What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

Mike Murdock

jmreire wrote: »

Give it time..the Traveller issue in Ireland goes back generations, and the 330'000 who voted for Casey, all had personal experience's with them. Now the immigration issue on the other hand is relatively new here, at least in the present Nrs. But there is growing dissafaction with the whole immigration issue, but like many have posted here, to speak out or even seek informed discussion on the subject is tabboo , lest you bring the hellfire of racism, the woke and PC brigade's down on you. The problem is that the longer it takes to address the whole issue, the worse the problem will become, and the harder it will be to fix it.

I've been hearing this for 20+ years. Along with Ireland facing into a race war.

There is no Far Right party that will get elected into any semblance of authority here because the Irish, for all their flaws, will rightly scoff at them and say "Will ya go and ****e."

The minute Far Right movement in Ireland, is magnified by NGO'S who need to tilt at windmills to justify their need for existence and, crucially, get more funding.

jmreire

Mike Murdock wrote: »

I've been hearing this for 20+ years. Along with Ireland facing into a race war.

There is no Far Right party that will get elected into any semblance of authority here because the Irish, for all their flaws, will rightly scoff at them and say "Will ya go and ****e."

The minute Far Right movement in Ireland, is magnified by NGO'S who need to tilt at windmills to justify their need for existence and, crucially, get more funding.

Mike, Irish politicians first priority is to get re-elected. And normally their political antennas tell them which way the public opinion wind is blowing. However exceptionally these self same antennas failed them completely in the last GE when unexpectedly SF took the lions share of the 1st preference votes, while some of the "regulars" had to go as far as the 18th to get elected. But as soon as they think that anti-immigration sentiment is growing, they will change accordingly. The problem is will it change in time?

WrenBoy

jmreire wrote: »

Mike, Irish politicians first priority is to get re-elected. And normally their political antennas tell them which way the public opinion wind is blowing. However exceptionally these self same antennas failed them completely in the last GE when unexpectedly SF took the lions share of the 1st preference votes, while some of the "regulars" had to go as far as the 18th to get elected. But as soon as they think that anti-immigration sentiment is growing, they will change accordingly. The problem is will it change in time?

The Evergreen in the Suiz canal if you will.

Mike Murdock

Mike Murdock wrote: »

I've been hearing this for 20+ years. Along with Ireland facing into a race war.

There is no Far Right party that will get elected into any semblance of authority here because the Irish, for all their flaws, will rightly scoff at them and say "Will ya go and ****e."

The minute Far Right movement in Ireland, is magnified by NGO'S who need to tilt at windmills to justify their need for existence and, crucially, get more funding.

Yes, but you're establishing from the beginning that an anti-immigration party needs to be Far Right, when there's no requirement of such. There is, realistically, no far right movement in Ireland. They're nationalist parties with leanings towards conservatism. They don't, (except for individual politicians) tend to display any of the characteristics or attitudes that typically are shown in Far Right groups in Europe, the UK or the US. The Far Right in Ireland, are a boogeyman promoted by the NGOs and Left leaning groups. The go-to way of discrediting others with a term that can possibly include all manner of ideas but be considered negative through association.

The movement to create alternative parties to FF, FG, etc is in it's infancy. There hasn't been much evolution yet, because they've represented people with badly thought out mandates, who have managed to alienate themselves even without any external criticism.

Given a few years, a few failures, and we'll see alternative parties which are not even remotely far right, appealing to those with moderate views, and are able to use logic/facts to support themselves.

The one good thing about the lack of resistance to immigration, and the current government policy is that there will be heaps of data that can be used to show the failure and cost to society and the State, for these initiatives.

As jmreire said, Give it time. It'll happen. Honestly, I suspect it'll be migrants themselves that end up getting the ball rolling on such an alternative party against further badly thought out immigration.

Kivaro

Deleted User wrote: »

....
As jmreire said, Give it time. It'll happen. Honestly, I suspect it'll be migrants themselves that end up getting the ball rolling on such an alternative party against further badly thought out immigration.

I posted the same thing a good while back. Just looking at the lack of backbone of Irish politicians to take on the liberal left and their push for unsustainable non-EU migration into Ireland at all costs while we are sorely lacking adequate services for the people already living in the country e.g. a million people on hospital waiting lists, I envision a person from Poland or even further afield to save us. In essence, they will be saving the Irish from the Irish. When they finally step forward, they will be successful.

Arthur Daley

Kivaro wrote: »

I posted the same thing a good while back. Just looking at the lack of backbone of Irish politicians to take on the liberal left and their push for unsustainable non-EU migration into Ireland at all costs while we are sorely lacking adequate services for the people already living in the country e.g. a million people on hospital waiting lists, I envision a person from Poland or even further afield to save us. In essence, they will be saving the Irish from the Irish. When they finally step forward, they will be successful.

