FF/FG/Green Next Government

_Kaiser_

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Where's the data on this?

Several high profile members have no problem with it, why or how could you say what you did?

I'd rather see a FF/SF coalition (in the hope that each will moderate the other's more excessive tendencies) than a extremely fragile FF/FG/GP setup which has fundamental problems from day one.

I'd certainly prefer it to another 5 years of FG mismanagement led by the social media spin doctor, or Simon "Yes Europe" Coveney.

Truthvader

The_Conductor wrote: »

Republicanism, in an Irish context, encompasses the political will for the reunification of Ireland and reiterates the absolute independence of Ireland, alongside a belief that the subjugation of Irish rule on any part of our island is illegitimate.

I'm sure there are other definitions out there- like to give yours?

Nope I'm good with that. A united Ireland is not important to me one way or the other, though I expect that we (Republic of Ireland) couldn't afford to maintain the Norn Iron money pit the way the Brits do to buy off the two tribes. Accept that for many it is important to them though.

The reason I asked is that I generally only hear the phrase used to celebrate the likes of Bobby Storey and so it had come to mean "Sinn Fein/IRA thug" to my mind.

While on the subject of Bobby Storey I note that he ended his days in England availing of the NHS largesse notwithstanding his history of murder of the same people rather than take a chance in the only Republic available. I guess his own health took priority over his political allegiances- and who can blame him.

Pity he did not have the same regard for the health of others

landofthetree

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I'd rather see a FF/SF coalition (in the hope that each will moderate the other's more excessive tendencies) than a extremely fragile FF/FG/GP setup which has fundamental problems from day one.

I'd certainly prefer it to another 5 years of FG mismanagement led by the social media spin doctor, or Simon "Yes Europe" Coveney.

FF/SF is still 6 TDs short.

They would be just as fragile depending on indos or the flakey SDs.

Also how can you call FG EU yes men when all parties backed them on Brexit/EU issues.

ELM327

landofthetree wrote: »

FF/SF is still 6 TDs short.

They would be just as fragile depending on indos or the flakey SDs.

Not to mention diametrically opposed.

James Brown

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Evidence?

the discrepancy between the €44,000 paid per bed in Ireland and the €10,000 paid per bed in Britain.

“I will give one example as to why we need to see these figures. The Beacon Medical Group was bought by Mr Denis O’Brien for €35 million, according to The Irish Times. If they get €44,000 a month for 200 beds, the State will have paid more than €35 million in four months but will not own a bed at the end of that process.

Harris: “Under the heads of terms, private hospitals are funded to 80% of their estimated monthly costs in advance by the HSE.

So if paid 80% in advance how can they tell how many beds will be used? We are told theres a claw back, but we don't have details.

The two boyos didn't seem to be on the same page:

The State’s confidential deal to effectively take over 19 private hospitals during the Covid-19 crisis is expected to cost about €115 million per month.

The Irish Times understands that as part of the unpublished agreement the State has also agreed to reimburse the existing pay of top management in private hospitals by up to €200,000 per year.

Taoiseach Leo Varadkar said yesterday a bill of €115 million per month was an “accurate estimate” of the cost to the State of its deal to lease the 19 hospitals. However he said the actual cost will not be known until the end of the contract when all the bills were calculated.

Later Minister for Health Simon Harris told the Dáil the HSE had made advance payments for April of €90.2 million.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/private-hospital-deal-will-cost-state-115-million-per-month-1.4230969

And the government wasn't making the details known:

The Government has not published the private hospital agreement and the Department of Health has declined to answer questions about provisions in the deal, which contains a specific confidentiality clause.

Of course we've FG TD Brophy concerned that such moves are making private health insurance pointless. Akin to someone complaining about their grocery bill when the lad on the Trocaire box gets food for nothing.

FrancieBrady

Lorna Bogue grievances about anti-woman intimidation in the Greens to get another airing on Drivetime.

