Leo says the Civil Service is 'very white'

ArchXStanton

Wibbs wrote: »

True, however if you look at any other "multicultural" European nations, even after many generations the non native populations specifically those who don't look "local" are never quite local enough. Sure if individuals do well they're lauded to some degree, but their background demographic not nearly so much. Hence we have social problems and occasional actual unrest like we see currently in the UK many generations in.

But the multiculturalists refuse to acknowledge history and basic human nature. Then again that's a thread that runs strongly through the so called "left" and progressives. They imagine a world of human blank slates that top down cultural pressures can shift, but they don't and they can't. That's a bitter pill they won't swallow.

Now to be fair it's an optimistic view of humanity and that's nicer than a pessimistic view, but it doesn't make it a reality. So called "melting pots" of different ethnicities don't last too long without unrest, without a them and us coming into it. It doesn't have to be along "race" lines either. This island has seen and still sees a social them and us between Planters and Native, many centuries on. And they're the same "race", same colour. And you think introducing people who look quite different and in some demographics quite different culturally and expect that to magically work? If so I have some magic beans you may be interested in.

Forget non natives for a second. Today we have a social schism and discrimination and social unrest and distrust between Travellers and Settled Irish. Same "race" down to the bones. And yet here we are.

It's lovely wishful thinking but history and current events prove it to be a naive bloody nonsense. Again please list European multicultural nations without strife along ethnic/racial lines. Please list European multicultural nations where Black Africans aren't the lowest demographic on the social scale. And you want to import that stupidity here? In the naive hope that somehow this time we'll get it right? We won't and we're already seeing the rise of the unrest and ghettoisation in this country after less than two decades of this multicultural bollocks being imported.

Hell a large part of why we got it imported was because of the Good Friday, please God let the ethnic Troubles end, born in Ireland makes you Irish stuff, which had a long queue of non EU "refugees" from Nigeria and the like with their waters breaking on the pier at Rosslare. Of course Ireland having a boom at the time helped... Not a lot of "refugees" coming here in the doldrums of the 80's. Funny that.

Was going to mention that earlier, nobody came here in the 80s

Wibbs

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Was going to mention that earlier, nobody came here in the 80s

Funny enough I knew two. Well one his dad had come from the Middle East in the 70's escaping a likely death sentence. He could have settled in a couple of places but chose here, because he thought it a cohesive and religious at the time safe place to raise kids(one could argue that one thing that does make it safe from more social unrest is our very homogeneity. Perish the thought...). Made a good go of it too. Worked his arse off. The other lad was from Cameroon who rocked up in the mid 80's. Both guys were highly intelligent and educated people.

ArchXStanton

Wibbs wrote: »

Funny enough I knew two. Well one his dad had come from the Middle East in the 70's escaping a likely death sentence. He could have settled in a couple of places but chose here, because he thought it a cohesive and religious at the time safe place to raise kids(one could argue that one thing that does make it safe from more social unrest is our very homogeneity. Perish the thought...). Made a good go of it too. Worked his arse off. The other lad was from Cameroon who rocked up in the mid 80's. Both guys were highly intelligent and educated people.

I can remember clearly being a child in Dublin City one day in the 80s and seeing a black person for the first time, what struck me was there was people around giving him a second look, I'm guessing it was their first time too

lawred2

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

Imagine, a small island country in north western europe with no history of colonialism or ties to Africa has a ‘very white’ public sector. Given that we have very few direct flights to Africa and didn’t have them a long time, the number of ‘people of colour’ from Africa who managed to get here without setting foot in another safe country before claimed asylum here is more surprising that a ‘very white’ public sector.

well

except for being colonised

buried

Very little poor people in the upper echelons of the Civil service too. Will we see that imbalance of equality be addressed?

Will we f**k.

TheCitizen

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Anyone that doesn't think that this is wrong or something sinister about it would want their heads examined

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbIc1LZqIAw

Was wondering what or who Gefira.org was. https://medium.com/dfrlab/electionwatch-murky-metrics-in-italian-migration-debate-198e80253644

Says here they are a dodgy outfit that aren't what they claim to be and make all sorts of allegations that they don't back up. This place has gone to the dogs.

ArchXStanton

TheCitizen wrote: »

Was wondering what or who Gefira.org was. https://medium.com/dfrlab/electionwatch-murky-metrics-in-italian-migration-debate-198e80253644

Says here they are a dodgy outfit that aren't what they claim to be and make all sorts of allegations that they don't back up. This place has gone to the dogs.

