What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

MarkEadie

MikeOxsgreen wrote: »

These chaps look bent on integrating into a "multiculture"

What percentage of Muslims do you think are like this? I know this question has been asked before and completely dodged and I don't expect to get a direct answer in terms of a percentage but I thought I'd ask anyway.

MarkEadie

MarkEadie wrote: »

What percentage of Muslims do you think are like this? I know this question has been asked before and completely dodged and I don't expect to get a direct answer in terms of a percentage but I thought I'd ask anyway.

A quick Google (from 5 years ago granted)

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/apr/11/british-muslims-strong-sense-of-belonging-poll-homosexuality-sharia-law

And what is an acceptable amount of this thinking to allow in ?

MarkEadie

MarkEadie wrote: »

What percentage of Muslims do you think are like this? I know this question has been asked before and completely dodged and I don't expect to get a direct answer in terms of a percentage but I thought I'd ask anyway.

This kind of question has been raised numerous times on the thread, and various posters have committed themselves to answering it.

The problem is that posters like yourself won't accept any opinions given in response to it, and will instead, cry "stop generalising", "what about the individuals?", etc. So.. no, it wasn't dodged, although, TBF, it's a question that's realistically impossible to answer... but that's the point, in asking such a loaded question, isn't it?

For myself, I would say that the majority of Muslim males from the age of 13 to 99, would have opinions to match those in the image. I doubt they're all out protesting in public though, but I would imagine there's quite a network of such sentiment floating around online somewhere. Islam is a very community driven religion, and peer pressure along with religious conditioning would ensure that most would agree with such sentiments.

Dyr

MarkEadie wrote: »

What percentage of Muslims do you think are like this? I know this question has been asked before and completely dodged and I don't expect to get a direct answer in terms of a percentage but I thought I'd ask anyway.

Better question, what percentage of Islamic societies are like this?

It's no good saying the majority of Muslims are grand when they inevitabily create societies where this is the norm.

Wibbs

Deleted User wrote: »

For myself, I would say that the majority of Muslim males from the age of 13 to 99, would have opinions to match those in the image.

Not in my experience, or at least it varies by quite a bit. Just going on those Muslims I've known(all men, mostly in Ireland, all clued in, mostly qualified in something guys), I can think of only one that would be on the "kill the enemies of Islam" end of things and his mates would tend to throw their eyes up to heaven when he came out with that stuff. His ire was very much focused too, mostly on US foreign policy, but a broader WTF with western interference in the ME. He was the most educated of the lot too.

Most of all they kinda reminded me of general views towards subjects like homosexuality, religion and women that would have fitted into 1950's Catholic Ireland. Minus the beer. Their support for Islamic freedom fighters depended on which group, where and how they went about things. Mowing down civillians was seen as well out of order.

The community is a huge thing alright, but I always got the impression it was as much if not more about origin country and its form of Islam than Islam itself and a feature of diasporas everywhere.

Wibbs

Wibbs wrote: »

Not in my experience, or at least it varies by quite a bit. Just going on those Muslims I've known(all men, mostly in Ireland, all clued in, mostly qualified in something guys), I can think of only one that would be on the "kill the enemies of Islam" end of things and his mates would tend to throw their eyes up to heaven when he came out with that stuff. His ire was very much focused too, mostly on US foreign policy, but a broader WTF with western interference in the ME. He was the most educated of the lot too.

Maybe. Most of the Muslims that I would have included in my majority statement were those from the M.East, whereas, I've found that Asian/African Muslims don't have much of those sentiments. Still, It really comes down to what I said earlier in the thread. Individually, most Muslims are lovely, but when a group forms, a certain conformity of thinking and attitudes comes into play. At least, in my experience it's like that.

The community is a huge thing alright, but I always got the impression it was as much if not more about origin country and its form of Islam than Islam itself and a feature of diasporas everywhere.

True enough.

Fandymo

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

No!