Could see this changing a few Green minds. Eamonn and the other party bigwigs always seemed a bit desperate to get this deal done.

Interesting few days

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

Nope I'm good with that. A united Ireland is not important to me one way or the other, though I expect that we (Republic of Ireland) couldn't afford to maintain the Norn Iron money pit the way the Brits do to buy off the two tribes. Accept that for many it is important to them though.

The reason I asked is that I generally only hear the phrase used to celebrate the likes of Bobby Storey and so it had come to mean "Sinn Fein/IRA thug" to my mind.

While on the subject of Bobby Storey I note that he ended his days in England availing of the NHS largesse notwithstanding his history of murder of the same people rather than take a chance in the only Republic available. I guess his own health took priority over his political allegiances- and who can blame him.

Pity he did not have the same regard for the health of others

I would love to see a United Ireland. I never heard of Bobby Storey before yesterday and I've given FG as many votes I've given SF.
Don't let your dislike for any one party steal your right to want a united Ireland, or not want it
Parties are built around ideals, but they don't own them.

Truthvader

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Lorna Bogue grievances about anti-woman intimidation in the Greens to get another airing on Drivetime.

Could see this changing a few Green minds. Eamonn and the other party bigwigs always seemed a bit desperate to get this deal done.

Interesting few days

Could they not get a man to make this complaint?

Truthvader

Bowie wrote: »

I would love to see a United Ireland. I never heard of Bobby Storey before yesterday and I've given FG as many votes I've given SF.
Don't let your dislike for any one party steal your right to want a united Ireland, or not want it
Parties are built around ideals, but they don't own them.

Fair enough. Just not bothered myself one way or the other. And certainly don't see it as a solution to anything. England has a united England and Boris is in charge running about painting planes and fantasising over Brexit etc.

For me its enough to be able to vote in who you want, earn a living without fear and live my life etc.

As to disliking parties, can live with any view and take or leave aspects of it but when it comes to Sinn Fein and their members and candidates either what they have done or their willingness to justify and glorify what they have done finishes them for me. It will be a very sinister Country if they ever take power.

Genuinely intrigued that anyone could move back and forth from Sinn Fein to Fine Gael. I am inclined to the view that you are young enough not to have lived through or remember what they did.

FrancieBrady

Truthvader wrote: »

I am inclined to the view that you are young enough not to have lived through or remember what they did.

It's almost a 100 years ago but anyone with a knowledge of history would know what the founders of FG did.

Truthvader

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It's almost a 100 years ago but anyone with a knowledge of history would know what the founders of FG did.

WTF is this nonsense? Are Fine Gael - or any other party running thieves and murderers as candidates or celebrating and glorying in their exploits?

Bowie

Bowie wrote: »

So if paid 80% in advance how can they tell how many beds will be used? We are told theres a claw back, but we don't have details.

The two boyos didn't seem to be on the same page:



And the government wasn't making the details known:



Of course we've FG TD Brophy concerned that such moves are making private health insurance pointless. Akin to someone complaining about their grocery bill when the lad on the Trocaire box gets food for nothing.

I’m sure that there’s some point in your post, but I cannot see it.

Imagine if those beds were needed urgently but weren’t available?

dundalkfc10

Truthvader wrote: »

WTF is this nonsense? Are Fine Gael - or any other party running thieves and murderers as candidates or celebrating and glorying in their exploits?

Plenty of thieves about the place, as the expenses scandal showed us.

Celebrating our History, Leo wanted to celebrate the RIC, why cant Sinn Fein celebrate Irish History?

FrancieBrady

Truthvader wrote: »

WTF is this nonsense? Are Fine Gael - or any other party running thieves and murderers as candidates or celebrating and glorying in their exploits?

How would I know that? Has anyone in FG been charged with thieving and murder?

ELM327

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Plenty of thieves about the place, as the expenses scandal showed us.

