Forced Return to Office Work

Snow Garden

OP you will find people are increasingly confrontational on Boards since 'lockdown'. Lack of social interaction or something.
I hope you get the answers you are looking for - might be a good question for the main Covid thread.

ixoy

Health considerations aside, with massively reduced public transport there'll be a lot of employees who will not be able to get into their office place as buses will be full. Any employer should try and factor the pure practicality in where they could - no point in having an employee coming in hours late when it can be avoided.

Dodge

Dodge wrote: »

While this is clearly true, if the employer can’t show what measures they’ve taken, then I think it’s fair for staff to query that. Particularly if productivity hasn’t been effected for that staff member

If the employer shows how safe the workplace is, then there should be no problems at all

That is true. Even in 5 weeks when there is full return to work, an employer will need to have taken certain measures. And employees will be able to question that. But I don’t believe that public transport is, or should be, part of that safety assessment. That is not in the power of the employer to influence and if, on 20 July, staff requested to be in the office, then it’s up to the employee as to how they get there

RurtBeynolds

Not sure why the op is getting such a hard time here.

Guidelines are that those who can work from home should continue to do so. End of.

Telling the op they should be just grateful to have a job at all is not helpful.

millb

Deleted User wrote: »

That is true. Even in 5 weeks when there is full return to work, an employer will need to have taken certain measures. And employees will be able to question that. But I don’t believe that public transport is, or should be, part of that safety assessment. That is not in the power of the employer to influence and if, on 20 July, staff requested to be in the office, then it’s up to the employee as to how they get there

https://hsa.ie/eng/topics/covid-19/covid-19_advice_for_employers_and_employees/covid_19_%E2%80%93_advice_for_employers_and_employees.html

The Stress section is possibly relevant. Most employers are asking folks if they want to come back first or later and how they intend to travel.. If you come in and have any symptom (eg cough) you have to go home straight away.. Others may then have to self-isolate as well... what is the response-plan?

Snow Garden

RurtBeynolds wrote: »

Not sure why the op is getting such a hard time here.

Guidelines are that those who can work from home should continue to do so. End of.

Telling the op they should be just grateful to have a job at all is not helpful.

They are Covidiots. It will pass.

road_high

Hard to understand people with jobs now unwilling to go back to them- it's what you signed up to, including the location. No doubt very clearly stated in the contract you signed. They are not obliged to continue home-working so long as the workplace is Covid compliant. If i wanted to be blunt I'd tell you to just get on with it or find another job.

petes

road_high wrote: »

Hard to understand people with jobs now unwilling to go back to them- it's what you signed up to, including the location. No doubt very clearly stated in the contract you signed. They are not obliged to continue home-working so long as the workplace is Covid compliant. If i wanted to be blunt I'd tell you to just get on with it or find another job.

Does the contract they signed mention Covid=19?

newuser99999

road_high wrote: »

Hard to understand people with jobs now unwilling to go back to them- it's what you signed up to, including the location. No doubt very clearly stated in the contract you signed. They are not obliged to continue home-working so long as the workplace is Covid compliant. If i wanted to be blunt I'd tell you to just get on with it or find another job.

Find another job where exactly? You don’t know what OP does for a living or their circumstances. What a ridiculous answer, as if finding a job is liking buying a new pair of shoes or something. Get a grip.

Lux23

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Getting to work via public transport presents the highest risk in my opinion.

Any risk assessment without it included is not worth the paper it is written on and you would have to question an adequate Covid 19 risk mitigation strategy has been put in place.

Yes, my employer has had to include this in the risk assessment and I don't understand why the OP's employer hasn't. Well, maybe it is because they haven't a clue what they are doing.

road_high

petes wrote: »

Does the contract they signed mention Covid=19?

