What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

Cordell

Cordell wrote: »

No, not really, or it's the good kind of multiculturalism, where the cultures share the core values, they complement each other, and they have more in common than they have differences. Let me put it this way: in this "multiplicity of cultures" no american will be beheaded some italian just because they put pineapple on pizza.

You need to add "progress" and the advancement of social consciousness to your logic. It's what tends to separate western culture from others. In that, personal freedoms, and the protections extended to the weakest members of society, tend to be lacking in non-western nations, which comes from the development of European, and later, American thought on social development, and freedom.

Annasopra

Annasopra wrote: »

Isnt that multiculturalism then? You know Westerm Culture being a multiplicity of cultures from Akerica and many European countries.

I can't think of many objections (on the thread) of multiculturalism that involved peoples of similar cultural backgrounds, or the connections within "Western culture". The issues tend to arise when the conversation turns to those of very different cultures, such as Africans, and Arabic/Persian. Which are significantly different from western culture.

Cordell

Deleted User wrote: »

You need to add "progress" and the advancement of social consciousness to your logic. It's what tends to separate western culture from others. In that, personal freedoms, and the protections extended to the weakest members of society, tend to be lacking in non-western nations, which comes from the development of European, and later, American thought on social development, and freedom.

I kind of did, in my early posts on this, before the discussion was diverted into things like food and music.

99nsr125

SchrodingersCat wrote: »

Cultural racism/neo-racism describes discrimination of racial and ethnic groups based on cultural differences. If you believe that various cultures are not compatible with each other and should not co-exist in the same society, then congrats: You are a Cultural Racist. https://www.encyclopedia.com/cultural-racism


Biological racism is where groups are discriminated and oppressed based on their biological race. This is the racism that we are most familiar with, as it caused so much harm to our societies in the last century. We saw the horrible results of racism in the second world war, 60's America, apartheid, colonialism, etc. Thankfully, we have come a long way since. In the second half of the last century, societies have progressed to where it became a repulsive view with the general public and made governments denounce it.

The reason why both biological and Cultural Racism are forms of racism is that both result in the same harmful discrimination of groups of people.
Another reason why Cultural Racism is a form of racism is because biological racists use it as a tool to push a more palatable version of their views to the public. Remember when I said how the general public were repulsed by racism? Well, instead of saying that they don't want a certain race of people accepted in their country, its an easier sell to say that they don't want a certain culture of people accepted in their country. Both have the same result, which is the discrimination of a group of people, but one is less repulsive to say than the other.
Similarly, biological racists use Cultural Racism to justify to themselves that they are not racist.

Annasopra summarised it well:





See explanation above.

Culture is not race in cased you missed that bit during your education.

MontgomeryClift

99nsr125 wrote: »

Culture is not race in cased you missed that bit during your education.

It is.

All this talk of Western Culture, when what people really mean is White Culture!

MontgomeryClift

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

It is.

All this talk of Western Culture, when what people really mean is White Culture!

No, that's fair, Western culture would be predominately related to White people/White culture. Although I always found it interesting that the darker shades of the Mediterranean in Europe are still considered to be White, simply because they're part of Europe.

However, culture is not based on race, unless you're looking to make it so.

MontgomeryClift

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

It is.

All this talk of Western Culture, when what people really mean is white European Culture!

FYP
Ideology movitavated by "white" culture is despicable.

MikeOxsgreen

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

Ideology movitavated by "white" culture is despicable.

Whereas any ideology driven by any other racial group is a good thing? That's racist!

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Whereas any ideology driven by any other racial group is a good thing? That's racist!

Only white people can be racist!

RobbieTheRobber

Cordell wrote: »

But camel racing, halal music (no pitched instruments, just percussion), no alcohol, no books, men only dancing are just as good

You fell for it What you listed are indeed things that are making life enjoyable, but the core western values are those that make life worth living. They are not specifically Irish, but they are Irish and French and German and American all the same. Western values, they are those that make our culture superior. After all, computers and internet, i.e. what makes this very conversation possible, is the result of western science and, why not, capitalism.

So not Irish right?

Your are now claiming American values as Irish culture. Are we claiming BLM for Irish culture too?

RobbieTheRobber

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The issues tend to arise when the conversation turns to those of very different cultures, such as Africans, and Arabic/Persian. Which are significantly different from western culture.

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No, that's fair, Western culture would be predominately related to White people/White culture. Although I always found it interesting that the darker shades of the Mediterranean in Europe are still considered to be White, simply because they're part of Europe.

However, culture is not based on race, unless you're looking to make it so.

That seems like a racial split in your previous post klaz

Cordell

So it's racist and harmful discrimination to claim that the culture flying probes to Mars is superior to the ones of talibans and zulu warriors.
In fact, their cultures are all just as good and equal.

*delusion intensifies*

RobbieTheRobber

Cordell wrote: »

So it's racist and harmful discrimination to claim that the culture flying probes to Mars is superior to the ones of talibans and zulu warriors.
In fact, their cultures are all just as good and equal.

*delusion intensifies*

I didn't say racist Cordell untie your knickers there pal they seem to be twisted up.