Celebrating our History, Leo wanted to celebrate the RUC, why cant Sinn Fein celebrate Irish History?

RIC

RandomViewer

Truthvader wrote: »

Nope I'm good with that. A united Ireland is not important to me one way or the other, though I expect that we (Republic of Ireland) couldn't afford to maintain the Norn Iron money pit the way the Brits do to buy off the two tribes. Accept that for many it is important to them though.

The reason I asked is that I generally only hear the phrase used to celebrate the likes of Bobby Storey and so it had come to mean "Sinn Fein/IRA thug" to my mind.

While on the subject of Bobby Storey I note that he ended his days in England availing of the NHS largesse notwithstanding his history of murder of the same people rather than take a chance in the only Republic available. I guess his own health took priority over his political allegiances- and who can blame him.

Pity he did not have the same regard for the health of others

Just wondering when Noonan pops his clogs will you have a similar view?

RandomViewer

landofthetree wrote: »

FF/SF is still 6 TDs short.

They would be just as fragile depending on indos or the flakey SDs.

Also how can you call FG EU yes men when all parties backed them on Brexit/EU issues.

Not really , there are two or three gene pool on each side without going to Kerry

RandomViewer

Truthvader wrote: »

WTF is this nonsense? Are Fine Gael - or any other party running thieves and murderers as candidates or celebrating and glorying in their exploits?

Thieving second nature to them and the way the fxxked the Regency trial they seem comfortable assisting murderers,
Any statement from Charlie as to why Lunnys van was burned?

RandomViewer

Watched part of Yates tonight show last night, Green party member being bullied by some heavy yoke, poor cxxt seemed very uncomfortable in his 1980s suit.

Shefwedfan

LawBoy2018 wrote: »

Stephen Donnelly seemed to get on rather well with Pearse Doherty last night on Tonight VMTV.

McMurphy wrote: »

Eamon O'Cuiv, and Pat the Cope Gallagher also if my memory is correct.

Next you will be telling us that a FF politican walked past Mary Lous house so that MUST mean they are in negotiations :pac:

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

Fair enough. Just not bothered myself one way or the other. And certainly don't see it as a solution to anything. England has a united England and Boris is in charge running about painting planes and fantasising over Brexit etc.

For me its enough to be able to vote in who you want, earn a living without fear and live my life etc.

As to disliking parties, can live with any view and take or leave aspects of it but when it comes to Sinn Fein and their members and candidates either what they have done or their willingness to justify and glorify what they have done finishes them for me. It will be a very sinister Country if they ever take power.

Genuinely intrigued that anyone could move back and forth from Sinn Fein to Fine Gael. I am inclined to the view that you are young enough not to have lived through or remember what they did.

Well SF have their beliefs and I agree with many if not all as regards a united Ireland, housing and society being more for the average person than an elite little cabal. That said if SF changed their housing policy more in line with FG, they'd not see a vote from me.
I would not be so dishonest as to pretend who and what the IRA were doesn't differ from person to person. I'd rather nobody shot anybody. I also don't criticise UK leaders and monarchs for celebrating Remembrance day. Each group has their own reasons for supporting and celebrating their armed forces. As many have for being critical. Pointing to either side after accepting and signing up to the peace process to score political points is being hypocritical IMO. Although many issues remain unresolved.
I use to believe Fine Gael were the party best suited to take the reins after the financial crash, despite their pandering to private and party concerns above that of the public. Like FF we know they can't help but do that. Also I know many decent FG'ers. We want the same things just feel differently about how they may be achieved.
These days I think FF/FG are never going to change and are actively engaged in a lot of what some claim to fear from a SF government, (corruption, sweet deal, cronyism, wasting tax payer money etc.).
FG could have transformed the entire country after the 2011 election. There was an appetite for it and they got voted in on a promise of doing so. They chose not to. I'll be hard pressed to get over that. The shenanigans and tom foolery of the current top tier make FG come across as an indifferent farce.
A sinister country is one were private business is put above the tax payer and the Taoiseach uses movie quotes to amuse himself and win bets for fun when speaking on a global pandemic and who doesn't seem to give a f*** how it comes across. It's also one were the electorate is dismissed or ridiculed for not voting the right way.

