What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

gormdubhgorm

Sand wrote: »

Entirely true.

Rubbish, and you should know it. The Republic of Ireland has being speaking English for nearly 100 years since its freedom. No mealy mouthed excuses can cover that up. Yet here we are on a thread conversing in English worrying about how migrants will effect Irish culture! The mind boggles.

The majority Irish people have chosen which culture they want, and it closer to British than Irish. It is how the world works cultures, pastimes, and languages get appropriated from the more dominant one. You even use the phase 'signalling' as in 'virtue signalling'. Where did this phrase originate? From a British journalist in the Spectator five years ago!

https://www.thesun.ie/living/483376/what-is-virtue-signalling-meaning-origin-and-examples-heres-all-you-need-to-know/

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/easy-virtue

It could be argued you have fallen to cultural appropriation and are being multi cultural without even realising it.

Even the word 'craic' used in Irish is a loan word from English and only started being used in the 1960's in Ireland

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craic

https://www.irishhistorycompressed.com/craic-can-someone-please-explain-the-origins-of-this-word/

Whether you like it or not you absorb multiculturalism without even realising it.
In my view a couple of migrants every year are only going to add to any Irish culture that remains.

gormdubhgorm

Sand wrote: »

Would you be okay with Irish people being a minority in Ireland, so long as the new majority where hard working, well educated and socially liberal? Essentially better people in your view than the Irish working class.

When you say Irish you mean white do you? Because in future the Irish working class will not be predominantly of one shade. Those who are hard working will thrive as simple as that.

Sand

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

When you say Irish you mean white do you? Because in future the Irish working class will not be predominantly of one shade. Those who are hard working will thrive as simple as that.

I mean the European ethnic group commonly described as Irish, who primarily descend from the same people who lived on the island of Ireland in the 5th-6th century and even before. Those Irish people. Would you be okay with that ethnic group becoming a minority in their own homeland? So long as they were displaced by better, more productive and cost effective workers?

gormdubhgorm

Sand wrote: »

I mean the European ethnic group commonly described as Irish, who primarily descend from the same people who lived on the island of Ireland in the 5th-6th century and even before. Those Irish people. Would you be okay with that ethnic group becoming a minority in their own homeland? So long as they were displaced by better, more productive and cost effective workers?

Mask is really slipping on you isn't it? I have no problem with any law abiding citizen(s) coming to Ireland and making a life for themselves.
Much as many of our current and past relations did/do going to other countries on the globe. It is the way the world works in an open capitalist society.

I hate to break it to you though those White pure Irish you revere from the 5th-6th century no longer exist.
White Irish people are a mix of a few Irish tribes. Plus Anglo-Irish, Norman, Viking and so on. A kid from 1st year could tell you that. Anyone you know called 'Walshy' or 'Fitzy' is of Norman stock straight away !

https://www.aletterfromireland.com/irish-norman-surnames/#:~:text=Nagle%2C%20Nangle%2C%20Nugent%2C%20Plunkett,IN%20YOUR%20IRISH%20FAMILY%20TREE%3F

Dyr

Sand wrote: »

I mean the European ethnic group commonly described as Irish, who primarily descend from the same people who lived on the island of Ireland in the 5th-6th century and even before. Those Irish people. Would you be okay with that ethnic group becoming a minority in their own homeland? So long as they were displaced by better, more productive and cost effective workers?

I doubt a lad who'd find in Charlie Flanagan a kindred soul, will have much time for the concept of the Irish being a distinct ethnic group

Sand

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Mask is really slipping on you isn't it? I have no problem with any law abiding citizen(s) coming to Ireland and making a life for themselves.
Much as many of our current and past relations did/do going to other countries on the globe. It is the way the world works in an open capitalist society.

I think it is your mask that is slipping. Irish people would never support policies which resulted in their own people becoming a minority in their own country, whereas you clearly do. Your own views are extremist, inhuman and out of step with what most people - any people in fact - hope for their country and their families.

gormdubhgorm

Sand wrote: »

I think it is your mask that is slipping. Irish people would never support policies which resulted in their own people becoming a minority in their own country, whereas you clearly do. Your own views are extremist, inhuman and out of step with what most people - any people in fact - hope for their country and their families.

