What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

igCorcaigh

igCorcaigh wrote: »

One person cannot speak for the many.
It's rubbish, and I hope you told them so.

He took his direction from the Mosque in Clonskeagh. He'd be a fairly typical devout Muslim in Dublin.

igCorcaigh

igCorcaigh wrote: »

You depict a nightmare scenario, assuming that most Muslim people abide by an extremist interpretation of the religion.
That doesn't seem the case to me, it seems more like most Muslim people today in the world exist under extremist governments, such as the one in Iran, or even worse, under the control of warlorlds.

Actually, I described a very moderate scenario. I didn't say anything about extreme interpretations of Islam... because I don't need to.

Consider this for a moment. When you are a member of a very distinct and clear minority, you have to tolerate the beliefs/behaviors that run counter to your own. On the other hand, when the majority population around you, shares the same culture, and manner of behavior, you can pressure others to conform.

You're doing the same thing that Bubblypop did earlier. Suggesting an extreme view instead of dealing with was written.

I would expect most Muslim people here in this country are more than delighted to escape their totalitarian Islamic governments and terrorists, surely.

I doubt they care that much TBH. I've lived in China, Russia, and spent time in Iran.. most people get to live their lives rather peacefully, and without much government involvement. Except those that don't.

Rodney Bathgate

biko wrote: »

Mohammad increasingly popular.

UK
Oliver held its position as the most popular boys' name since 2013, according to the Office for National Statistics (ONS).
But while Oliver topped the 2017 list with 6,259 babies - if we combine 14 different spellings of Muhammad it's 7,307 babies.

Sweden
The name Mohamed is now the second most popular name for newborn boys in the Swedish city of Gothenburg and the third most popular in multicultural Malmö.

Norway
Mohammed most common men's name in Oslo
Although Mohammed - with various spellings - has been the favourite name for baby boys in Oslo for the past four years, this is the first time it has also topped the men's list.

Ireland
Muhammad is fastest growing boys’ name in Ireland and is up 36 places in just one year


https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/muhammad-fastest-growing-boys-name-10535640

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-45638806

https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-news-from-elsewhere-28982803

On God. That doesn’t bode well for the future.

Eric Cartman

Eric Cartman wrote: »

tower hamlets in London is one such enclave, check out videos there and stories about butchers selling pork being intimidated out, sharia control zones etc.

This is just like the stories I hear about areas I know well in the UK, but theyre not true. And I know these areas well, first hand experience.

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

I'm afraid my beliefs are written in statutes, so whether they believe them or not, doesn't matter. They are law.

I wanted to reply to this, but was occupied with dinner.

If you look at the video I provided, it relates to the lives of western women in France, where Muslims have become far more representative in local areas. Even though the laws of France are still in effect, through intimidation, and simply showing themselves, Islamic men can pressure others into living under their standards.

The simple truth is that most people don't want trouble.. and will go a long way to avoid it. When intimidated by others, many will accept the easy way out, which means accepting whatever it is that's being forced on them.. and after a while, it stops being strange, and simply becomes the way things are. Unless you want to leave... but if your life is tied up with a mortgage, or family commitments, leaving mightn't be possible.

The point is that even with our laws in effect, there is a lot of scope for people to influence/pressure others into conforming.

Go back to my example, about a small town like Longford, which could easily be taken over by a few thousand Muslims congregating there. I get the feeling that you haven't really considered what could happen... even though, it has happened in other European countries.

I keep getting the image of someone with their hands over their ears, shouting "LA LA LA LA LA", all the while promoting their own view of what they expect reality to be like. That's not an insult direct at you, btw.

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

This is just like the stories I hear about areas I know well in the UK, but theyre not true. And I know these areas well, first hand experience.

So.. you believe the video report I posted earlier is false and some kind of propaganda? Did you even watch it?

Forget the UK. Look at France which has a larger Muslim population, and a greater similarity between the nationalities of Muslims going there and those coming here. (M.Eastern, and African)

igCorcaigh

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Of course, most of the posters here, myself included, are not Muslims, or from other cultures.
Without that input, it seems like a waste of broadband, does it not.

Why?