IF a large number of people from a specific foreign culture (Muslim)
IF move to another country (Belgium)
IF and don't integrate
THEN they are going to create ghettos (Moulenbeek)
THEN subcultures that clash with the nation's culture. (Bataclan suspect able to walk around freely despite being on every news channel in Europe)

It's a giant big fallacy of a post!

You are posting nonsense, that is easily probable as wrong. I’ve amended your post with a real world example of it. Swap Belgium for France, U.K., Germany, etc. Strangely it doesn’t happen in Poland/Hungary.

RobbieTheRobber

Fandymo wrote: »

You are posting nonsense, that is easily probable as wrong. I’ve amended your post with a real world example of it. Swap Belgium for France, U.K., Germany, etc. Strangely it doesn’t happen in Poland/Hungary.

Easily probable haha. What's it like to live in constant fear fandy?

It doesn't happen in Poland except the no go areas for LGBT people right?

https://www.bbc.com/news/stories-54191344

Fandymo

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Seeing as all the posters in this thread love a good question and are so happy to answer questions let's throw another onto the thread and see who wants to answer.

What are the positives of Irish culture?

No lazy culture answers please, no claiming music arts or sport etc. We don't really have a history of cuisine so I shouldn't need to say that but let's add it the banned list of positives anyway.

Chicken fillet rolls, spice bags, coddle. Our great sense of humour, our red hair is very exotic to foreigners. Some of the greatest writers, poets, playwrights, actors given to the world. Our tradition of story telling. The craic.

Fandymo

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Easily probable haha. What's it like to live in constant fear fandy?

It doesn't happen in Poland except the no go areas for LGBT people right?

https://www.bbc.com/news/stories-54191344

My post was specifically about people from a specific foreign culture, in reply to your post about people from a specific foreign culture. Stick to the topic please. Except you cannot.

The majority of LGBT people in Poland/Hungary are indigenous, and their treatment has absolutely nothing to do with multiculturalism. I’m sure there is an LGBT thread if you wish to discuss that there. We are here however to talk about multiculturalism as per the thread title. So do you want to try again??

Annasopra

Fandymo wrote: »

Chicken fillet rolls......

Yeah enough said that you're taking the piss

rgossip30

kildare lad wrote: »

The same government allowing landlords to own hundreds of properties , the biggest owns 2500 apartments in Dublin .... Disgraceful


https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30897316.html


Revenue figures show there are around 3,000 individuals and companies which own over 10 houses or apartments, including 1,000 who own more than 100 properties each.

Landlords with largescale investment property portfolios consisting of over 200 properties are relatively few (Revenue do not provide an exact figure) but the number of properties they own grew by almost 10% in 2018.

Such landlords, which would include real estate investment trusts known as REITs, now own 31,200 housing units compared to 28,600 in 2017. IRES REIT is Ireland’s biggest residential landlord and owns more than 2,500 apartments in Dublin with annual rental income of €36m in 2017.

Some countries don't allow foreigners to buy houses let alone buying multiple properties .

Annasopra

kildare lad wrote: »

Stacey Dooley at a protest in luton about an arrest of a woman whos husband blew themselves up . Isis flags , full bodies veils , hate the west rhetoric . Although not a sign of any woke , blue haired , non binary , welcome all refugee types marching with them .... Strange that .

https://youtu.be/hHvDy_X_hDM

Patriotic Alternative? an extreme racist white Nationalist group. Its leader isnt exactly pro LGBT rights either. Mad isnt. People here continuously saying they are not racist and they are in favour of LGBT rights but then promoting extreme bigoted racists and homophobes.

