FF/FG/Green Next Government

Hawthorn Tree

Truthvader wrote: »

Well if we're playing the Sinn Fein comparison gane "lucky to be alive" is the key phrase. They mightn't even get the body back if there was a Sinn Fein IRA whisteblower

I wasn't playing any Sinn Fein comparison, whatever than means. Is your brain capable of any other automated but idiotic response? If you dont understand the reference with McCabe, just ask.

Hawthorn Tree

Rows Grower wrote: »

If Coveney gets the gig, and he would be a great choice in my opinion, then FG will be in a bit of a dilemma who to run to take his seat because Buttimer is in still in the thick of this controversy.

Cork TDs are letting their constituents down a lot lately. There must be loads of anger still over the Dara Murphy antics.

Truthvader

Hawthorn Tree wrote: »

I wasn't playing any Sinn Fein comparison, whatever than means. Is your brain capable of any other automated but idiotic response? If you dont understand the reference with McCabe, just ask.

Because only an idiot would mention all the crime and thuggery

Hawthorn Tree

Truthvader wrote: »

Because only an idiot would mention all the crime and thuggery

Here is my original post

McCabe was let down by the state on so many fronts. He is lucky to be alive. The interview Yates did with McCabe and his wife a few months ago was powerful stuff. Compelling. I have so much admiration for that man and his long suffering family. I am not sure the rot and corruption in the Gardai has been cleaned up but it has improved.

Educate yourself

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/garda-whistleblower-maurice-mccabes-wife-feared-he-would-kill-himself-885008.html

The wife of Garda whistleblower Maurice McCabe has said she was afraid her husband would kill himself over false allegations of sexual assault.

“We put all the kids to bed and I told Lorraine in the sitting room and I broke down,” he said. “She hugged me and she cried and that’s how I told her.”

Lorraine McCabe said: “I knew it was wrong but it doesn’t make it any easier. I was afraid he would take his own life.”

The Disclosures Tribunal found former Garda commissioner Martin Callinan was part of a “campaign of calumny” against Mr McCabe, aided by his former press officer, Superintendent David Taylor.

Mr McCabe said the allegations by a girl, known as Ms D, “completely changed our family life, completely”.

“I didn’t bath the kids ever again, or wash them,” he said.

“I wouldn’t be here if there were visitors with their children, I’d always have something to do or somewhere to go.”

Your 2 responses look very foolish now, don't they?

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

Well if we're playing the Sinn Fein comparison gane "lucky to be alive" is the key phrase. They mightn't even get the body back if there was a Sinn Fein IRA whisteblower

We're not.

RandomViewer

Hawthorn Tree wrote: »

I wasn't playing any Sinn Fein comparison, whatever than means. Is your brain capable of any other automated but idiotic response? If you dont understand the reference with McCabe, just ask.

The Truthevader is a former guard, gets very worked up when you mention corruption in the Garda , seem to have similar attitude as the Church to members doing bad things,

McMurphy

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Would it be right to say the angry reaction to Frances being nominated has sent FG looking in a direction it didn't want to look in - a sitting TD (Coveney) which will require a by-election and Mairead McGuinness?

It's going pretty much exactly how I thought it might when I heard she (Fitzgerald) was to be considered a nomination.

Lots of twitter users this morning linking the infamous emails and various other aspects of the Maurice McCabe scandal directly to Ursala von der Leyen.

Truthvader

Hawthorn Tree wrote: »

Here is my original post



Educate yourself

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/garda-whistleblower-maurice-mccabes-wife-feared-he-would-kill-himself-885008.html



Your 2 responses look very foolish now, don't they?

No you're just not able to keep up. McCabe was treated very badly by the guards as a result of his decision to tell the truth. Ultimately he was vindicated. Eamonn Collins told the truth about Sinn Fein IRA and ultimately was vindi..... Oh no , they found his body beaten to death on a border road. Gettit now?

Bannasidhe

Bishop of hope wrote: »

SF topped the poll there in the election.
Would that have been the case if candidates were reduced?
Either FF or SF most likely to win that by-election if Coveney goes I reckon.

I know CSC well and I can't see FF taking 3 seats there. I can actually see Martin struggle to hold his seat.

SF were always in a strong position to take the old 'Labour' seat. There was always a strong left of centre voting bloc in CSC and Labour urinated it away. Now SF are attracting many of those voters, plus disaffected FFers (e.g. my 86 year old Mam).

SF have a shot at 2 but FG should hold it if they run the right candidate - not Buttimer, he was already a busted flush before he went to play golf.

Personally I would like to see the SDs take it , I can't really see that happening - but they did pull off a surprise in West Cork so it's not impossible if they garner the Green vote plus the 'want an alternative but can't stomach SF' vote.

