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Police Shooting USA. Rayshard Brooks.

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    #1502
    Spon Farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,243 ✭✭✭Spon Farmer


    I didn't know about this one until I saw it here on the boards.

    This is just bizarre.

    no I didn't watch it all - but it is 40 of two ordinary pleasant guys who happen to be police talking talking with an annoying but equally pleasant man not able admit to that he was too drunk to drive but decent enough to not actually drive.

    How the hell did somebody get shot?

    Why did he struggle? He can't get away because they know who he is already?

    Why did they tase him - let alone shoot him? They know who he is? Just pick him up later?

    I've witnessed Garda in similar situations a few of times dealing with drunks and unreasonable people. Nobody dies.

    I thought those cameras where meant to not fall off so easy Did they release the footage from the other camera?


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    #1503
    I Am Nobody
    Closed Accounts Posts: 726 ✭✭✭I Am Nobody


    Overheal wrote: »
    Brooks was fleeing, not charging.

    So during his fleeing,when was the part he turned and fired the taser?Or did you miss that part?That proves intent to cause bodily harm.


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    #1504
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Stateofyou wrote: »
    There are people who have climbed the White House fence and even made it inside the front doors. They are still alive.
    Next.

    I never mentioned the White House fence or front door. Try again.


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    #1505
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,483 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    Try to keep up.

    I am. He was fleeing.


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    #1506
    Spon Farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,243 ✭✭✭Spon Farmer


    I Am Nobody wrote: »
    So during his fleeing,when was the part he turned and fired the taser?Or did you miss that part?That proves intent to cause bodily harm.

    So there is another video?


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    #1507
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,483 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    I Am Nobody wrote: »
    So during his fleeing,when was the part he turned and fired the taser?Or did you miss that part?That proves intent to cause bodily harm.

    Is it a death sentence in a court of law. No. And he did so while fleeing. And he missed.


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    #1508
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Overheal wrote: »
    I am. He was fleeing.

    Doesn't matter which way he was running.

    He fires back.


    He could have had his back to them the whole time


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    #1509
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Overheal wrote: »
    I am. He was fleeing.

    Here’s a clue. Read the post I was responding to. It helps.


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    #1510
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Overheal wrote: »
    Is it a death sentence in a court of law. No.

    No but it wasn't a court of law.


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    #1511
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,483 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Danzy wrote: »
    No but it wasn't a court of law.

    Then why the Judge, Jury, and Executioner?

    We have Police officers on the street, not Judges.


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    #1512
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,483 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    Here’s a clue. Read the post I was responding to. It helps.

    The post you were responding to was my own. As was literally dozens of posts in this chain of quotes and replies, so you weren't addressing anybody else. Are you okay?


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    #1513
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Overheal wrote: »
    Is it a death sentence in a court of law. No. And he did so while fleeing. And he missed.

    So cops should only shoot if the criminal has already committed murder, genocide, treason or espionage?? Those are the only crimes that carry a death sentence on a court of law in the US.


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    #1514
    Green Peter
    Registered Users Posts: 964 ✭✭✭Green Peter


    Stateofyou wrote: »
    Rayshard didn't have a gun. Neither did all the other black lives who were innocently taken by police violence. What bullets would they be taking? It's their perceived fear from their bias - and that's their own issue that needs to be corrected.

    He had a taser gun which he fired at Police.


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    #1515
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Overheal wrote: »
    The post you were responding to was my own. As was literally dozens of posts in this chain of quotes and replies, so you weren't addressing anybody else. Are you okay?

    You said “If the actions aren't a death sentence, deadly force should not be authorized.“

    I countered with “try charging at the President with a taser.”

    “He was fleeing” isn’t a response that makes sense to my reply.


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    #1516
    Green Peter
    Registered Users Posts: 964 ✭✭✭Green Peter


    Spon Farmer wrote: »
    So there is another video?

    Just the one we all saw on TV.


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    #1517
    Spon Farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,243 ✭✭✭Spon Farmer


    Green Peter wrote: »
    He had a taser gun which he fired at Police.

    The dash cam and the security camera footage add a whole dimension to the story.

    Everything was pleasant until the struggle and then Brooks overpowered two fully grown men and stole a weapon.

    I'm not an American cop, or a Garda, so I cannot comment on whether it was necessary for Rolfe to either pull his gun or shoot the man but thee is no innocent victim here.


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    #1518
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,483 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    So cops should only shoot if the criminal has already committed murder, genocide, treason or espionage?? Those are the only crimes that carry a death sentence on a court of law in the US.

    There is a lower standard for violence against police officers that applies if the perp is engaged in a continuing criminal enterprise.

    Meting out of a punishment in excess of the crime by a LEO doesn't sit right with me at all. If people really want it to be okay for cops to shoot people dead for exhibiting less than deadly force or even the threat of less than deadly force, then, make it the law, make it punishable by death before a court of law. Anything else is extrajudicial.


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    #1519
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,483 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    You said “If the actions aren't a death sentence, deadly force should not be authorized.“

    I countered with “try charging at the President with a taser.”

    “He was fleeing” isn’t a response that makes sense to my reply.