Collett, for example, has referred in the past to homosexuals as ‘AIDS monkeys’, declared his admiration for Adolf Hitler and called asylum seekers ‘cockroaches.’

https://www.hopenothate.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/HnH_Patriotic-Alternative-report_2020-08-v3.pdf
https://archive.is/JzJxT
https://theferret.scot/exposed-inside-far-right-patriotic-alternative/
https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/news/leeds-news/leeds-neo-nazi-mark-collet-19882854
https://gnet-research.org/2021/02/22/turning-back-to-biologised-racism-a-content-analysis-of-patriotic-alternative-uks-online-discourse/

Annasopra

There will be someone along in a short while to say that Patriotic Alternative couldnt possibly be racist despite the overwhelming evidence of their white supremacist hate and bigotry :pac::pac::pac::pac:

Cordell

What is your point? You are the first to mention them.

enricoh

Annasopra wrote: »

There will be someone along in a short while to say that Patriotic Alternative couldnt possibly be racist despite the overwhelming evidence of their white supremacist hate and bigotry :pac::pac::pac::pac:

Never heard of em tbh. Any comment on the video by Stacey Dooley at all? Or is it just shoot the messanger?!

99nsr125

MontgomeryClift wrote: »

It is.

All this talk of Western Culture, when what people really mean is White Culture!

Oh god it's not, you may interpret one thing as another but they are not equivalent


If they were then, here I'll use an egregious example.

White supremacist culture could accuse you of racism if you levied any criticism at them.

Rapists could advocate for rape culture to be thought in schools in equivalency to black culture.

tdf7187

Where is our Hans-Georg Maassen?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9752205/Former-head-Germanys-spy-agency-slams-Angela-Merkels-immigration-policies-fatal.html

Cordell

This is a brave new world, old white men belong in the past, and so is their views.

/s

Dyr

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Easily probable haha. What's it like to live in constant fear fandy?

It doesn't happen in Poland except the no go areas for LGBT people right?

https://www.bbc.com/news/stories-54191344

What a terrible man *clutches purse*

Sakiewicz tells me people should be able to have sex with whoever they choose and boasts that in some respects, Poland is progressive. It decriminalised homosexuality in 1932, decades before most European countries.

But he is against what he describes as "aggressive ideology promoting homosexuality". The struggle for gay rights is a foreign concept imported from the US and Western Europe, he adds, and it threatens the traditional heterosexual Polish family.

Now in his 50s, Sakiewicz grew up in a Poland controlled by the Soviet Union when the government told people how to think, rejected Church influence and tolerated no dissent. Bizarrely, he now accuses LGBT campaigners of behaving in the same way.

"Communists used to wave the red flag and told people they were fighting for the poor, for the workers, for the peasants," he says. "Now these activists hold up the rainbow flag and say they are fighting for sexual minorities. It was not true and it is not true. And since we lived through communist times we have a duty to tell others how dangerous such ideas can be."

Cordell

I see his point but he's totally wrong. Soviets were waving the red flag with one hand and the kalashnikov with the other. Pride flag wavers do no such thing and they should be free to wave their flag wherever and wherever they like. Freedom doesn't mean a thing if you only grant the freedoms you approve.

kildare lad

rgossip30 wrote: »

Some countries don't allow foreigners to buy houses let alone buying multiple properties .

They're all coming to Ireland now it's like the wild west , a thousand people own 100,000 properties ... The people who allow this should be done for treason

kildare lad

enricoh wrote: »

Never heard of em tbh. Any comment on the video by Stacey Dooley at all? Or is it just shoot the messanger?!

No your just a racist if you disagree with a march where people are flying isis flags, thats held in a first world country . Some logic . There's 50 countries in the world with a majority Muslim population , how come they never migrate there .

Dyr

Cordell wrote: »

I see his point but he's totally wrong. Soviets were waving the red flag with one hand and the kalashnikov with the other. Pride flag wavers do no such thing and they should be free to wave their flag wherever and wherever they like. Freedom doesn't mean a thing if you only grant the freedoms you approve.

