FF/FG/Green Next Government

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

but their best government. Strange old world Angus

If you invest in property large scale. Angus...do I call you Angus?

almostover

Finty Lemon wrote: »

11,000 people in Limerick city would not agree with you

They have short memories it seems. A man in the prime of his life serving his country by protecting its citizens was gunned down in cold blood by cowards. Quinlivan isn't too far detached from said cowards.

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

Particularly one who is the brother of an IRA terrorist who helped Pearse McAculey escape from jail. Pearse of course went on to murder Garda Gerry McCabe. As you might expect given the Special Criminal Court has impacted so directly on close family friends and Sinn Fein heroes this particular fantasy Minister for Justice will be anxious to abolish it first. Can only speculate on the atmosphere as the new Minister sits down with the Garda Commissioner.

Either Sinn Feiners don't actually know who their own people are or they have some kind of medical issue that allows them to make such a suggestion

It's common knowledge they've former IRA. I don't get the attempt at shock value.
We've had some bad years under Callinan and O'Sullivan and a below par Fitzgerald and Flanagan. Not to mention the whole RIC/Tan disgrace. The laws are there, if they break them do you think there won't be consequences?
A bit silly to suggest otherwise TBH.
Talk of Army at the ATM's? Claiming protestors are ISIS? Smearing the reputation of any Garda pipes up about any corruption? Highly unlikely....

Truthvader

. The laws are there, if they break them do you think there won't be consequences

Really. Ask Paul Quinn's family, Robert McCartney's Joe Rafferty's. Do you think anyone could go to a Garda Station without fear knowing Quinlivan could access the file .

As Gerry Adams says in Norn Iron "I would urge anyone with information to go to the PSNI". Strangely no-one ever does

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

At the end of the day he delivered FG's worst election ever.

Loose with the facts as always Francie.

In 2020, Fine Gael got 35 seats with 20.9% of the vote and 455,568 vote.

In 1948, they got 31 seats with 19.8% of the vote.

In 2002, they also only managed to get 31 seats.

In 1944, they got 30 seats with 20.5% of the vote.

In every election from 1938 to 1969 (inclusive) they got less than 450,000 votes, and again in 1992 and 2002.

Never really good with the history, are you?

Water John

It was Flanagan and the RIC comemeration that did the damage to FG. I hope McEntee is tough enough for the job. I wish her well.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Loose with the facts as always Francie.

In 2020, Fine Gael got 35 seats with 20.9% of the vote and 455,568 vote.

In 1948, they got 31 seats with 19.8% of the vote.

In 2002, they also only managed to get 31 seats.

In 1944, they got 30 seats with 20.5% of the vote.

In every election from 1938 to 1969 (inclusive) they got less than 450,000 votes, and again in 1992 and 2002.

Never really good with the history, are you?

Remarkable from a Green voter I must say.

OK, I stand corrected, one of their worst...well done Leo.

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

Why is there a minister for the islands?

I thought all land masses mattered?

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

. The laws are there, if they break them do you think there won't be consequences

Really. Ask Paul Quinn's family, Robert McCartney's Joe Rafferty's. Do you think anyone could go to a Garda Station without fear knowing Quinlivan could access the file .

As Gerry Adams says in Norn Iron "I would urge anyone with information to go to the PSNI". Strangely no-one ever does

Why? Do you think the Garda play politics and would leak sensitive info to TD's?
Norn Iron, very mature. Do you make fun of other people or parts ot the country too?

markodaly

I've have been reading some of the comments the past few days, and is it surprising that the same half dozen posters are still giving it yarns?

No, not at all.
They think politics is akin to Man United vs Liverpool.

For me, I wish the government well, as if they do a good job, they the nation as a whole will benefit.

Bishop of hope

markodaly wrote: »

I've have been reading some of the comments the past few days, and is it surprising that the same half dozen posters are still giving it yarns?

No, not at all.
They think politics is akin to Man United vs Liverpool.

For me, I wish the government well, as if they do a good job, they the nation as a whole will benefit.

You're quiet mistaken as often.
I compared the lads on here to Liverpool and Man u supporters.

ThunbergsAreGo

Bowie wrote: »

That's one way to spin it.
You could also say he was in a huff took his ball and went home, before the dust settled and MM lured him out for one last hurrah.
Can't see Leo sticking politics for another 5 year.

