What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Um, can you quote him where he said he wanted all immigrants to be sent home?

Not you reading between the lines. Somehow I missed him saying what you claim.

Are you really going to waste your time klaz!

Hhhhh

Hhhhh wrote: »

Are you really going to waste your time klaz!

Heraclius

Strumms wrote: »

In 2021 our tax is spent thusly..

Social Protection: 23.3 billion

Health: 22.1 billion

Education: 8.9 billion

Justice: 3.0 billion

Agriculture: 1.8 billion

Debt Service/EU payments : 9.2 billion

Transport : 3.5 billion

Misc : 17.8 billion

So we want to run up higher numbers by facilitating a rapid population growth ?

Who pays for it ? Taxes will skyrocket....

You seem to be assuming that economy will remain the same size and tax revenue won't grow. Extra people should mean an increase in tax revenue. If a country couldn't survive population growth there wouldn't be a country left at this stage.

Gradius

Strumms wrote: »

Try running our health service without LEGAL immigrants with genuine qualifications.

Yep, all whom arrive to fill skills gaps and shortages in skills and qualified...earn, pay their way and contribute to the running and success of the state and its population.[/quote]

But this is just the Crux of it, isn't it?

Two thirds of youth in this country are unemployed. Shocking, even withstanding the pandemic fallout.

Yet you'll handily find entire spar shops and the like run entirely by non-irish people.

Essential skills? Employment gaps?

It simply doesn't tally. Rubbish.

If one doctor can cater for the needs of 100 people, but you bring in 200 people for every doctor...build 10 units of accommodation for every twenty people that arrive...

It's the mathematics of a raving lunatic. Solid, all-day-long imbeciles and conmen are driving this.

Justin Credible Darts

Heraclius wrote: »

You seem to be assuming that economy will remain the same size and tax revenue won't grow. Extra people should mean an increase in tax revenue. If a country couldn't survive population growth there wouldn't be a country left at this stage.

get real.....most of the people coming here are making the system worse.
They have to be housed for starters.
where do you think that money comes from ?

Justin Credible Darts

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

tell me, when someone is caught entering this country on a false passport, how do you think they were caught ?


astound me..

What's the point?
If someone is not allowed entry to the state, the do not get entry.
If someone is allowed entry, then they are allowed to enter, but they do not need to register anywhere.
So any amount of people can be living here, without any authority knowing they are living here.
That's ok to you?

Strumms

Heraclius wrote: »

You seem to be assuming that economy will remain the same size and tax revenue won't grow. Extra people should mean an increase in tax revenue. If a country couldn't survive population growth there wouldn't be a country left at this stage.

Extra tax revenue is of sweet fûck all use when they are in receipt of more in handouts then they are bringing in to the kitty.... housing, weekly cash, free unlimited healthcare, free unlimited transport... as well as other benefits....

The country can survive growth, it can’t survive being overburdened...you need a new calculator.

Justin Credible Darts

Strumms wrote: »

Extra tax revenue is of sweet fûck all use when they are in receipt of more in handouts then they are bringing in to the kitty.... housing, weekly cash, free unlimited healthcare, free unlimited transport... as well as other benefits....

The country can survive growth, it can’t survive being overburdened...you need a new calculator.

no no no......they get a free house, benefits, free healthcare, but that is ok they might have a part time job and pay a small amount of tax....and low rent for the house.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Likely a range of hosted servers. You do understand how data can be recorded and stored in this digital age of ours?

You seem to think that this would be hard to do. It's not.

Oh I understand exactly how data can be recorded, I also understand how it can be kept and for.what reasons. Legally.
Living and working here, no need to register and no authority keeping that data.
Any reason to.think otherwise?

Justin Credible Darts

bubblypop wrote: »

What's the point?
If someone is not allowed entry to the state, the do not get entry.
If someone is allowed entry, then they are allowed to enter, but they do not need to register anywhere.
So any amount of people can be living here, without any authority knowing they are living here.
That's ok to you?

well done on avoiding the question.


tell me why would they be stopped from entering ?
could it be their information and details dont correlate with government records for example ?
Might a system in place flag something up ?

Heraclius

Strumms wrote: »

Extra tax revenue is of sweet fûck all use when they are in receipt of more in handouts then they are bringing in to the kitty.... housing, weekly cash, free unlimited healthcare, free unlimited transport... as well as other benefits....

The country can survive growth, it can’t survive being overburdened...you need a new calculator.

Do you have evidence of that though?

Justin Credible Darts

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

no no no......they get a free house, benefits, free healthcare, but that is ok they might have a part time job and pay a small amount of tax....and low rent for the house.