You are some packet - inhuman?! extremist?! What? Explain!
Are you off the wall?
Your excuse for Irish people not speaking Irish as thier first language was laughable and weak.
Completely ignoring the past 100 years. And the Irish people's own ineptitude when it comes to the Irish language.

Next you say your definition of Irish people are those who came from the 5th/6th centuries!!??
Which in your view seems to be non-extremist???

Completely ignoring all the cross pollination since!
I bet you have family with Norman names!?


If you are having a laugh fair play. If not I feel a bit sorry for you!
All the stuff about an 'Irish race' was a very recent creation from Irish Republicans in the early part of last century! Well done!

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I have it is the Irish working class that is the issue.

I will tell you why.

I wish you would because you keep saying it, but don't provide any evidence to support that belief. And before you claim, that we haven't either, most recent posts are still talking about things which were evidenced earlier in the thread. Your belief is new.

1) Blue collar workers manual labour - where all you need is two arms and to legs
2) Lack of education.
3) More prone to casual racism
4) Blame migrants for thier issues

Ok, but you have a very limited view of Blue collar, since many traditionally held Blue Collar jobs require certification or the LC behind them. So they're not completely lacking in education.

You still have to explain though why the lack of education is a problem for working class workers, and connect it to your claim of being particularly biased against immigrants.

As for casual racism... I suspect that's a stereotype taken from the British rather than the Irish. Still... even if they do... A lot of immigration relates to white people (Eastern Europeans, or other EU citizens), so do they have a problem with them, or just the Black people?

Rinse and repeat. Then any migrant who is integrated and educated is viewed the exception rather than the rule. All it takes is a few migrants who are viewed as spongers/dole cheats and criminals to say ah sure they are all at it!

Except, any migrant who is educated and integrates is the exception rather than the rule. You have yet to show how this is not the case.

I'm not a blue collar worker. I'm highly educated (2 Bachelors, MBA, various diplomas), and I believe that such are a rarity of immigrants who don't fall within the traditional legal forms of migration (Visas). Asylum seekers, refugees, and economic migrants, do fall outside the normal visa rules, and typically, are not educated or integrate well. That's been shown throughout Europe already.

So... what are you going to show us to prove what you say is more accurate?

In my opinion. People who are confident in themselves and thier own culture would have no real issue with multiculturalism.

That's nice. Now... read back over the last ten pages. Ten pages won't take you that long... then, consider what is said within those pages about multiculturalism...

Because that last sentence shows that you still haven't read anything of the thread, and have simply plonked yourself in here. Not being rude... but you're expecting everything to be regurgitated for your benefit...

Marcos

Sand wrote: »

I think it is your mask that is slipping. Irish people would never support policies which resulted in their own people becoming a minority in their own country, whereas you clearly do. Your own views are extremist, inhuman and out of step with what most people - any people in fact - hope for their country and their families.

Sand, it's called projection - accusing you (and others) of having ulterior motives and feelings about illegal immigrants while he or she exhibits negative feelings towards Irish people, especially working class.

Ebun is that you?

Sand

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

You are some packet - inhuman?! extremist?! What? Explain!

You're unconcerned or even supportive of policies that would lead to the Irish being a minority in their own homeland. That is extremist. You only evaluate outcomes on the basis of them creating a more productive workforce for corporations. That is inhuman.

Your excuse for Irish people not speaking Irish as thier first language was laughable and weak.

Forgive me for not clarifying earlier that I wont necessarily follow you off into the weeds of some tangent or distraction.

My point was the Irish speak English because of the unique historical experience of the Irish people. It doesn't need an excuse. It simply is a historical fact and essentially part of the culture of Irish people as they exist today. You ranting about 20th century language policy doesn't change that.

Next you say your definition of Irish people are those who came from the 5th/6th centuries!!??
Which in your view seems to be non-extremist???

Studies are increasingly showing that European populations are overwhelmingly living in the same place their ancestors did. The idea of mass migrations throughout history is the exception, not the rule.

Completely ignoring all the cross pollination since!
I bet you have family with Norman names!?