I've spent time in Islamic countries, and have known many Muslims in my life. Others here have also lived/worked in Islamic countries.

I don't speak much about the inner workings/beliefs of the Islamic faith.. I don't need to. All I need to do is look at how Islamic countries, and those other countries which originally had large non-Muslim populations, but have since changed demographics, have changed over time. The changes in social norms, taboos, customs, and yes, their laws.

kildare lad

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Bubblypop... have you looked at the videos online (or visited yourself) of the neighborhoods, and suburb areas in French cities which have been taken over by Muslim populations? The way in which they push their cultural beliefs on the natives (or non-Muslims) and the flight of those people away, due to that pressure...

edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gZFGpNdH1A

go on. it's 4 years old, but relevant.

Don't forget when the chechens were fighting north Africans in france last year ... You can bet the bleeding hearts were nowhere to be found during them four days of violence

https://youtu.be/igEAPV_tQ6Q

I watched the video Klaz, tbh i was expecting worse!
I understand exactly what you mean, but I have seen the same type of behaviour in many countries. Serbia, Vietnam jump to mind as two of the most obvious I remember.
I know there is a poster here who has an issue with feminism also, I don't remember who it is, and I dont want to accuse you, but this is not unusual behaviour towards women in a lot of countries.
If course, I don't agree with it, but luckily in Ireland we have very good anti discrimination laws. Plenty of Irish businesses have found themselves in front of the court because of their discrimination.

But, like I said, I know areas of the UK where people claim Muslims have taken over, that white people and women cannot go there, that's not true at all.
I lived in a Muslim (very small) city, & yes plenty of men drinking coffee & smoking everywhere, but it was one of the safest places i ever was.

I just don't go along with the whole Muslim = bad, because, I believe it's not religion that's the issue, it's more the culture of the country someone comes from.

jmayo

flazio wrote: »

So by implementing extreme conservative policies on people's rights to move here, we keep extreme conservatism out of the country?

Makes sense.

Ah yes the modern liberally minded.

I am not just talking about little old Ireland, but what we term Western democracy.

You know that a lot of the freedoms you enjoy today had to be fought for over decades, hell centuries and they had to be protected by people some even giving up their lives ?

A lot of lives were destroyed along the way.
A lot of hardwork by revolutionaries, by labour advocates, by those seeking equality for women, rights for children, rights for freedom of religion, even the recent drive for equality for LGBT.

You think that where we are today magically happened.
In the 1940 millions gave their lives to prevent real right wingers from turning Europe and much of the world into their toxic vision for the world.

Rights and freedoms are nothing without protection.

You have a lot of the Western World's younger generations believing that they can invite in half of the world, which for the most part have always been and currently are backwards, culturally discriminatory and the antithesis of our Western secular societies, and these younger generations believe that everything will be hunky dory.

I don't know if it is total stupidity or is there a huge element of arrogance thrown in as well.

The arrogance that they will change these people.

bubblypop wrote: »

I do agree that Islamic led countries have little in the way of human rights, and I do have issues with that, absolutely yes.

No, I don't believe that Ireland is going to turn into an Islamic country because some muslims come to live here.
I believe in the laws of this land, anyone breaking the law should be brought before the courts.
As for people's beliefs, so long as their beliefs are their beliefs, no issue. If they break the law because of those beliefs, different matter.
However, that's the same for everyone in the country as far as I am concerned.

Yeah tell that to say the British school girls who lives were destroyed.
Sure their tormentors were eventually brought before the courts.

Tell that to the families of the people slaughtered on the streets of Paris, Nice, London, Stockholm, Berlin, Madrid, Manchester, Brussels, Barcelona.

Shutting the stable door when the horse is in the next parish or should we say shutting the immigration gates when your people are being slaughtered is a bit late.

You arrogantly believe that they will actually care about your beliefs.

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

I watched the video Klaz, tbh i was expecting worse!

Dunno why, since the vast majority of my posts and attitudes tend to be rather moderate.

I understand exactly what you mean, but I have seen the same type of behaviour in many countries. Serbia, Vietnam jump to mind as two of the most obvious I remember.