James Brown

Truthvader wrote: »

WTF is this nonsense? Are Fine Gael - or any other party running thieves and murderers as candidates or celebrating and glorying in their exploits?

Is that a can of worms you want to be opening?

James Brown

Deleted User wrote: »

I’m sure that there’s some point in your post, but I cannot see it.

Imagine if those beds were needed urgently but weren’t available?

It's about the costings Maryanne.

Did you imagine I said it was a bad idea? Like most things FG the way they do business is the problem.

Bowie

Bowie wrote: »

It's about the costings Maryanne.

Did you imagine I said it was a bad idea? Like most things FG the way they do business is the problem.

You seem to have misunderstood the post yourself. One is on about one hospital. The other about all hospitals.
And the comparison with England is like comparing apples and water. Cost of living in England not same as here. Nor welfare, etc.

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

I would love to see a United Ireland. I never heard of Bobby Storey before yesterday and I've given FG as many votes I've given SF.
Don't let your dislike for any one party steal your right to want a united Ireland, or not want it
Parties are built around ideals, but they don't own them.

If you never heard of Bobby Storey before yesterday, any vote for Sinn Fein was an uniformed one.

dundalkfc10

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I think you need to read the article.

As part of the government’s efforts to tackle the crisis, a huge recruitment drive across the health service is to get under way today according to Health Minister Simon Harris.

“We will hire everybody that we can to work in the Irish health service,” he said at yesterday’s press conference, appealing to retired healthcare professionals and students to apply.

He made a special plea to Irish healthcare workers abroad, to those working part-time and to medical students, saying “we need you”.

Harris later told RTɒs Claire Byrne Live Show: “A huge amount of work is being prepared.

Anyone who has a qualification and wants to work in the Irish health service will get a job… Your country needs you.

James Brown

Deleted User wrote: »

You seem to have misunderstood the post yourself. One is on about one hospital. The other about all hospitals.
And the comparison with England is like comparing apples and water. Cost of living in England not same as here. Nor welfare, etc.

Where you went wrong was the entire piece is about the cost and one hospitals details were used as an example.
It's not, it's comparing the costs of the same thing in the UK and using sterling.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

If you never heard of Bobby Storey before yesterday, any vote for Sinn Fein was an uniformed one.

I disagree completely.
You never heard of FG O'Leary, who admired the blueshirts in a tweet the other week, so had you ever voted FG, (;)) would that have made you an uniformed voter? I'm sure there's many FG fascist admirers or a SF 'RA head neither of us know about. Maybe a few Greens too?
Are you suggesting each voter get a personnel profile from party HQ HR of every party member or affiliate before voting? Would Varadkar have even met every FG member? Are you taking the piss?

Shefwedfan

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

As part of the government’s efforts to tackle the crisis, a huge recruitment drive across the health service is to get under way today according to Health Minister Simon Harris.

“We will hire everybody that we can to work in the Irish health service,” he said at yesterday’s press conference, appealing to retired healthcare professionals and students to apply.

He made a special plea to Irish healthcare workers abroad, to those working part-time and to medical students, saying “we need you”.

Harris later told RTɒs Claire Byrne Live Show: “A huge amount of work is being prepared.

Anyone who has a qualification and wants to work in the Irish health service will get a job… Your country needs you.

The bit in bold.....


If they dont have the money they can't hire anyone. Or you expect people to work for free?

James Brown

Shefwedfan wrote: »

The bit in bold.....


If they dont have the money they can't hire anyone. Or you expect people to work for free?

Ireland's Call was a dishonest PR stunt. 70,000 applied to help out, only 111 were followed up on and they were passed to a private recruitment agency.