Allow me to explain why the 'All Live Matter' hashtag is awful.

Cupatae

Foxtrol wrote: »

Equality



Yes, no need for a town of 10,000 people and low crime rates to have a tank.



Yes, Ireland renamed towns and took down statues after we got independence.



Unfairly targeted and have been for generations.



Why in Ireland then are areas of poverty more likely to have higher crime rates? Why did Ireland move away from concil estates/blocks?



Depends what you mean. A person makes their own choices but when you live in poverty you have less options (just like in Ireland).



I may come across like that because I am. I don't think I was ever as bad as many on this thread but before I moved to the states I didn't see or understand what people deal with (and I don't still fully understand because I'll never walk in their shoes). I've also been on several peaceful protests and seen first hand how cops react.

This isn't the 1950s black people are right now = to everyone else and rightly so, this narrative of black people being slaughtered in the streets by am evil Police force is just nonsense there are incidents , and they are certainly far more highlighted than any other race but over all the police over there do a good job , a tough one and have alot more good police than bad. I don't see how they can be anymore equal than they already are.

I think this is the worst of the lot the defunding the police ... It's so stupid let's give the police less money and hope for a better police force I'd go the opposite to you I'd give the police force more money,

To

A) Give them more training / regular training

Allow for alot more stringent screening of potential officers

C) it's a violent nation with alot of guns you need them, imagine what it d be like without em...

Ireland and the us are two vastly different places, you can't pin committing well over half the voilent crime on poverty there's more to it than that. Especially for such a small portion of the population 13.5% and the women account for next to none of it.. u can figure the rest yourself.

So with those numbers in mind you can see how they will more than likely have more encounters with the police.

Cupatae

BarnardsLoop wrote: »

More instances of, in the US, more white people killed for being white than black people killed for being black?

Please, I can only take so much inane racism in one day, any more and I'll have to start charging by the minute.


Its not like 93% of prison inmates in the US are men. Guess they should start taking a hard look at all men, eh?

Please provide me with some numbers to back this and factual proof that these people were killed "because they were black"

Foxtrol

jackboy wrote: »

They have plenty of options in the US, much more so than the poor in Ireland. There are so many incredibly poor recent immigrants that do extremely well in the US with no supports. They do well because they work like dogs and spend all their money on their families.

The inter generational poor do not do well because of cultural reasons, not lack of options. They are brought up in and surrounded by a culture that keeps them down. That is why so few of them break out of where they were raised. The poor starved uneducated recent immigrants do better.

From that post you have no idea about the US.

The poor in Ireland live like kings compared to those in the US, when you look at benefits and the minimum wage for the working poor.

'Inter generational' is nonsense. Some people that went to segregated schools are only in their 50s nows. In some states people couldn't marry outside their races in the 1960s. Blatant racism was incredibly recent.

jackboy

Foxtrol wrote: »

From that post you have no idea about the US.

The poor in Ireland live like kings compared to those in the US, when you look at benefits and the minimum wage for the working poor.

'Inter generational' is nonsense. Some people that went to segregated schools are only in their 50s nows. In some states people couldn't marry outside their races in the 1960s. Blatant racism was incredibly recent.

There is unlimited work in the US for those who want to work. This is why so many recent immigrants thrive. A lot of the poor people in the US are absolutely not prepared to work like the recent immigrants. This is because of the culture they grew up in.

I’m talking about both the poor black and white Americans. Their mentality has been shaped by their culture. If they had the mentality of the recent immigrants, far more of them would thrive.

Foxtrol

Cupatae wrote: »

This isn't the 1950s black people are right now = to everyone else and rightly so, this narrative of black people being slaughtered in the streets by am evil Police force is just nonsense there are incidents , and they are certainly far more highlighted than any other race but over all the police over there do a good job , a tough one and have alot more good police than bad. I don't see how they can be anymore equal than they already are.

I disagree, significant elements of the police forces are poisoned and I can't describe anyone as a 'good cop' that turns a blind eye. Look at how 3 cops let MF be murdered in front of them, did nothing, and lied about it afterwards. Listen to the unions that are supposed to speak for cops. There is a systemic cultural problem that appears incapable of self reflection.