Who do you think gets this

Justin Credible Darts

Heraclius wrote: »

Do you have evidence of that though?

suppose a family of 2 parents and 2 kids gets a 3 bedroom house......mother stays at home, father in low income job, ergo low rent.


Dont need to be an accountant to work out the state is worse off.

Strumms

Heraclius wrote: »

Do you have evidence of that though?

All on the CSO website for you my friend... the rest of it is common sense and arithmetic.

Heraclius

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

suppose a family of 2 parents and 2 kids gets a 3 bedroom house......mother stays at home, father in low income job, ergo low rent.


Dont need to be an accountant to work out the state is worse off.

And you think that example captures every migrant to Ireland or even the median or mean migrant?

Heraclius

Strumms wrote: »

All on the CSO website for you my friend... the rest of it is common sense and arithmetic.

Post a link so please.

Strumms

Heraclius wrote: »

Post a link so please.

Google so please I’m not your PA.

Justin Credible Darts

Heraclius wrote: »

And you think that example captures every migrant to Ireland or even the median or mean migrant?

What percentage do you reckon of immigrants own their own home, pay tax, and pay in more than they take out ?


I suggest you take a step outside your from door and walk through any council estate and look at the ethnicity of estates today.

Heraclius

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

What percentage do you reckon of immigrants own their own home, pay tax, and pay in more than they take out ?


I suggest you take a step outside your from door and walk through any council estate and look at the ethnicity of estates today.

I don't know so I would like you to provide statistics from a reputable source. I'm not even sure who you are talking about now? Is it everyone who isn't Irish or just asylum seekers?

Last time I went campaigning in a council estate almost every door was opened by someone I believe was Irish.

Heraclius

Strumms wrote: »

Google so please I’m not your PA.

I'm still waiting for this evidence. If it was easy to find/existed I'm sure you'd have posted it so I guess it was just prejudice.

Strumms

Heraclius wrote: »

I'm still waiting for this evidence. If it was easy to find/existed I'm sure you'd have posted it so I guess it was just prejudice.

Ok, prejudice is right there on the cso website, you don’t want to be enabled with facts by virtue of clicking a mouse not my problem just shows you up for taking a rather disingenuous stand. .

Heraclius

Strumms wrote: »

Ok, prejudice is right there on the cso website, you don’t want to be enabled with facts by virtue of clicking a mouse not my problem. .

An emoji is not really evidence. I take it you aren't going to provide it anyway. It's a shame, you'd have totally won me over.

Strumms

Heraclius wrote: »

An emoji is not really evidence. I take it you aren't going to provide it anyway. It's a shame, you'd have totally won me over.

You’d have won yourself over if you could follow simple advice and go to the CSO website and actively obtain this info you have a definite craving for. Yes, a real shame.

Gradius

Heraclius wrote: »

An emoji is not really evidence. I take it you aren't going to provide it anyway. It's a shame, you'd have totally won me over.

Listen, you're no more interested in evidence than a hamster is in particle physics.

I showed you direct evidence earlier, quoted solid information, damn, I even calculated some numbers for you.

And what did it result in? Sweet bollock all.

You're acting like a pure shill.

Do you want to point out the details of Dalton's quantum chemistry? No, you wont?

"Guess chemistry doesn't exist then hurp durp"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5a45f1uy80

Heraclius

Gradius wrote: »

Listen, you're no more interested in evidence than a hamster is in particle physics.

I showed you direct evidence earlier, quoted solid information, damn, I even calculated some numbers for you.

And what did it result in? Sweet bollock all.

You're acting like a pure shill.

Do you want to point out the details of Dalton's quantum chemistry? No, you wont?

"Guess chemistry doesn't exist then hurp durp"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5a45f1uy80

I disagreed with you on your claim of 50% in less than a generation and I still do. I will accept that we may define generations very differently though.

I will accept that other poster's claims if he can back them up with some statistics from a reputable source.

If you want to discuss quantum chemistry I would love to.

Gradius

Heraclius wrote: »

I disagreed with you on your claim of 50% in less than a generation and I still do. I will accept that we may define generations very differently though.

I will accept that other poster's claims if he can back them up with some statistics from a reputable source.

If you want to discuss quantum chemistry I would love to.

United Nations forecasts from 2017 is global average population growth of approximately 1%, equating to roughly 14% total increase to 2040.

I calculated, assuming a generation is 40 years, from historical government statistics and government plans, that the population increase in this country would be 59%.

59% is larger than 14%. That's not a claim. That's a mathematically calculated number.

Let's imagine your idea of generation is only 20 years. Great, now we can use only historical data. And that calculation is 32% of an increase.

32% is larger than 14%. That's not a claim. That's a number.

Let's get particular. The population increase from 2000 to 2010 was 0.9 million, so a 24% increase.