I don't. Even if I did you seem to think that Irish and Gaelic are interchangeable and unchanging. They're not. The Irish people are an ethnic group which overwhelmingly descends from Gaelic people, but which also assimilated English, Scots, Normans, Vikings etc. Those non-Gaelic peoples were always a tiny, tiny minority in Ireland though. To place things in their proper context, 1 in 5 of Ireland's population was born abroad - that is unheard of.

If you are having a laugh fair play. If not I feel a bit sorry for you!
All the stuff about an 'Irish race' was a very recent creation from Irish Republicans in the early part of last century! Well done!

I think you'll find it goes well before that. Someone so versed in Norman history in Ireland must be familiar with Gerald of Wales and his views on the Irish race.

gormdubhgorm

Sand wrote: »

You're unconcerned or even supportive of policies that would lead to the Irish being a minority in their own homeland. That is extremist. You only evaluate outcomes on the basis of them creating a more productive workforce for corporations. That is inhuman.

So was Darren Sutherland (Boxer) was he Irish to you?
Is Leo Varadkar Irish to you?
Are footballers Gavin Bazunu, Michael Obafemi, and Adam Idah Irish to you?

I fear your definition of Irishness is very narrow considering you only view Irishness as being white fellas from the 5th/6th century. Even rules Ray Darcy. He is a bit Norman don't you know?

It is a good job there are not more intelligent and charismatic politicians with your narrow viewpoint or Ireland would be in trouble.

Ireland is capitalist society and those who do not succeed in that society are maintained by the welfare state. I see that as very humane and other cultures can help bring variety to Irish society and culture.
Your view of Irishness seems extremely narrow based on the 5th or 6th century - as you have already said. Pie in the sky stuff yeah here you are conversing in your first language English!
I think it is about time you took your head out of that Sand.

Forgive me for not clarifying earlier that I wont necessarily follow you off into the weeds of some tangent or distraction.

My point was the Irish speak English because of the unique historical experience of the Irish people. It doesn't need an excuse. It simply is a historical fact and essentially part of the culture of Irish people as they exist today. You ranting about 20th century language policy doesn't change that.

Yes it does it paints you as a grade A hypocrite going on about Irish culture as if you find it sacred.

Studies are increasingly showing that European populations are overwhelmingly living in the same place their ancestors did. The idea of mass migrations throughout history is the exception, not the rule.

More red herring bullshít! You need only look at the proliferation of Norman names in Ireland which places your statement on what Irishness is - not on sand but on quicksand!

I don't. Even if I did you seem to think that Irish and Gaelic are interchangeable and unchanging. They're not. The Irish people are an ethnic group which overwhelmingly descends from Gaelic people, but which also assimilated English, Scots, Normans, Vikings etc. Those non-Gaelic peoples were always a tiny, tiny minority in Ireland though. To place things in their proper context, 1 in 5 of Ireland's population was born abroad - that is unheard of.

You seem to believe the Irish are unchanging in your view Ireland is still based on the tribes which made up the misnomer - Celts! You are the one who had gone on about Irish as a people from the 5c and 6c. There has been 1000 years of intermarriage between the Normans, Anglo-Irish, Saxons and so on!

You are parroting a Republican myth that was manufactured around the late 19th/ early 20th century! I find it hilarious you believe it!
You are definitely having me on.

Kivaro

Is it a coincidence that those who want open borders also question our Irish culture ..... as if we have none? They ask us to define our Irish culture, which is a request rooted in sheer ignorance and abject resentment. You will also notice that they interject "the pub" a number of times in their attempt to try and reduce our culture to just alcohol.
I almost have pity for them.

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

More red herring bullshít! You need only look at the proliferation of Norman names in Ireland which places your statement on what Irishness is - not on sand but on quicksand!
.

You're missing a rather obvious point though. Norman, viking, Saxon, etc, all came from within Europe, and happened at a period of time when populations were quite low compared to today. The vast majority of the migration we are seeing coming into Ireland and Europe, comes from outside of Europe, and is happening to nations that are well established. Any migration we see from EU member states, share a commonality of culture and values through a shared history, along with connections with the RCC.