I think this is the worst of the lot the defunding the police ... It's so stupid let's give the police less money and hope for a better police force I'd go the opposite to you I'd give the police force more money,

To

A) Give them more training / regular training

Allow for alot more stringent screening of potential officers

C) it's a violent nation with alot of guns you need them, imagine what it d be like without em...

You have nurses wearing garbage bags, teachers buying their own supplies for kids, and then cops with enough military equipment to invade Iraq.

Your first 2 points cost little and though your 3rd point is accurate, local police forces don't need tanks.

Ireland and the us are two vastly different places, you can't pin committing well over half the voilent crime on poverty there's more to it than that. Especially for such a small portion of the population 13.5% and the women account for next to none of it.. u can figure the rest yourself.

So with those numbers in mind you can see how they will more than likely have more encounters with the police. [/QUOTE]

There is of course more to it, the ridiculous bail laws over there which lead to many poor people (which we have agreed black community are over represented) admitting to crimes they didn't commit as they can't afford bail or a good lawyer. Once people have a record it makes it incredibly difficult to get jobs or housing so you're pushed further to crime.

Then you have population of people who ended up in jail based on unfair drug and policing practices, which again leave them and their families limited options.

nullzero

TomTomTim wrote: »

.


Supposedly she got a promotion too.

What she did was incite hatred and increase racial tension in the UK.

Had a white person said the same thing about a group of people of a different colour they would have been sacked and rightly so.

These hate filled cretins need to be punished not praised for pushing their vile racist agendas.

Racism cuts in every direction, the sooner we realise that the better.

1800_Ladladlad

Foxtrol wrote: »

What are people even trying to prove by posting random acts of violence by citizens? What does it add to the discussion?

"Randomly attacks"

There's nothing to prove when there are facts that dismantle the claims of BLM. The videos illuminate the utter f*cking hypocrisy in the posts of those who vehemently stand behind and protect BLM like its a sanctified cult. It's one rule for us and another for the supremacist mob. Its to show black people are more than capable of assault and committing crime in the same way the cult seems to only portray whites as being the only race capable of committing. Its the use of aggressive silencing in their pursuit of societal change and guilt-tripping. People are angry and fed up.

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

Not hate speech: “White lives don’t matter.”

Foxtrol

jackboy wrote: »

There is unlimited work in the US for those who want to work. This is why so many recent immigrants thrive. A lot of the poor people in the US are absolutely not prepared to work like the recent immigrants. This is because of the culture they grew up in.

I’m talking about both the poor black and white Americans. Their mentality has been shaped by their culture. If they had the mentality of the recent immigrants, far more of them would thrive.

The culture they grew up in where they couldn't go to the same school as their white neighbour or the culture where they couldn't marry who they wanted?

Federal minimum wage in the US is 36% less than in Ireland and they don't get near the additional benefits.

I think you've been buying into too many tales of 'the American dream'. Sure there are examples of that happening but so are there examples of black families getting out of poverty. The difference for white and black families that make it out, one family will continue to be discriminated against.

Foxtrol

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

"Randomly attacks"

There's nothing to prove when there are facts that dismantle the claims of BLM. The videos illuminate the utter f*cking hypocrisy in the posts of those who vehemently stand behind and protect BLM like its a sanctified cult. It's one rule for us and another for the supremacist mob. Its to show black people are more than capable of assault and committing crime in the same way the cult seems to only portray whites as being the only race capable of committing. Its the use of aggressive silencing in their pursuit of societal change and guilt-tripping. People are angry and fed up.

The idea that the bolded is some form of mainstream idea is again all in your head.

You are posting random videos to argue a point no one is making (aside from the voices in your head or on right wing media).

Your videos have as much value as me posting this video to show there is white on white violence (despite no one claiming there isn't)

https://twitter.com/NYounker/status/1223595605005611008?s=20

oyvey

Cupatae wrote:

So what do you agree with then exactly, what's your ideal outcome of this situation for black people?

Foxtrol wrote: »

Equality

Equality in what sense?

