FF/FG/Green Next Government

Bannasidhe

blanch152 wrote: »

Let me get this straight.

If, and it’s a big if, because we have no evidence it will happen, so if Foster copies Sinn Fein and breaks social distancing rules, this shows Foster up, but Sinn Fein are still entitled to a hall pass. Do I understand you correctly?

Just trying to get this straight in my head.

Personally I think it was ill advised - to be charitable - of SF leadership to attend a large funeral during restrictions. I also think MO'N shouldn't have travelled to Dublin when she did.

However, I think having a go at SF members for attending a large funeral when Charlie Flanagan while still Minister for Justice, plus the Garda Commissioner and high ranking members of an Gardaí can clearly be seen attending a large funeral with serious lack of social distancing is a bit hypocritical.

Both funerals were large with a notable lack of social distancing. Both, imho, were disrespectful to those thousands of mourners who couldn't say a proper farewell to their departed loved ones.
Both could have been properly policed (metaphorically and literally) to ensure social distancing.

In NI the PSNI should have tactfully stepped in, in RoI the Gardaí were, ironically, part of the funeral and ignored what was happening.

If Foster wants Orange Parades to go ahead she's demonstrating she's no better than the rest of them. And turning down a gold plated opportunity to score political points.

Bowie

Bowie wrote: »

The south too.

Newly formed government. Posts being given out. Seante drawing from a hat. National crises, Covid, Brexit...dig at the shinners, (free pass for the Garda doing the same thing).

MON apology actually knocked a story about the reported number of Covid deaths off the top spot on RTE.

The point people seem to be missing is that these politicians want us to look up to them. Then they do something so insensitive that they think simply saying sorry is enough.

Regarding the Gardai paying their respects to their comrade, communities around the country have been doing similar guards of honour when they couldn’t attend a funeral. They didn’t cross a border into another state to do so.

christy c

Bowie wrote: »

Took your politicians refusing seats out of the papers any way. Took a report on the wrong numbers of covid deaths being released off the top spot. Handy that.

They have Sinn Fein and their political stupidity followed by their arrogance to thank for that.

Brendan Bendar

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Personally I think it was ill advised - to be charitable - of SF leadership to attend a large funeral during restrictions. I also think MO'N shouldn't have travelled to Dublin when she did.

However, I think having a go at SF members for attending a large funeral when Charlie Flanagan while still Minister for Justice, plus the Garda Commissioner and high ranking members of an Gardaí can clearly be seen attending a large funeral with serious lack of social distancing is a bit hypocritical.

Both funerals were large with a notable lack of social distancing. Both, imho, were disrespectful to those thousands of mourners who couldn't say a proper farewell to their departed loved ones.
Both could have been properly policed (metaphorically and literally) to ensure social distancing.

In NI the PSNI should have tactfully stepped in, in RoI the Gardaí were, ironically, part of the funeral and ignored what was happening.

If Foster wants Orange Parades to go ahead she's demonstrating she's no better than the rest of them. And turning down a gold plated opportunity to score political points.

If the PSNI in NI had “tactfully stepped in” what do you think would have been the outcome?

Bannasidhe

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

If the PSNI in NI had “tactfully stepped in” what do you think would have been the outcome?

Not the point.

If there was disorder then rightfully the organisers should be firmly taken to task and SF - if they failed to act with the PSNI to ensure social distancing rules were adhered to - should be rightfully pilloried.
But the fact remains the PSNI didn't act and that is down to a policy decision with the force - has anyone asked them why they didn't?

In RoI the Gardaí took part. The top brass were there. They could have acted to ensure social distancing in a way that was respectful to a fallen member of the force, the serving members of the force putting themselves at risk of infection, and those whose loved ones had no proper final sending off - no matter how deeply loved they were.
That did not happen.
The crowds are there to see for all on-line. There was no social distancing.

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

No. In fact you couldn't be more wrong.