This is really why Irexit is not comparable to the UK, and is a weak proposition. Governance is so bad in Ireland that even the issues we've seen roll out in the EU are an improvement. Many people reach this conclusion when they consider things like Anglo and the massive deficits run up since the early 2000s.

Let the French/Dutch/Germans have a go, 'they couldn't be any worse'.:eek:

With the bills being rammed through currently it is a great irony that other EU countries may be the ones to put a stop to the nonsense, if they feel it is threatening their own borders/interests. Or if Britain feels a threat coming from the common travel area.

rgossip30

A number of non national crimes linked to Bank ATM fraud and female gentile mutilation . I cannot seem to find any Irish nationals linked to such crimes but please do link if you know .The number of those with fake passports , driving licences and birth certs it must be a flourishing business .

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/crime/father-of-two-32-jailed-for-stealing-over120000-from-atm-machines-using-cloned-cards-40240249.html


A Prince !

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/circuit-court/man-who-used-technical-glitch-to-steal-25-000-from-bank-avoids-jail-1.4519085#:~:text=Prince%20Joseph%20Ncube%20(24)%20manipulated,online%20system%20to%20create%20credits&text=A%20financial%20services%20worker%20who,a%20three%20year%20suspended%20sentence.

The parents of a child who they allowed a man to perform a botched FGM are appealing their jail sentence !

https://www.thejournal.ie/parents-jailed-fgm-child-reexamined-5388259-Mar2021/

An Interesting website for news .

https://watchers.ie/

Mike Murdock

Mike Murdock wrote: »

I've been hearing this for 20+ years. Along with Ireland facing into a race war.

There is no Far Right party that will get elected into any semblance of authority here because the Irish, for all their flaws, will rightly scoff at them and say "Will ya go and ****e."

I don't know anyone looking for a far right party, just people who want a party to implement proper immigration controls and to clamp down on illegal immigration. Nothing about that is far right.

wicklowstevo

rgossip30 wrote: »

A number of non national crimes linked to Bank ATM fraud and female gentile mutilation . I cannot seem to find any Irish nationals linked to such crimes but please do link if you know .The number of those with fake passports , driving licences and birth certs it must be a flourishing business .

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/crime/father-of-two-32-jailed-for-stealing-over120000-from-atm-machines-using-cloned-cards-40240249.html


A Prince !

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/circuit-court/man-who-used-technical-glitch-to-steal-25-000-from-bank-avoids-jail-1.4519085#:~:text=Prince%20Joseph%20Ncube%20(24)%20manipulated,online%20system%20to%20create%20credits&text=A%20financial%20services%20worker%20who,a%20three%20year%20suspended%20sentence.

The parents of a child who they allowed a man to perform a botched FGM are appealing their jail sentence !

https://www.thejournal.ie/parents-jailed-fgm-child-reexamined-5388259-Mar2021/

An Interesting website for news .

https://watchers.ie/

well that's your argument dismantled in one brief link

Biafranlivemat

clytemnestra wrote: »

I have some experience of this in a school context. I've found that the more multicultural a school is, the less friendly it is, and the less the parents will get involved in contributing. Add the resources issue with the school having to deal with non-English speakers, and cultural and religious differences, and it becomes a place you don't want to send your kids. I saw this happen to a formerly lovely school with a strong sense of community around it - within 20 years Irish kids became a minority and everyone keeps to their own little groups. It's depressing.

Because I'm in the US and have sent my children to public schools I can tell you that any school with Whites and Asians making 85% Of the school population is good.
Anything under that number the school system is turning bad.


Sure some people who don't know what they are talking about will scream racism or other nonsense, but my advice is ignore the naming calling and do whatever you need to put your own children first.

Biafranlivemat

clytemnestra wrote: »

It's interesting the way they can't throw the "racist" epithet at her. They do try to accuse her of being heartless considering her own parents were Ugandan Indians fleeing Idi Amin, but there's no comparison. Ugandan Indians had deep ties to Britain, with many of them already holding British citizenship. They were in genuine danger of death - Amin had threatened to kill them all. And they were overwhelmingly hardworking, entrepreneurial, self-sufficient and culturally compatible.