Why would it mention that or any other of the millions of viruses out there? I've never had a contract that mentioned a specific illness or viral infection. Some people need to get with the programme or else go onto Jobseekers and #stayhome

Snow Garden

road_high wrote: »

Why would it mention that or any other of the millions of viruses out there? I've never had a contract that mentioned a specific illness or viral infection. Some people need to get with the programme or else go onto Jobseekers and #stayhome

I bet you're one on those heroes who, in times gone by, came into work when sick and happily infected everyone else.

road_high

newuser99999 wrote: »

Find another job where exactly? You don’t know what OP does for a living or their circumstances. What a ridiculous answer, as if finding a job is liking buying a new pair of shoes or something. Get a grip.

Well if they don't want to attend the one they have as requested- is anyone forcing them to? Just do not expect the employer to keep paying you. Perfectly logical I would have thought but seemingly not.

newuser99999

road_high wrote: »

Well if they don't want to attend the one they have as requested- is anyone forcing them to? Just do not expect the employer to keep paying you. Perfectly logical I would have thought but seemingly not.

It’s not really logical considering they have health issues and can complete their tasks perfectly fine working from home. Would seem logical to continue what they’re doing but seemingly you cannot read.

RurtBeynolds

RurtBeynolds wrote: »

Not sure why the op is getting such a hard time here.

Guidelines are that those who can work from home should continue to do so. End of.

Telling the op they should be just grateful to have a job at all is not helpful.

To be fair, I think a lot of the comment is looking to 20 July, when the "should continue to work from home where possible" changes to "phased return to office" and challenging the OP on what they will do then

And the opening post was talking about public transport, which I don't think is the employers problem

road_high

Snow Garden wrote: »

I bet you're one on those heroes who, in times gone by, came into work when sick and happily infected everyone else.

No just someone who gets on with things rather than feeling sorry for myself in self pity. And perfectly realise the employer-employee relationship is a two way transactional process whereby they don't owe you anything and if you've signed up to working in an office and can't negioate otherwise then that is that. Either turn up or find yourself a new job.

petes

road_high wrote: »

Why would it mention that or any other of the millions of viruses out there? I've never had a contract that mentioned a specific illness or viral infection. Some people need to get with the programme or else go onto Jobseekers and #stayhome

Because Covid-19 has changed how we work whether we like or agree with or not.. Are you so clueless that you can't see that and that's it's not going to have an effect on workplaces?

s1ippy

road_high wrote: »

Well if they don't want to attend the one they have as requested- is anyone forcing them to? Just do not expect the employer to keep paying you. Perfectly logical I would have thought but seemingly not.

Definitely the musings of somebody with a detailed knowledge of employment legislation.

^ That's sarcastic.

B.A._Baracus

s1ippy wrote: »

Just be grateful, roll over and take whatever they demand of you? Yeah, employers love that characteristic. It can be quite a worrying sign if your self-worth is that low though.

You're dead right to be opposing this OP. As other posters have pointed out, you are well within your right to call these demands out, especially as "WFH where possible" is still in place.

Are you a member of a union? I strongly recommend you join a relevant one and consult them for advice on the specifics of this situation rather than leave yourself at the mercy of the baying boards hoardes, where you'll get more abuse for not worshipping your masters than salient information.

So you're saying moan moan moan until you get your way?
Lot of people in this world would love your mentality. Egg you on saying "go on, I wouldnt be having that. Are you an ejjit?!" - then laugh when you f**k yourself over. Even take what's yours if they could.

So go moan.

road_high

petes wrote: »

Because Covid-19 has changed how we work whether we like or agree with or not.. Are you so clueless that you can't see that and that's it's not going to have an effect on workplaces?

Who said workplaces have not changed? So long as social distancing etc are implemented then the employer is making reasonable efforts to accomodate safely. There's no legislation mandating home working and if that does not suit the employer then so be it.

paw patrol

dancingqueen wrote: »

I'm on annual leave today

thanks for the wonderful comment though - you're hilarious

you've an answer for everything not only an answer...the correct answer
:rolleyes:

petes

road_high wrote: »

Who said workplaces have not changed? So long as social distancing etc are implemented then the employer is making reasonable efforts to accomodate safely. There's no legislation mandating home working and if that does not suit the employer then so be it.