Cupatae

Foxtrol wrote: »

I disagree, significant elements of the police forces are poisoned and I can't describe anyone as a 'good cop' that turns a blind eye. Look at how 3 cops let MF be murdered in front of them, did nothing, and lied about it afterwards. Listen to the unions that are supposed to speak for cops. There is a systemic cultural problem that appears incapable of self reflection.



You have nurses wearing garbage bags, teachers buying their own supplies for kids, and then cops with enough military equipment to invade Iraq.

Your first 2 points cost little and though your 3rd point is accurate, local police forces don't need tanks.



So with those numbers in mind you can see how they will more than likely have more encounters with the police.

You can't condemn nearly 800,000 cops because of the actions of 3 or a select few individual cases honestly i think your hatred of the police over there has clouded your judgement,

Again a select few samples of make shift hospital gowns isn't a good reason to scrap the police either, of that's the case why not take the money off the military that's already invaded Iraq and has a insane budget?

Police training would cost alot especially extensive training which they obviously need they get bare bones training and that's there lot go deal with the real world.

Incredibly tough job there being demonized now because the action of one man that killed gf and a select few other cases all there good work easily dismissed and forgotten about while there negatives and blasted at anyone that ll listen

Again poverty isn't am advantage but it certainly does not excuse the ridiculous crime statistics they have , at some point culture and personal choices and everything else have to be weighed in you can't just blame the system for everything which is the easy way out.

Foxtrol

oyvey wrote: »

Equality in what sense?

That progress is made that an average white family's net worth isn't 10 times that of a black family. That there is equality in treatment by the police. That there is equality in treatment by courts.

Those would be a good start

jackboy

Foxtrol wrote: »

The culture they grew up in where they couldn't go to the same school as their white neighbour or the culture where they couldn't marry who they wanted?

Federal minimum wage in the US is 36% less than in Ireland and they don't get near the additional benefits.

I think you've been buying into too many tales of 'the American dream'. Sure there are examples of that happening but so are there examples of black families getting out of poverty. The difference for white and black families that make it out, one family will continue to be discriminated against.

There is no doubt that the average recent immigrant works much harder than the average poor black or white American. These immigrants come from much much greater oppression than these poor Americans. Culture not opportunity is the main factor in outcomes for poor Americans.

Foxtrol

Cupatae wrote: »

You can't condemn nearly 800,000 cops because of the actions of 3 or a select few individual cases honestly i think your hatred of the police over there has clouded your judgement,

You had you head in the sand if you even narrow down the last month and think 3 or a select few' are the issue.

The evidence is everywhere if you bother to look.

Again a select few samples of make shift hospital gowns isn't a good reason to scrap the police either, of that's the case why not take the money off the military that's already invaded Iraq and has a insane budget?

I didn't say scrap them, I want some defunding and reinvestment.

I'm all for taking money off both the police and military.

Police training would cost alot especially extensive training which they obviously need they get bare bones training and that's there lot go deal with the real world.

I don't see any evidence for that.

Incredibly tough job there being demonized now because the action of one man that killed gf and a select few other cases all there good work easily dismissed and forgotten about while there negatives and blasted at anyone that ll listen

I sound like a broken record, if you think this is because of the actions of one man then you've been living under a rock.

Again poverty isn't am advantage but it certainly does not excuse the ridiculous crime statistics they have , at some point culture and personal choices and everything else have to be weighed in you can't just blame the system for everything which is the easy way out.

All the things I pointed out don't excuse but they explain.

What you're trying to make out is that a guy who grows up in a council estate in Limerick has the same choices as a guy that went to Blackrock. Ireland has made a lot of attempts to level the field but for all the talk (whining) about affirmative action, the US does practically nothing

Cupatae

Foxtrol wrote: »

That progress is made that an average white family's net worth isn't 10 times that of a black family. That there is equality in treatment by the police. That there is equality in treatment by courts.

Those would be a good start

What about Asians having more money than them ? Is it like a two step thing level em with the whites first then, bring em up to that Asian money ?

Wealth doesnt = equality

Rich and poor always gonna be there it doesn't give a damn about color so...

Do we just hand em money or ?