Truthvader

RandomViewer wrote: »

The Truthevader is a former guard, gets very worked up when you mention corruption in the Garda , seem to have similar attitude as the Church to members doing bad things,

Nothing worse than being a guard for a certain kind of person. A criminal.

Hawthorn Tree

RandomViewer wrote: »

The Truthevader is a former guard, gets very worked up when you mention corruption in the Garda , seem to have similar attitude as the Church to members doing bad things,

Ok I didn't know. I wont expect an apology so.

RandomViewer

Truthvader wrote: »

Nothing worse than being a guard for a certain kind of person. A criminal.

Problem is the Gardai are riddled with criminals, were you one of them?

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

No you're just not able to keep up. McCabe was treated very badly by the guards as a result of his decision to tell the truth. Ultimately he was vindicated. Eamonn Collins told the truth about Sinn Fein IRA and ultimately was vindi..... Oh no , they found his body beaten to death on a border road. Gettit now?

Give Garda McCabe the respect of allowing his story be told. It's a government thread discussing one of the key players in his story possibly getting the FG 'we look after our own' treatment despite her incompetence and murky record in office.

Hawthorn Tree

Truthvader wrote: »

No you're just not able to keep up. McCabe was treated very badly by the guards as a result of his decision to tell the truth. Ultimately he was vindicated. Eamonn Collins told the truth about Sinn Fein IRA and ultimately was vindi..... Oh no , they found his body beaten to death on a border road. Gettit now?

The context was Frances Fitzgerald who let down Maurice McCabe repeatedly, there was zero reference to SF/IRA. I am not a Sinn Fein supporter. I never have been. Actually I am not going to engage with you further...Mark Twain said it best 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience'.

James Brown

McMurphy wrote: »

It's going pretty much exactly how I thought it might when I heard she (Fitzgerald) was to be considered a nomination.

Lots of twitter users this morning linking the infamous emails and various other aspects of the Maurice McCabe scandal directly to Ursala von der Leyen.

EU positions always seems to be more of a slap on the back for a party crony than 'the best people'. Might be an idea, in a healthly democracy, the new supposed post civil war politics era, to look for the best person regardless of party?
Wouldn't fit with the 'gimme gimme, mine mine' calibre of these people though.

Truthvader

Bowie wrote: »

Give Garda McCabe the respect of allowing his story be told. It's a government thread discussing one of the key players in his story possibly getting the FG 'we look after our own' treatment despite her incompetence and murky record in office.

Ah the Sinn Fein "respect for the guards". Ha ha ha

Bannasidhe

Hawthorn Tree wrote: »

Cork TDs are letting their constituents down a lot lately. There must be loads of anger still over the Dara Murphy antics.

The fury in Cork with FF, FG, GP, and LP - North and South Central - is palpable.

McGrath is probably the safest of the current govt TDs as (much as I dislike FF) I have to give him credit for being a good constituency TD.
The Cork Greens are in open revolt against the party leadership.
The LP is, I think, finished in Cork.

We could, hopefully, be looking at a better spread of party affiliations in Cork in the future with the days for 2 FF/FG seats per constituency a thing of the past.

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

Ah the Sinn Fein "respect for the guards". Ha ha ha

...so that would be a 'no'.

Hawthorn Tree

Bannasidhe wrote: »

The fury in Cork with FF, FG, GP, and LP - North and South Central - is palpable.

McGrath is probably the safest of the current govt TDs as (much as I dislike FF) I have to give him credit for being a good constituency TD.
The Cork Greens are in open revolt against the party leadership.
The LP is, I think, finished in Cork.

We could, hopefully, be looking at a better spread of party affiliations in Cork in the future with the days for 2 FF/FG seats per constituency a thing of the past.

I would love SDs to take it too. That would put them 1 TD ahead of the Labour Party in the Dail with 7 seats.

Bishop of hope

Bannasidhe wrote: »

I know CSC well and I can't see FF taking 3 seats there. I can actually see Martin struggle to hold his seat.

SF were always in a strong position to take the old 'Labour' seat. There was always a strong left of centre voting bloc in CSC and Labour urinated it away. Now SF are attracting many of those voters, plus disaffected FFers (e.g. my 86 year old Mam).

SF have a shot at 2 but FG should hold it if they run the right candidate - not Buttimer, he was already a busted flush before he went to play golf.

Personally I would like to see the SDs take it , I can't really see that happening - but they did pull off a surprise in West Cork so it's not impossible if they garner the Green vote plus the 'want an alternative but can't stomach SF' vote.

I wouldn't be too sure of FG holding, in fact I'd be surprised.
It's going to be a one seat shootout.
SF topped the poll with one candidate in the GE, but FF were miles ahead in first preferences.
FG were third on first preferences.
Depends on the candidates I suppose, but if it follows party preferences it should be a FF win.
SF might get it if there's a swing from FF like has been suggested in lately polls.