Yeah it's not like Salvini and co put the boot down on these "NGOs" for no reason

TheCitizen

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Yeah it's not like Salvini and co put the boot down on these "NGOs" for no reason

Yeah Salvini from the Far Right Lega Nord. This site has gone Far Right as well by the looks of it. It's as if all the Alt Right type goons from Politics.ie and other places have migrated over here and taken over the show.

Wibbs

Wibbs wrote: »

Funny enough I knew two. Well one his dad had come from the Middle East in the 70's escaping a likely death sentence. He could have settled in a couple of places but chose here, because he thought it a cohesive and religious at the time safe place to raise kids(one could argue that one thing that does make it safe from more social unrest is our very homogeneity. Perish the thought...). Made a good go of it too. Worked his arse off. The other lad was from Cameroon who rocked up in the mid 80's. Both guys were highly intelligent and educated people.

I think the problem is that those who push the multicultural line don't want to recognize that the world has changed. Part of it is our own fault. The development of a society that feels itself "entitled" to a way of life, without the work/risks that previous generations would have considered part of the process. The issue is that we see immigrants who have the same sense of entitlement. In the past(80s/90s), migrants came here knowing that Ireland wasn't the "best" and knew that they would need to work (and integrate) to get a similar standard of living as the natives. Hell, better than many of the natives, in fact. They knew that integration was the easiest way to achieve that, so they dressed as we did, and made an effort to participate with our values (while retaining their own cultural habits in the privacy of their own homes)

However, the last decade, we've seen those who feel entitled to "be taken care of", and hold no gratitude for what they receive. I'm not going to sugar coat it because TBH i suspect many westerners would be the same had they been in the same position. However, the more that I have lived abroad, the more I have come to respect the power of culture. With Muslims. for example, there has been a shift towards the more fundamental aspects of their religion, and while I know many boardsies, don't see them as the same, their religion and culture is intertwined. This affects the manner in which they feel that they can comfortably integrate with the local culture, versus maintaining their own cultural purity. With Muslims, it's important to see the difference in how males behave when they're in their twenties, versus how they behave in their thirties (when they marry). Many want to ignore these factors, and use generalisations to suggest a level of acceptance that simply doesn't exist. Which is why we have seen gangs being formed in many countries, along with scattered violence/crime.

I'm not against migration, since I genuinely feel that it does improve a country by becoming exposed to other options/cultures. Having said that though, I feel that migration is neglected the attention it deserves, to determine what is the best/optimum manner to go about it. And that would mean examining how other nations do it... and leaving the virtue signalling out of it.

ArchXStanton

Deleted User wrote: »

I think the problem is that those who push the multicultural line don't want to recognize that the world has changed. Part of it is our own fault. The development of a society that feels itself "entitled" to a way of life, without the work/risks that previous generations would have considered part of the process. The issue is that we see immigrants who have the same sense of entitlement. In the past(80s/90s), migrants came here knowing that Ireland wasn't the "best" and knew that they would need to work (and integrate) to get a similar standard of living as the natives. Hell, better than many of the natives, in fact. They knew that integration was the easiest way to achieve that, so they dressed as we did, and made an effort to participate with our values (while retaining their own cultural habits in the privacy of their own homes)

However, the last decade, we've seen those who feel entitled to "be taken care of", and hold no gratitude for what they receive. I'm not going to sugar coat it because TBH i suspect many westerners would be the same had they been in the same position. However, the more that I have lived abroad, the more I have come to respect the power of culture. With Muslims. for example, there has been a shift towards the more fundamental aspects of their religion, and while I know many boardsies, don't see them as the same, their religion and culture is intertwined. This affects the manner in which they feel that they can comfortably integrate with the local culture, versus maintaining their own cultural purity. With Muslims, it's important to see the difference in how males behave when they're in their twenties, versus how they behave in their thirties (when they marry). Many want to ignore these factors, and use generalisations to suggest a level of acceptance that simply doesn't exist. Which is why we have seen gangs being formed in many countries, along with scattered violence/crime.

I'm not against migration, since I genuinely feel that it does improve a country by becoming exposed to other options/cultures. Having said that though, I feel that migration is neglected the attention it deserves, to determine what is the best/optimum manner to go about it. And that would mean examining how other nations do it... and leaving the virtue signalling out of it.