What's stopping a black person from gaining wealth? Bar excuses ? Nothing if they put in the same work as the next person they ll get the breaks just ask every single successful black person on America.

Your points are insanely biased to black Americans like to a ridiculous level .your about two posts away from defunding the police and giving the money to black people.

Cupatae

Foxtrol wrote: »

You had you head in the sand if you even narrow down the last month and think 3 or a select few' are the issue.

The evidence is everywhere if you bother to look.



I didn't say scrap them, I want some defunding and reinvestment.

I'm all for taking money off both the police and military.



I don't see any evidence for that.



I sound like a broken record, if you think this is because of the actions of one man then you've been living under a rock.



All the things I pointed out don't excuse but they explain.

What you're trying to make out is that a guy who grows up in a council estate in Limerick has the same choices as a guy that went to Blackrock. Ireland has made a lot of attempts to level the field but for all the talk (whining) about affirmative action, the US does practically nothing

He does actually , infact he can get college paid all the way up to masters and avail of countless grants just cause you don't start at point C doesn't mean you can't get there.

Now if he sits there and whinges how he started behind the 8 ball well them that's on him but the main point is the opportunity is there , the work is there. It's down to the individual, all those lads that chose crime in the us could have easily choose to get a job and graft but they took the easy way out.

You don't think police training costs money ?

As I said the actions of the few shouldn't out weigh the good deeds of the many are you saying the police in the us are and always have been bad ? All of them ?

Also are implying there is systematic mass slaughter of black people in the us by the police , is that what you meant by my head in the sand you keep saying that vague stuff but never back it up.

Foxtrol

jackboy wrote: »

There is no doubt that the average recent immigrant works much harder than the average poor black or white American. These immigrants come from much much greater oppression than these poor Americans. Culture not opportunity is the main factor in outcomes for poor Americans.

That is an interesting perspective but I think you're comparing apples with oranges there.

Immigrants to the US generally aren't 'average' people from their culture though, so you're not comparing like with like. To emigrate from their home country they are incredibly driven and you can see similar driven folk among poor white and black communities.

You're also overly inflating the success 1st generation poor immigrants have in the US. It is generally 2nd or 3rd generation where you see their families go to college and move into the middle class. Again, a black person that went to a segregated school could be 55 years old now so we haven't seen what the 2nd or 3rd generations will do.

1800_Ladladlad

Apparently, a white man who's married to a black woman, and have a child together, can still be a racist. Racism can only. be systematically white. :rolleyes:

https://twitter.com/WatchChad/status/1276170833527025664

Foxtrol

Cupatae wrote: »

What about Asians having more money than them ? Is it like a two step thing level em with the whites first then, bring em up to that Asian money ?

Wealth doesnt = equality

Rich and poor always gonna be there it doesn't give a damn about color so...

Do we just hand em money or ?

What's stopping a black person from gaining wealth? Bar excuses ? Nothing if they put in the same work as the next person they ll get the breaks just ask every single successful black person on America.

Your points are insanely biased to black Americans like to a ridiculous level .your about two posts away from defunding the police and giving the money to black people.

Sure in Irish history why weren't the sons of Irish tenant farmers able to gain the same wealth as the sons of the landlords.

If they just weren't so lazy... :rolleyes:

Cupatae

Foxtrol wrote: »

Sure in Irish history why weren't the sons of Irish tenant farmers able to gain the same wealth as the sons of the landlords.

If they just weren't so lazy... :rolleyes:

Good Lord how far back do ya wanna go like ? Why don't we start at the Neolithic age altogether and go from there... Talk about dragging the discussion into absolute nonsense.

We were clearly on about the present day...

Foxtrol

Cupatae wrote: »

He does actually , infact he can get college paid all the way up to masters and avail of countless grants just cause you don't start at point C doesn't mean you can't get there.

Now if he sits there and whinges how he started behind the 8 ball well them that's on him but the main point is the opportunity is there , the work is there. It's down to the individual, all those lads that chose crime in the us could have easily choose to get a job and graft but they took the easy way out.

No one says he can't get there but it is common sense that on average a greater number of people starting at C won't make it to A than those that start at A.

You don't think police training costs money ?