24% is larger than 14%. That's not a claim. That's a mathematically calculated number. Is your idea of a generation only 10 years?

And so on.

I'd break down the birth rates if I was bothered, and also if the information wasn't "accidentally" vague. And you already know what that's going to show, whether you can absorb it or not.

Here's a bonus nugget of information too, there is +1 net migrant every 90 minutes in Ireland.

So, I suppose you'll find something else to "disagree" with next...

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

Oh I understand exactly how data can be recorded, I also understand how it can be kept and for.what reasons. Legally.
Living and working here, no need to register and no authority keeping that data.
Any reason to.think otherwise?

Legally. You make it sound like the government or any such authority does not have the legal right to access information collected by airlines or ports on travelers entering or leaving these areas. They do.

I didn't say anyone needed to register. Look at the requirements for the booking of flights. An ID/Passport is needed for such a purchase, and again, the same photo ID is required when passing through security. The details of that ID will be recorded first by the airline, and that information will be passed to airport security (to be put against known risks), or fed into a database for the police to track the movements of criminals and other such threats.

You could take a look at the various airlines, they all require that you have ID with you for the boarding of their aircraft, and the same again, for Irish ferries, or similar. Which is why your ticket, and ID are checked before gaining access to the departure area. However, you've said that you've traveled a fair bit, so I assume that you know from personal experience that you need such documentation to travel.. regardless of the freedom of movement for EU citizens.

Now. You've gone beyond silly at this stage in your effort to deny that such records will be recorded, and made available to the government. This is basic common sense, considering the range of risks from terrorism, and other considerations, that have affected travel services over the last few decades.. and even outside of that, all companies have statistics about their consumers, again, which will be made available to the government if required. All legal.

And... I'm finished dancing around this pole with you. Unless you've got some evidence that shows that the government is unable to gain any such information on travelers?

Heraclius

Gradius wrote: »

United Nations forecasts from 2017 is global average population growth of approximately 1%, equating to roughly 14% total increase to 2040.

I calculated, assuming a generation is 40 years, from historical government statistics and government plans, that the population increase in this country would be 59%.

59% is larger than 14%. That's not a claim. That's a mathematically calculated number.

Let's imagine your idea of generation is only 20 years. Great, now we can use only historical data. And that calculation is 32% of an increase.

32% is larger than 14%. That's not a claim. That's a number.

Let's get particular. The population increase from 2000 to 2010 was 0.9 million, so a 24% increase.

24% is larger than 14%. That's not a claim. That's a mathematically calculated number. Is your idea of a generation only 10 years?

And so on.

I'd break down the birth rates if I was bothered, and also if the information wasn't "accidentally" vague. And you already know what that's going to show, whether you can absorb it or not.

Here's a bonus nugget of information too, there is +1 net migrant every 90 minutes in Ireland.

So, I suppose you'll find something else to "disagree" with next...

How do you get a 1% growth rate to 2040 being 14%? If you mean from 2021 to 2040 surely 1% over 19 years yields 20.8% growth?

I will accept your figure for the global population growth rate of 1% it seems about right. The Irish population growth rate is 1.1% (From the CSO April 2020 estimates) though which doesn't support your argument for atypical growth in Ireland. Over the same 19 year period that the world would grow 20.8% I think Ireland would grow 23.1%.

Gradius

Heraclius wrote: »

How do you get a 1% growth rate to 2040 being 14%? If you mean from 2021 to 2040 surely 1% over 19 years yields 20.8% growth?

I will accept your figure for the global population growth rate of 1% it seems about right. The Irish population growth rate is 1.1% (From the CSO April 2020 estimates) though which doesn't support your argument for atypical growth in Ireland. Over the same 19 year period that the world would grow 20.8% I think Ireland would grow 23.1%.

Rate versus growth.

Normal core human temperature is 37 degrees.

If your temperature increased at a RATE of 1% per year, you wouldn't live to see your third birthday.

If your temperature GREW by 1% total, you'd live happily ever after with a nice sweat.

1% can sound benign, but it can mean very different things. It's late and I can't be arsed explaining everything.

Justin Credible Darts

Heraclius wrote: »

I don't know so I would like you to provide statistics from a reputable source. I'm not even sure who you are talking about now? Is it everyone who isn't Irish or just asylum seekers?

Last time I went campaigning in a council estate almost every door was opened by someone I believe was Irish.

The onus is on you to back up your initial claim.Thats how it works.




you think most immigrants are not taking from the state ?
for every immigrant who is fleecing the system, getting houses etc, they need countless working immigrants contributing to compensate for that, Its not happening.


As I said earlier, all these immigrants are getting housed...quicker than irish people are, and it is financially crippling.