If that's the only plus compared to the many negative and potential negatives of it, I'd rather just buy a flight and go and see these cultures

ArchXStanton

ArchXStanton wrote: »

If that's the only plus compared to the many negative and potential negatives of it, I'd rather just buy a flight and go and see these cultures

I wouldn't. I remember the Midlands of the 70s/80s <shudders>. And while there is an overabundance of Africans just hanging around all day (in my hometown), Irish people have changed due to their exposure to other cultures... people who wouldn't have gone abroad to work or holiday. I know dozens of people in Ireland who have never actually gone abroad..

DelaneyIn

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Why do you keep asserting that Irish people can omly be white?

We are told that Irishness doesn’t know any colour and that we are a multicultural and multiracial people; but all equally Irish. Once you have the magic piece of paper. In some cases, the media will tell us the “undocumented” are Irish too.

Then we are told that only a particular section of modern Irish people are responsible for racism, perceived historical past wrongs and a role in the British empire yada yadda - “white” Irish people.

Seems a bit of a scam to me.

The actual people descended from those that persevered, endured great hardship and built Ireland to what it is today are shouted down if they try to claim Irish ethnicity or our unique identity. They’re told we are all Irish once you hold that magic piece of paper thrown around at the citizenship soirées.

But then the same folk are happy to group the same folk they mock and chastise for claiming to be “native Irish” when it comes to lectures on racism etc.

The double standards are ignored as it must fit neatly with the agenda. “Whites” oppressors. The rest are “oppressed.” The Green's Janet Horner on Eamon Ryan's recent use of the n-word;

We have a lot of work to do as a party, and as a society more generally, in bringing the voices of black, indigenous and and people of colour to the table and in stamping out racism and marginalisation.

We are the indigenous people. She’s adopting the American view of racism and trying to pigeon hole that narrative and fit it in to an Irish context. Which is ludicrous but explains how we are where we are.

This nonsense needs to be boxed off and fired back across the Atlantic in a trebuchet.

sabat

DelaneyIn wrote: »

W The Green's Janet Horner on Eamon Ryan's recent use of the n-word;

With a name like that she probably owes me reparations.

James Brown

buried wrote: »

Very little poor people in the upper echelons of the Civil service too. Will we see that imbalance of equality be addressed?

Will we f**k.

Touched on this the other day. The school you went to, area code and accent played a big part. In many institutions such as RTE and civil service jobs. Not to take away from any minorities. It's a bit much to hear priviledged people like Varadkar side step it to try be the hip statesman in his usual foot in mouth manner. You'll see many people of colour on RTE and in the civil service before you'll see the traditional marginalised.

CrabRevolution

Deleted User wrote: »

I wouldn't. I remember the Midlands of the 70s/80s <shudders>. And while there is an overabundance of Africans just hanging around all day (in my hometown), Irish people have changed due to their exposure to other cultures... people who wouldn't have gone abroad to work or holiday. I know dozens of people in Ireland who have never actually gone abroad..

You reckon all the negatives from immigration are worth it in order to inspire some Irish people to go on a holiday abroad?

Tony EH

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Was going to mention that earlier, nobody came here in the 80s

What was there to come to?

Eric Cartman

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Was going to mention that earlier, nobody came here in the 80s

and then Europes most generous, easily defrauded welfare system arrived.

Tony EH

Eric Cartman wrote: »

and then Europes most generous, easily defrauded welfare system arrived.

LOL, it was much, MUCH, easier to defraud the welfare system in the 80's. :pac:

Topgear on Dave

Tony EH wrote: »

What was there to come to?

****ing nothing that I remember.:pac:

We had ONE kid join our class in our country boy school. He'd moved home from England with his parents who are local. It was such an unusual occurance that I still remember it.

People didn't travel the way they do now with more developed air travel.

Tony EH

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

****ing nothing that I remember.:pac:

We had ONE kid join our class in our country boy school. He'd moved home from England with his parents who are local. It was such an unusual occurance that I still remember it.

People didn't travel the way they do now with more developed air travel.

Half the country were dying to get out of it. And often, when you gone, you were gone.

Wibbs

Bowie wrote: »

You'll see many people of colour on RTE and in the civil service before you'll see the traditional marginalised.

And the darker the berry the sweeter the photo op. The pale marginalised don't generate as many feels or attention. You often see this with the NGO racism lot. The occasional Asian person, almost no Europeans, no matter how tragic their circumstances - not "exotic' enough for White guilt - It's almost always African folks to the fore. And a thankfully minority of same have used it as a bandwagon to a career. The woman who found a racist drink was/is one. She even got a race relations course rattled up for herself. Then there was another who had the brass neck to run for local office, when her background of how she ended up here was a tad questionable.