It costs money but the NYPD budget is $6 billion dollars and actual expenditure is a few billion more

As I said the actions of the few shouldn't out weigh the good deeds of the many are you saying the police in the us are and always have been bad ? All of them ?

Also are implying there is systematic mass slaughter of black people in the us by the police , is that what you meant by my head in the sand you keep saying that vague stuff but never back it up.

Did you support the RUC in the north? Were their actions just a few bad cops? Were you angry that they were 'defunded' and replaced with the PSNI?

Foxtrol

Cupatae wrote: »

Good Lord how far back do ya wanna go like ? Why don't we start at the Neolithic age altogether and go from there... Talk about dragging the discussion into absolute nonsense.

We were clearly on about the present day...

And black kids that weren't allowed to go to school with white kids could be 55 years old now.

The civil rights act is only 56 years old.

A child that had to ride in the back of the bus may not have hit pension age.

You're complaining that the entire black community hasn't pulled themselves out of poverty in that period.

As I said you're calling the sons of Irish tenant farmers lazy for not being as wealthy as the sons of land owners. It is as ridiculous argument

Cupatae

Foxtrol wrote: »

No one says he can't get there but it is common sense that on average a greater number of people starting at C won't make it to A than those that start at A.



It costs money but the NYPD budget is $6 billion dollars and actual expenditure is a few billion more



Did you support the RUC in the north? Were their actions just a few bad cops? Were you angry that they were 'defunded' and replaced with the PSNI?

From tenant farmers to the ruc are we still talking about BLM in the US, absolutely ridiculous comparisons , and you talk to other posters about comparing apples and oranges

So it's not racism you want to end then it's poverty specifically black poverty because everyone should be treated equal what ya think about white poverty??, But anyway I've got some bad news for ya... Defunding the police ain't gonna cut it there.

Danzy

Democratic Senator from Wisconsin got a few head kicks from BLM fighting squads.

Cupatae

Foxtrol wrote: »

And black kids that weren't allowed to go to school with white kids could be 55 years old now.

The civil rights act is only 56 years old.

A child that had to ride in the back of the bus may not have hit pension age.

You're complaining that the entire black community hasn't pulled themselves out of poverty in that period.

As I said you're calling the sons of Irish tenant farmers lazy for not being as wealthy as the sons of land owners. It is as ridiculous argument

Making stuff up again I see , can you qoute me on about the tenant farmers bit ? Thanks

You ve been pressed for answers ya ain't got em your realizing slowly how ridiculous your stances and your reaching desperately now... You ve been found wanting!

Should they ever be stupid enough to defund the police in the states , you ll be in for a interesting time!

Cupatae

Foxtrol wrote: »

And black kids that weren't allowed to go to school with white kids could be 55 years old now.

The civil rights act is only 56 years old.

A child that had to ride in the back of the bus may not have hit pension age.

You're complaining that the entire black community hasn't pulled themselves out of poverty in that period.

As I said you're calling the sons of Irish tenant farmers lazy for not being as wealthy as the sons of land owners. It is as ridiculous argument

Making stuff up again I see , can you qoute me on about the tenant farmers bit ? Thanks

You ve been pressed for answers ya ain't got em your realizing slowly how ridiculous your stances and your reaching desperately now... You ve been found wanting!

Should they ever be stupid enough to defund the police in the states , you ll be in for a interesting time!

Silentcorner

Danzy wrote: »

Democratic Senator from Wisconsin got a few head kicks from BLM fighting squads.

Things are shaping up well for the Democratic party being led by a 78 year old man in a bunker who is well placed to control all the extreme elements of his party....according to the polls anyway!!!

Quantum Erasure

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

Apparently, a white man who's married to a black woman, and have a child together, can still be a racist. Racism can only. be systematically white. :rolleyes:

that took an unexpected turn

Foxtrol

Silentcorner wrote: »

Things are shaping up well for the Democratic party being led by a 78 year old man in a bunker who is well placed to control all the extreme elements of his party....according to the polls anyway!!!

Not to unlike the 74 year old man in a bunker currently

1800_Ladladlad

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

that took an unexpected turn

The content I love to see