Advice on dealing with factory

Bass Reeves

wrangler wrote: »

I'd consider a FS 1 a casualty, you'd have to see him hanging up before you'd go charging in. Farmers should insist on seeing a queried animal even with the present regulations, some carcases can be sh..e though
Without even seeing him I can say now I'd rather not be eating him. something desperate wrong with him to be a 265kg FS1 at 35 mths

I have seen bulls killed at FS 1, FS 1 is just seriously under fleshed with bullocks, with bulls it the physical fat cover. A SIM would not have bad confirmation. I be interested as well was he manually or machine graded. Manual graders can under grade poor fat cover animals by 2-4 units on the grid. I have finished a few such animals. Most are a pain in the hole. You have to keep by themselves and feed them 2-3 times a day as they will not consume 4-6 Kg otherwise. Actually it easier to finish 3-4 together of them than one. Animals are a herd animal they do not thrive by themselves.

OP said he had part of the hoof removed, but I be more annoyed by the FM not sending him home when he saw him or indicating there was an issue with him. It saves the FM hassle and it saves a lot of sh!t as well. As well Kepak were the first factory to more of less show a complete price grid for all animal types

As well we still are not sure of his exact FS

wrangler

Bass Reeves wrote: »

I have seen bulls killed at FS 1, FS 1 is just seriously under fleshed with bullocks, with bulls it the physical fat cover. A SIM would not have bad confirmation. I be interested as well was he manually or machine graded. Manual graders can under grade poor fat cover animals by 2-4 units on the grid. I have finished a few such animals. Most are a pain in the hole. You have to keep by themselves and feed them 2-3 times a day as they will not consume 4-6 Kg otherwise. Actually it easier to finish 3-4 together of them than one. Animals are a herd animal they do not thrive by themselves.

OP said he had part of the hoof removed, but I be more annoyed by the FM not sending him home when he saw him or indicating there was an issue with him. It saves the FM hassle and it saves a lot of sh!t as well. As well Kepak were the first factory to more of less show a complete price grid for all animal types

As well we still are not sure of his exact FS

I'd still be insisting on seeing the carcase as soon as there was a problem

blue5000

It's an awkward situation to be in OP.

Looking at it from the factory PoV
He's over 30 months,
under fleshed,
not QA,
out of spec for a lot of markets.

From your PoV he wasn't thriving etc. With the benefit of hindsight it would have been better if an agent looked at him in the field before all this happened.

Best thing to do now is take the 2 sides to a butcher, mince most of it and make burgers, stew beef and maybe get a few steaks out of it. Don't hang it for too long either as there isn't enough fat on it. Butcher can advise you on this. It's going to cost roughly 300 for a butcher, maybe less as it's in carcase form.

PM me if you want contact details of a butcher in the midlands.

Bullocks

blue5000 wrote: »

It's an awkward situation to be in OP.

Looking at it from the factory PoV
He's over 30 months,
under fleshed,
not QA,
out of spec for a lot of markets.

From your PoV he wasn't thriving etc. With the benefit of hindsight it would have been better if an agent looked at him in the field before all this happened.

Best thing to do now is take the 2 sides to a butcher, mince most of it and make burgers, stew beef and maybe get a few steaks out of it. Don't hang it for too long either as there isn't enough fat on it. Butcher can advise you on this. It's going to cost roughly 300 for a butcher, maybe less as it's in carcase form.

PM me if you want contact details of a butcher in the midlands.

Will the factory give you the animal back if you're not happy and if they do will you have to pay a fee for killing and cleaning him?

Cavanjack

If he quoted him 3.50 on the grid with a fs of at least 2+ well that’s what he should have got. He saw him that morning and said nothing. Id ring someone in the Ifa weather you are a member or not and they will tell you or find out if you’ve a case or not. I wouldn’t be accepting €200 anyway. You’d want to hurry before he is processed or lorried off.

Odelay

Does the factory manager run around giving extra money to lads when he finds a beast kills out better than he expected?

Bass Reeves

Cavanjack wrote: »

If he quoted him 3.50 on the grid with a fs of at least 2+ well that’s what he should have got. He saw him that morning and said nothing. Id ring someone in the Ifa weather you are a member or not and they will tell you or find out if you’ve a case or not. I wouldn’t be accepting €200 anyway. You’d want to hurry before he is processed or lorried off.

If he has a DS of even 2-/= he should only be deducted off the base. However OP was not familiar with the importance of FS's

wrangler

Cavanjack wrote: »

If he quoted him 3.50 on the grid with a fs of at least 2+ well that’s what he should have got. He saw him that morning and said nothing. Id ring someone in the Ifa weather you are a member or not and they will tell you or find out if you’ve a case or not. I wouldn’t be accepting €200 anyway. You’d want to hurry before he is processed or lorried off.