Except that they're not western countries. Look, it's simple enough. The western attitudes to freedoms and personal rights, make western nations far more susceptible to the effects of a growing population of people whose culture is far different from theirs.

I know there is a poster here who has an issue with feminism also, I don't remember who it is, and I dont want to accuse you, but this is not unusual behaviour towards women in a lot of countries.

Nope, it's fine... I do have many issues with feminism. No issues at all with equality though.

And throughout the western world, women have equal rights with men. In some cases, they have improved rights over men, but that's a different topic.

You say this isn't unusual behavior in a lot of countries? Which of them would be Western? I've lived or spent time in most western nations.. can't recall any restrictions on women like what was shown in the video.

If course, I don't agree with it, but luckily in Ireland we have very good anti discrimination laws. Plenty of Irish businesses have found themselves in front of the court because of their discrimination.

Err.. you highlight Irish businesses being pulled up on discrimination... but we're talking about something else entirely here. What's the relevance? (considering what you've quoted and responded to)

But, like I said, I know areas of the UK where people claim Muslims have taken over, that white people and women cannot go there, that's not true at all.

It is and it isn't. The UK has a unique set of problems... which is why I said to focus on France.

I lived in a Muslim (very small) city, & yes plenty of men drinking coffee & smoking everywhere, but it was one of the safest places i ever was.

Me too. I have heaps of fun in Iran. In spite of all the comments by posters, or those who have never been, I found it to be a wonderful country... when you respected their customs, and didn't seek to change them.

Again... you're missing the point. The issue being the transplantation of Islamic cultural norms into a western neighborhood, or suburb.

I just don't go along with the whole Muslim = bad, because, I believe it's not religion that's the issue, it's more the culture of the country someone comes from.

Of course, Muslims from certain African countries will have different cultural norms than those from Afghanistan. Sure.. but... there are common perspectives on how others should behave, especially, when it comes to the behavior of women in public. Since those cultural expectations come from the religion and not simply their cultural backgrounds independent of that religion...

I don't go with Muslims - bad. I'm perfectly fine with Islam in non-western nations, or where Muslims have zero expectation that their customs will be adopted in a western nation. That they don't project their expectations of what is acceptable behavior on to others, especially those not of their faith.

jmreire

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Well that is hardly true.
What makes a good Muslim?
Do you know?

Because that was not written into the Koran, before "modern western secular societal values" even existed?

And thats part of the problem. You ask what makes a good Muslim? OK, I'll tell you.To be a good Muslim, you must follow all the teaching of Mohammad, as recorded in the Holy Quran, in the Hadiths, and follow Mohammads Law, The Sharia. Thes laws date back to the 6th century, and cannot be changed,ever except by God or his Prophet, Mohammad. Deviating from any of these Laws, makes you less of a Muslim. Serious breaches makes you an unbeliever. So a Muslim lives by 6th Century laws in the 21st Century.
So now you have it. The Quran teaches that when in non-islamic Country's , in the spread of Islam, which is a priority it is permissible to tell lies and follow the law of the land, but Sharia remains the real Law, and the one which must be followed. This was proved recenly when 150 Muslims attended prayers in the Blackpitts Mosque in Dublin, in spite of the lockdown. Dont be under any illusion about which Laws Muslims swear allegiance to,,,there is only one, and thats Sharia. Not so important when Muslims represent a small % of the population, when that figure rises, then they will assert themselves more and more, and insist that things change to fit into the Islamic way of life..it has been this way always....and its still happening, even now here in Ireland. But to really appreciate what this means, you will have to go and live in a " real hardline " Islamic Country,,, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia. And not just a flying visit type,,live there for months and years...then come back to Europe and see the difference. Or google Iran, pre and post departure of the Shah.

jmreire

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Of course, most of the posters here, myself included, are not Muslims, or from other cultures.
Without that input, it seems like a waste of broadband, does it not.

That would depend on what your experience of Islam is. And sorry , but knowing some Muslims, be they friends, colleagues or neighbours , does not count. That is not knowing Islam or how it works in real life.