TheCitizen wrote: »

Yeah Salvini from the Far Right Lega Nord. This site has gone Far Right as well by the looks of it. It's as if all the Alt Right type goons from Politics.ie and other places have migrated over here and taken over the show.

Ah yeah, here we go: If you don't agree with my naive third hand right on opinions, by definition you must be a fascist. :rolleyes: Here's a thought; maybe try debating rather than dog whistling in the usual fashion? It's almost as if you don't have an argument beyond "I'm right(on)". One thing the hard lefties, handwringers of social conscience and the hard right have in common is their arguments are as delicate as a butterfly's wing. The merest touch of dissension and it's damaged.

Wibbs

CrabRevolution wrote: »

You reckon all the negatives from immigration are worth it in order to inspire some Irish people to go on a holiday abroad?

Hardly, and again(though not aimed at Klaz) we never hear the usual mouthpieces arguing that other non European cultures are in such dire need of "diversity". My word Sir, this country is too Black, it needs more White cultural enrichment. Said no progressive ever. Which shows up their ballsology for what it is.

CrabRevolution

CrabRevolution wrote: »

You reckon all the negatives from immigration are worth it in order to inspire some Irish people to go on a holiday abroad?

Not what I meant. I meant the very insular thinking that used to be very common in Ireland, and I personally feel declined (in part) due to exposure to foreign cultures as they arrived in Ireland. While many Irish people did work/live abroad for periods of time, many others didn't. Perhaps that was more of an issue in the country towns than the cities. Dunno.

And I have no idea where you got me dismissing all the perils of immigration.... have you read my other posts?

ArchXStanton

Eric Cartman wrote: »

and then Europes most generous, easily defrauded welfare system arrived.

Were else in the world would you get €204 a week for sitting on your hole.... Or more depending on how many sprogs you had

TheCitizen

Wibbs wrote: »

And the darker the berry the sweeter the photo op. The pale marginalised don't generate as many feels or attention. You often see this with the NGO racism lot. The occasional Asian person, almost no Europeans, no matter how tragic their circumstances - not "exotic' enough for White guilt - It's almost always African folks to the fore. And a thankfully minority of same have used it as a bandwagon to a career. The woman who found a racist drink was/is one. She even got a race relations course rattled up for herself. Then there was another who had the brass neck to run for local office, when her background of how she ended up here was a tad questionable.

Ah yeah, here we go: If you don't agree with my naive third hand right on opinions, by definition you must be a fascist. :rolleyes: Here's a thought; maybe try debating rather than dog whistling in the usual fashion? It's almost as if you don't have an argument beyond "I'm right(on)". One thing the hard lefties, handwringers of social conscience and the hard right have in common is their arguments are as delicate as a butterfly's wing. The merest touch of dissension and it's damaged.

Yep. A whole lot of groundless guff and the point that Gefira.org is a crock of shít website that throws out falsehoods with nothing to back it up is neatly sidelined. Has a lot in common with most of the commentary from the Alt Right echo chamber that has taken over this thread.

Eric Cartman

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Were else in the world would you get €204 a week for sitting on your hole.... Or more depending on how many sprogs you had

I do not know of any other country in which you can achieve more spending money per month than a school principal earns for sitting on your hole, pumping out kids and racking up criminal convictions.

TheCitizen

TheCitizen wrote: »

Yep. A whole lot of groundless guff and the point that Gefira.org is a crock of shít website that throws out falsehoods with nothing to back it up is neatly sidelined. Has a lot in common with most of the commentary from the Alt Right echo chamber that has taken over this thread.

Could you name those supporters of the Alt Right on this thread? Rather than constantly hinting at its presence. I'd genuinely love to know who you keep referring to with such comments... (I suspect I'm going to laugh myself silly when you name them...)

TheCitizen

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Were else in the world would you get €204 a week for sitting on your hole.... Or more depending on how many sprogs you had

Attack the welfare state, another hallmark of the Far Right that are stinking this place out of it

TheCitizen

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Could you name those supporters of the Alt Right on this thread? Rather than constantly hinting at its presence. I'd genuinely love to know who you keep referring to with such comments... (I suspect I'm going to laugh myself silly when you name them...)

Again Gelfira.org (who the poster was citing) that has zero credibility ignored and glossed over. Similar in ways to your comments about how in the last 10 years immigrants come to Ireland “expecting to be looked after etc.” Warped, incoherent, baseless, subjective “opinion” vomited on to these pages as if it was fact.

ArchXStanton

TheCitizen wrote: »

Attack the welfare state, another hallmark of the Far Right that are stinking this place out of it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKmfHOPf3YU