Madeleine McCann

TheW1zard

happyoutscan wrote: »

I hope not, the door was open.

Where does that leave Kates blowy curtains

Kidchameleon

Before all the shutter crap starts again... the intruder would have gone in and out the patio door. The shutter would have been opened as a contingency escape route in case one of the adults came back for an unexpected check.

TheW1zard

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Before all the shutter crap starts again... the intruder would have gone in and out the patio door. The shutter would have been opened as a contingency escape route in case one of the adults came back for an unexpected check.

Sounds unlikely IMO

Spanish Eyes

TheW1zard wrote: »

Where does that leave Kates blowy curtains

The answer is Blowing In The Wind.

We won't know much until the German investigators provide more information isn't that the case now?

Day Lewin

After they've dug up the first cellar and covered it over (after removing not much, apparently) there is a second cellar to be investigated.
A thrill a minute!

The lawyer for CB has said "They will find nothing"

And it crosses my mind that the police never actually said that the cache of porn and USB sticks found at a premises once used by CB was actually proven to be his....
At least I can't remember if they said it was definitely his. Though we do know that he video'd the rape and torment of the American woman.

Burying a cache of old contraband is something that any old pervert might do, I suppose.

limnam

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Before all the shutter crap starts again... the intruder would have gone in and out the patio door. The shutter would have been opened as a contingency escape route in case one of the adults came back for an unexpected check.

That wouldn't explain the Portuguese police picture showing the curtains pinned behind the bed though...

The opening of those types shutters would also be risky noise wise they make a racket no matter how slowly you do it...

Banana Republic.

All opinions are valid until proven otherwise.

happyoutscan

Banana Republic. wrote: »

All opinions are valid until proven otherwise.

Some opinions are stupid and shouldn't be put forward st this stage. You know the ones I'm on about.

Kidchameleon

Day Lewin wrote: »

And it crosses my mind that the police never actually said that the cache of porn and USB sticks found at a premises once used by CB was actually proven to be his....
At least I can't remember if they said it was definitely his.

There was lots of materiel involving him performing sex acts on himself, so the USB sticks found were definitely his. Also, they were found buried under his dog, on his own property. Doubt they were put there by a randomer.

Kidchameleon

limnam wrote: »

That wouldn't explain the Portuguese police picture showing the curtains pinned behind the bed though...

I'm not sure what you mean, the shutters are a few inches away from the curtains, they would not have come in contact with each other under any circumstance?

limnam wrote: »

The opening of those types shutters would also be risky noise wise they make a racket no matter how slowly you do it...

And yet, they were opened. Perhaps a seasoned burglar would have some tricks for opening such mechanisms quietly.

Day Lewin

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I'm not sure what you mean, the shutters are a few inches away from the curtains, they would not have come in contact with each other under any circumstance?




And yet, they were opened. Perhaps a seasoned burglar would have some tricks for opening such mechanisms quietly.

Might have just opened the shutters for a quick glance out, a look-around. To check there was nobody in the street.

Kidchameleon

Day Lewin wrote: »

Might have just opened the shutters for a quick glance out, a look-around. To check there was nobody in the street.

Absolutely. Also, could the child have been handed out to an accomplice? There are a million and one reasons why those shutters were opened.

happyoutscan

Shutters were opened an an escape route if needed. It would have made no sense in using this as an exit with the child when the door was a million miles easier as well as being more discreet.

Banana Republic.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/extra.ie/2020/08/02/news/world-news/madeleine-mccann-suspect-chrisitan-b-sleeping-girls/amp

The list is just getting longer The positive is that former friends are talking about him and that could lead to further evidence coming forward.

Day Lewin

Banana Republic. wrote: »

https://www.google.com/amp/s/extra.ie/2020/08/02/news/world-news/madeleine-mccann-suspect-chrisitan-b-sleeping-girls/amp

The list is just getting longer The positive is that former friends are talking about him and that could lead to further evidence coming forward.

Ugh, what a nasty beast. Should be locked up forever, or deleted.

Banana Republic.