We flying many probes to Mars from Ireland?

Cordell

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

I didn't say racist Cordell untie your knickers there pal they seem to be twisted up.

It wasn't directed at you, bud.

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

We flying many probes to Mars from Ireland?

https://www.esa.int/Space_in_Member_States/Ireland

RobbieTheRobber

Cordell wrote: »

It wasn't directed at you, bud.



https://www.esa.int/Space_in_Member_States/Ireland

That looks like a multicultural European space agency.

Cordell

No, it actually looks like western culture.

RobbieTheRobber

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

That seems like a racial split in your previous post klaz

Of course there is... because I said as much. :rolleyes:

Although, again, its not exactly racial, but cultural.

RobbieTheRobber

Cordell wrote: »

No, it actually looks like western culture.

Much in the same way the baseball world series and BLM protests are western culture I guess.

RobbieTheRobber

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Much in the same way the baseball world series and BLM protests are western culture I guess.

They are American aspects of western culture.

Much as the GAA and homegrown political protests are part of the Irish western culture.

Culturally very similar but tweaked for individual countries situations.

RobbieTheRobber

[Deleted User] wrote: »

They are American aspects of western culture.

Much as the GAA and homegrown political protests are part of the Irish western culture.

Culturally very similar but tweaked for individual countries situations.

Mmm hmmm

Cordell wrote: »

You can't separate them, western cultures evolved together as THE western culture with it's values that we value today.

Indeed.

Cordell

Yes, some cultures enjoy soccer and pizza, others hamburgers and basketball, others hang homosexuals, they are all the same and they are all equal.

Sudden Valley

Odd that people are only talking about Technology making western culture "superior", whatever that means, while seemingly ignoring the eastern countries like Japan, Taiwan, South Korea and the inventions/technological advances they have come up with. I prefer western culture, just not sure it is superior. The ideas of superior culture is not too far way from the idea of a superior race.

Sudden Valley

Sudden Valley wrote: »

Odd that people are only talking about Technology making western culture "superior", whatever that means, while seemingly ignoring the eastern countries like Japan, Taiwan, South Korea and the inventions/technological advances they have come up with. I prefer western culture, just not sure it is superior. The ideas of superior culture is not too far way from the idea of a superior race.

I don't think not embracing a culture that is intolerant to homosexuality or equal rights for the sexes or races is anywhere near the idea of a superior race.

RobbieTheRobber

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't think not embracing a culture that is intolerant to homosexuality or equal rights for the sexes or races is anywhere near the idea of a superior race.

Your right we shouldnt embrace Poland and Hungary.

kildare lad

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

I mean your making my argument for me mike you haven't yet produced a single unique positive thing about Irish culture.

Just out of curiosity since Ireland hasnt produced a single positive thing culturally . What positive cultural aspects have you seen from African migrantion , Asia migration and Eastern European migration to Ireland over the last 2 decades ???

RobbieTheRobber

kildare lad wrote: »

Just out of curiosity since Ireland hasnt produced a single positive thing culturally . What positive cultural aspects have you seen from African migrantion , Asia migration and Eastern European migration to Ireland over the last 2 decades ???

Well kildare lad I actually believe my question is fallacious. For the same reasons I said the big gotcha about multiculturalism was fallacious. If you exclude all the positive things from human society food and arts and culture music and sport and science. Write them off as exoticism then really us humans aren't worth a lot.
What were the positives we discovered are really left for Ireland (Guinness farts and tayto and a middle Eastern religion) ?
So really I think my question was stupid but I think the question about multiculturalism framed in the same way is stupid too for the exact same reasons.

Mic 1972

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Well kildare lad I actually believe my question is fallacious. For the same reasons I said the big gotcha about multiculturalism was fallacious. If you exclude all the positive things from human society food and arts and culture music and sport and science. Write them off as exoticism then really us humans aren't worth a lot.
What were the positives we discovered are really left for Ireland (Guinness farts and tayto and a middle Eastern religion) ?
So really I think my question was stupid but I think the question about multiculturalism framed in the same way is stupid too for the exact same reasons.

once again, you didn't answer the question

RobbieTheRobber

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

If you exclude all the positive things from human society food and arts and culture music and sport and science. Write them off as exoticism then really us humans aren't worth a lot.

The first answers you got were actually values-based, and called to the values of individuality, freedom, equality and so on, which you dismissed out of hand without any comment.

I've seen nobody object to multiculturalism on the basis that we simply cannot take one more new Middle-Eastern recipe in the country. I've seen plenty object on the basis that values are part of culture, and they prefer values of freedom, equality and so on to values that restrict women, punish homosexuality, curtail freedoms etc.

If the biggest threat that multiculturalism proposed to Irish society was that we might have to find some way to cope with more varied cuisine and music scenes in a couple of decades, there wouldn't even be a thread about it.

Mic 1972

Mic 1972 wrote: »

once again, you didn't answer the question

I'm shocked

RobbieTheRobber

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Your right we shouldnt embrace Poland and Hungary.

Are they stringing them from cranes or flinging them off roofs?