Sir Oxman

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/legal-action-cost-and-migrant-status-set-for-reform-1.4491142
It's a juggernaut - decided by multiple, small dedicated lobby groups.
"Ms McEntee will also announce plans to bring in a scheme to allow for the regularisation of an estimated 17,000 undocumented migrants in Ireland, 3,000 of whom are young people or children.

It is intended for the scheme to be launched by autumn, with applications to be accepted by the end of the year.

Referring to the plight of undocumented Irish people in the United States, the Minister said: “We must acknowledge there are thousands of people here in Ireland in a similar position.”

She said they have started families in Ireland, work here and “contribute so much to our society”.

She said the scheme would demonstrate “a similar commitment to those who have made our country their home as we ask be shown to our own people abroad”."

Nope. The Irish in the same boat in America or Australia etc are illegal immigrants as are the ones here.
It's really very disingenuous that kind of shíttery.
I would have no problem with forensic case-by-case basis but carte blanche just encourages this crap.
And how did it (again) get to this stage if we have a robust system?

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Dunno why, since the vast majority of my posts and attitudes tend to be rather moderate.



Except that they're not western countries. Look, it's simple enough. The western attitudes to freedoms and personal rights, make western nations far more susceptible to the effects of a growing population of people whose culture is far different from theirs.



Nope, it's fine... I do have many issues with feminism. No issues at all with equality though.

And throughout the western world, women have equal rights with men. In some cases, they have improved rights over men, but that's a different topic.

You say this isn't unusual behavior in a lot of countries? Which of them would be Western? I've lived or spent time in most western nations.. can't recall any restrictions on women like what was shown in the video.



Err.. you highlight Irish businesses being pulled up on discrimination... but we're talking about something else entirely here. What's the relevance? (considering what you've quoted and responded to)



It is and it isn't. The UK has a unique set of problems... which is why I said to focus on France.



Me too. I have heaps of fun in Iran. In spite of all the comments by posters, or those who have never been, I found it to be a wonderful country... when you respected their customs, and didn't seek to change them.

Again... you're missing the point. The issue being the transplantation of Islamic cultural norms into a western neighborhood, or suburb.



Of course, Muslims from certain African countries will have different cultural norms than those from Afghanistan. Sure.. but... there are common perspectives on how others should behave, especially, when it comes to the behavior of women in public. Since those cultural expectations come from the religion and not simply their cultural backgrounds independent of that religion...

I don't go with Muslims - bad. I'm perfectly fine with Islam in non-western nations, or where Muslims have zero expectation that their customs will be adopted in a western nation. That they don't project their expectations of what is acceptable behavior on to others, especially those not of their faith.

Well, Serbia is in track to join the EU, so pretty western.
Kosovo itself is fairly western (some years behind) and that is a Muslim country.
My point was that those behaviours go on in a lot of countries, they are not just Muslim behaviours.
You claim it is the religion that causes them to act as they do towards women. But yet many men of differing religions have those attitudes, so it must be something else.
My example of Serbia and Vietnam are two very very different countries, neither are muslim countries. I'm sure there are more.

Restrictions that were on women in the video, such as not being served in the coffee shop, these may happen here, but as I pointed out, we have laws and it wouldn't be long before someone took that cafe to the wrc.

You tell me to concentrate on France, not the UK, why? Because I said I have personal experience in parts of the UK that are painted as no go areas, which is completely false. So why would France be different? They are both western countries are they not?

While you claim to be moderate, you do not give the same expectation to people who are muslim. You expect them to try and change western countries.
There are many many moderate Muslims, I know some. They just get on with their lives the same as the rest of us.


And, just before you dismiss me, I do know Muslim men who are typical. I have meet them and tried to deal with them. As I said, as part of my work I do find myself dealing with Muslim people, more and more, I have been inside their families and homes. I am well aware of some of the attitudes. But also, I have these attitudes from others.
I know you believe there is no issue for females in Irish society, but you be a female in my job, you will see plenty.
I'm not saying there won't be people coming into this country that are not good for our society, I'm sure there will. That's life. People do ****ty bad things all the time.

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

Well, Serbia is in track to join the EU, so pretty western.