If Foster is complaining the shinners were irresponsible for not social distancing, (which I agree they were and you know this) and then uses that to justify having an orange march, it means she never had an issue based on public safety.
You really have to get off this 'one cancels the other out' philosophy. That's all you Blanch.
Both the garda and SF were wrong not to socially distance. One doesn't excuse the other.
It's like Varadkar using quotes from Lord of the Rings and Mean Girls, for fun, for an inside joke, disrespecting those who died during Covid isn't cancelled out by FG councillor O'Leary admiring the fascist blueshirts and comparing them to FG of today.

It would be the height of arrogance and hypocrisy for Sinn Fein, their leaders or any of their followers, supporters and voters to complain about anyone else not social distancing following the behaviour at that funeral.

The rush to find "he did it too" this time with unfair comparisons to the garda funeral mirrors the "he hit me first" explanation for the terrorist campaign. It is childish and false at best.

Bannasidhe

blanch152 wrote: »

It would be the height of arrogance and hypocrisy for Sinn Fein, their leaders or any of their followers, supporters and voters to complain about anyone else not social distancing following the behaviour at that funeral.

The rush to find "he did it too" this time with unfair comparisons to the garda funeral mirrors the "he hit me first" explanation for the terrorist campaign. It is childish and false at best.

On the contrary the rush to condemn SF when an FG minister and An Gardaí did it too is childish and false at best.

If the rules apply to all of us then the rules apply to all of us.
Regardless.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

It would be the height of arrogance and hypocrisy for Sinn Fein, their leaders or any of their followers, supporters and voters to complain about anyone else not social distancing following the behaviour at that funeral.

The rush to find "he did it too" this time with unfair comparisons to the garda funeral mirrors the "he hit me first" explanation for the terrorist campaign. It is childish and false at best.

Nobody has yet explained why the comparisons to other funerals are invalid..we have had quite a few and latitude (in layman's terms a blind eye was turned) was given when very obviously, regs were being broken because they were funerals.

The virus does not distinguish between state funerals, the funeral of an SDLP man, a child, an Orange parade or any other large gathering.

SF did not get this right, no doubt about that and I am glad they have apologised for the hurt caused, but the joyful way it is being politically played by the usual suspects is pathetic and looking for a woman to apologise for attending a friends funeral is frankly obscene. Especially from those who could not even bring themselves to say Leo Varadkar was sending the wrong message by publicly drinking cans in the park.



Stop with the hypocrisy.

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Nobody has yet explained why the comparisons to other funerals are invalid..we have had quite a few and latitude (in layman's terms a blind eye was turned) was given when very obviously, regs were being broken because they were funerals.

The virus does not distinguish between state funerals, the funeral of an SDLP man, a child, an Orange parade or any other large gathering.

SF did not get this right, no doubt about that and I am glad they have apologised for the hurt caused, but the joyful way it is being politically played by the usual suspects is pathetic and looking for a woman to apologise for attending a friends funeral is frankly obscene. Especially from those who could not even bring themselves to say Leo Varadkar was sending the wrong message by publicly drinking cans in the park.



Stop with the hypocrisy.

Maybe because it was in another jurisdiction. When there’s a ban on unnecessary travel.

Brendan Bendar

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Not the point.

If there was disorder then rightfully the organisers should be firmly taken to task and SF - if they failed to act with the PSNI to ensure social distancing rules were adhered to - should be rightfully pilloried.
But the fact remains the PSNI didn't act and that is down to a policy decision with the force - has anyone asked them why they didn't?

In RoI the Gardaí took part. The top brass were there. They could have acted to ensure social distancing in a way that was respectful to a fallen member of the force, the serving members of the force putting themselves at risk of infection, and those whose loved ones had no proper final sending off - no matter how deeply loved they were.
That did not happen.
The crowds are there to see for all on-line. There was no social distancing.

Are you seriously comparing the murder of a serving Garda to a normal funeral.?

Answer the question, what do you think would be the outcome if the PSNI has intervened in Mr Storeys funeral, as you suggested was an option?

You have a lot of questions to answer, a chara.