Thomas burke at IFA farm centre was good at sorting factory problems when I was involved, don't know if he's there still, he was over animal health the last I heard.
I'd go direct to him if I had a problem

just looked it up there he's still the associations livestock officer as well so would be dealing with factories
https://www.ifa.ie/cross-sectors/animal-health/contacts/

minerleague

mcdesmo wrote: »

With that being said everyone can make a mistake and I know what its like to be mad busy and rushed into poor decision, my mistake was being green and taking a person at their word etc Im just wondering whats fair play here? I suppose I think I'm being taken advantage of here with whats being offered and you'd swear I was some sort of criminal with how it was offered but I wont go into that.

I didnt act in bad faith or certainly didnt mean to do so, I dont want to crucify someone but dont want to be taken advantage of here......whats a very fair number for them would you think?....just so I can move on (if disappointed)

since mechanical grading came in factories dont seem to be as willing to change their minds on grades or any other queries. when the bullock was lame was he injected into muscle on hind quarter or was this mentioned at all? 265 equates to say 500 live ( not great for 35 mths in fairness) if u got up to 300 euro and chalk it down to experience i think wouldnt be bad

charolais0153

Got 20 euro for a ewe this week, i certainly wouldnt like to have to eat her and couldnt see any meat on her, a shocking animal, camt be surprised with a shocking price

wrangler

minerleague wrote: »

since mechanical grading came in factories dont seem to be as willing to change their minds on grades or any other queries. when the bullock was lame was he injected into muscle on hind quarter or was this mentioned at all? 265 equates to say 500 live ( not great for 35 mths in fairness) if u got up to 300 euro and chalk it down to experience i think wouldnt be bad

If you were a processor killling maybe 500 + cattle per day, would you be bothered paying a farmer a rip off, what difference is it going to make to their bottom line at the end of the day,
Once cattle are unloaded they can't go back to the farm, so any talk of been sent home is futile.
The owner hasn't even looked at the carcase yet. again I'd be insisting that the manager show me what's wrong with the animal
Septic arthritis is similar to joint ill, were all the joints infected, I've seen lamb carcases with joint ill neglected.... not nice

Donegalforever

mcdesmo wrote: »

Hes sticking to his guns and saying no way in hell will I get the colour of it.......200 euros and hes doing me a mighty favour at that........he wont be reasonable, what can you do then?

Says he didnt know what the animal was like, saw it that morning when I dropped it in.

I think you should threaten the factory with legal action for breach of contract.
If they do not change their attitude go and see whatever Solicitor in your area is know to put up a good fight.

DukeCaboom

It happened me two years ago with a lm cow I killed. She looked perfect and had flesh on the rib when I handled her. Now she was under pressure as she was rearing twins and had a cracked hip(but could walk perfectly)

Anyway got my print out of my weights and saw p1 down for this cow. Rang the following morning and he said I was expecting your call and he WhatsApp me a picture of the carcases. Its was as black as could be. Got canner price, couldn't complain.

cute geoge

I have a cow with johnes disease ,she has with a couple of months and is thin as a whip but perfectly healthy otherwise withdrawal period for drugs is up so have i any point sending her to factory with other cows ,what else can i do with her

mcdesmo

minerleague wrote: »

when the bullock was lame was he injected into muscle on hind quarter or was this mentioned at all? 265 equates to say 500 live ( not great for 35 mths in fairness) if u got up to 300 euro and chalk it down to experience i think wouldnt be bad

No vet gave him an injection or two into hoof area when procedure carried out......I had guessed his weight at around 550kg....big enough frame on him.......

wrangler wrote: »

Once cattle are unloaded they can't go back to the farm, so any talk of been sent home is futile.
The owner hasn't even looked at the carcase yet. again I'd be insisting that the manager show me what's wrong with the animal
Septic arthritis is similar to joint ill, were all the joints infected, I've seen lamb carcases with joint ill neglected.... not nice

Guess I'm learning the hard way. I didnt know you couldn't take him back if he got off the trailer, I thought if yer man had a problem with him he would say and send him back up into the trailer that morning, he mentioned on the phone he would look at the animal the morning of the kill, which he did............................still fuming he didnt say so if he felt the animal wasnt suitable, at 100 euro id have kept him in the trailer and held on to him and pumped him with meal if thats what was required or even let him go in the mart at a severly reduced price, I thought I was doing the right thing for everyone tbh

This lad wasnt lame or anything, its about a year since vet out to him and hes been walking fine since, i outwintered him on silage in case hoof under pressure in shed or bullied by other animals.....he wasnt showing signs of any other joint problems or anything, vet inspected where he cut off the section of hoof at time and said it hadnt spread and hell be fine...ffs I think I spent more on the vet bill for him than I'm being offered

Donegalforever wrote: »

I think you should threaten the factory with legal action for breach of contract.
If they do not change their attitude go and see whatever Solicitor in your area is know to put up a good fight.

