fact based information with a bit of his own sentiments?

I've tried watching his videos and found them to be rambling with vague ominous warnings tossed in through the facts. I'm not saying he should report bad news as good, I'm saying the language he uses is often more negative than is necessary. It matters because his own sentiment often seems to be on the scaremongering side, and mixing that in with facts is misleading.

He’s stating facts, reporting where these facts (and sources) come from and giving people the chance to objectively assess the information themselves. Have you assessed what he said or is it that you just don’t like how he says it?

A big part of the issue is how he says it, yes. The language used in communication is important. The fact he mixes facts in with his fearmongering is irrelevant.

And yes, I’m attacking people in general for lack of capacity for critical thinking. A lot of are People focusing on how they feel about information, how it’s presented and more on how it suits them, then actually Critically looking at the information.

Ah yes, the old "everyone who disagrees me isn't thinking critically". Have you considered you might be guilty of the same thing as you're accusing others here.

I’m sorry but Dr John is very educated and informed on the topic, unless you can actually state why he’s a bad source for information I will take it that for whatever reason you just don’t like him. That seems to be the case with people in here, they don’t like him because they don’t like him, nothing to do with his competency on the subject.

I've stated why I think he's a bad source for information. If you don't want to agree that's fair enough but there's no need for the constant claims that anyone who disagrees with the man is either thick or just doesn't like him.

You've yet to show any evidence of him being an expert on the virus, I'd suggest that if he actually was he might be involved in the response rather than making videos on YouTube.

caveat emptor

Mwengwe wrote: »

It was just one case, this is a cluster. It's a perfect storm of elements : the back-slapping 'we're doing so well in Sligo!' element, the 'back-street barbers' rumours that have been flying around since all hairdressers were closed, the contentious travel/quarantine debate, add a dash of racism, loads of angry people cooped up in lockdown twitching their curtains and spreading rumours...

One colourful detail added to the rumours was that when they were in the hospital they were mocking/making fun of the nurses wearing PPE gear. Does anyone really believe that to be true? And who would have witnessed it if it were true? People are morons.

Yeah good points. Also find it interesting that they were saying they came from Belfast. As in no cases could possibly arrive from the far larger airport with far more flights and connections.

Propaganda is real people. Would be interesting to see what route they took from Iraq.

Statistically it was probably via London. Will they be tracing people on the flight. I bet no.

Also allows the aviation industry then to say "There is no evidence that anyone got it on a flight".
Have manifests ever been requested followed up on?

gmisk

Drumpot wrote: »

So nobody really can say why he’s a bad source, just that he’s not a virologist and can be quite negative about a global pandemic? I didn’t realise that everybody on here got all their information directly from scientists at the frontline of researching The virus.

He is a source for some....but as you admit he is not qualified in that area or even in a related area..... So I would be taking his predictions with a pinch of salt.
I am not saying all his information is bad.
My mum for example is a nurse with 30+ years but she isn't on YouTube proclaiming to be clued in with regards predictions related to a global pandemic.
Imo he should stick to the areas he knows, hand washing etc.

Drumpot

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

I've tried watching his videos and found them to be rambling with vague ominous warnings tossed in through the facts. I'm not saying he should report bad news as good, I'm saying the language he uses is often more negative than is necessary. It matters because his own sentiment often seems to be on the scaremongering side, and mixing that in with facts is misleading.
A big part of the issue is how he says it, yes. The language used in communication is important. The fact he mixes facts in with his fearmongering is irrelevant.


Ah yes, the old "everyone who disagrees me isn't thinking critically". Have you considered you might be guilty of the same thing as you're accusing others here.



I've stated why I think he's a bad source for information. If you don't want to agree that's fair enough but there's no need for the constant claims that anyone who disagrees with the man is either thick or just doesn't like him.

You've yet to show any evidence of him being an expert on the virus, I'd suggest that if he actually was he might be involved in the response rather than making videos on YouTube.

I’m not the one questioning his credentials, you are and yet you haven’t offered anything significant as a rebuttal. Just you don’t like how he communicates information, that’s literally it.

Regarding critical thinking I always question/doubt myself but I can’t change what I think without some logical reasoning, none of which you have provided. You have now Spent several posts just saying you don’t like how he says things, that’s the nub of your reasoning behind disliking him, you haven’t actually elaborated on anything beyond that.