So far none forthcoming

FrancieBrady

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe because it was in another jurisdiction. When there’s a ban on unnecessary travel.

What ban? That restriction has been lifted...both Doherty and MLMD have said if the funeral had been last week they wouldn't have and couldn't have gone.

McMurphy

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Are you seriously comparing the murder of a serving Garda to a normal funeral.?

Time to put up of shut up here bren.

This arseboxing about "comparing funerals" is just that, arseboxing.

What's being compared is the lack of social distancing from the mourners at the funerals.

One group = state funeral, the virus can't be contracted nor spread by mourner's because it's a state funeral?

The other group of mourners not socially distancing = destroy them with fire, worse than Hitler!

Answer the question, what do you think would be the outcome if the PSNI has intervened in Mr Storeys funeral, as you suggested was an option?

You have a lot of questions to answer, a chara.

So far none forthcoming

Can't wait to hear what excuse the Gardai in Mayo will use for them failing to intervene.

James Brown

Deleted User wrote: »

The point people seem to be missing is that these politicians want us to look up to them. Then they do something so insensitive that they think simply saying sorry is enough.

Regarding the Gardai paying their respects to their comrade, communities around the country have been doing similar guards of honour when they couldn’t attend a funeral. They didn’t cross a border into another state to do so.

It's actually the original point Maryanne.

Making excuses now.
Both should have socially distanced and did not. Both wrong not to do so. At least MON apologised, ner a peep from Charlie.

Brendan Bendar

McMurphy wrote: »

Time to put up of shut up here bren.

This arseboxing about "comparing funerals" is just that, arseboxing.

What's being compared is the lack of social distancing from the mourners at the funerals.

One group = state funeral, the virus can't be contracted nor spread by mourner's because it's a state funeral?

The other group of mourners not socially distancing = destroy them with fire, worse than Hitler!


Can't wait to hear what excuse the Gardai in Mayo will use for them failing to intervene.

What’s being compared, my friend, is the restraint shown by Ireland’s leaders in staying away versus NIs leaders breaking their own rules.


Try to keep up,a chara.

James Brown

christy c wrote: »

They have Sinn Fein and their political stupidity followed by their arrogance to thank for that.

Not really Christy.
You are now blaming SF for the media and others making hypocritical points and outrage off it? :rolleyes:
It shows me the media are still desperately skewed by dodging real national issues of greater concern. Making SF look like the victims now the longer it drags on.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What ban? That restriction has been lifted...both Doherty and MLMD have said if the funeral had been last week they wouldn't have and couldn't have gone.

You are behind the news, Francie, the order lifting the restriction didn't take effect until the evening after the funeral.

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

Not really Christy.
You are now blaming SF for the media and others making hypocritical points and outrage off it? :rolleyes:
It shows me the media are still desperately skewed by dodging real national issues of greater concern. Making SF look like the victims now the longer it drags on.

The thing is, anonymous internet posters like you and me don't get to choose the real national issues of greater concern. The media, on the back of the general public, tend to do that.

There is anger out there at the arrogance of Sinn Fein through this. One rule for their funerals, other rules for others. Bobby Storey was nobody special, just an ordinary criminal thug.

You guys are making it worse by bringing up the Garda funeral. What you don't get is that ordinary people are prepared to give a pass to a State funeral for a garda killed in the line of duty but aren't prepared to give a pass to a Shinner funeral for a criminal thug who killed ordinary people for nothing.

You call that hypocrisy, I call it appropriate.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

It would be the height of arrogance and hypocrisy for Sinn Fein, their leaders or any of their followers, supporters and voters to complain about anyone else not social distancing following the behaviour at that funeral.

The rush to find "he did it too" this time with unfair comparisons to the garda funeral mirrors the "he hit me first" explanation for the terrorist campaign. It is childish and false at best.

Nope. Again, that's all you.
You keep twisting it, I'll keep calling you on it.
You are inferring opinion on others then criticising it. Classic stuff.