Serbian culture is traditionally more eastern than western. When we talk about Western culture, typically, we're talking about Western Europe, not eastern. The approach towards politics, the place of citizens in society, the values, etc all tend to be different than those promoted within western culture.

They may be leaning towards western culture, but that's not the same thing as having embraced them.

"Look, it's simple enough. The western attitudes to freedoms and personal rights, make western nations far more susceptible to the effects of a growing population of people whose culture is far different from theirs."

That's important and I get the feeling you skipped over it.

My point was that those behaviours go on in a lot of countries, they are not just Muslim behaviours.

You still haven't provided western nations that fit the bill....

You claim it is the religion that causes them to act as they do towards women. But yet many men of differing religions have those attitudes, so it must be something else.

No. You're simplifying what I said. Both culture and religion play a part, but since we're talking about cultural groups where Islam has been a dominant influence for centuries, it's a moot point. Once again, it comes down to the fact that the Islamic faith is pervasive throughout any Muslim culture. It has it's fingers tapping every aspect of their culture and society.

My example of Serbia and Vietnam are two very very different countries, neither are muslim countries. I'm sure there are more.

Neither of which are Western by nature. They can counter the effects of Islam in ways that are generally not available to Western countries. Vietnam, for example, is still very much a communist nation with the government having supreme influence over society... when they want to involve themselves.

Restrictions that were on women in the video, such as not being served in the coffee shop, these may happen here, but as I pointed out, we have laws and it wouldn't be long before someone took that cafe to the wrc.

It's not about the cafe. It's not about the premises. Which I suspect you know... and you keep dancing around.. I'm not going to continually repeat myself, just because you refuse to deal with the points made.

You tell me to concentrate on France, not the UK, why? Because I said I have personal experience in parts of the UK that are painted as no go areas, which is completely false. So why would France be different? They are both western countries are they not?

Why? Because the video was about France. Not the UK. If i'd wanted to discuss the UK, I would have gotten something from there. Since I didn't, it's pretty obvious the focus should be on France.

While you claim to be moderate, you do not give the same expectation to people who are muslim. You expect them to try and change western countries.

Huh? That makes no sense. I extend the same expectations to everyone.

I expect followers of Islam to seek an environment that matches with the laws of their religion. If they find themselves a minority, there is no scope to change things. As their population increases, their ability to influence change increases. But then, I've said this before, and no doubt, you'll skip past it again, instead reply to some simplified version.

There are many many moderate Muslims, I know some. They just get on with their lives the same as the rest of us.

Of course there are. I've never made the case that all Muslims behave the same. If they did, there would be far less friction between various Islamic faiths..

I know you believe there is no issue for females in Irish society, but you be a female in my job, you will see plenty.

Which is not what I said. You do this far too much.

I keep trying to engage in discussion with you, in the hopes that you'll deal directly with points made, but you skip important points, simplify them, deflect to other issues which I haven't used... all the while, dancing around those that I have.

There's really little point continuing, since you seem incapable of engaging with a poster.

Kivaro

From the Sunday Times:

The investigation led to the arrest of the man, a taxi driver who had driven from Dublin to Northern Ireland on February 8 with two Eritrean passengers who had recently sought asylum in the south. Gardai discovered the taxi driver lived in a mews in the grounds of Lis na Carrig in Foxrock, owned by Chantal McCabe. The philanthropist is separated from Bill McCabe, a businessman ranked the 245th richest man in Ireland last year with a fortune worth €81 million.

The man was found to have been legally resident in Ireland since 2015 when he was given a critical skills employment permit, known as a Stamp 4 visa, on the basis that he worked in IT for Chantal McCabe, who co-founded the Immigrant Council of Ireland in 2001.
.......

The source said the Eritrean man had been McCabe’s driver while she was in his country on charitable work. He came to Ireland in 2015 on a visa sponsored by McCabe to help her identify Eritrean families in need of assistance. McCabe provided him with the mews residence rent-free. The source said although the man continued to make use of the mews, in more recent times he had also lived in another property with his partner and their child and he had begun work as a taxi driver.