You seem to be wanting to make some big point about historical migration but the simple truth is that Europe has never seen a comparable point of migration to what it's seeing today. The numbers far outweigh anything that has gone before, and will be much greater as time goes by. You do realise that migration is not going to diminish, and will increase dramatically over the next 20 years?

In the far reaches of the past, migration happened with countries which were undergoing the development of their national identities. America, Australia, etc all were essentially new states, with a new national character that would come from it's migrants. Throughout history, anywhere you want to look, you will find a dislike of 'mass' immigration into countries which had an established national culture. It's only really since WW2, and the UN creation of migrant rights, that attitude has changed... but even then, look around. Not many countries are open to mass immigration.. with the possible exception of western nations. Which, thankfully, seems to be changing.

gormdubhgorm

Deleted User wrote: »

I wish you would because you keep saying it, but don't provide any evidence to support that belief. And before you claim, that we haven't either, most recent posts are still talking about things which were evidenced earlier in the thread. Your belief is new.

I have already mentioned Ola Majekodunmi from Radio na Life and born in Nigeria, And lecturer Dr Abdullahi El-Tom. Both Gaeilgeoir's with more interest in Irish culture than many who want to keep the forrinirs out! I even know another Irish speaker from Moscow!

Ok, but you have a very limited view of Blue collar, since many traditionally held Blue Collar jobs require certification or the LC behind them. So they're not completely lacking in education.

That is what I meant these days LC/equivalent is a minimal requirement for any sort of a decent start. Barring learning a trade.

You still have to explain though why the lack of education is a problem for working class workers, and connect it to your claim of being particularly biased against immigrants.

Because thier lack of education means they are more prone to prejudice, in my experience.

As for casual racism... I suspect that's a stereotype taken from the British rather than the Irish. Still... even if they do... A lot of immigration relates to white people (Eastern Europeans, or other EU citizens), so do they have a problem with them, or just the Black people?

Many do have a prejudice, funniest one I saw was an Irish fella f'n and blinding about Polish etc in the sauna. Polish people entered the sauna he went quiet. Went to leave then slipped when climbing down the benches. Finalindignity for him was when the Polish lads helped him up and he went bright red. Left in silence. Not a word of thanks.

Except, any migrant who is educated and integrates is the exception rather than the rule. You have yet to show how this is not the case.

It only appears to be the exception because it is a new phenomenon in Ireland. There are not massive numbers of migrants here yet. But despite this our hospitals are full of exotically named doctors. And we have an exocially named Taoiseach. Given time it will become the norm as the second generation of the 'new Irish' reach thier 20's.

I'm not a blue collar worker. I'm highly educated (2 Bachelors, MBA, various diplomas), and I believe that such are a rarity of immigrants who don't fall within the traditional legal forms of migration (Visas). Asylum seekers, refugees, and economic migrants, do fall outside the normal visa rules, and typically, are not educated or integrate well. That's been shown throughout Europe already.

So... what are you going to show us to prove what you say is more accurate?

https://www.maynoothuniversity.ie/sites/default/files/assets/document/Fran%20McGinnity%20June%202017_0.pdf

When immigrants are aged 9 and in Irish education they struggle in thier well being. But by age 13 they are no different to thier Irish counterparts.

It only takes time.
Look at England/UK you can clearly see the social mobility of those from migrant backgrounds. And how one group from abc leaves an area and betters themselves and another from xyz moves in.
I see nothing wrong with that aspect

That's nice. Now... read back over the last ten pages. Ten pages won't take you that long... then, consider what is said within those pages about multiculturalism...

Because that last sentence shows that you still haven't read anything of the thread, and have simply plonked yourself in here. Not being rude... but you're expecting everything to be regurgitated for your benefit...

Most of it was dire stuff from a small cohort of posters - learnt nothing from it really. There was some fairly disturbing views.

Sand

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

So was Darren Sutherland (Boxer) was he Irish to you?
Is Leo Varadkar Irish to you?

Both of those men are of Irish ethnic descent.

Are footballers Gavin Bazunu, Michael Obafemi, and Adam Idah Irish to you?

Adam Idah is of Irish ethnic descent too. The other two aren't any more Irish than Tony Cascarino.