The hypocrisy of the likes of yourself pretending to be outraged at the shinner funeral to score points while ignoring and in some cases excusing the same behaviour elsewhere is being pointing out time and again.

Can I expect your response to how the councillor O'Leary tweet admiring the fascist Blueshirts and likening them to present day FG was 'misrepresentation'?

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

Nope. Again, that's all you.
You keep twisting it, I'll keep calling you on it.
You are inferring opinion on others then criticising it. Classic stuff.

The hypocrisy of the likes of yourself pretending to be outraged at the shinner funeral to score points while ignoring and in some cases excusing the same behaviour elsewhere is being pointing out time and again.

I fully understand why the vast majority of ordinary people are prepared to give a pass to the State funeral of a garda killed in the line of duty, but not prepared to give a pass to the funeral of a Sinn Fein criminal thug who made a virtue out of killing people.

It is very easy to distinguish between the two, and it is not a bit hypocritical. It is only hypocritical if you consider the two to be equal in status. I certainly don't and I think the vast majority of ordinary people would agree with me.

Brendan Bendar

blanch152 wrote: »

You are behind the news, Francie, the order lifting the restriction didn't take effect until the evening after the funeral.

Nothing new about that....

christy c

Bowie wrote: »

Not really Christy.
You are now blaming SF for the media and others making hypocritical points and outrage off it? :rolleyes:
It shows me the media are still desperately skewed by dodging real national issues of greater concern. Making SF look like the victims now the longer it drags on.

I am not blaming SF for the media. I am blaming SF for making a stupid political move, and then doubling down with their arrogance. The other 4 parties have asked MON to step aside, while I dont think it is warranted, it is news and will be reported.

Hand waving this away (to borrow the SF fans phrase), saying what about someone else, or laughably trying to portray SF as the victims is not working.

If heads had been kept down, this would have blown over.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

The thing is, anonymous internet posters like you and me don't get to choose the real national issues of greater concern. The media, on the back of the general public, tend to do that.

There is anger out there at the arrogance of Sinn Fein through this. One rule for their funerals, other rules for others. Bobby Storey was nobody special, just an ordinary criminal thug.

You guys are making it worse by bringing up the Garda funeral. What you don't get is that ordinary people are prepared to give a pass to a State funeral for a garda killed in the line of duty but aren't prepared to give a pass to a Shinner funeral for a criminal thug who killed ordinary people for nothing.

You call that hypocrisy, I call it appropriate.

The Garda funeral is only raised to show your hypocrisy. Nobody was complaining about the garda funeral. if you were at all credible you'd apply the same standards to everyone equally.

We are allowed opinions Blanch. If you think the media are right to put this above all else, (including an actual story on Covid death numbers) that's cool.

blanch152 wrote: »

... Reacting now to the latest sensationalist media fascination is not for me, I am usually far ahead of and above that.

blanch152 wrote: »

The problem when you rely on sensational news articles is that they don't tell the real story.
....

oops...

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

You are behind the news, Francie, the order lifting the restriction didn't take effect until the evening after the funeral.

What?

Travel restrictions were lifted 5 days ago. The day after the funeral was 2 days ago.

Bannasidhe

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Are you seriously comparing the murder of a serving Garda to a normal funeral.?

Answer the question, what do you think would be the outcome if the PSNI has intervened in Mr Storeys funeral, as you suggested was an option?

You have a lot of questions to answer, a chara.

So far none forthcoming

I am saying if the rules apply to all of us then the rules apply to all of us regardless of circumstances.

Does a virus care why crowds have gathered?

We have over 1,500 people dead in this jurisdiction from a contagious virus, not to mention the toll it has taken on the living - of the 8,018 Health Care Workers who became infected 89% were infecting doing their job. 7 healthcare workers have died. In the performance of their duties. Not one of them got a State funeral. They were quietly sent to their last resting place amid the restrictions we are all meant to follow.

It was perfectly possible that under the circumstances An Garda could have led by example and ensured that social distancing was maintained as a mark of respect to their fallen comrade, and the HCW's who also gave their lives.