Day Lewin wrote: »

Ugh, what a nasty beast. Should be locked up forever, or deleted.

See it’s a catch 22, needed alive to gain all the information he has about his crimes and needs to be deleted cause he’s not needed on this planet with his evilness.

buttercups88

Banana Republic. wrote: »

https://www.google.com/amp/s/extra.ie/2020/08/02/news/world-news/madeleine-mccann-suspect-chrisitan-b-sleeping-girls/amp

The list is just getting longer The positive is that former friends are talking about him and that could lead to further evidence coming forward.

So if he was breaking into apartments to do this and this is where his collection of kids swimsuits came from is this what he had planned to do but then saw his opportunity and snatched her

Day Lewin

buttercups88 wrote: »

So if he was breaking into apartments to do this and this is where his collection of kids swimsuits came from is this what he had planned to do but then saw his opportunity and snatched her

Actually, that sounds a quite possible scenario. Consistent with known facts.

Banana Republic.

buttercups88 wrote: »

So if he was breaking into apartments to do this and this is where his collection of kids swimsuits came from is this what he had planned to do but then saw his opportunity and snatched her

Absolutely it’s fitting within his profile and his online chatter and info from former friends have revealed so it was only a matter of time. If he did take her he’s the most famous abductor ever and isn’t that what they all want in their crazed minds one would think.

TheQuietBeatle

Banana Republic. wrote: »

Absolutely it’s fitting within his profile and his online chatter and info from former friends have revealed so it was only a matter of time. If he did take her he’s the most famous abductor ever and isn’t that what they all want in their crazed minds one would think.

Not necessarily, he might enjoy toying with the public and cops more. He thinks in his head they have nothing concrete to put him away.

Banana Republic.

TheQuietBeatle wrote: »

Not necessarily, he might enjoy toying with the public and cops more. He thinks in his head they have nothing concrete to put him away.

Maybe he knows in his head they have nothing on him and like you say he’s getting off his name being linked to it and actually being a suspect, I’m sure dirt like him always claim anything that’ll make them look great.

buttercups88

CB is having his appeal heard today in the EU Court of justice. He hopes to have his rape conviction thrown out because his extradition warrant was only for drug conviction and didn't mention the rape. The law is that a person can only be prosecuted for crimes listed on the warrant.
Would be a serious miscarriage of justice if he got off on that technicality

happyoutscan

If he gets off he will be a marked man. That won't be good considering the amount of info he has stored in that disturbed head of his.

LillySV

buttercups88 wrote: »

CB is having his appeal heard today in the EU Court of justice. He hopes to have his rape conviction thrown out because his extradition warrant was only for drug conviction and didn't mention the rape. The law is that a person can only be prosecuted for crimes listed on the warrant.
Would be a serious miscarriage of justice if he got off on that technicality

What I’d like to know who is funding the appeal and related costs... solicitors lawyers etc

LillySV

LillySV wrote: »

What I’d like to know who is funding the appeal and related costs... solicitors lawyers etc

The proceeds of crime?

JimmyVik

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I'm not sure what you mean, the shutters are a few inches away from the curtains, they would not have come in contact with each other under any circumstance?

And yet, they were opened. Perhaps a seasoned burglar would have some tricks for opening such mechanisms quietly.

Ive opened many of those types of shutters without a sound while on holidays.
And it wasnt to rob the place or kidnap someone, it was to stop the kids waking up.
Also ive heard people all over the place open them loudly. So much i didnt even bother looking out out. I just cursed them under my breath for making a racket.

political analyst

Brueckner's name and image are well-known throughout Europe and he has no good name to defend.

Why was German law designed to ban the revealing of the full names of adults accused of these crimes?

One would have thought that German authorities would have taken transparency a bit more seriously, given their country's recent history.

splinter65

LillySV wrote: »

What I’d like to know who is funding the appeal and related costs... solicitors lawyers etc

Every EU citizen is entitled to avail of the EU justice appeals system with no cost to themselves. I’m always staggered when people don’t know this.