Obafemi in particular was born in Ireland to non-Irish parents who moved to England and raised him in London.

I fear your definition of Irishness is very narrow considering you only view Irishness as being white fellas from the 5th/6th century. Even rules Ray Darcy. He is a bit Norman don't you know?

I fear you didn't read my last post.

Ireland is capitalist society and those who do not succeed in that society are maintained by the welfare state. I see that as very humane

Of course you see it that way. Extremists always think they're just being sensible.

Irish society and culture.

But you deny there is such a thing as an Irish people or an Irish society or an Irish culture. So which is it? Do they Irish exist or don't they?

Your view of Irishness seems extremely narrow based on the 5th or 6th century -

I suggest you familiarize yourself with the rules around Irish citizenship if you want a shock. Its primarily based on descent from an Irish parent.

Yes it does it paints you as a grade A hypocrite going on about Irish culture as if you find it sacred.

I think the Irish people have a right to develop and change their culture as they see fit. A 1000 years ago the inhabitants of Ireland primarily spoke Gaelic. Today they primarily speak English. But the Irish people today are still overwhelmingly the descendants of those Gaelic speakers 1000 years ago.

More red herring bullshít! You need only look at the proliferation of Norman names in Ireland which places your statement on what Irishness is - not on sand but on quicksand!

You're in denial of reality.

You seem to believe the Irish are unchanging in your view Ireland is still based on the tribes which made up the misnomer - Celts! You are the one who had gone on about Irish as a people from the 5c and 6c. There has been 1000 years of intermarriage between the Normans, Anglo-Irish, Saxons and so on!

Nope. Viking/Normans/English/Scottish invaders/settlers were always a tiny minority in Ireland. They were assimilated by the much larger native population over time.

You are parroting a Republican myth that was manufactured around the late 19th/ early 20th century! I find it hilarious you believe it!
You are definitely having me on.

You're parroting convenient myths that were created in just the last 20 years to serve corporate interests. Sadly, I'm sure you believe it.

Sand

Kivaro wrote: »

Is it a coincidence that those who want open borders also question our Irish culture ..... as if we have none? They ask us to define our Irish culture, which is a request rooted in sheer ignorance and abject resentment. You will also notice that they interject "the pub" a number of times in their attempt to try and reduce our culture to just alcohol.
I almost have pity for them.

Well, we assume because it's an Irish board that we are talking to other Irish people. Its not always the case, which might explain the ignorance and resentment.

gormdubhgorm

Deleted User wrote: »

You're missing a rather obvious point though. Norman, viking, Saxon, etc, all came from within Europe, and happened at a period of time when populations were quite low compared to today. The vast majority of the migration we are seeing coming into Ireland and Europe, comes from outside of Europe, and is happening to nations that are well established. Any migration we see from EU member states, share a commonality of culture and values through a shared history, along with connections with the RCC.

You seem to be wanting to make some big point about historical migration but the simple truth is that Europe has never seen a comparable point of migration to what it's seeing today. The numbers far outweigh anything that has gone before, and will be much greater as time goes by. You do realise that migration is not going to diminish, and will increase dramatically over the next 20 years?

In the far reaches of the past, migration happened with countries which were undergoing the development of their national identities. America, Australia, etc all were essentially new states, with a new national character that would come from it's migrants. Throughout history, anywhere you want to look, you will find a dislike of 'mass' immigration into countries which had an established national culture. It's only really since WW2, and the UN creation of migrant rights, that attitude has changed... but even then, look around. Not many countries are open to mass immigration.. with the possible exception of western nations. Which, thankfully, seems to be changing.

That is what the poster said though - 'Sand' it was daft stuff. At least you are making a coherent point.

America, Australia, etc were being conquered and the indigenous populations were being wiped out.
I have no dislike of mass immigration to Ireland because in my view Ireland has a very lukewarm (at best/confused at worst) sense of Irishness.

Many immigrants who come here will see little difference between England/Scotland and Wales. That is just fact so we might as well let other cultures in because Ireland is badly in need of a revamp.