There is something really odd about McCabe's whole story here. So when McCabe was in the Eastern African country of Eritrea, the man who was her driver/chauffeur there found himself in receipt of an Irish critical skills employment permit due to his expertise in IT. The Immigrant Council of Ireland's co-founder McCabe claimed that the requirements for her IT work were so short of expertise in Ireland that she had to bring in a Eritrean driver to do it. And yet when he got to Ireland, he ended up as a taxi-driver, the job that he was doing in Eritrea, and yes of course less we forget ......... a people smuggler in Ireland.

There should be an investigation of McCabe in her involvement through the procurement of the special visa up to the man's arrest.

"requirements for her IT work were so short of expertise in Ireland "

This is after Ireland has spent two decades investing in IT training and development. The fact that this reason was accepted is astounding.. the idea that there were no IT Irish people, that would be comparable in skills/education with a driver from Eritrea.... ?

Mules

The NGOs in the med are notorious for people smuggling. It probably shouldn't be a surprise that ones in Ireland are up to it too.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Serbian culture is traditionally more eastern than western. When we talk about Western culture, typically, we're talking about Western Europe, not eastern. The approach towards politics, the place of citizens in society, the values, etc all tend to be different than those promoted within western culture.

They may be leaning towards western culture, but that's not the same thing as having embraced them.

"Look, it's simple enough. The western attitudes to freedoms and personal rights, make western nations far more susceptible to the effects of a growing population of people whose culture is far different from theirs."

That's important and I get the feeling you skipped over it.



You still haven't provided western nations that fit the bill....



No. You're simplifying what I said. Both culture and religion play a part, but since we're talking about cultural groups where Islam has been a dominant influence for centuries, it's a moot point. Once again, it comes down to the fact that the Islamic faith is pervasive throughout any Muslim culture. It has it's fingers tapping every aspect of their culture and society.



Neither of which are Western by nature. They can counter the effects of Islam in ways that are generally not available to Western countries. Vietnam, for example, is still very much a communist nation with the government having supreme influence over society... when they want to involve themselves.



It's not about the cafe. It's not about the premises. Which I suspect you know... and you keep dancing around.. I'm not going to continually repeat myself, just because you refuse to deal with the points made.



Why? Because the video was about France. Not the UK. If i'd wanted to discuss the UK, I would have gotten something from there. Since I didn't, it's pretty obvious the focus should be on France.



Huh? That makes no sense. I extend the same expectations to everyone.

I expect followers of Islam to seek an environment that matches with the laws of their religion. If they find themselves a minority, there is no scope to change things. As their population increases, their ability to influence change increases. But then, I've said this before, and no doubt, you'll skip past it again, instead reply to some simplified version.



Of course there are. I've never made the case that all Muslims behave the same. If they did, there would be far less friction between various Islamic faiths..




Which is not what I said. You do this far too much.

I keep trying to engage in discussion with you, in the hopes that you'll deal directly with points made, but you skip important points, simplify them, deflect to other issues which I haven't used... all the while, dancing around those that I have.

There's really little point continuing, since you seem incapable of engaging with a poster.

There's little point in engaging with you also, as when you don't like answers given, you try to shut a poster down or change your direction.

Do you have issues with any other cultures living in western countries?

WrenBoy

igCorcaigh wrote: »

One person cannot speak for the many.
It's rubbish, and I hope you told them so.

You should try to go to Speakers Corner in Hyde Park in London on a Sunday and listen to the debates and preaching. Quite a large Muslim element there and I found it very eye opening to some of the attitudes and beliefs held by muslims who have lived for quite some time in the West.
Some great debates to be had there sometimes, lot of nonsense too depends on the day and the participants.

Cordell

bubblypop wrote: »

There are many many moderate Muslims, I know some. They just get on with their lives the same as the rest of us.

That is in fact a problem and not really a true definition of a moderate religious person, if that said person is getting on with their lives guided by the religion they observe rather than the rules of the society they chosen to live in.

Doctor Roast

Mules wrote: »

The NGOs in the med are notorious for people smuggling. It probably shouldn't be a surprise that ones in Ireland are up to it too.