    Well charging a POTUS with a taser is a whole other hill of beans. An absurd whataboutism. I called you out because your whataboutisms centered on charging in to assault, even though the clear circumstance here was fleeing.


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    #1520
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,483 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Spon Farmer wrote: »
    The dash cam and the security camera footage add a whole dimension to the story.

    Everything was pleasant until the struggle and then Brooks overpowered two fully grown men and stole a weapon.

    I'm not an American cop, or a Garda, so I cannot comment on whether it was necessary for Rolfe to either pull his gun or shoot the man but thee is no innocent victim here.

    Definitely not innocent, I just don't think extrajudicial capital punishment was the right call here.


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    #1521
    Spon Farmer
    Registered Users Posts: 4,243 ✭✭✭Spon Farmer


    Green Peter wrote: »
    Just the one we all saw on TV.

    There are three videos.

    Cop Number 2's body cam that ends up on the ground.

    The patrol car's dashcam.

    The Wendy's (I think) security camera.

    I assume Rolffe's cam cannot be released as it is evidence against him or something.


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    #1522
    Green Peter
    Registered Users Posts: 964 ✭✭✭Green Peter


    He was on temporary release from prison due to covid 19 and was in breach of bail. When he realised the police were going to arrest him for DUI after he tried to soft talk them he knew he was going back to jail. He decided to cut loose and resist arrest. He stole a police weapon in the struggle / assault on police and fired it at a cop. He died as a result of being shot for doing this. He was a silly man.


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    #1523
    Stateofyou
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭Stateofyou


    I Am Nobody wrote: »
    So during his fleeing,when was the part he turned and fired the taser?Or did you miss that part?That proves intent to cause bodily harm.

    You're talking about intent when 1. he didn't hit anyone and he was fleeting so it was a deterrent, 2. He was shot in.the.back. What bodily harm are you going to cause while fleeing with a spent taser and the two officers have guns?


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    #1524
    Stateofyou
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭Stateofyou


    I Am Nobody wrote: »
    IMO your just pulling radical ideas out of your ass to bolster your agenda.There is no educating you on real world police matters so I won't bother responding you from here on out.

    But I have to say as an American,with 32 years in LE.You need to cop on if you also are American. the risks and dangers LE face every day to protect you.Yes there are bad cops,as there are bad Doctors,Lawyers,etc.

    In my opinion, yes Floyd's case was murder,you can tell from the officer's body language and eventual history they had.But with Brooks,he escalated it to the point it didn't need to be.

    Yes I know he was intoxicated but not to the point he didn't know what he was doing.It' tragic when anyone loses their life over something so avoidable.But the truth is,it wouldn't have gone to that point without him taking it there.

    So you have to acknowledge that Brooks was part of the problem.IMO

    And there we are, folks.


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    #1525
    Stateofyou
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭Stateofyou


    Green Peter wrote: »
    He had a taser gun which he fired at Police.

    Yep, no bullets. And he was drunk. And fleeing. And he missed. And they still had another taser. They had his home address. They had his work details. Not good enough. It obviously wasn't good enough for his bosses either seeing as he was FIRED.


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    #1526
    Stateofyou
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭Stateofyou


    Green Peter wrote: »
    He was on temporary release from prison due to covid 19 and was in breach of bail. When he realised the police were going to arrest him for DUI after he tried to soft talk them he knew he was going back to jail. He decided to cut loose and resist arrest. He stole a police weapon in the struggle / assault on police and fired it at a cop. He died as a result of being shot for doing this. He was a silly man.

    Nope. He realised that he could most likely die in the course of police response and custody as so many others had.
    He was a drunk man. In legitimate fear.


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    #1527
    Mic 1972
    Registered Users Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭Mic 1972


    At the end of the day you are expected to collaborate with the Police, that guy wrestling with the cops then running away like that? sorry but, he went for it


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    #1528
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Stateofyou wrote: »
    You're talking about intent when 1. he didn't hit anyone and he was fleeting so it was a deterrent, 2. He was shot in.the.back. What bodily harm are you going to cause while fleeing with a spent taser and the two officers have guns?

    No Judge will view a child abuser meth heads inability to aim effectively as an excuse. It's not an excuse for anyone.

    He tried and that's all we can ask of anyone.

    The officer then got to respond and he was able to prevent the child abuser meth head from having a 2nd chance.


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    #1529
    Stateofyou
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭Stateofyou


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    You said “If the actions aren't a death sentence, deadly force should not be authorized.“

    I countered with “try charging at the President with a taser.”

    “He was fleeing” isn’t a response that makes sense to my reply.

    He didn't charge the President though. Take your whataboutism somewhere else.


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    #1530
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 83,483 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Stateofyou wrote: »
    Nope. He realised that he could most likely die in the course of police response and custody as so many others had.
    He was a drunk man. In legitimate fear.

    Either afraid of the cops killing him, or covid, or of the prison gangs


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    #1531
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Stateofyou wrote: »
    Nope. He realised that he could most likely die in the course of police response and custody as so many others had.
    He was a drunk man. In legitimate fear.

    Or he knew he was back to jail.


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