What fearmongering examples are you talking about? Some people take facts as fearmongering so that statement means different things to different people.

ACitizenErased

The Irish Travel Agents Association is calling for the government to formally cancel flights abroad so people can get refunds. It seems as if people are actually being forced to go on holiday by the airlines.

Drumpot

gmisk wrote: »

He is a source for some....but as you admit he is not qualified in that area or even in a related area..... So I would be taking his predictions with a pinch of salt.
I am not saying all his information is bad.
My mum for example is a nurse with 30+ years but she isn't on YouTube proclaiming to be clued in with regards predictions related to a global pandemic.
Imo he should stick to the areas he knows, hand washing etc.

So when you go into a hospital , If it’s not a virologist treating you, you won’t let them take care of you? Most people in medicine are not virologists, what is your point?

He’s a qualified doctor giving out practical advice , discussing quite technical stuff to a wider audience and has been extremely helpful to me and many others. If you have a problem with his information and feel it’s innacurate, please do share the Actual information he has supplied that is an issue.

I watch him and medcram for updates, both of which are complimentary and they quite often overlap. You eventually see stuff he’s said weeks afterwards in the papers or mainstream media or from government. This is a consistant pattern I can attest to. And as I said he corrects himself when he’s wrong, he’s not infallible anymore then the way western democracy’s have managed the crisis. But he’s quick to correct himself which is a quality that most information outlets are very slow or reluctant to do. He is a far superior source of information then the majority of sources used by the masses which is usually news media outlets or papers.

Doctor Jimbob

Drumpot wrote: »

I’m not the one questioning his credentials, you are and yet you haven’t offered anything significant as a rebuttal. Just you don’t like how he communicates information, that’s literally it.

Regarding critical thinking I always question/doubt myself but I can’t change what I think without some logical reasoning, none of which you have provided. You have now Spent several posts just saying you don’t like how he says things, that’s the nub of your reasoning behind disliking him, you haven’t actually elaborated on anything beyond that.

What fearmongering examples are you talking about? Some people take facts as fearmongering so that statement means different things to different people.

He literally isn't qualified on viruses. What more of a rebuttal do you want? Even virologist can't seem to agree on the virusbyet we're supposed to take the opinion of someone qualified in a totally different branch of medicine as fact according to some on here. And yes, despite your constant attempts to play down the importance of how things are communicated, I think that's very important.

You're not applying critical thinking at all, you're taking the opinion of someone as fact. You've spent several posts saying he's qualified in the area despite the fact he isn't.

The fearmongering is in the language he uses, as I said. He's always very worried, very concerned, talking in a very grave voice. The method of communication matters. In the video posted earlier he's critocising Ireland's approach - despite the fact out approach is on the recommendation of public health experts here. What gives his opinion more weight than theirs?

Arghus

Jackman25 wrote: »

Truly pathetic. Any excuse to have a go at the restrictions thread.
Must be killing you seeing people out eating and drinking enjoying themselves today.
At least have the courage to go on the actual thread and have your snipe, but of course it just got too much for you (coincident with the numbers of cases tumbling and earlier easing of restrictions)

The thread was set up to call for an earlier easing of restrictions and that is what happened so just deal with it instead of lurking in the shadows waiting for any little chance to have a snipe.

I agree, it did get too much for me: there's only so much idiocy I can read.

It's largely pointless posting in that thread.

No, it isn't killing me to see people out and about.

gmisk

Drumpot wrote: »

So when you go into a hospital , If it’s not a virologist treating you, you won’t let them take care of you? Most people in medicine are not virologists, what is your point?

He’s a qualified doctor giving out practical advice , discussing quite technical stuff to a wider audience and has been extremely helpful to me and many others. If you have a problem with his information and feel it’s innacurate, please do share the Actual information he has supplied that is an issue.

I watch him and medcram for updates, both of which are complimentary and they quite often overlap. You eventually see stuff he’s said weeks afterwards in the papers or mainstream media or from government. This is a consistant pattern I can attest to. And as I said he corrects himself when he’s wrong, he’s not infallible anymore then the way western democracy’s have managed the crisis. But he’s quick to correct himself. He is a far superior source of information then the majority of sources used by the masses which is usually news media outlets or papers.