Kivaro

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Many immigrants who come here will see little difference between England/Scotland and Wales. That is just fact so we might as well let other cultures in because Ireland is badly in need of a revamp.

And there we have it .....
Over 20% of the population in Ireland were born outside of the country, but yet we are still in need of a ................ "revamp".

Sand

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Many immigrants who come here will see little difference between England/Scotland and Wales. That is just fact so we might as well let other cultures in because Ireland is badly in need of a revamp.

Christ almighty, that is a laughable claim. You really thing that mass migration and globalised culture will introduce some variation from London or other UK cities? They'll make Dublin indistinguishable from those cities. The immigrant communities in Balbriggan are already imitating London post code gangs.

4068ac1elhodqr

Kivaro wrote: »

And there we have it .....
Over 20% of the population in Ireland were born outside of the country, but yet we are still in need of a ................ "revamp".

A revamp like Sweden, that poster must surely be having a laugh.


The uk, France etc are now (slightly late in the day) getting very concerned about out of control multi-cultruralism. Patel even suggested sending new illegal arrivals to PNG. Macron (looking for extra votes) simply wants them out with little or no appeals time available.

gormdubhgorm

Sand wrote: »

Both of those men are of Irish ethnic descent.



Adam Idah is of Irish ethnic descent too. The other two aren't any more Irish than Tony Cascarino.

Obafemi in particular was born in Ireland to non-Irish parents who moved to England and raised him in London.



I fear you didn't read my last post.



Of course you see it that way. Extremists always think they're just being sensible.



But you deny there is such a thing as an Irish people or an Irish society or an Irish culture. So which is it? Do they Irish exist or don't they?



I suggest you familiarize yourself with the rules around Irish citizenship if you want a shock. Its primarily based on descent from an Irish parent.



I think the Irish people have a right to develop and change their culture as they see fit. A 1000 years ago the inhabitants of Ireland primarily spoke Gaelic. Today they primarily speak English. But the Irish people today are still overwhelmingly the descendants of those Gaelic speakers 1000 years ago.



You're in denial of reality.



Nope. Viking/Normans/English/Scottish invaders/settlers were always a tiny minority in Ireland. They were assimilated by the much larger native population over time.



You're parroting convenient myths that were created in just the last 20 years to serve corporate interests. Sadly, I'm sure you believe it.

I give up you are off the wall and have invented your own sense of reality with one contradiction after another. I doubt you are a floating voter you clearly have a hidden agenda in relation to the issue of multiculturalism.

If you are young now I think you will not like the next 30 years. Because change is inevitable as Ireland matures as nation and moves away from old myths.

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I have already mentioned Ola Majekodunmi from Radio na Life and born in Nigeria, And lecturer Dr Abdullahi El-Tom. Both Gaeilgeoir's with more interest in Irish culture than many who want to keep the forrinirs out! I even know another Irish speaker from Moscow!

Lovely. But you've just reinforced the perception that they're the exception to the majority...

Dr Abdullahi El-Tom

" A LEADING member of one of Darfur's rebel groups has resigned from his position on the advisory board of Irish Aid, the Government's overseas development division, The Irish Timeshas learned.

Darfur-born Abdullahi El-Tom is director of training and strategic planning for the Justice and Equality Movement (JEM), one of the main rebel factions that have been fighting the Sudanese government and their militias since 2003."

"Militant groups JeM, Hizbul recruited children in Kashmir during clashes with security forces: UN report
The United Nations report noted “grave violations” and said at least three incidents of recruitment and use of children by terrorist groups were reported in Jammu and Kashmir during clashes with the security forces."

Awesome. Exactly the kind of migrant we want in this country.

That is what I meant these days LC/equivalent is a minimal requirement for any sort of a decent start. Barring learning a trade.

which most Irish people have... and most migrant don't have. I've taught in Asia and Africa. The standard of education is not comparable to Ireland/Europe.. even if it's made available to people, which in most cases, it's not. So, migrants coming from Africa will need to learn English to a level where it becomes useful, and also obtain a level of education comparable with Irish people...

Because thier lack of education means they are more prone to prejudice, in my experience.

It's not prejudice, it's being practical. Ireland is not a rich country, with unlimited resources, and services that aren't under strain. It's a nation with serious problems in providing to it's existing population of low income groups. And you want to add to that strain.