But the OP doesn't know if these things are in place

Have you actually read the thread you're posting in?

alwald

OP is raising a serious topic and he/she's not the only one, FLAC are receiving lots of calls from employees about forced return to the office.

Whatever happens do not resign, call citizen information or FLAC. Any reasonable employer would put the well-being of their employees first, including when using public transport.

techdiver

I know the type of employer that insists on people being in the office even though the job can be done easily remotely. They are the type who do not trust their employees and in return will bread a sense of resentment from employees. Doesn't bode well for fostering a good working environment.

The world needs to move more towards working remotely not less. Employers are the ones who need to change attitude. I'm not talking about every professions by the way, just the ones that can achieve everything required remotely.

Remote working has so many benefits not only to environment and housing supply but also quality of life. Hopefully it's one thing that comes from the covid-19 crisis that many employers that were on the fence will now see the light. The upside for employers is potentially massive also. Think of the potential cost savings on office space when requirements are reduced. Many companies are embracing it with twitter CEO announcing that employees can remain working from home indefinitely.

On another point I can't see how most offices that were at or near capacity before the outbreak can re-open fully from July anyway. So the choice is to purchase more office space or allow the status quo to continue for now.

jrosen

If people can work from home they should continue to do so. But ultimately that will be decided by your employer. They will decide who is ok to stay working from home and who they need back in the office.
Offices are already open, people are already back to work.

If your employer can open up the office whist keeping to the guidelines then you have a couple of options. You make it work and return to the office, you engage with your employer and explain why you think you cant/shouldnt have too return to the office, you go sick.

How you get to and from work is something you need to work out.

But I would tread carefully. Companies will be making cuts, we are all disposable.

dancingqueen

DuffleBag wrote: »

Dare I ask if any of your colleagues, presuming of course you aren't as passive aggressive to them, are experiencing similar issues?

I think overall it's just something you're going to have to suck up and get over, like a lot of people will be doing. There's plenty PPE gear you could use if you were really worried about it on a bus. Best to start investing in them.

Can you tell us how long you have to travel distance wise so we can maybe give advice?

I have colleagues with health issues, and concerns yes that are also very concerned about returning to the office

dancingqueen

ixoy wrote: »

Health considerations aside, with massively reduced public transport there'll be a lot of employees who will not be able to get into their office place as buses will be full. Any employer should try and factor the pure practicality in where they could - no point in having an employee coming in hours late when it can be avoided.

Hey if I have to, I'll be taken the extra time it took me to get on a bus, out of my work day !

dancingqueen

s1ippy wrote: »

Just be grateful, roll over and take whatever they demand of you? Yeah, employers love that characteristic. It can be quite a worrying sign if your self-worth is that low though.

You're dead right to be opposing this OP. As other posters have pointed out, you are well within your right to call these demands out, especially as "WFH where possible" is still in place.

Are you a member of a union? I strongly recommend you join a relevant one and consult them for advice on the specifics of this situation rather than leave yourself at the mercy of the baying boards hoardes, where you'll get more abuse for not worshipping your masters than salient information.

I wish I had a union, will look into it this week for sure.

Thanks for the advice.

ka2

I'm in the exact same situation as the OP. Reopening fully on Monday next. I don't drive (believe me, I've tried) and live 40 km from work so walking or cycling aren't options for me. So I'll be back on the buses at a time that we're still advised to work from home if possible.

Cuddlesworth

gibgodsman wrote: »

The 8th of June phase is basically the reopening of Ireland

jrosen wrote: »

If people can work from home they should continue to do so. But ultimately that will be decided by your employer. They will decide who is ok to stay working from home and who they need back in the office.
Offices are already open, people are already back to work.

Have you told the Minister for Health about the changes to his plan?