Babooshka

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2020/aug/06/european-court-advises-madeleine-suspect-was-lawfully-tried-for

Good news, so far....hopefully the official judgement follows through.

LillySV

splinter65 wrote: »

Every EU citizen is entitled to avail of the EU justice appeals system with no cost to themselves. I’m always staggered when people don’t know this.

Can I avail of it to appeal penalty points so or would I have to kill someone for it ? Can I use it to appeal vrt too!?

splinter65

LillySV wrote: »

Can I avail of it to appeal penalty points so or would I have to kill someone for it ? Can I use it to appeal vrt too!?

No. It’s all explained here. In layman’s terms.
https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/legal_aid_and_advice/criminal_legal_aid.html

LillySV

splinter65 wrote: »

No. It’s all explained here. In layman’s terms.
https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/legal_aid_and_advice/criminal_legal_aid.html

Well in layman’s terms, not everyone is entitled to it like you said earlier

Sounds like it’s means assessed ...

splinter65

LillySV wrote: »

Well in layman’s terms, not everyone is entitled to it like you said earlier

Sounds like it’s means assessed ...

Yes. They look at your means and see if they think you can afford €100,000 + for a legal team to defend you against a charge which if your found guilty will result in a lengthy prison term for you. That means that for 99.9% of defendants they qualify for legal aid in those situations.
Me Bruekner like everyone else who is more or less a homeless vagrant living from hand to mouth would have fallen into that bracket and in order for justice to be done and to be seen to be done is entitled to pursue his appeal to Brussels.
I don’t know why you want to argue about this here.

LillySV

splinter65 wrote: »

Yes. They look at your means and see if they think you can afford €100,000 + for a legal team to defend you against a charge which if your found guilty will result in a lengthy prison term for you. That means that for 99.9% of defendants they qualify for legal aid in those situations.
Me Bruekner like everyone else who is more or less a homeless vagrant living from hand to mouth would have fallen into that bracket and in order for justice to be done and to be seen to be done is entitled to pursue his appeal to Brussels.
I don’t know why you want to argue about this here.

I’m not the one being condescending here.. anyways let’s back to the subject at hand , Madeline

LillySV

LillySV wrote: »

I’m not the one being condescending here.. anyways let’s back to the subject at hand , Madeline

He wasn't being condescending, you asked a question, Splinter gave you the answer.

LillySV

[Deleted User] wrote: »

He wasn't being condescending, you asked a question, Splinter gave you the answer.

Sound now let’s all make up and get back to topic!! Haha

splinter65

LillySV wrote: »

I’m not the one being condescending here.. anyways let’s back to the subject at hand , Madeline

I’m sorry if I came across as condescending.
My own opinion is that learning about democracy should be a compulsory subject in secondary school in particular our justice system as it’s one of the cornerstones and it always shocks me when people don’t know their rights and entitlements.
I know people are disgusted that barbarians like Bruekner can make use of the legal system in this way but you can’t say that justice was done if he hasn’t been allowed to drag this all the way to the end and still been proven to be guilty.

political analyst

happyoutscan wrote: »

If he gets off he will be a marked man. That won't be good considering the amount of info he has stored in that disturbed head of his.

Like he ever would disclose it(!)

political analyst

buttercups88 wrote: »

CB is having his appeal heard today in the EU Court of justice. He hopes to have his rape conviction thrown out because his extradition warrant was only for drug conviction and didn't mention the rape. The law is that a person can only be prosecuted for crimes listed on the warrant.
Would be a serious miscarriage of justice if he got off on that technicality

Why was this issue not raised during the original extradition proceedings?

joeguevara

political analyst wrote: »

Why was this issue not raised during the original extradition proceedings?

I don’t know the particulars of this case but have been involved in others where an Eu arrest warrant contained a charge that was used for the extradition proceedings but once in the jurisdiction, other charges were then brought. The time it should have been raised was in a pre trial application before the case started that he is currently incarcerated for.

Banana Republic.