What freedoms were being denied in that quote?

kildare lad

Annasopra wrote: »

Patriotic Alternative? an extreme racist white Nationalist group. Its leader isnt exactly pro LGBT rights either. Mad isnt. People here continuously saying they are not racist and they are in favour of LGBT rights but then promoting extreme bigoted racists and homophobes.


https://www.hopenothate.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/HnH_Patriotic-Alternative-report_2020-08-v3.pdf
https://archive.is/JzJxT
https://theferret.scot/exposed-inside-far-right-patriotic-alternative/
https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/news/leeds-news/leeds-neo-nazi-mark-collet-19882854
https://gnet-research.org/2021/02/22/turning-back-to-biologised-racism-a-content-analysis-of-patriotic-alternative-uks-online-discourse/

Any comment on the video , or do you think it's normal for marchs with Isis supporters being held in Britain. Nice deflection with the Patriotic Alternative , never heard of them. You're the one promoting them by posting all their links . Btw I doubt many of your mates in the march are pro LGBT either .

Annasopra

Annasopra wrote: »

Patriotic Alternative? an extreme racist white Nationalist group. Its leader isnt exactly pro LGBT rights either. Mad isnt. People here continuously saying they are not racist and they are in favour of LGBT rights but then promoting extreme bigoted racists and homophobes.

People here? Who are these people who are supposedly promoting this stuff?

You really do love to generalise about the posters on this thread.

I've said I'm not racist, and I do support LGB rights. (I'm not terribly supportive of Trans rights, except for the extremely tiny percentage of genuinely Transgendered people).. and I haven't promoted any of the stuff you've just alluded to.

SO, perhaps edit your post and be a bit more specific as to whom you're addressing?

Cordell

Dyr wrote: »

What freedoms were being denied in that quote?

Those ideas were used to justify removal of basic rights like freedom of speech and equality.

Dyr

Cordell wrote: »

Those ideas were used to justify removal of basic rights like freedom of speech and equality.

You're going to have to point out where in that quote anyone suggested removing freedom of speech or equality. Try doing it without making some massive leap into conjecture.

Cordell

Cordell wrote: »

I see his point but he's totally wrong. Soviets were waving the red flag with one hand and the kalashnikov with the other. Pride flag wavers do no such thing and they should be free to wave their flag wherever and wherever they like.

I think the point is that under the Pride flag there are all manner of groups and agendas being pushed. It's a long time since Pride was primarilyabout the rights/interests of homosexuals, and many of the activists who might be active for gay rights, also are active for a variety of other causes.

There's also a side of the Trans topic which is very... aggressive, and divisive, which many within the Pride community have adopted for the next big move for homosexuals, even though, the T covers all manner of people who wouldn't, traditionally, be considered homosexual.

While I agree with you that Pride should be allowed to promote itself, at the same time, I do appreciate the desire to downplay the more aggressive, and dangerous elements that are associated with the Trans issue. I think for many people, we'd like to see more research on the effects of it on people and society, before seeing it encouraged... especially when Pride (and others) want to link the T with the LGB. I know a lot of people who have disassociated themselves from Pride, because they didn't like what it had evolved into.

Still, LGB rights should be protected across Europe.

Freedom doesn't mean a thing if you only grant the freedoms you approve.

Europeans have always lived under limited freedoms. We're not the US, with their belief in being completely free, at least, we weren't until US cultural influence became so strong here... and we've seen the US tearing itself apart under the illusion of the Great Freedom of theirs.

This thread is full of posters concerned about where society is heading. These demands for freedom in everything are part of what makes western culture so vulnerable these days. There have to be boundaries, and a common sense approach applied to freedom, and the good of society. That's not to say that LGB rights should be removed, or anything like that, but at the same time, we need to recognise that there are dangerous/destructive agendas/theories being pushed under causes that were originally justified, but have since been hijacked to promote other concerns.

Just as we need to recognise that the situation regarding immigration, multiculturalism, and assimilation/integration of other cultures have also changed over the last decade or so.