How long before Irish reunification? (Part 2) Threadbans in OP

Fionn1952

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

Nothing. It’s up to you to compromise. I’m not the one that wants a United Ireland.

A perfect summation of why the Union is destined to fail eventually.

You have as much responsibility to convince people of the benefits of the Union in the long term as any Republican has to convince people of the benefits of Unification. All too often, those who support continued partition totally fail to realise this and continue plodding along with nothing but presuming things will always stay the same.

maccored

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

You know I wouldn’t put it past the EU to have a United Ireland as a long term own goal. A lot of external parties seem to have a vested interest in it happening.

And don’t want to engage with Unionist people (not just the DUP)

spoken like a true unionist. paranoid much?

FrancieBrady

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

And the likes of Allison Morris isn’t a Nationalist equivalent?

Had to google her. She doesn't feature much here r I would have heard of her. I don't know if she is or isn't.

Any comment on Lowry or are we gonna have to look over there?

Nqp15hhu

Fionn1952 wrote: »

A perfect summation of why the Union is destined to fail eventually.

You have as much responsibility to convince people of the benefits of the Union in the long term as any Republican has to convince people of the benefits of Unification. All too often, those who support continued partition totally fail to realise this and continue plodding along with nothing but presuming things will always stay the same.

I don’t have any responsibility for anything. I am not a politician. I am not calling for Constitutional change.

Fionn1952

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

I don’t have any responsibility for anything. I am not a politician. I am not calling for Constitutional change.

What Constitution?

FrancieBrady

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

You know I wouldn’t put it past the EU to have a United Ireland as a long term own goal. A lot of external parties seem to have a vested interest in it happening.

And don’t want to engage with Unionist people (not just the DUP)

It now suits the EU and the British to have a UI. The British might never say it out loud but the fact is, it is a millstone around their necks. The more Unionists agitate the more that is the case.

FrancieBrady

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

Nothing. It’s up to you to compromise. I’m not the one that wants a United Ireland.

Wasn't hard to out you. :D

Decent Unionists have nothing to fear, some of the best people I know are Unionists.
Belligerent Unionists will need to pull the horns in a bit more than they have had to and finally realise that the British are not their friends and are not to be trusted.

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You have to wonder why Ben Lowry is allowed on the airwaves pretending to be a newspaper editor, he is an out and out Unionist spokesman...about as neutral a voice as Paisley was.

No issue with him being a Unionist and expressing his opinion, I just think it undermines the press and media.

Because he disagrees with you?

Natterjack from Kerry

FrancieBrady wrote: »

oh Rob, have you sunk this low? There isn't a single Republican voice that has said that.
If you disagree, gwan and link to one saying it.

It depends on whether you consider Sinn Fein a republican voice. Most do.
In Sinn Fein's latest published document on the topic :

https://www.sinnfein.ie/files/2020/Economic_Benefits_of_a_United_Ireland.pdf

It explicitly proposes how the EU would contribute :

"Direct support from the EU could come in the form of a bespoke funding mechanism designed to
stabilise the process of reunification, however gradual this process may be. PEACE funding represents
an already existing and very material example of such a fund, which has supported the peace process
through investment in the North and the surrounding border area in the South.
EU funding can be divided between social and reconciliation funding, and direct capital investment to
improve economic integration and coordination across the island, but particularly in the ‘peripheral’
border area."

downcow

Fionn1952 wrote: »

Imagine mismanaging a place SO badly that it costs a few billion a year to subsidise and then boasting about it, and criticising the people who suggest an entire economic reform, with investment to get the place self sufficient.....all the while lying to misrepresent what those people have suggested.

Honestly, if the best Unionism has to offer is, 'we f*cked it so bad you can't afford it', that isn't the super selling point you think it is.

Did you not need rescued by the Eu? I seem to remember visiting your big country when you had to dodge massive potholes, queue at every village, and zero chance of ever finding a phone box working. And that was the main road to Dublin

BonnieSituation

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

I am referring to the Irish Government’s and the Irish people’s attitude towards the United Kingdom.

And what is this attitude of which you speak?

What are we doing wrong? Tell us how to bend the knee please.

I'm assuming you're one of those post-Nationalist Partitionist types who think it's a sign of maturity to blindly agree with any old shíte that Unionism comes out with.

BonnieSituation

Natterjack from Kerry wrote: »

Possibly not, at this stage. The weakness of much republican thinking is that it is no more sophisticated than - we're the good guys, they're the bad guys. Genuinely considering the matter with some smattering of intelligent analysis as you are asking for, is not really in their comprehension.

Tell us all about the strength of Unionist thinking please?

downcow

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Had to google her. She doesn't feature much here r I would have heard of her. I don't know if she is or isn't.

Any comment on Lowry or are we gonna have to look over there?

So if you are saying Ben Lowry does feature greatly over there, then that’s great news. Good on you Ben, keep the work up bringing balance to that partisan place

RobMc59

FrancieBrady wrote: »

oh Rob, have you sunk this low? There isn't a single Republican voice that has said that.
If you disagree, gwan and link to one saying it.

Francie,you are the main culprit for this,if anyone doubts that they only have to look back through various threads associated with this subject.You`re constantly banging on about a UI with no credible plan of the financial side of such an undertaking.You and your fellow disgruntled republicans then become very indignant when this is pointed out.
Whether it`s popular amongst republicans,the cost of a UI will be a very important consideration.The `sure,it`ll be grand regardless`is a fantasy.

Fionn1952

downcow wrote: »

Did you not need rescued by the Eu? I seem to remember visiting your big country when you had to dodge massive potholes, queue at every village, and zero chance of ever finding a phone box working. And that was the main road to Dublin

....did you forget I'm from the North again, Downcow?