In 1972 Ugandan Dictator, General Idi Amin ordered the explusion of Ugandas Asian community. Just before the deadline Thames Televisions 'This Week' reporter Johnathan Dimbleby visited Uganda to whitness the chaotic scenes first hand of Ugandas Asian community desperate to leave

Biafranlivemat

rgossip30 wrote: »

A number of non national crimes linked to Bank ATM fraud and female gentile mutilation . I cannot seem to find any Irish nationals linked to such crimes but please do link if you know .The number of those with fake passports , driving licences and birth certs it must be a flourishing business .

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/crime/father-of-two-32-jailed-for-stealing-over120000-from-atm-machines-using-cloned-cards-40240249.html


A Prince !

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/circuit-court/man-who-used-technical-glitch-to-steal-25-000-from-bank-avoids-jail-1.4519085#:~:text=Prince%20Joseph%20Ncube%20(24)%20manipulated,online%20system%20to%20create%20credits&text=A%20financial%20services%20worker%20who,a%20three%20year%20suspended%20sentence.

The parents of a child who they allowed a man to perform a botched FGM are appealing their jail sentence !

https://www.thejournal.ie/parents-jailed-fgm-child-reexamined-5388259-Mar2021/

An Interesting website for news .

https://watchers.ie/

Watchers.ie is very good, there was a horrible double murder and suicide recently outside Mitchelstown,

A relative of mind who lives in the town said that Watchers.ie was the most accurate of all the media in reporting the horrible news


My relative knew all 3 men and their families since childhood

ExMachina1000

Lucan seems to be a highly diverse area. I drove through the area during the week around the same time the schools were on lunch. Very diverse.
Is it a problem? I don't know I don't live there.
Would I want to live there? No I would not.

Cordell

Oversimplified and exaggerated:
Nationalism: we need to put our nation first!
Anti immigration: we need to reduce and control the influx of non nationals for the good of our people!

Now, tell me, how are these 2 concepts right wing, because they sound extremely left to me.

Doctor Roast

Meanwhile.... I don't remember hearing about this in the media, I could be wrong though..

https://gript.ie/malta-sent-flight-with-migrants-to-ireland-in-march/

TomTomTim

Doctor Roast wrote: »

Meanwhile.... I don't remember hearing about this in the media, I could be wrong though..

https://gript.ie/malta-sent-flight-with-migrants-to-ireland-in-march/

On the topic of not reporting things that are inconvenient. I can't seem to find the story about the Islamic protests in the UK in most places, it's not on the Journal or RTE's website from what I can see. How they can justify stuff like this is beyond me. I hate to repeat myself, but if was Christians doing similar, it would be prime time news all week.

ExMachina1000

TomTomTim wrote: »

On the topic of not reporting things that are inconvenient. I can't seem to find the story about the Islamic protests in the UK in most places, it's not on the Journal or RTE's website from what I can see. How they can justify stuff like this is beyond me. I hate to repeat myself, but if was Christians doing similar, it would be prime time news all week.

"Adil Shahzad, imam of the Al-Hikam Institute in Bradford, said that a letter outlining the feelings of Britain’s Muslim community would be sent to Johnson and several local MPs, The Times reported.
He added: “All we ask for is a bit of respect. If one teacher can do it, another teacher can do it five years down the line, and we do not want this to be the case. Otherwise we are not responsible for the actions of some individuals.”

The last sentence. Like you said imagine if Christians said it

Cordell

Every single one of those sentences is problematic.
They demand respect, but they don't offer it
They don't want teachers to have the freedom to teach
And of course, the thinly veiled threat.

Doctor Roast

Cordell wrote: »

Every single one of those sentences is problematic.
They demand respect, but they don't offer it
They don't want teachers to have the freedom to teach
And of course, the thinly veiled threat.

Remember the european court ruling that crucifixes are not allowed be displayed in Italian schools, one of the judges pivotal in it was linked to the open societies foundation..it was eventually overturned...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/artanddesign/jonathanjonesblog/2009/nov/04/italy-art-cross

prishtinaboy99

If your small minded and fearful of change then you may have an issue.

If your openminded who is able to see the benefits that immigrants bring through culture, food, innovation etc then Ireland will be a better place for it.

Doctor Roast

Doctor Roast wrote: »

Remember the european court ruling that crucifixes are not allowed be displayed in Italian schools, one of the judges pivotal in it was linked to the open societies foundation..it was eventually overturned...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/artanddesign/jonathanjonesblog/2009/nov/04/italy-art-cross

"Maria Stella Gelmini, said: "No one, not even some ideologically motivated European court, will succeed in rubbing out our identity."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2009/nov/03/italy-classroom-crucifixes-human-rights

Doctor Roast

prishtinaboy99 wrote: »

If your small minded and fearful of change then you may have an issue.

If your openminded who is able to see the benefits that immigrants bring through culture, food, innovation etc then Ireland will be a better place for it.