Bannasidhe

Bishop of hope wrote: »

I wouldn't be too sure of FG holding, in fact I'd be surprised.
It's going to be a one seat shootout.
SF topped the poll with one candidate in the GE, but FF were miles ahead in first preferences.
FG were third on first preferences.
Depends on the candidates I suppose, but if it follows party preferences it should be a FF win.
SF might get it if there's a swing from FF like has been suggested in lately polls.

2016 Martin and McGrath got in on the first count.

2020 Martin got in on the 6th count and McGrath on the 8th having failed to reach the quota.
The FF vote nearly collapsed in it's Cork stronghold and you think they might take a 3rd seat? I think they will be bloody lucky to hold the 2 they have.

FG might manage to hang on if, and it's a big if, they have a well known candidate with a 'name'. If they run Buttimer they will lose.

Lorna Bogue came within 1631 votes of knocking out McGrath (who is actually popular) - she has been highly critical of the Green's going into government - will she be willing to run for them again?
If the GP vote collapses where do you think her 5k+ FP votes will go? To FF? No way.

There is a left vote in CSC that is looking for a candidate - it used to be a Labour Vote, some of it went SF but not all. A good bit went Green.
The SDs didn't poll well but neither did Labour - the SDs are on the way up and LP on the way down.
If - and again it's a big if - the SDs can capture the Green vote they are in with a shot.
If Bogue left the Greens and joined the SDs I reckon she could take a seat.

Bishop of hope

I think you forget this is a separate election if it happens.
FF took by far the highest percentage votes there in the GE.
The same people get to vote again.
https://www.irishtimes.com/election2020/cork-south-central

Scoondal

Bannasidhe wrote: »

The fury in Cork with FF, FG, GP, and LP - North and South Central - is palpable.

McGrath is probably the safest of the current govt TDs as (much as I dislike FF) I have to give him credit for being a good constituency TD.
The Cork Greens are in open revolt against the party leadership.
The LP is, I think, finished in Cork.

We could, hopefully, be looking at a better spread of party affiliations in Cork in the future with the days for 2 FF/FG seats per constituency a thing of the past.

"LP" are the opposition.

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

Give Garda McCabe the respect of allowing his story be told.

Happy to the let the story of both Garda McCabes be told.

Bannasidhe

Bishop of hope wrote: »

I think you forget this is a separate election if it happens.
FF took by far the highest percentage votes there in the GE.
The same people get to vote again.
https://www.irishtimes.com/election2020/cork-south-central

I haven't forgotten anything - nor have the people of Cork South Central. The 2 candidates who topped the polls and romped home in 2016 struggled in 2020, one of them failing to make the quota. Sure - if you combine their vote together they get most of the votes - but it was close for McGrath. How you can possibly think FF could take a 3rd seat is a mystery to me.
If you - or the Irish Times - think FF have done enough during these last weeks in govt to reverse the decline in their vote in Cork you must be a) looking at a completely different govt to the one I am looking at and b) far far away from Cork.

Bannasidhe

Scoondal wrote: »

"LP" are the opposition.

Really.
Gee I hadn't noticed. But thanks for the heads up Captain Obvious.

Way to miss the point which is that opposition or not the LP's vote in Cork has completely collapsed.
It is now up for grabs. Last time SF and GP benefited - now the question is has the SF vote peaked and will the Greens be decimated?

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

Happy to the let the story of both Garda McCabes be told.

Seemingly not. Earlier we were talking about Frances Fitzgerald and her role during the McCabe Whistleblower/smear campaign as it related to her being a poor candidate to replace Hogan.

Bishop of hope

Bannasidhe wrote: »

I haven't forgotten anything - nor have the people of Cork South Central. The 2 candidates who topped the polls and romped home in 2016 struggled in 2020, one of them failing to make the quota. Sure - if you combine their vote together they get most of the votes - but it was close for McGrath. How you can possibly think FF could take a 3rd seat is a mystery to me.
If you - or the Irish Times - think FF have done enough during these last weeks in govt to reverse the decline in their vote in Cork you must be a) looking at a completely different govt to the one I am looking at and b) far far away from Cork.

Oh gosh, sorry.
I was looking for something to base how a new, poll might go.
You said FG should win it, what made you think that?
I said likely FF or SF originally and more than likely SF if the FF vote has collapsed, but you chose FG as being the favourites even though they're not yours.
You're basically talking yourself into an argument with me for something I haven't actually said, just based my assessment on the GE results.
And like it or not FF got the biggest vote.

markodaly

Bannasidhe wrote: »

If the GP vote collapses where do you think her 5k+ FP votes will go? To FF? No way.

I think a lot of those votes will go to FG and the SD's.

dundalkfc10

markodaly wrote: »

I think a lot of those votes will go to FG and the SD's.

You hope