An excellent read and how things should of went even to anyone not involved in the investigation and just looking in from the outside with minimal knowledge. Huge gaps were missed and the first things like house to house and known sex offenders questioned within the first 24/48 hrs would of been crucial in any normal investigation. It’s truly huge human error from the police force no matter how small they are, you ask for help if it is to far over your limit of numbers of officers to cover all that was needed to be done.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1319425/madeleine-mccann-suspect-british-police-german-investigation-praia-da-luz-portugal-spt/amp

political analyst

joeguevara wrote: »

I don’t know the particulars of this case but have been involved in others where an Eu arrest warrant contained a charge that was used for the extradition proceedings but once in the jurisdiction, other charges were then brought. The time it should have been raised was in a pre trial application before the case started that he is currently incarcerated for.

Maybe the authorities brought the other charges on the basis of evidence they had just discovered after the obstacles to extradition had been cleared.

joeguevara

political analyst wrote: »

Maybe the authorities brought the other charges on the basis of evidence they had just discovered after the obstacles to extradition had been cleared.

As I said I don’t know the particulars of the case but I have seen something happen like this previously.

Not me personally, but my second year master was involved in an arrest warrant case where it was argued by her (that the warrant was bogus and only being used to get the accused in the jurisdiction to charge him with something else. She won only because if the other charges were before the court the warrant would have been refused because ...well for particular reasons.

political analyst

joeguevara wrote: »

As I said I don’t know the particulars of the case but I have seen something happen like this previously.

Not me personally, but my second year master was involved in an arrest warrant case where it was argued by her (that the warrant was bogus and only being used to get the accused in the jurisdiction to charge him with something else. She won only because if the other charges were before the court the warrant would have been refused because ...well for particular reasons.

I know you don't know all the details of the Brueckner extradition but Germans are renowned for attention to detail. It would have to be an egregious case of human error on the German prosecutors' part if they didn't think to mention the rape charge in the extradition proceedings.

joeguevara

political analyst wrote: »

I know you don't know all the details of the Brueckner extradition but Germans are renowned for attention to detail. It would have to be an egregious case of human error on the German prosecutors' part if they didn't think to mention the rape charge in the extradition proceedings.

Hahah bit of a stereotype there but accept your preface. Interestingly it would not be the Germans who would be arguing the arrest warrant but the prosecution in the country he was in based on the information supplied by German police and maybe their DPP equivalent.

If it was done on purpose, one scenario was they didn’t want to alert him so he could arrange for evidence to be destroyed.,from reading the initial ecj advocates opinion, there is no breach to use a charge on good faith and to add charges once they have additional evidence. But honestly that’s only from skimming the information available.

2u2me

Mad that we can talk about the possible abduction from a suspect in Germany, but we can't talk about George floyd and the 4 cops charged with his murder because that topic has run it's course.

This boards has gone full insane.

Kidchameleon

2u2me wrote: »

Mad that we can talk about the possible abduction from a suspect in Germany, but we can't talk about George floyd and the 4 cops charged with his murder because that topic has run it's course.

This boards has gone full insane.

That topic running its course seemed to coincide with the release of the body cam footage. Pure coincidence in my honest opinion.

happyoutscan

political analyst wrote: »

Like he ever would disclose it(!)

Well he can't disclose it if he's dead.

MonkieSocks

On the European arrest warrants

First European arrest warrant

- On June 22, 2017, CB was handed over to Germany by the Tribunal de Relacao de Evora, Portugal (= arrest warrant for imprisonment imposed for child abuse).

In doing so, CB did not waive its compliance with the speciality principle. (= important!)

- He was in prison only until 31 August 2018.

- During his (child abuse) imprisonment, the Braunschweig Regional Court revoked the suspended sentence on probation from the Niebüll District Court's judgment of 6 October 2011 by order of 15 March 2018, legally effective since 21 June 2018 (= drug trafficking).