I'm not buying it, what happens is you end up the same as every other multicultural place... Soulless, consumers, grey economic units with no real identity or social cohesion, anomic societies.... Plus the many many negatives versus the scant few "benefits"

Kermit.de.frog

prishtinaboy99 wrote: »

If your small minded and fearful of change then you may have an issue.

If your openminded who is able to see the benefits that immigrants bring through culture, food, innovation etc then Ireland will be a better place for it.

Food? How many decades has Ireland had Italian chippers, Chinese restaurants and Indian takeaways?

It didn't take mass immigration to bring those things here. They are here anyway.

As for culture this is Ireland and one would expect our culture to be Irish.

Otherwise what are we? Just another western European country moulded in to the same morass of indistinguishable sameness.

Outside western Europe everywhere else is keeping their own culture. For some reason we are intent on diluting ours.

Eric Cartman

Biafranlivemat wrote: »

In 1972 Ugandan Dictator, General Idi Amin ordered the explusion of Ugandas Asian community. Just before the deadline Thames Televisions 'This Week' reporter Johnathan Dimbleby visited Uganda to whitness the chaotic scenes first hand of Ugandas Asian community desperate to leave

uganda was much worse off for having removed them. Having watched many documentaries about it, the asian community really was the backbone of trade in the nation. The same went for white farmers in Zimbabwe and even recently white farmers in SA who've all left for Australia. These were clear examples of positive immigration and a very racist reactionary political stance to remove them with false promises of things getting better.

However these are incomparible to current desires to remove immigrants from europe as there is very little positive influence and what is positive is dragged way down by the overwhelmingly negative experience of non eu migrants in europe.

prishtinaboy99

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Food? How many decades has Ireland had Italian chippers, Chinese restaurants and Indian takeaways?

It didn't take mass immigration to bring those things here. They are here anyway.

As for culture this is Ireland and one would expect our culture to be Irish.

Otherwise what are we? Just another western European country moulded in to the same morass of indistinguishable sameness.

Outside western Europe everywhere else is keeping their own culture. For some reason we are intent on diluting ours.

Italian and chinese takeaways have hardly added to our taste pallets, ok after a night on the sauce.


Some good middle eastern cafes restaurants i have come across and how bad boy.


Nothing wrong with our Irish culture but nothing wrong with a bit of diversity either.

Lemon Davis lll

prishtinaboy99 wrote: »

Italian and chinese takeaways have hardly added to our taste pallets, ok after a night on the sauce.


Some good middle eastern cafes restaurants i have come across and how bad boy.


Nothing wrong with our Irish culture but nothing wrong with a bit of diversity either.

Vast majority of immigrant food businesses from Brussels to Balham to Boyle are identikit late night Kebabish/Pizza joints serving pretty crummy food.

The culinary dividend is greatly overstated.

prishtinaboy99

Lemon Davis lll wrote: »

Vast majority of immigrant food businesses from Brussels to Balham to Boyle are identikit late night Kebabish/Pizza joints serving pretty crummy food.

The culinary dividend is greatly overstated.

Cant speak for the rest of Ireland as i left Ireland in 2005 but when I visit Cork there are some top notch restaurants there and many top notch foreign delicacies and im not talking late night kebabs or Pizzas either.

prishtinaboy99

prishtinaboy99 wrote: »

If your small minded and fearful of change then you may have an issue.

IMHO anyone who starts a post this way, is small minded and fearful of others opinions. How can you claim to be interested in a discussion, when you lead with that kind of comment?

If your openminded who is able to see the benefits that immigrants bring through culture, food, innovation etc then Ireland will be a better place for it.

It's the "etc" that most of us are concerned about. Perhaps you could address those concerns rather than picking the parts with lowest possible impact on a host nation?

And considering "culture".. how do you feel about FGM being introduced into Ireland, since that's part of various cultures? If you're against aspects like FGM, are there other non-Irish cultural behaviors you'd be against.. or are you open to everything that other cultures bring into Ireland and expect the be accepted?

Cordell

Lemon Davis lll wrote: »

Vast majority of immigrant food businesses from Brussels to Balham to Boyle are identikit late night Kebabish/Pizza joints serving pretty crummy food.

The culinary dividend is greatly overstated.

And we have all the recipes already, we can stop now.

jmreire

prishtinaboy99 wrote: »

Italian and chinese takeaways have hardly added to our taste pallets, ok after a night on the sauce.


Some good middle eastern cafes restaurants i have come across and how bad boy.


Nothing wrong with our Irish culture but nothing wrong with a bit of diversity either.

Maybe some Birre Peya diversity would be OK......:)