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What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

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    #9212
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    You tell me Mike. Its your question. So what is your answer?

    What if the person being stoned has committed rape of children or murder. Is it still vile in your opinion then to stone to death the person found guilty of such crimes.

    Yes. It is vile and backwards to stone anyone to death.

    See how easy it is to answer a simple question Robbie??


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    #9213
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    Leviticus 24:16
    16 Whoever blasphemes the name of the Lord shall surely be put to death. All the congregation shall stone him. The sojourner as well as the native, when he blasphemes the Name, shall be put to death.

    Christians believe that the bible was mans interpretation of Gods message. Man is fallible. They also had a reformation.

    Muslims believe the Quran is the actual literal word of the prophet Mo. No reformation.

    You know all of this though. It’s been said many many times.


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    #9214
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    I am an opponent of all forms of capital punishment.

    The Christian Bible however says adultery is punishable by death by stoning. See leviticus below.

    Leviticus 20:10
    10 “If a man commits adultery with the wife of[a] his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death

    Mentions of stoning: 0


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    #9215
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    bubblypop wrote: »
    This seems to be a ridiculous line of questioning going on here now.

    Pretty sure the majority of people don't agreeing with stoning people as punishment, or throwing gays from really high places or marrying children.
    What is the point of this?

    So surely it would be easy to state the above and end the line of questions rather than deflecting and whataboutery??


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    #9216
    WrenBoy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭WrenBoy


    Fandymo wrote: »
    Christians believe that the bible was mans interpretation of Gods message. Man is fallible. They also had a reformation.

    Muslims believe the Quran is the actual literal word of the prophet Mo. No reformation.

    You know all of this though. It’s been said many many times.

    Actually may be a type error but the Quran is believed by muslims to be the literal and final word of Allah which was revealed through/given to muhammad.


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    #9217
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Fandymo wrote: »
    So surely it would be easy to state the above and end the line of questions rather than deflecting and whataboutery??

    Sure who has said otherwise!!


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    #9218
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    WrenBoy wrote: »
    Actually may be a type error but the Quran is believed by muslims to be the literal and final word of Allah which was revealed through/given to muhammad.

    That’s why I called him the prophet. They believe his words to be the literal word of god, not an interpretation or adaptation. The literal word.


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    #9219
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Sure who has said otherwise!!

    Well there is one poster who had so far refused to state that killing gay people, stoning adulterers, marrying six year olds is vile and backwards. He was asked for a simple yes or no to the question, but refused to answer.

    If this was the other way around you’d be on it like a bloodhound.


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    #9220
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Sure who has said otherwise!!

    You've interjected yourself into a line of questions with another poster, where they had painted themselves in to a corner; possibly in some noble attempt to dig an ally out of a tight spot.

    "Rediculous"?
    they can't bring themselves to call stoning for adultery vile.
    That's ridiculous all right.


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    #9221
    Wibbs
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,159 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    I remember now reading how crusading knights would abstain from baptismal rites until near death so that they could be without sin as they enter heaven.
    Eh, I don't know what you were reading that claimed that, but it is an obvious nonsense. Every Christian was baptised usually as soon as possible after they were born(infant mortality being a serious risk) to bring them into the Church. No crusading knight would have been unbaptised. It was a fundamental entry requirement.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



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    #9222
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    MikeOxsgreen wrote: »
    You've interjected yourself into a line of questions with another poster, where they had painted themselves in to a corner; possibly in some noble attempt to dig an ally out of a tight spot.

    "Rediculous"?
    they can't bring themselves to call stoning for adultery vile.
    That's ridiculous all right.

    You mike have interjected yourself into a discussion I was having with JCD. :rolleyes:


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    #9223
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Wibbs wrote: »
    Eh, I don't know what you were reading that claimed that, but it is an obvious nonsense. Every Christian was baptised usually as soon as possible after they were born(infant mortality being a serious risk) to bring them into the Church. No crusading knight would have been unbaptised. It was a fundamental entry requirement.

    Every Christian is not baptised as soon as they are born.


    I might well be wrong on the crusaders but you are wrong that every Christian is baptised as an infant.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptism


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    #9224
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    WrenBoy wrote: »
    The point is that the main figure in Christianity does not advocate the stoning of women for adultery. If stoning women for adultery is as accepted in Christianity as Islam then we would expect Jesus to affirm that the punishment is stoning and say it is right to do so, but he doesn't. None are without sin is the message , it highlights the move in christianity that the punishment for sins is for God alone.

    As for your second point, Ive never heard of that so no offence I wont take that as a point but I'd be happy to look at some link to the info if you have one.

    And you will now of course provide a source from the Quran where Allah orders stoning for adultery right?


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    #9225
    WrenBoy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭WrenBoy


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    Every Christian is not baptised as soon as they are born.