Yeah probably, its such a pain in the hole though, I was offloading him to take the pressure off, I wasnt expecting the sun, moon and stars and I wasnt trying to get into a legal pissing contest Im even willing to be reasonable now if Im wrong but the price offered cant be right.

DukeCaboom wrote: »

It happened me two years ago with a lm cow I killed. She looked perfect and had flesh on the rib when I handled her. Now she was under pressure as she was rearing twins and had a cracked hip(but could walk perfectly)

Anyway got my print out of my weights and saw p1 down for this cow. Rang the following morning and he said I was expecting your call and he WhatsApp me a picture of the carcases. Its was as black as could be. Got canner price, couldn't complain.

This lad never mentioned anything like that, just seemed to be put out there wasnt much steaks or cuts on him etc.......i mentioned it was below the lowest of the low price per kilo and what even the worst cull cows were making but he wasnt for turning...them lads have a market for that etc....which led me to thinking if you knew you didnt have a market for it why did you accept the product and screw both of us in the process........

out of curiosity I though meat got a bit darker due to stress but it wasnt a huge issue...I see and buy fairly dark looking vacuum packed cuts in supermarkets, was it darker due to some other issue

mcdesmo

duplicate

ruwithme

Op, in life now dealing with many places, no one there seems to give a toss about you, when there's a queue forming behind you.

Who2

cute geoge wrote: »

I have a cow with johnes disease ,she has with a couple of months and is thin as a whip but perfectly healthy otherwise withdrawal period for drugs is up so have i any point sending her to factory with other cows ,what else can i do with her

Get rid of her as soon as possible. It’s worse she’ll get and she will destroy your herd if she hasn’t already.

Base price

I think this thread smells a lot.
A) First time poster.
Doesn't know that when cattle go into a factory lairage that they cannot come back out on the hoof.
C) OP's comment in a recent post - "out of curiosity I though meat got a bit darker due to stress but it wasnt a huge issue...I see and buy fairly dark looking vacuum packed cuts in supermarkets, was it darker due to some other issue"
Call me paranoid but I reckon we have a feckin vegan.

ruwithme

They say if you can think of it,its probably happened somewhere, base

Cavanjack

Did you have insurance on the bullock? just tell the factory to condemn him and claim the insurance?

Sheep breeder

cute geoge wrote: »

I have a cow with johnes disease ,she has with a couple of months and is thin as a whip but perfectly healthy otherwise withdrawal period for drugs is up so have i any point sending her to factory with other cows ,what else can i do with her

Knackery and think of the rest of the herds health status, johnes is like a plague.

whelan2

cute geoge wrote: »

I have a cow with johnes disease ,she has with a couple of months and is thin as a whip but perfectly healthy otherwise withdrawal period for drugs is up so have i any point sending her to factory with other cows ,what else can i do with her

I would send her asap . Btw she probably has it longer than a couple of months. Do you test all for johnes?

mcdesmo

Base price wrote: »

I think this thread smells a lot.
A) First time poster.
Doesn't know that when cattle go into a factory lairage that they cannot come back out on the hoof.
C) OP's comment in a recent post - "out of curiosity I though meat got a bit darker due to stress but it wasnt a huge issue...I see and buy fairly dark looking vacuum packed cuts in supermarkets, was it darker due to some other issue"
Call me paranoid but I reckon we have a feckin vegan.

I'm no vegan, just obviously green when it comes to factories. Dont finish and sell through the mart mostly. Dont know how to prove it. I'm happy to leave it at that and not post again if you think im some sort of wind up merchant. Just really wasnt expecting what happened and thought I got a raw deal and wanted peoples opinions. Didnt want to make an even bigger tit of myself pursuing it if I was wrong.

Base price

Base price wrote: »

I think this thread smells a lot.
A) First time poster.
Doesn't know that when cattle go into a factory lairage that they cannot come back out on the hoof.
C) OP's comment in a recent post - "out of curiosity I though meat got a bit darker due to stress but it wasnt a huge issue...I see and buy fairly dark looking vacuum packed cuts in supermarkets, was it darker due to some other issue"
Call me paranoid but I reckon we have a feckin vegan.

If you've a problem with the thread, report it. Everyone was a first time poster on a forum at some stage.
I'm not even a farmer!

kk.man

mcdesmo wrote: »

I'm no vegan, just obviously green when it comes to factories. Dont finish and sell through the mart mostly. Dont know how to prove it. I'm happy to leave it at that and not post again if you think im some sort of wind up merchant. Just really wasnt expecting what happened and thought I got a raw deal and wanted peoples opinions. Didnt want to make an even bigger tit of myself pursuing it if I was wrong.

Your fat score was all wrong, you weren't QA, cattle prices are at a low base ie 3.50 and you have no knowledge of when cattle are factory fit.

Factory owners don't care about one animal in a lairage as the grade and fat score will tell the true story. They have other things going on.

Time to move on.