Up to their necks in it, just recently 33 were arrested by Greek authorities after being investigated for a few months, these NGOs need to be put under closer scrutiny, sanctioned or banned from operating.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbIc1LZqIAw

jmreire

Cordell wrote: »

That is in fact a problem and not really a true definition of a moderate religious person, if that said person is getting on with their lives guided by the religion they observe rather than the rules of the society they chosen to live in.

But especially when the laws of their religion are in direct conflict with the laws of the host Country.

Esho

jmreire wrote: »

That would depend on what your experience of Islam is. And sorry , but knowing some Muslims, be they friends, colleagues or neighbours , does not count. That is not knowing Islam or how it works in real life.

The Centre for European Fatwah is based in Clonseagh.
A think tank to promote Islam in Europe.

The first.time I heard one of these Wahibees expressing their desire to have Sharia in Ireland, I was very offended-
there is no When In Rome with this shower.

Same with Ali Salim, the former PRO of the Clonseagh Mosque saying that.music shouldn't be taught in schools in case some from his flavour of Islam are offended - f right off.

Same with the old testament attitude to homosexuality.
It's back to McQuaid's Ireland but more militant.

I'm all for religious tolerance - but only if its for all.

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

There's little point in engaging with you also, as when you don't like answers given, you try to shut a poster down or change your direction.

Actually, I've stayed consistent on the same points.. you're the one that tends to drift considerably.

Do you have issues with any other cultures living in western countries?

Generally no, because there are no barriers to them adjusting to western culture and values... as would normally occur over time, nor is there the expectation based on their own cultural norms for westerners to conform.

But yeah.. I won't be responding to your posts from now on. So, we're both saved the frustration.

biko

bubblypop wrote: »

Do you have issues with any other cultures living in western countries?

I have a problem with American cultural imperialism in Europe, but of course particularly in Ireland.
The problem with the American cultural imperialism is we don't even need Americans here for it to happen, our youth is quite eager to appropriate it.

When western countries all adopt US culture we are no longer unique or distinct from each other.
Cultural values are propagated from US and people here act the same as people there.

That might be ok for some teens but I remember when countries and peoples were different and interesting, and it's something I would like for Europe to hang on to.

TomTomTim

biko wrote: »

I have a problem with American cultural imperialism in Europe, but of course particularly in Ireland.
The problem with the American cultural imperialism is we don't even need Americans here for it to happen, our youth is quite eager to appropriate it.

When western countries all adopt US culture we are no longer unique or distinct from each other.
Cultural values are propagated from US and people here act the same as people there.

That might be ok for some teens but I remember when countries and peoples were different and interesting, and it's something I would like for Europe to hang on to.

What amusing about this is that many tyrants have pointed this out in the past. Both Putin and Assad have said that whoever controls America controls the West. This has always been true to a degree due to pop culture, but it's accelerated rapidly with the age of the internet.

doublejobbing 2

Sir Oxman wrote: »

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"Ms McEntee will also announce plans to bring in a scheme to allow for the regularisation of an estimated 17,000 undocumented migrants in Ireland, 3,000 of whom are young people or children.
I would have no problem with forensic case-by-case basis but carte blanche just encourages this crap.

I would hope it is on a case by case basis, but, tbh, there are worse things happening. I'd sooner have a Chinese lad who isn't shy of hard work getting his papers over some activist living in a DP centre getting hers and 20 years later her son is complaining about how dem fedz fcuk with a roadman when he's just trying to chill in the 4 bed semi we gave them in Clonee. We have had enough of that already.

biko

biko wrote: »

I have a problem with American cultural imperialism in Europe, but of course particularly in Ireland.
The problem with the American cultural imperialism is we don't even need Americans here for it to happen, our youth is quite eager to appropriate it.

When western countries all adopt US culture we are no longer unique or distinct from each other.
Cultural values are propagated from US and people here act the same as people there.

That might be ok for some teens but I remember when countries and peoples were different and interesting, and it's something I would like for Europe to hang on to.

I think that's a teenage thing more than anything, sounding American, because of the programs they watch, music they listen to. But that's always been the case. It was when I was a teenager.
Many countries have been influenced by American culture, they still retain their same values and cultures.