Yes, making an effort to form a government, create a partnership document with another party, engage with the greens, create and agree a PfG, and go into government while dealing with a pandemic.

FG are so bad they can't even take their ball and go home effectively.

I am very disappointed for all of the SF social media posts they failed to agree anything with any party. Now that might not be their fault as Labour and SDs seem afraid to catch responsibility but some transparency would be nice.

Bishop of hope

Eamon making excuses already over direct provision.
It may take the full length of the new Govt he says.
So basically if the govt lasts three to four years it won't change.
That's one of the pledges on the long finger anyway and it's only day 2.
That and an upcoming leadership battle will take a few minds off the job in the early stages.
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/new-transport-minister-ryan-warns-against-going-on-foreign-holidays-39323360.html

Dara Calleary not happy either in FF camp, effectively demoted, there will be others disgruntled too, rumblings already.
Party infighting might well take the shine off the new jobs.

maccored

I say lets go government. the shinners are precisely where they wanted to be and should provide good opposition.

mariaalice

maccored wrote: »

I say lets go government. the shinners are precisely where they wanted to be and should provide good opposition.

Labour will make a bit of resurgence, I would not be so quick to say SF is the only real opposition.

nc6000

It's interesting to be starting off with a new Government where the Chief Whip is already not happy.

blanch152

maccored wrote: »

I say lets go government. the shinners are precisely where they wanted to be and should provide good opposition.

So all the whinging and crying about being excluded from negotiations and the proposed street protests about it are all sham?

Snow Garden

blanch152 wrote: »

So all the whinging and crying about being excluded from negotiations and the proposed street protests about it are all sham?

Yes. Quite obvious. It was their best approach no doubt.

Snow Garden

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Dara Calleary not happy either in FF camp, effectively demoted, there will be others disgruntled too, rumblings already.
Party infighting might well take the shine off the new jobs.

Yes but it was a clever decision. He is the best FF candidate for Chief Whip. I am not sure that he will be entirely unhappy.

TCDStudent1

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Eamon making excuses already over direct provision.
It may take the full length of the new Govt he says.
So basically if the govt lasts three to four years it won't change.
That's one of the pledges on the long finger anyway and it's only day 2.
That and an upcoming leadership battle will take a few minds off the job in the early stages.
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/new-transport-minister-ryan-warns-against-going-on-foreign-holidays-39323360.html

Dara Calleary not happy either in FF camp, effectively demoted, there will be others disgruntled too, rumblings already.
Party infighting might well take the shine off the new jobs.

Its a hard one to understand. Appointing Calleary (or Rabbitte) would have solved the western geography issue. Both of those have been very prominent in recent times for FF. Even harder to understand when a back bencher was appointed to a high profile education job. Unless Martin has been so overwhelmingly impressed with that backbencher. But if he was that impressed, surely she should have been on the front bench?!

nc6000

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

Its a hard one to understand. Appointing Calleary (or Rabbitte) would have solved the western geography issue. Both of those have been very prominent in recent times for FF. Even harder to understand when a back bencher was appointed to a high profile education job. Unless Martin has been so overwhelmingly impressed with that backbencher. But if he was that impressed, surely she should have been on the front bench?!

But she was only elected in February and to appoint her to the frontbench would have needed a reshuffle of some sort which would have been unlikely to happen while they were trying to form a government. I wouldn't have thought Thomas Byrne is impressed anyway.

Floppybits

nc6000 wrote: »

It's interesting to be starting of with a new Government where the Chief Whip is already not happy.

I know once someone is appointed Leader of a party that the knives will be out for that person but has Martin some sort of death wish with the decisions he has made?

Already he had O'Cuiv and McGuiness against him and now he has managed to make the deputy leader, the party faithful along the Western Seaboard unhappy and also has probably turned a couple of more people against him like O'Callaghan and Byrne.

Plus the way the departments were divded, I am sure FG are laughing now that they have managed to the dump Health and Housing onto the FF. I think if I was a FF party member I wouldn't be a happy camper.

TCDStudent1

Floppybits wrote: »

I know once someone is appointed Leader of a party that the knives will be out for that person but has Martin some sort of death wish with the decisions he has made?