    I might well be wrong on the crusaders but you are wrong that every Christian is baptised as an infant.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptism


    Are you talking about people who convert to Christianity later in life ?


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    #9226
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    And you will now of course provide a source from the Quran where Allah orders stoning for adultery right?

    It’s in the Hadiths.

    Hadith, Arabic Ḥadīth (“News” or “Story”), also spelled Hadīt, record of the traditions or sayings of the Prophet Muhammad, revered and received as a major source of religious law and moral guidance, second only to the authority of the Qurʾān, the holy book of Islam.

    'Ubada b. as-Samit reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: Receive (teaching) from me, receive (teaching) from me. Allah has ordained a way for those (women). When an unmarried male commits adultery with an unmarried female (they should receive) one hundred lashes and banishment for one year. And in case of married male committing adultery with a married female, they shall receive one hundred lashes and be stoned to death.


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    #9227
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Fandymo wrote: »
    Yes. It is vile and backwards to stone anyone to death.

    See how easy it is to answer a simple question Robbie??

    I never asked you that. To borrow a phrase from Mike "you have interjected" yourself into a discussion i was not having with you.
    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    What is my agenda. Am I a secret gay killing, child marrying, woman abuser?

    You should also note that I have never directly condemned the use of nuclear weapons in this thread.


    What utter nonsense your posting. Secret agenda indeed.
    Write up your list of crimes you wish me to condem and condem them all to secular hell I will just for you pal. Xoxo

    Can you please provide quotes outfling my "Agenda"?
    Can you provide any quotes of me supporting your position that i supported any of the heinous acts you are accusing me of supporting?


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    #9228
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Fandymo wrote: »
    It’s in the Hadiths.

    Hadith, Arabic Ḥadīth (“News” or “Story”), also spelled Hadīt, record of the traditions or sayings of the Prophet Muhammad, revered and received as a major source of religious law and moral guidance, second only to the authority of the Qurʾān, the holy book of Islam.

    'Ubada b. as-Samit reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: Receive (teaching) from me, receive (teaching) from me. Allah has ordained a way for those (women). When an unmarried male commits adultery with an unmarried female (they should receive) one hundred lashes and banishment for one year. And in case of married male committing adultery with a married female, they shall receive one hundred lashes and be stoned to death.


    From the Quran please. The Quran was explicitly mentioned so please use that as your source!


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    #9229
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    You mike have interjected yourself into a discussion I was having with JCD. :rolleyes:

    Correct - it's an open discussion.
    but I'm not in an indignant pique when it's pointed out to me.

    :rolleyes:


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    #9230
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    So we'll just put Robbie down for enjoying an auld stoning or two.


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    #9231
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    WrenBoy wrote: »
    Are you talking about people who convert to Christianity later in life ?

    No.

    I provided a link with all the information you need. In that wiki article there is a table outlining which Christian sects baptise infants and which don't. Please go and find the information you need.


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    #9232
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    I never asked you that. To borrow a phrase from Mike "you have interjected" yourself into a discussion i was not having with you.



    Can you please provide quotes outfling my "Agenda"?
    Can you provide any quotes of me supporting your position that i supported any of the heinous acts you are accusing me of supporting?

    It’s a public message board, there is a pm option for a private conversation.

    Your refusal to answer simple yes/no questions give me the impression that you see no issue with them.

    As the quote goes “Often what people don't say or leave out, tells the real story”.


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    #9233
    Wibbs
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,159 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    Every Christian is not baptised as soon as they are born.


    I might well be wrong on the crusaders but you are wrong that every Christian is baptised as an infant.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptism
    Oh for god's sake(no pun). Wikipedia? Your understanding of history and religion is more than a bit lacking. We're talking about pre Reformation here. Outside of the Eastern Church(where they also baptised infants as a given) there was only the Church back then, the same church crusading knights belonged to. The same church that also baptised Christian born infants as a given.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



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    #9234
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Wibbs wrote: »
    Oh for god's sake(no pun). Wikipedia? Your understanding of history and religion is more than a bit lacking. We're talking about pre Reformation here. Outside of the Eastern Church(where they also baptised infants as a given) there was only the Church back then, the same church crusading knights belonged to. The same church that also baptised Christian born infants as a given.

    Death by stoning for wibbs the blasphemer!


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    #9235
    WrenBoy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭WrenBoy


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    And you will now of course provide a source from the Quran where Allah orders stoning for adultery right?

    Well I wasn't going to initially to be honest.
    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    From the Quran please. The Quran was explicitly mentioned so please use that as your source!

    Punishment for adultery in Quran:
    Quran 24.2

    The [unmarried] woman or [unmarried] man found guilty of sexual intercourse1 - lash each one of them with a hundred lashes,2 and do not be taken by pity for them in the religion [i.e., law] of Allah,3 if you should believe in Allah and the Last Day. And let a group of the believers witness their punishment.