The hospital visit analogy is a nonsense, embarrassing in fact.

He isn't qualified to give most of the opinions and predictions he is giving as simple as that. What exactly is his Dr in? Training of nurses online learning? Or something similar?

Drumpot

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

He literally isn't qualified on viruses. What more of a rebuttal do you want? Even virologist can't seem to agree on the virusbyet we're supposed to take the opinion of someone qualified in a totally different branch of medicine as fact according to some on here. And yes, despite your constant attempts to play down the importance of how things are communicated, I think that's very important.

You're not applying critical thinking at all, you're taking the opinion of someone as fact. You've spent several posts saying he's qualified in the area despite the fact he isn't.

The fearmongering is in the language he uses, as I said. He's always very worried, very concerned, talking in a very grave voice. The method of communication matters. In the video posted earlier he's critocising Ireland's approach - despite the fact out approach is on the recommendation of public health experts here. What gives his opinion more weight than theirs?

He reads out information that are facts. He quotes the sources of these facts. What opinion am I stating as fact? You can watch his videos and not let how he feels about the information affect you. What has he said that is innacurate?

And again, fearmongering is a subjective and pejorative term to use, you haven’t qualified why it’s objectively fear mongering, probably because you can’t. It’s a statement of opinion, not fact

Drumpot

gmisk wrote: »

The hospital visit analogy is a nonsense, embarrassing in fact.

He isn't qualified to give most of the opinions and predictions he is giving as simple as that. What exactly is his Dr in? Training of nurses online learning? Or something similar?

So you don’t even know what his qualifications are but you are sure he hasn’t a clue about what he is talking about?

stephenjmcd

ACitizenErased wrote: »

The Irish Travel Agents Association is calling for the government to formally cancel flights abroad so people can get refunds. It seems as if people are actually being forced to go on holiday by the airlines.

If your flight is operating and accommodation open on the other end then yes you've no option to go or lose all the money, plain and simple. Europe is opening up to travel but of course we must be different.

And in same article you've also got this, I just don't know anymore what to say when I see quotes like this. Seal us off, we're different than everyone else in Europe clearly... today's independent, cancel holiday's as we're seeing the signs of a resurgence. Christ almighty this country needs to get a grip and quick. There's going to be spikes in areas, we aren't going to get to 0. The important thing is any spikes are manged correctly.

"Public health expert Dr Gabriel Scally told the same programme he did not think air bridges were the solution and that there was in fact no real solution other than to “get rid of the virus in Ireland”.

bb1234567

Were the people Iraqi or Irish soldiers travelling back from Iraq?

DebDynamite

LiquidZeb wrote: »

I'll keep my neck wound out thanks very much. What I'm saying is that you'll have the usual crew of anti immigration posters making hay while the Suns shining. It wasnt meant as an insult against Sligo so calm down.

Why are you making is about race? Like the case of the two New Zealand women who tested positive coming from Britain to see a dying relative, some cases become public knowledge. New Zealander’s were pretty annoyed about those cases, however you can’t claim racism there. People have every right to be annoyed when cases are imported where there’s no evidence of the advised 14 day quarantine, regardless if they came from an Irish citizen or not

MY BAD

bb1234567 wrote: »

Were the people Iraqi or Irish soldiers travelling back from Iraq?

In the Sligo case its because the barbers that they work in was due to reopen

tom1ie

It’s great to see economic activity coming back it’s needed. However I am in mount joy square at the minute bringing a family member to an essential hospital appointment and I can tell you now, SD has all but disappeared, mask wearing is in the low 10-15% of people.
It’s fairly obvious we will see an increase in numbers.
If they lock down dublin for 14 days how the hell is that gonna be enforced?
They cant even make people wear masks on busses at the minute!
I hope it doesn’t end up as bad as Florida or anywhere like that.

Gruffalux

MY BAD wrote: »

In the Sligo case its because the barbers that they work in was due to reopen

The lads in that barber shop in Sligo are lovely fellas. It is very popular. Sorry to hear they are sick. People don't speak much of the unconscious stigma that attaches to covid 19. As one of my siblings said recently I would certainly keep it on the downlow if I caught it. These lads just happen to be identifiable which is tough for them. Anyway I don't know if there is anything scandalous otherwise attached yo the matter as I just dropped in.