Already he had O'Cuiv and McGuiness against him and now he has managed to make the deputy leader, the party faithful along the Western Seaboard unhappy and also has probably turned a couple of more people against him like O'Callaghan and Byrne.

Plus the way the departments were divded, I am sure FG are laughing now that they have managed to the dump Health and Housing onto the FF. I think if I was a FF party member I wouldn't be a happy camper.

Never thought of that!!!

hoodie6029

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Dara Calleary not happy either in FF camp, effectively demoted, there will be others disgruntled too, rumblings already.

He led the campaign in his party to retain the 8th Amendment when his leader wanted to repeal it. He got the public mood badly wrong on that one. Mayo voted 57% in favour of repealing it.

After going against his leader, he expected a full Ministeral role? Michael McGrath backtracked and said he got it wrong and look where he is. Not getting a portfolio is the consequence of his campaign

maccored

mariaalice wrote: »

Labour will make a bit of resurgence, I would not be so quick to say SF is the only real opposition.

SF will be the main opposition. Labour have 6 seats. bit late for a resurgence

maccored

blanch152 wrote: »

So all the whinging and crying about being excluded from negotiations and the proposed street protests about it are all sham?

Nope - that was trying to do what the voters wished (strange concept I know to FF and FG and their voters ). They couldnt do that but they also arent in a bad place, and they know it.

namloc1980

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Dara Calleary not happy either in FF camp, effectively demoted, there will be others disgruntled too, rumblings already.
Party infighting might well take the shine off the new jobs.

He was against MM on repeal the 8th, he was the director of elections for the GE which wasn't exactly a resounding success and he also hasn't been shadowing any minister on the front bench since 2018 - he was put in charge of party policy formulation or some such. The writing has been on the wall for him so it can't have been a surprise really. But Government Chief Whip is a big role and with 3 parties involved it's a serious job. Norma Foley was a big surprise and Anne Rabbitte getting nothing but maybe Norma Foley has been massively impressive - who knows.

aido79

markodaly wrote: »

I've have been reading some of the comments the past few days, and is it surprising that the same half dozen posters are still giving it yarns?

No, not at all.
They think politics is akin to Man United vs Liverpool.

For me, I wish the government well, as if they do a good job, they the nation as a whole will benefit.

Using the Man Utd vs Liverpool as a comparison is actually very relative.
Man Utd won their first game 4-0. Liverpool won theirs 4-1. So shouldn't Man Utd have been handed the premier league trophy after the game?
That's what it's like when SF voters say they should be in government or they won the election because they got the most first preference votes.

Elmo

mariaalice wrote: »

Labour will make a bit of resurgence, I would not be so quick to say SF is the only real opposition.

Labour are going to spend the next few years battling SF, SF will ignore them, while SD will (if smart) ignore both Labour and SF.

Look at Labour's resurgence V The Greens, while The Greens have a general worldwide global appeal helping them go from 2 seats to 12, Labour just held 6, SDs up 4 to 6.

Labour are in a very bad place and so far in this Dail they have yet to prove themselves, except to their Die Hard's. Both speaches were more of an attack on SF then the government.

Labour we will work with you when we agree with you, but will oppose Sinn Fein, no hand out to SF (In other words even if we agree with SF we will never agree with SF).

Bannasidhe

Things must be very bad internally in FF when not one but two party stalwarts go public with criticism just two days after MM is made Taoiseach.
Derek Mooney leaves the party and says why in his weekly column https://www.broadsheet.ie/2020/06/29/derek-mooney-you-cant-expel-me-ive-already-quit/?utm_source=internal&utm_medium=web&utm_content=latest_comments#comment-2210453

And Conor Linehan states he fears this is the end of FF https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/conor-lenihan-fianna-f%C3%A1il-faces-possibility-of-extinction-1.4290820?mode=amp

I would be of the same opinion as Linehan (there's a sentence I never thought I'd write) and said so on Sat in this thread. I think this could well be the end of FF unless they can pull off something spectacular - and I don't think they have the talent for it in their ranks. FG have out maneuvered then on the right(ish), SF have out maneuvered them on the left(ish) and FF are left without a clear identity. No one is quite sure what they actually stand for ...