- (I quote from a court letter of 26.08.2019 concerning the speciality principle): “The accused was (...) informed that immediate subsequent execution due to the speciality principle was only possible on the basis

of a request for supplementation or the accused's waiver of the speciality. Since the accused objected to a subsequent execution and the Portuguese authorities had not yet waived the application of the speciality principle and had not agreed to the execution of the sentence despite a corresponding request by the Flensburg public prosecutor's office, the accused was released from prison on 31 August 2018.”

- No later than 19 days after his release, i.e. on 18 or 19 September 2018, CB travelled to the Netherlands and subsequently to Italy.

This means that between mid-June 2018 and the end of August 2018, Portugal had not replied to the inquiry from Germany and therefore CB had to be released from prison under German (European) law.

They had to let him go - and so it happened.


Second European arrest warrant

- Result: another European arrest warrant - issued on 26 September by the public prosecutor's office in Flensburg - and arrest on 27 September 2018 in Milan.

Important: When the warrant was declared by the Italian authorities, the accused agreed to his surrender, again without renouncing the speciality principle.

But as you can see: the German investigating authorities targeted him step by step. Within one day they had caught him. My friends and I assume that since 2016 they have had him on the hook "for bigger things".

In the background, the investigators are working much more intensively than the public realizes.

Back to our chronology: For those who thought until now that all this was complicated enough, the next chapter will make your head spin.

Third European arrest warrant

On October 5, 2018, the Braunschweig (Brunswick) District Court issued an arrest warrant against CB on "strong suspicion of serious rape with bodily harm and predatory extortion" (= the case of the 72-year-old American woman).

This made it possible to keep him in custody as long as Portugal did not come forward.

- From October 18, 2018, CB served the prison sentence from the drug trafficking conviction. However, in its decision of 13 March 2019, the Kiel Regional Court then stated, at the request of the defendant, "that the enforcement of the total custodial sentence from the Niebüll Local Court ruling of 6 October 2011 is currently inadmissible, as the execution would violate the speciality principle. (...) The interruption of the enforcement was ordered." (Quote as above court letter).

CB was from now on remanded in custody for the rape in Portugal, 2005.

- Subsequently, on 12 December 2018, the public prosecutor's office in Braunschweig issued a European arrest warrant (In my opinion, this was a formality to keep him on the hook) in order to be able to file charges for the rape of the American woman and at the same time made a supplementary request to the Italian authorities - in order not to come into conflict with the speciality principle.

The Court of Appeal in Milan, by decision of 22 March 2019, granted the extradition of the accused also for the prosecution of the above rape.

- The conditions for the trial for rape were thus fulfilled for the German justice system!

- Now, according to the legal opinion of the Brunswick judges, the trial could take place and lasted until December 2019, because for this charge they did not need a promise from Portugal and the Italian, which was necessary, they had.

- Finally, in spring 2020, the Portuguese authorities also approved the German application of mid-June 2018 to enforce the total prison sentence from the drug trafficking conviction - i.e. after more than one and a half years.

This means that since spring 2020 there are no restrictions whatsoever on measures taken by German courts against CB as a result of the speciality principle.

Christian's holiday trip

As you will remember, Germany had to release CB from custody on 31 August 2018 because the Portuguese authorities are taking a little longer to process important inquiries.

The delinquent used this opportunity to escape? No! Only we would think so.

But the German lawyers see it the same way, just a little more complicated:

With regard to the speciality protection from Portugal (the abolition of which was neglected as described above), the German federal judges are of the opinion: "The defendant lost the speciality protection by voluntarily going to the Netherlands and later to Italy at the latest 19 days after his release. (...)

Anyone who voluntarily leaves the Member State which accepts a restriction of his or her sovereign rights by the speciality protected surrender can no longer invoke this protection, irrespective of any return."

CB's argument and that of his star lawyers, on the other hand, is - and I will describe it in blunt manner: he did not "leave" Germany in the strict sense of the word, he just took a little holiday and would have come back.

splinter65

Kidchameleon wrote: »

That topic running its course seemed to coincide with the release of the body cam footage. Pure coincidence in my honest opinion.

What does the body cam footage demonstrate? I gather there’s no evidence of any racism ?