If you think making excuses for why it is ok to have a large funeral in the middle of a health crises that has caused the deaths of frontline staff while we are being warned a second surge is very possible then it's not me who has to answer question, a chara.

Brendan Bendar

Bannasidhe wrote: »

I am saying if the rules apply to all of us then the rules apply to all of us regardless of circumstances.

Does a virus care why crowds have gathered?

We have over 1,500 people dead in this jurisdiction from a contagious virus, not to mention the toll it has taken on the living - of the 8,018 Health Care Workers who became infected 89% were infecting doing their job. 7 healthcare workers have died. In the performance of their duties. Not one of them got a State funeral. They were quietly sent to their last resting place amid the restrictions we are all meant to follow.

It was perfectly possible that under the circumstances An Garda could have led by example and ensured that social distancing was maintained as a mark of respect to their fallen comrade, and the HCW's who also gave their lives.

If you think making excuses for why it is ok to have a large funeral in the middle of a health crises that has caused the deaths of frontline staff while we are being warned a second surge is very possible then it's not me who has to answer question, a chara.

More deflection and rubbish.

The leaders of SF thought it appropriate to attend a funeral when others didn’t attend a State funeral.

One of them made a watery apology after disrupting the relationships up there.

Shows the respect McDonald and O’Neill have for the frontline staff in Health.

Then to compound the insult they appoint the ‘break the State’ guy as Health
‘Spokesman’
And then they wonder why honest and decent people won’t talk to them.

C’mon man, you need to think on your feet and not be used by chancers

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

More deflection and rubbish.

The leaders of SF thought it appropriate to attend a funeral when others didn’t attend a State funeral.

One of them made a watery apology after disrupting the relationships up there.

Shows the respect McDonald and O’Neill have for the frontline staff in Health.

The to compound the insult they appoint the ‘break the State’ guy as Health
‘Spokesman’
And then they wonder why honest and decent people won’t talk to them.

C’mon man, you need to think on your feet and not be used by chancers

Two different restriction times. SF said they woukd not have attended last week because guess what? There were restrictions

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Two different restriction times. SF said they woukd not have attended last week because guess what? There were restrictions

Heh heh he keep digging Francie, you are good at that.

Defending the indefensible...... now lookit... I haven’t got three months to dance on the head of a pin, a chara.

Your woman got it wrong, dude, real wrong.

Take care..

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Heh heh he keep digging Francie, you are good at that.

Defending the indefensible...... now lookit... I haven’t got three months to dance on the head of a pin, a chara.

Your woman got it wrong, dude, real wrong.

Take care..

I think the guy misrepresenting is the one doing the championship digging.

Bannasidhe

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

More deflection and rubbish.

The leaders of SF thought it appropriate to attend a funeral when others didn’t attend a State funeral.

One of them made a watery apology after disrupting the relationships up there.

Shows the respect McDonald and O’Neill have for the frontline staff in Health.

Then to compound the insult they appoint the ‘break the State’ guy as Health
‘Spokesman’
And then they wonder why honest and decent people won’t talk to them.

C’mon man, you need to think on your feet and not be used by chancers

Look at the photographs of Garda Horkan's funeral.
Tell me that in the middle of a pandemic when we are urged to keep 2 metres apart that that is what happened.

It didn't.

There is no deflection, or being led by chancers.

It is looking at what is in front of me and not letting ideology get in the way.

There was no social distancing at Garda Horkan's funeral.

Bannasidhe

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Look at the photographs of Garda Horkan's funeral.
Tell me that in the middle of a pandemic when we are urged to keep 2 metres apart that that is what happened.

It didn't.

There is no deflection, or being led by chancers.

It is looking at what is in front of me and not letting ideology get in the way.

There was no social distancing at Garda Horkan's funeral.

But, where was Garda Horkans funeral? In the Republic. Not across a border in another jurisdiction. One would have thought that MaryLou especially would be aware of the dangers of Covid infection.