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    #9236
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    WrenBoy wrote: »
    Well I wasn't going to initially to be honest.



    Punishment for adultery in Quran:
    Quran 24.2

    The [unmarried] woman or [unmarried] man found guilty of sexual intercourse1 - lash each one of them with a hundred lashes,2 and do not be taken by pity for them in the religion [i.e., law] of Allah,3 if you should believe in Allah and the Last Day. And let a group of the believers witness their punishment.

    Sorry can you tell me where is says stoning?
    I mean there have been pages and pages at this stage accusing me of supporting stoning. So I am not sure what the above passage is in reference to.

    Edit: I think we have been quite clear on this too. I have stated I am an opponent of Capital punishment. So lets be clear stoning is a capital punishment and lashing is a corporal punishment.


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    #9237
    Alwandy
    Registered Users Posts: 49 ✭Alwandy


    Sigh,


    Bible verses about stoning:
    https://biblia.com/bible/esv/leviticus/20/27
    https://biblia.com/bible/esv/exodus/21/28
    https://biblia.com/bible/esv/deuteronomy/22/24

    I can keep going if wanted?

    Now to answer your questions about muslims:
    1. Treatment of Women, by Prophet Muhammed statements we are supposedly to respect our wifes, treat them with kindness and offer them everything. If you actually read the Qu'ran you would read some statements such as: The man shall bring the money for the family while the woman who makes money shall keep it for herself. It is a man duty to feed the family and take care of his wife .. More in depth if you read it properly which you haven't.

    2. Stoning on gays, sadly this includes all three Abrahamic religions. I do not agree with it as I do not like life being taken away (1 Tour Afghanistan, trust me I know how it is) but yes it is said so in Qu'ran, though most muslims agrees it is not theirs to judge rather than Allah himself. In other words, it is not my business and I'm flattered if a gay person flirts with me.

    3. Marrying 12 year olds, I'm sure you referencing to our prophet Mohammed, this was quite a norm back in the days even in Europe, the royal families tried to keep the bloodline clean etc by doing inbred work :)

    4. Arrange marriage is not Islam, it is a culture. Many Asian countries has this issue, look at India, Look at China etc.... It's all for profit and gains.


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    #9238
    Fandymo
    Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    RobbieTheRobber wrote: »
    From the Quran please. The Quran was explicitly mentioned so please use that as your source!

    One poster, who hasn’t posted since 23:47 last night and wasn’t me, mistakenly said it was in the Quran.

    Why would I use some stranger on the internet’s mistake as my source, when I know it’s incorrect and I have provided the correct source a few posts back. That’s a ridiculous request Robbie.


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    #9239
    Alwandy
    Registered Users Posts: 49 ✭Alwandy


    WrenBoy wrote: »
    Well I wasn't going to initially to be honest.



    Punishment for adultery in Quran:
    Quran 24.2

    The [unmarried] woman or [unmarried] man found guilty of sexual intercourse1 - lash each one of them with a hundred lashes,2 and do not be taken by pity for them in the religion [i.e., law] of Allah,3 if you should believe in Allah and the Last Day. And let a group of the believers witness their punishment.

    That's not stoning, that's whipping (does not make it better though). And adultery back in those days religion or not was harshly punished. Always keep in mind as these were written this is how the world looked around it.



    BTW,
    Don't get me wrong, I understand where you guys are coming from with these comments as some muslim countries haven't really... represented us well.


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    #9240
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    enricoh wrote: »
    I'm amazed rte reported it! Someone slipped up!

    So am I.

    Today's story on RTE is about a Syrian refugee who set up a pharmacy in Carlow.

    And I didn't realise until this week, the Black and Irish podcast that they keep giving article space to, is actually theirs(maybe they didnt have it originally).
    This week the B&I had E.Joseph on to talk about systematic racism.

    Nice to see taxpayers license fee is funding that far left trash.


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    #9241
    RobbieTheRobber
    Registered Users Posts: 6,826 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Fandymo wrote: »
    Christians believe that the bible was mans interpretation of Gods message. Man is fallible. They also had a reformation.

    Muslims believe the Quran is the actual literal word of the prophet Mo. No reformation.

    You know all of this though. It’s been said many many times.
    Fandymo wrote: »
    One poster, who hasn’t posted since 23:47 last night and wasn’t me, mistakenly said it was in the Quran.

    Why would I use some stranger on the internet’s mistake as my source, when I know it’s incorrect and I have provided the correct source a few posts back. That’s a ridiculous request Robbie.

    No actually you also named the Quran during the discussion.

    Any luck finding quotes to support your belief I have an agenda?


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