Either way, if you think that pointing out how much Ireland has improved somehow helps your point, you're sadly mistaken.

I didn't know phone boxes were such a significant factor in your wish to remain part of the United Kingdom though.

Natterjack from Kerry

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Tell us all about the strength of Unionist thinking please?

You could have put that in the more conventional non answer dodge format "Whatabout the strength of Unionist thinking ?".

BonnieSituation

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

I didn’t refer to the EU. I was talking about simple things such as:

- Having GMT +1 as the standard timezone.
- Using Euros.
- Not joining any wars.

I would think there would be even more divergence on things like Plug types, LHD vehicles if NI did not exist.

By the way, nobody rejected any deal. We in Northern Ireland didn’t get to vote on any of these deals.

That’s what irks me so much when you have all these politicians coming out talking about the support it has.

Well these are all new ones on me.

We joined the Euro because we hate the Brits?

I'll leave the other 2 nonsensical statements alone.

FrancieBrady

downcow wrote: »

So if you are saying Ben Lowry does feature greatly over there, then that’s great news. Good on you Ben, keep the work up bringing balance to that partisan place

He's introduced as a newspaper editor and gives a staunch Unionist viewpoint. If your editors are like that, no wonder you have a certain tunnel vision.

BonnieSituation

Natterjack from Kerry wrote: »

You could have put that in the more conventional non answer dodge format "Whatabout the strength of Unionist thinking ?".

You posited it.

Fire away whenever you like. I'm all ears.

You seem to have such a glowing opinion of Unionism that it shouldn't take you long to come up with a response.

FrancieBrady

RobMc59 wrote: »

Francie,you are the main culprit for this,if anyone doubts that they only have to look back through various threads associated with this subject.You`re constantly banging on about a UI with no credible plan of the financial side of such an undertaking.You and your fellow disgruntled republicans then become very indignant when this is pointed out.
Whether it`s popular amongst republicans,the cost of a UI will be a very important consideration.The `sure,it`ll be grand regardless`is a fantasy.

Can you produce a single republican saying: 'The British, The EU or the US will pay for it'?

Those 3 will without a doubt contribute, but nobody, except you has suggested they would pay for it all.

So go on...for once, back it up.

Natterjack from Kerry

BonnieSituation wrote: »

You posited it.

Fire away whenever you like. I'm all ears.

You seem to have such a glowing opinion of Unionism that it shouldn't take you long to come up with a response.

I suggest you answer one question before we move on to new ones. If we all just asked but didnt answer questions, the discussion would go nowhere at all.

FrancieBrady

Fionn1952 wrote: »

....did you forget I'm from the North again, Downcow?

Either way, if you think that pointing out how much Ireland has improved somehow helps your point, you're sadly mistaken.

I didn't know phone boxes were such a significant factor in your wish to remain part of the United Kingdom though.

Phone boxes?

This is like the one about Sainsbury's sandwiches.

Gatling

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Can you produce a single republican saying: 'The British, The EU or the US will pay for it'?

Who else is going to pay ?

Natterjack from Kerry

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Can you produce a single republican saying: 'The British, The EU or the US will pay for it'?

Those 3 will without a doubt contribute, but nobody, except you has suggested they would pay for it all.

So go on...for once, back it up.

It depends on whether you consider Sinn Fein a republican voice. Most do.
In Sinn Fein's latest published document on the topic :

https://www.sinnfein.ie/files/2020/E...ed_Ireland.pdf

It explicitly proposes how the EU would contribute :

"Direct support from the EU could come in the form of a bespoke funding mechanism designed to
stabilise the process of reunification, however gradual this process may be. PEACE funding represents
an already existing and very material example of such a fund, which has supported the peace process
through investment in the North and the surrounding border area in the South.
EU funding can be divided between social and reconciliation funding, and direct capital investment to
improve economic integration and coordination across the island, but particularly in the ‘peripheral’
border area."

FrancieBrady

So I missed the debate (what to do with all this popcorn )
Seems it didn't even get into the main chamber, the SoS wasn't there never mind Boris and it didn't go well:

https://twitter.com/AlexKane221b/status/1363911989915959296

FrancieBrady

Gatling wrote: »

Who else is going to pay ?

The people of the island.

RobMc59

Gatling wrote: »

Who else is going to pay ?

Well..We`re constantly hearing how considerably richer you are in Ireland than us urchins in the UK..perhaps YOU should pay for it!

BonnieSituation

RobMc59 wrote: »

Francie,you are the main culprit for this,if anyone doubts that they only have to look back through various threads associated with this subject.You`re constantly banging on about a UI with no credible plan of the financial side of such an undertaking.You and your fellow disgruntled republicans then become very indignant when this is pointed out.
Whether it`s popular amongst republicans,the cost of a UI will be a very important consideration.The `sure,it`ll be grand regardless`is a fantasy.

You think the murder of children at a football match by their State security forces and their government by proxy was justifiable.

BonnieSituation

Natterjack from Kerry wrote: »

I suggest you answer one question before we move on to new ones. If we all just asked but didnt answer questions, the discussion would go nowhere at all.

You're the one on here making the case for the status quo and telling us all how wrong we are.

Mon...

FrancieBrady

RobMc59 wrote: »

Well..We`re constantly hearing how considerably richer you are in Ireland than us urchins in the UK..perhaps YOU should pay for it!

You aren't hearing that either Rob. What you are hearing is that the UK has some of the poorest regions in western Europe.
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/dec/10/number-of-europes-poorest-regions-in-uk-more-than-doubles