Many do have a prejudice, funniest one I saw was an Irish fella f'n and blinding about Polish etc in the sauna. Polish people entered the sauna he went quiet. Went to leave then slipped when climbing down the benches. Finalindignity for him was when the Polish lads helped him up and he went bright red. Left in silence. Not a word of thanks.

Which means nothing, since you knew nothing about the backgrounds of the people involved, and can't verify anything.

It only appears to be the exception because it is a new phenomenon in Ireland. There are not massive numbers of migrants here yet. But despite this our hospitals are full of exotically named doctors. And we have an exocially named Taoiseach. Given time it will become the norm as the second generation of the 'new Irish' reach thier 20's.

You're very conveniently jumping between migrant groups. Honestly, I see little point discussing this topic until you stop doing so.

Yup. I snipped the rest, because there's little point continuing considering the manner of your posts so far.

gormdubhgorm

Kivaro wrote: »

And there we have it .....
Over 20% of the population in Ireland were born outside of the country, but yet we are still in need of a ................ "revamp".

This thread is proof of it many off the wall people with an off the wall mentality.
Once they die off Ireland will settle down for the better. Might be the odd working class riot, but it will give an opportunity for a rebuild.

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

That is what the poster said though - 'Sand' it was daft stuff. At least you are making a coherent point.

America, Australia, etc were being conquered and the indigenous populations were being wiped out.
I have no dislike of mass immigration to Ireland because in my view Ireland has a very lukewarm (at best/confused at worst) sense of Irishness.

Many immigrants who come here will see little difference between England/Scotland and Wales. That is just fact so we might as well let other cultures in because Ireland is badly in need of a revamp.

I'm getting the rather strong impression that you're not even Irish... Your logic is... bizarre.

4068ac1elhodqr

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

... Because change is inevitable as Ireland matures as nation and moves away from old myths.

The (now old) myth that unregulated, sudden and mass illegal migration is of any benefit, outside of e.g. kebabs and tastey new foods.

The EU already has 1/2bn of human resources to avail from, anyone with exceptional skills outside of this can certainly be addative.

gormdubhgorm

Deleted User wrote: »

L
Which means nothing, since you knew nothing about the backgrounds of the people involved, and can't verify anything.



You're very conveniently jumping between migrant groups. Honestly, I see little point discussing this topic until you stop doing so.

Yup. I snipped the rest, because there's little point continuing considering the manner of your posts so far.

Only convenient when you don't agree with it seems. All that education seems to be wasted. I suppose you could lead a rabble maybe?

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

This thread is proof of it many off the wall people with an off the wall mentality.
Once they die off Ireland will settle down for the better. Might be the odd working class riot, but it will give an opportunity for a rebuild.

Now, that's uncalled for, and outright insulting. Okay. If that's the attitude...

We'll replace you with five people from Ethiopia. Sounds fair. :rolleyes:

gormdubhgorm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Only coinvent when you don't agree with it seems. All that education seems to be wasted. I suppose you could lead a rabble maybe?

And... my last post to you. You reap what you sow. Your attitude and posting style on the thread has been pathetic and I see no point dealing with your ignorance. I'll leave it to others.

But bear in mind, that it was you that was unable to form a coherent and logical argument... and also you that focused on working class people as being racist towards migrants. Your virtue signalling efforts need some serious work.

Yellow_Fern

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

It only takes time.
Look at England/UK you can clearly see the social mobility of those from migrant backgrounds. And how one group from abc leaves an area and betters themselves and another from xyz moves in.
I see nothing wrong with that aspect


Most of it was dire stuff from a small cohort of posters - learnt nothing from it really. There was some fairly disturbing views.

If we are to believe the press there is a massive lack of social mobility in immigrant communities hence the explosion in discussion of the issue there.

gormdubhgorm

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm getting the rather strong impression that you're not even Irish... Your logic is... bizarre.

I am not Irish now??

Says a lot about the mindset of the people who populate this thread.

"If you are not with us. You must not be one of us! :eek:

Did anyone here vote the National Party by any chance? Be honest!